Is Pain And Suffering The Only Way To Convince Atheists That God Exists?

[hobelim]

Atheists always claim they have to have evidence that God exists, but history shows us different. Once you provide the evidence, then they end up forgetting like that which happened to Jesus Christ or they want even more evidence such that every atheist must be convinced.

If you rubes had actually provided evidence, you might have a point, but you haven't.

What evidence would you accept for something outside of space and time? And why is it other people's job to provide it to you? Are you waiting for something magical to happen?

No need for anyone to wait for something magical to happen.

You have already been turned into a toad.

You openly proclaim that God can become a cheap snack food that has no life just because you believe...

You actually said this over and over again without even an inkling how insane that belief is....

And no one is even holding a gun to your head or threatening you with ruin or being burned at the stake...

 

[ding]

Atheists always claim they have to have evidence that God exists, but history shows us different. Once you provide the evidence, then they end up forgetting like that which happened to Jesus Christ or they want even more evidence such that every atheist must be convinced.

If you rubes had actually provided evidence, you might have a point, but you haven't.

What evidence would you accept for something outside of space and time? And why is it other people's job to provide it to you? Are you waiting for something magical to happen?

No need to wait...

You have already been turned into a toad.

You openly proclaim that God can become a cheap snack food that has no life just because you believe...

You actually said this over and over again without even an inkling how insane that belief is....

Yeah, no. I don't think the world needs your damning people to hell theology for no other reason than being Christian. You should worry about yourself and not others.

 

[hobelim]

Atheists always claim they have to have evidence that God exists, but history shows us different. Once you provide the evidence, then they end up forgetting like that which happened to Jesus Christ or they want even more evidence such that every atheist must be convinced.

If you rubes had actually provided evidence, you might have a point, but you haven't.

What evidence would you accept for something outside of space and time? And why is it other people's job to provide it to you? Are you waiting for something magical to happen?

No need to wait...

You have already been turned into a toad.

You openly proclaim that God can become a cheap snack food that has no life just because you believe...

You actually said this over and over again without even an inkling how insane that belief is....

Yeah, no. I don't need the world needs your damning people to hell theology for being Christian.

You are not being damned to hell by me for being Christian, you have been damned to hell by God because you have dedicated yourself to desecrate the teachings of Jesus and perjure yourself in the name of God on a daily basis.

I am actually doing you a favor by pointing it out, shit for brains.


You are clinging to the religious flotsam of a dying age in full view of heaven and earth. Characters like you will be condemned to the shame of eternal abhorrence in new fairy tales that will be written for the children of the future.


But don't you worry your silly self, I am not worried about you. You can have it. I wouldn't dream of taking away from you what you have deliberately chosen for yourself.


"This, he told me, is the curse that goes out over all the land; for by the writing on one side every thief shall be swept clean away, and by the writing on the other every perjurer shall be swept clean away. I have sent it out, the Lord of Hosts has said, and it will enter the house of the thief and the house of the man who has perjured himself in my name. It shall stay inside that house and demolish it, timbers and stones and all."



Unless you repent, you will never enter the kingdom of Heaven.

 

[james bond]

Christians have thumbs to give out the two-punch. Actually, we all do. That's because God gave us thumbs. There you go.

Alright then..

God has given all rational people the green light to pay you back in your own coin..

How do you like them apples?

Fine with me. I know how to fight. Also, use my thumbs to grab a gun and shoot accurately..

Well goody for you.

I have a gun that has no bullets and doesn't make any noise but will set your soul on fire.

You cannot defend yourself against what you cannot see or comprehend, the truth.

Goody for you, too, and your rounds with no bullets.

Have no idea what you are arguing? Which God do you refer to? Christian? Deist?

No idea? Thats a shame. And its only just begun...

Its going to be very humiliating and embarrassing for ya'll. But the people on whom your focus your hatred are going to laugh...

If you weren't such despicable spineless cowards full of corruption and a long history of doing evil on your permanent record, I would feel sorry for you.

Why would I be a coward *IF* pain and suffering is the truth that atheists want? Maybe God does that in the after life and not this life.

We already know that the Bible states that one has to have faith and that it takes courage to take the leap of faith? Maybe it takes courage to have faith.

 

[james bond]

Christians have thumbs to give out the two-punch. Actually, we all do. That's because God gave us thumbs. There you go.

