I just saw a pundit say that Trump stiffing his workers was the funniest part of the debate.

[rdean]

I thought it was horrible. Some woman guest on Morning Joe said it.

Someone pointed that out to her and she said voters think it's funny.

So is it true, do Republicans think that Trump stiffing his workers is hilarious?

And that not paying taxes is good business? Even if it stiffs the country including veterans?

Why do they think it's funny? Educate me. I always thought not paying was stealing.

 

[TNHarley]

least they aren't murdered...

 

[SassyIrishLass]

? Educate me. .

We've tried, you're hopeless

 

[guno]

 

[gipper]

I thought it was horrible. Some woman guest on Morning Joe said it.

Someone pointed that out to her and she said voters think it's funny.

So is it true, do Republicans think that Trump stiffing his workers is hilarious?

And that not paying taxes is good business? Even if it stiffs the country including veterans?

Why do they think it's funny? Educate me. I always thought not paying was stealing.

Hey Deanie girl, why is Hillary debating the f**king Nazi bastard in the first place?

 

[TNHarley]

How is Haiti?

 

[rdean]

? Educate me. .

We've tried, you're hopeless

So stiffing his workers is hilarious? OK, if that's what you think.

And were you happy he was able to make a lot of money when people were losing their houses?

 

[rdean]

I just saw the architect he stiffed interviewed on TV. Hillary is missing a golden opportunity. How many of these right wingers are crying about jobs and Trump stiffs his workers. Do you really think you will never be one of those he stiffs?

 

[g5000]

This Architect Says Trump Almost Destroyed His Business, But That Doesn't Mean They Can't Get Coffee

Adams: How can you say he’s a nice guy when he cheated you out of thousands of dollars?

Tesoro: Although I resent that he shorted me a huge amount of money, his organization does that to everybody. At the time I could see that the carpenters, the tile guy, the landscape consultant, the mechanical engineering consultant, other vendors and tradespeople were all subjected to an after-the-fact renegotiation challenge. I didn’t take it personally. And I believed Donald Trump when he showered me with compliments. Maybe that was his way of manipulating me into accepting less money. He was also nice and decent to me on an individual basis.



Adams: How did your payment negotiations go?

Tesoro: The executive vice president of the Trump Organization with whom I had a constructive relationship said go to the clubhouse, that there were many other vendors and professionals there, that they were having a negotiation session. We were surrounded by this group of a dozen or more Trump Organization people who were strangers to the project. They invented reasons to challenge every piece of paper that represented an additional item of work. It was 90% nonsense. But I didn’t get a chance to defend myself. They just said, “next, next.”




Adams: How much did Trump owe you at that point?

Tesoro: It gets very complicated. I had been paid a considerable sum for what I had already done. My position was that I was entitled to approximately $140,000 for all of the work that I hadn’t yet been paid for. That included things like $80,000 in additional architectural services that were directed, approved and implemented with Trump’s blessing. The project had grown immensely in scope and Mr. Trump wanted my firm to be involved in the construction phase. I did expect to have to negotiate.

 

[Penelope]

I was posting same time as you about the architect.


I would never have coffee with a stiff like Trump. Trump is disgusting.

 

[g5000]

I saw a documentary about Trump made many years ago. What Trump does is hire a contractor, and then all during the actual work, Trump makes changes. Lots and lots of changes to what he originally said he wanted done. Changes which add huge amounts of extra time and cost to the project.

Then he stiffs the contractors for the extra work.

 

[martybegan]

This Architect Says Trump Almost Destroyed His Business, But That Doesn't Mean They Can't Get Coffee

Adams: How can you say he’s a nice guy when he cheated you out of thousands of dollars?

Tesoro: Although I resent that he shorted me a huge amount of money, his organization does that to everybody. At the time I could see that the carpenters, the tile guy, the landscape consultant, the mechanical engineering consultant, other vendors and tradespeople were all subjected to an after-the-fact renegotiation challenge. I didn’t take it personally. And I believed Donald Trump when he showered me with compliments. Maybe that was his way of manipulating me into accepting less money. He was also nice and decent to me on an individual basis.