Alright then..

God has given all rational people the green light to pay you back in your own coin..

How do you like them apples?

Fine with me. I know how to fight. Also, use my thumbs to grab a gun and shoot accurately..

Well goody for you.

I have a gun that has no bullets and doesn't make any noise but will set your soul on fire.

You cannot defend yourself against what you cannot see or comprehend, the truth.

Goody for you, too, and your rounds with no bullets.

Have no idea what you are arguing? Which God do you refer to? Christian? Deist?

He's not very forthcoming about his theology. As nears as I can tell he's not Christian but he uses the NT and sees Jesus as a great man; a rebel, but nothing more. He's more closely aligned with the JW's, I think.

JWs think Jesus is an archangel -- Michael. He sounds more OT and Gnostic. Who knows what he'll spew forth next ha ha?

 

[Mac1958]

Seems to me that the horrors we see on this planet every single day are an indication that God doesn't exist.

I'm agnostic, but holy crap, this thread asks a weird question.

 

[frigidweirdo]

Atheists always claim they have to have evidence that God exists, but history shows us different. Once you provide the evidence, then they end up forgetting like that which happened to Jesus Christ or they want even more evidence such that every atheist must be convinced.

The Bible says otherwise. The existence of God cannot be proved or disproved. The Bible says that we must accept by faith the fact that God exists:

"Jesus performed countless miracles, yet the vast majority of people did not believe in Him. If God performed miracles today as He did in the past, the result would be the same. People would be amazed and would believe in God for a short time. That faith would be shallow and would disappear the moment something unexpected or frightening occurred. A faith based on miracles is not a mature faith. God performed the greatest “God miracle” of all time in coming to earth as the Man Jesus Christ to die on the cross for our sins (Romans 5:8) so that we could be saved (John 3:16). God does still perform miracles—many of them simply go unnoticed or are denied. However, we do not need more miracles. What we need is to believe in the miracle of salvation through faith in Jesus Christ."

Does God still perform miracles?

Lawrence Krauss is a professor of physics at Arizona State University. He said evidence for God would be as follows.

"Now, it would be easy to have evidence for God. If the stars rearrange themselves tonight and I looked up tonight—well not here, but in a place where you could see the stars, in Arizona, say,—and I looked up tonight and I saw the stars rearrange themselves say, “I am here.”

The Craig - Krauss Debate at North Carolina State University | Reasonable Faith

Later, another atheist responded that he would not accept the stars rearranging themselves because people south of the equator would not be able to see this.

Thus, the only way I see to convince every single atheist is pain and suffering. If they knew God brought this upon them, then they would have to believe. It's like they brought it upon themselves. You asked for it. You got it. Of course, this is what I think happens in the afterlife. The existence of God cannot be proved or disproved in this life.

I have a video on pain and suffering. Maybe this is one of the methods.

So you're saying that because we feel pain, which is literally a way of our body telling our brain something's gone wrong, that God exists?

You know the Venus fly trap plants. Well, they react to flies, does this "prove that God exists" too?

I'm just waiting to tell me why if God has to exist because things are so complex and nothing can just appear out of nowhere, why God apparently appeared out of nowhere and who created this God.

 

[james bond]

Seems to me that the horrors we see on this planet every single day are an indication that God doesn't exist.

I'm agnostic, but holy crap, this thread asks a weird question.

Okay, I'll accept your agnosticism. However, I consider agnostics the same as atheists except they are ignorant.

I do agree on the horrors, but we are all born with sin and the god of the world and the prince of the air influences all of us. It's not the true God as you claim who does nothing to stop it. Instead, the truth is God does exist. See, this shows that you are ignorant.

ETA: I only started this thread to ask the question. My answer is MAYBE. It could refer to this world. It could refer to the afterlife. If atheists want ABSOLUTE proof, then they get ABSOLUTE proof and still deny God. Atheism is like a religion to them. Thus, what would convince someone who has faith in NO God to realize the truth?

 

[Mac1958]

Seems to me that the horrors we see on this planet every single day are an indication that God doesn't exist.

I'm agnostic, but holy crap, this thread asks a weird question.

Okay, I'll accept your agnosticism. However, I consider agnostics the same as atheists except they are ignorant.

I do agree on the horrors, but we are all born with sin and the god of the world and the prince of the air influences all of us. It's not the true God as you claim who does nothing to stop it. Instead, the truth is God does exist. See, this shows that you are ignorant.

When you can prove it, I'm right here.

There is a difference between faith and fact.
.

 

[james bond]

Atheists always claim they have to have evidence that God exists, but history shows us different. Once you provide the evidence, then they end up forgetting like that which happened to Jesus Christ or they want even more evidence such that every atheist must be convinced.

The Bible says otherwise. The existence of God cannot be proved or disproved. The Bible says that we must accept by faith the fact that God exists:

"Jesus performed countless miracles, yet the vast majority of people did not believe in Him. If God performed miracles today as He did in the past, the result would be the same. People would be amazed and would believe in God for a short time. That faith would be shallow and would disappear the moment something unexpected or frightening occurred. A faith based on miracles is not a mature faith. God performed the greatest “God miracle” of all time in coming to earth as the Man Jesus Christ to die on the cross for our sins (Romans 5:8) so that we could be saved (John 3:16). God does still perform miracles—many of them simply go unnoticed or are denied. However, we do not need more miracles. What we need is to believe in the miracle of salvation through faith in Jesus Christ."

Does God still perform miracles?

Lawrence Krauss is a professor of physics at Arizona State University. He said evidence for God would be as follows.

"Now, it would be easy to have evidence for God. If the stars rearrange themselves tonight and I looked up tonight—well not here, but in a place where you could see the stars, in Arizona, say,—and I looked up tonight and I saw the stars rearrange themselves say, “I am here.”

The Craig - Krauss Debate at North Carolina State University | Reasonable Faith

Later, another atheist responded that he would not accept the stars rearranging themselves because people south of the equator would not be able to see this.

Thus, the only way I see to convince every single atheist is pain and suffering. If they knew God brought this upon them, then they would have to believe. It's like they brought it upon themselves. You asked for it. You got it. Of course, this is what I think happens in the afterlife. The existence of God cannot be proved or disproved in this life.

I have a video on pain and suffering. Maybe this is one of the methods.

So you're saying that because we feel pain, which is literally a way of our body telling our brain something's gone wrong, that God exists?

You know the Venus fly trap plants. Well, they react to flies, does this "prove that God exists" too?

I'm just waiting to tell me why if God has to exist because things are so complex and nothing can just appear out of nowhere, why God apparently appeared out of nowhere and who created this God.

Well, I was looking at it from the pov as a Christian that atheists want *proof* of God before they believe he exists. However, there won't be any proof because God stated that we have to have faith that he exists.

Lawrence Krauss said in the debate with Craig that he'll reconsider if a miracle occurred of the stars aligning to spell, "I'm here" or something to that effect. However, an astute atheist claimed that that isn't enough. The atheists in the other half of the hemisphere to Arizona would not see it. I thought this atheist said the only thing intelligent about atheism, i.e. someone would have to convince every single atheist and not just one, a few or many.

As for your Venus Fly Trap analogy, that's a fly or insect and we do not know if it feels pain in the trap. However, let's say God captures it and tears off its wings one-at-a-time and then moves to the legs one-at-a-time. Will the fly be more likely to believe if it could could communicate at a rudimentary level that it was in pain and does believe? I mean in this world, what would convince every single fly that God exists and is showing his power?

 

[james bond]

Seems to me that the horrors we see on this planet every single day are an indication that God doesn't exist.

I'm agnostic, but holy crap, this thread asks a weird question.

Okay, I'll accept your agnosticism. However, I consider agnostics the same as atheists except they are ignorant.

I do agree on the horrors, but we are all born with sin and the god of the world and the prince of the air influences all of us. It's not the true God as you claim who does nothing to stop it. Instead, the truth is God does exist. See, this shows that you are ignorant.

When you can prove it, I'm right here.

There is a difference between faith and fact.
.

I can prove you are agnostic. You still are ignorant. I just got through saying there is no proof, but through faith one can finally see the truth that God exists. That there is evidence which can be presented and an argument can be made to show why people believe God exists. However, you really don't care about that because you do not want to believe. Or else you would educate yourself and come to your own conclusions.

There is a difference between faith in Christianity and other faiths and that only one is the truth and that is the Word of God in the Bible. You act like you already know that Christianity doesn't deal with facts. Nothing can be further from the truth. Atheists are usually wrong.