Adams: How did your payment negotiations go?

Tesoro: The executive vice president of the Trump Organization with whom I had a constructive relationship said go to the clubhouse, that there were many other vendors and professionals there, that they were having a negotiation session. We were surrounded by this group of a dozen or more Trump Organization people who were strangers to the project. They invented reasons to challenge every piece of paper that represented an additional item of work. It was 90% nonsense. But I didn’t get a chance to defend myself. They just said, “next, next.”




Adams: How much did Trump owe you at that point?

Tesoro: It gets very complicated. I had been paid a considerable sum for what I had already done. My position was that I was entitled to approximately $140,000 for all of the work that I hadn’t yet been paid for. That included things like $80,000 in additional architectural services that were directed, approved and implemented with Trump’s blessing. The project had grown immensely in scope and Mr. Trump wanted my firm to be involved in the construction phase. I did expect to have to negotiate.

if you want to see companies get chewed to the bone during CO negotiations, go to your local government agency. The auditors there will penny pinch every nickel they can when it comes to additional work, same thing Trump does, and a lot of other businesses do.

 

[Lucy Hamilton]

I thought it was horrible. Some woman guest on Morning Joe said it.

Someone pointed that out to her and she said voters think it's funny.

So is it true, do Republicans think that Trump stiffing his workers is hilarious?

And that not paying taxes is good business? Even if it stiffs the country including veterans?

Why do they think it's funny? Educate me. I always thought not paying was stealing.

No The Donald didn't stiff his workers, they meant to say that The Donald sniffed his workers.

You know he has that sniffing problem with the allergic stuff, so he had to sniff his workers to make sure they didn't wear any parfum that he was allergic to

Hillary her parfum caused The Donald to have an allergic reaction, that's what the sniffing was.

 

[martybegan]

I saw a documentary about Trump made many years ago. What Trump does is hire a contractor, and then all during the actual work, Trump makes changes. Lots and lots of changes to what he originally said he wanted done. Changes which add huge amounts of extra time and cost to the project.

Then he stiffs the contractors for the extra work.

That is not uncommon in the construction industry. When a contractor comes at you with a $300k change order, for $100k worth of work, that is not "stiffing" someone.

 

[g5000]

I saw a documentary about Trump made many years ago. What Trump does is hire a contractor, and then all during the actual work, Trump makes changes. Lots and lots of changes to what he originally said he wanted done. Changes which add huge amounts of extra time and cost to the project.

Then he stiffs the contractors for the extra work.

That is not uncommon in the construction industry. When a contractor comes at you with a $300k change order, for $100k worth of work, that is not "stiffing" someone.

It is when they don't pay for the changes.

 

[martybegan]

I saw a documentary about Trump made many years ago. What Trump does is hire a contractor, and then all during the actual work, Trump makes changes. Lots and lots of changes to what he originally said he wanted done. Changes which add huge amounts of extra time and cost to the project.

Then he stiffs the contractors for the extra work.

That is not uncommon in the construction industry. When a contractor comes at you with a $300k change order, for $100k worth of work, that is not "stiffing" someone.

It is when they don't pay for the changes.

I know people who have worked for Trump, he's a bigger asshole than most other clients, but its by degree, and not exponentially worse than any other property owner.

Contractors always highball estimates, designers lowball it, and usually you meet in the middle. With trump he tends to lean towards the lowball side of the middle.

 

[Penelope]

This Architect Says Trump Almost Destroyed His Business, But That Doesn't Mean They Can't Get Coffee

Adams: How can you say he’s a nice guy when he cheated you out of thousands of dollars?

Tesoro: Although I resent that he shorted me a huge amount of money, his organization does that to everybody. At the time I could see that the carpenters, the tile guy, the landscape consultant, the mechanical engineering consultant, other vendors and tradespeople were all subjected to an after-the-fact renegotiation challenge. I didn’t take it personally. And I believed Donald Trump when he showered me with compliments. Maybe that was his way of manipulating me into accepting less money. He was also nice and decent to me on an individual basis.



Adams: How did your payment negotiations go?