 

[Mac1958]

Seems to me that the horrors we see on this planet every single day are an indication that God doesn't exist.

I'm agnostic, but holy crap, this thread asks a weird question.

Okay, I'll accept your agnosticism. However, I consider agnostics the same as atheists except they are ignorant.

I do agree on the horrors, but we are all born with sin and the god of the world and the prince of the air influences all of us. It's not the true God as you claim who does nothing to stop it. Instead, the truth is God does exist. See, this shows that you are ignorant.

When you can prove it, I'm right here.

There is a difference between faith and fact.
.

I can prove you are agnostic. You still are ignorant. I just got through saying there is no proof, but through faith one can finally see the truth that God exists. That there is evidence which can be presented and an argument can be made to show why people believe God exists. However, you really don't care about that because you do not want to believe. Or else you would educate yourself and come to your own conclusions.

There is a difference between faith in Christianity and other faiths and that only one is the truth and that is the Word of God in the Bible. You act like you already know that Christianity doesn't deal with facts. Nothing can be further from the truth. Atheists are usually wrong.

We humans have always created gods - sometimes multiple gods at one time - to provide us with guidance, comfort and answers.

Believers of these various gods have always been convinced, down to their very bones, that they had The Answer and that everyone else was just wrong.

Okay. That's fine. That still has never made those various gods real. And if you really don't see the difference between fact & faith, there's nothing I can say.
.

 

[frigidweirdo]

Atheists always claim they have to have evidence that God exists, but history shows us different. Once you provide the evidence, then they end up forgetting like that which happened to Jesus Christ or they want even more evidence such that every atheist must be convinced.

The Bible says otherwise. The existence of God cannot be proved or disproved. The Bible says that we must accept by faith the fact that God exists:

"Jesus performed countless miracles, yet the vast majority of people did not believe in Him. If God performed miracles today as He did in the past, the result would be the same. People would be amazed and would believe in God for a short time. That faith would be shallow and would disappear the moment something unexpected or frightening occurred. A faith based on miracles is not a mature faith. God performed the greatest “God miracle” of all time in coming to earth as the Man Jesus Christ to die on the cross for our sins (Romans 5:8) so that we could be saved (John 3:16). God does still perform miracles—many of them simply go unnoticed or are denied. However, we do not need more miracles. What we need is to believe in the miracle of salvation through faith in Jesus Christ."

Does God still perform miracles?

Lawrence Krauss is a professor of physics at Arizona State University. He said evidence for God would be as follows.

"Now, it would be easy to have evidence for God. If the stars rearrange themselves tonight and I looked up tonight—well not here, but in a place where you could see the stars, in Arizona, say,—and I looked up tonight and I saw the stars rearrange themselves say, “I am here.”

The Craig - Krauss Debate at North Carolina State University | Reasonable Faith

Later, another atheist responded that he would not accept the stars rearranging themselves because people south of the equator would not be able to see this.

Thus, the only way I see to convince every single atheist is pain and suffering. If they knew God brought this upon them, then they would have to believe. It's like they brought it upon themselves. You asked for it. You got it. Of course, this is what I think happens in the afterlife. The existence of God cannot be proved or disproved in this life.

I have a video on pain and suffering. Maybe this is one of the methods.

So you're saying that because we feel pain, which is literally a way of our body telling our brain something's gone wrong, that God exists?

You know the Venus fly trap plants. Well, they react to flies, does this "prove that God exists" too?

I'm just waiting to tell me why if God has to exist because things are so complex and nothing can just appear out of nowhere, why God apparently appeared out of nowhere and who created this God.

Well, I was looking at it from the pov as a Christian that atheists want *proof* of God before they believe he exists. However, there won't be any proof because God stated that we have to have faith that he exists.

Lawrence Krauss said in the debate with Craig that he'll reconsider if a miracle occurred of the stars aligning to spell, "I'm here" or something to that effect. However, an astute atheist claimed that that isn't enough. The atheists in the other half of the hemisphere to Arizona would not see it. I thought this atheist said the only thing intelligent about atheism, i.e. someone would have to convince every single atheist and not just one, a few or many.