Tesoro: The executive vice president of the Trump Organization with whom I had a constructive relationship said go to the clubhouse, that there were many other vendors and professionals there, that they were having a negotiation session. We were surrounded by this group of a dozen or more Trump Organization people who were strangers to the project. They invented reasons to challenge every piece of paper that represented an additional item of work. It was 90% nonsense. But I didn’t get a chance to defend myself. They just said, “next, next.”




Forbes Trep Talks

Where entrepreneurs discuss life in the trenches.

Susan Adams, Forbes Staff
Last week, the Hillary Clinton campaign released a three-and-a-half minute video of a small businessman, Andrew Tesoro, who tells how Donald Trump cheated his five-person architecture firm out of thousands of dollars back in 2006 when it designed the clubhouse at the Trump National Golf Club in the Westchester County town of Briarcliff Manor, NY. The video intersperses Tesoro’s narrative with footage of the candidate at a campaign rally saying, “I’ve built an extraordinary business on relationships and deals that benefit all parties involved.” (The Trump campaign didn’t respond to an email requesting comment.) The video has more than 7 million views on Facebook. In this condensed and edited interview, Tesoro, 64, describes how the video came about, the part of the story that ended up on the cutting room floor, and why he doesn’t hate Trump.

Susan Adams: Did you reach out to the Clinton campaign or did they get in touch with you?

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Andrew Tesoro: They got in touch with me as a result of an email I shared with a friend. My involvement with Trump was from 2002 to 2006. At the time my son was in elementary school and there was a mom at the school with whom I remained friends. She was aware of the story and she urged me to write it down. I sent it to her in an email. She passed it along to some colleagues, one of whom had a nephew who worked on the Clinton campaign. The campaign then contacted me and asked if I would be willing to tell them more. They videotaped me for more than an hour. Obviously a lot of details got left out of the three-minute video.


Adams: Is there more to the story that the public should know?

Tesoro: Personally I would like people to know that I don’t hate Donald Trump. I don’t think he is nearly as much of a demon as he often sounds like he is on the campaign trail. I think he’s basically a nice guy. I’m fond of him.

Adams: How can you say he’s a nice guy when he cheated you out of thousands of dollars?

Tesoro: Although I resent that he shorted me a huge amount of money, his organization does that to everybody. At the time I could see that the carpenters, the tile guy, the landscape consultant, the mechanical engineering consultant, other vendors and tradespeople were all subjected to an after-the-fact renegotiation challenge. I didn’t take it personally. And I believed Donald Trump when he showered me with compliments. Maybe that was his way of manipulating me into accepting less money. He was also nice and decent to me on an individual basis.

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Adams: If you like him, why did you make the video?

Tesoro: I feel very strongly that he is not well-suited to the job of president of the United States. Because he is impatient, he has a huge ego, and he has this infatuation with money. He measures everything in terms of money.

Adams: Had you heard rumors that Trump didn’t pay architects what they deserved?

Tesoro: I had heard a little bit, some rumors, that he was not particularly known for paying people at the end of a job. But I know I’m not greedy. I thought if other people got shorted, it was because they asked too much. He kept telling me what a great architect I was and how the clubhouse was going to get me wonderful projects and front page publicity in all the most important journals. That’s part of his charismatic style.

Adams: How did your payment negotiations go?

Tesoro: The executive vice president of the Trump Organization with whom I had a constructive relationship said go to the clubhouse, that there were many other vendors and professionals there, that they were having a negotiation session. We were surrounded by this group of a dozen or more Trump Organization people who were strangers to the project. They invented reasons to challenge every piece of paper that represented an additional item of work. It was 90% nonsense. But I didn’t get a chance to defend myself. They just said, “next, next.”


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Adams: How much did Trump owe you at that point?

Tesoro: It gets very complicated. I had been paid a considerable sum for what I had already done. My position was that I was entitled to approximately $140,000 for all of the work that I hadn’t yet been paid for. That included things like $80,000 in additional architectural services that were directed, approved and implemented with Trump’s blessing. The project had grown immensely in scope and Mr. Trump wanted my firm to be involved in the construction phase. I did expect to have to negotiate.

I saw a documentary about Trump made many years ago. What Trump does is hire a contractor, and then all during the actual work, Trump makes changes. Lots and lots of changes to what he originally said he wanted done. Changes which add huge amounts of extra time and cost to the project.

Then he stiffs the contractors for the extra work.

Yes that is also a trick of some contractors, they get the job due to low ball proposals, and then everything is an add on. One must get everything in writing, there are crooks on both ends.

Its too bad that architect couldn't afford to go to court. Its the little guys that the big guys stiff, they can wait it out , and have attorneys on their payroll, while the small guy takes what he gets. What's really bad is small companies that have materials and labor involved in the job, as their creditors need to get paid or no more materials.

What a slime ball. He obviously could careless about small businesses.

 

[rdean]

This Architect Says Trump Almost Destroyed His Business, But That Doesn't Mean They Can't Get Coffee

Adams: How can you say he’s a nice guy when he cheated you out of thousands of dollars?

Tesoro: Although I resent that he shorted me a huge amount of money, his organization does that to everybody. At the time I could see that the carpenters, the tile guy, the landscape consultant, the mechanical engineering consultant, other vendors and tradespeople were all subjected to an after-the-fact renegotiation challenge. I didn’t take it personally. And I believed Donald Trump when he showered me with compliments. Maybe that was his way of manipulating me into accepting less money. He was also nice and decent to me on an individual basis.



Adams: How did your payment negotiations go?

Tesoro: The executive vice president of the Trump Organization with whom I had a constructive relationship said go to the clubhouse, that there were many other vendors and professionals there, that they were having a negotiation session. We were surrounded by this group of a dozen or more Trump Organization people who were strangers to the project. They invented reasons to challenge every piece of paper that represented an additional item of work. It was 90% nonsense. But I didn’t get a chance to defend myself. They just said, “next, next.”




Adams: How much did Trump owe you at that point?

Tesoro: It gets very complicated. I had been paid a considerable sum for what I had already done. My position was that I was entitled to approximately $140,000 for all of the work that I hadn’t yet been paid for. That included things like $80,000 in additional architectural services that were directed, approved and implemented with Trump’s blessing. The project had grown immensely in scope and Mr. Trump wanted my firm to be involved in the construction phase. I did expect to have to negotiate.

So he ended up getting 25 thousand from the 140 thousand he was supposed to get and what he negotiated for? That's despicable. Much worse than deplorable.

 

[rdean]

I saw a documentary about Trump made many years ago. What Trump does is hire a contractor, and then all during the actual work, Trump makes changes. Lots and lots of changes to what he originally said he wanted done. Changes which add huge amounts of extra time and cost to the project.

Then he stiffs the contractors for the extra work.

That is not uncommon in the construction industry. When a contractor comes at you with a $300k change order, for $100k worth of work, that is not "stiffing" someone.

It is when they don't pay for the changes.

I know people who have worked for Trump, he's a bigger asshole than most other clients, but its by degree, and not exponentially worse than any other property owner.

Contractors always highball estimates, designers lowball it, and usually you meet in the middle. With trump he tends to lean towards the lowball side of the middle.

So 25 thousand out of a hundred and forty thousand. Could they be off by that much?

 

[martybegan]

I saw a documentary about Trump made many years ago. What Trump does is hire a contractor, and then all during the actual work, Trump makes changes. Lots and lots of changes to what he originally said he wanted done. Changes which add huge amounts of extra time and cost to the project.

Then he stiffs the contractors for the extra work.

That is not uncommon in the construction industry. When a contractor comes at you with a $300k change order, for $100k worth of work, that is not "stiffing" someone.

It is when they don't pay for the changes.

I know people who have worked for Trump, he's a bigger asshole than most other clients, but its by degree, and not exponentially worse than any other property owner.

Contractors always highball estimates, designers lowball it, and usually you meet in the middle. With trump he tends to lean towards the lowball side of the middle.

So 25 thousand out of a hundred and forty thousand. Could they be off by that much?

Depends on how good you are at padding an estimate.

most work is lump sum. Change orders are also lump sum, but you have to justify the expenses in far more detail.