As for your Venus Fly Trap analogy, that's a fly or insect and we do not know if it feels pain in the trap. However, let's say God captures it and tears off its wings one-at-a-time and then moves to the legs one-at-a-time. Will the fly be more likely to believe if it could could communicate at a rudimentary level that it was in pain and does believe? I mean in this world, what would convince every single fly that God exists and is showing his power?

So, you're basically saying you have no proof, but people should just accept what you say simply because you say it?

So you don't know if a fly feels pain, but you know God exists.

Why can't you just believe a fly feels pain the same way you believe God exists.

Whatever, we're not talking about the fly, but the plant. The plant will MOVE, which means the plant is receiving messages from other parts of the plant, which is the same as how we feel pain

 

[SweetSue92]

Atheists always claim they have to have evidence that God exists, but history shows us different. Once you provide the evidence, then they end up forgetting like that which happened to Jesus Christ or they want even more evidence such that every atheist must be convinced.

The Bible says otherwise. The existence of God cannot be proved or disproved. The Bible says that we must accept by faith the fact that God exists:

"Jesus performed countless miracles, yet the vast majority of people did not believe in Him. If God performed miracles today as He did in the past, the result would be the same. People would be amazed and would believe in God for a short time. That faith would be shallow and would disappear the moment something unexpected or frightening occurred. A faith based on miracles is not a mature faith. God performed the greatest “God miracle” of all time in coming to earth as the Man Jesus Christ to die on the cross for our sins (Romans 5:8) so that we could be saved (John 3:16). God does still perform miracles—many of them simply go unnoticed or are denied. However, we do not need more miracles. What we need is to believe in the miracle of salvation through faith in Jesus Christ."

Does God still perform miracles?

Lawrence Krauss is a professor of physics at Arizona State University. He said evidence for God would be as follows.

"Now, it would be easy to have evidence for God. If the stars rearrange themselves tonight and I looked up tonight—well not here, but in a place where you could see the stars, in Arizona, say,—and I looked up tonight and I saw the stars rearrange themselves say, “I am here.”

The Craig - Krauss Debate at North Carolina State University | Reasonable Faith

Later, another atheist responded that he would not accept the stars rearranging themselves because people south of the equator would not be able to see this.

Thus, the only way I see to convince every single atheist is pain and suffering. If they knew God brought this upon them, then they would have to believe. It's like they brought it upon themselves. You asked for it. You got it. Of course, this is what I think happens in the afterlife. The existence of God cannot be proved or disproved in this life.

I have a video on pain and suffering. Maybe this is one of the methods.

Oh, so your God of Love will inflict pain and suffering to prove he exists? Wow, that kind of compassion is astounding.

Are you wishing for atheists to have God inflict all this pain & suffering on them?

I'm not saying that I necessarily agree with the conclusions of the OP, but the concept of "short term pain for long term gain" is one every parent should know well. And if they do not, they will raise some very spoiled, entitled, and unequipped children.

 

[SweetSue92]

Seems to me that the horrors we see on this planet every single day are an indication that God doesn't exist.

I'm agnostic, but holy crap, this thread asks a weird question.

Okay, I'll accept your agnosticism. However, I consider agnostics the same as atheists except they are ignorant.

I do agree on the horrors, but we are all born with sin and the god of the world and the prince of the air influences all of us. It's not the true God as you claim who does nothing to stop it. Instead, the truth is God does exist. See, this shows that you are ignorant.

When you can prove it, I'm right here.

There is a difference between faith and fact.
.

I can prove you are agnostic. You still are ignorant. I just got through saying there is no proof, but through faith one can finally see the truth that God exists. That there is evidence which can be presented and an argument can be made to show why people believe God exists. However, you really don't care about that because you do not want to believe. Or else you would educate yourself and come to your own conclusions.

There is a difference between faith in Christianity and other faiths and that only one is the truth and that is the Word of God in the Bible. You act like you already know that Christianity doesn't deal with facts. Nothing can be further from the truth. Atheists are usually wrong.

We humans have always created gods - sometimes multiple gods at one time - to provide us with guidance, comfort and answers.

Believers of these various gods have always been convinced, down to their very bones, that they had The Answer and that everyone else was just wrong.

Okay. That's fine. That still has never made those various gods real. And if you really don't see the difference between fact & faith, there's nothing I can say.
.

True, we have always invented gods. Many religions, however, know their gods are invented--or at least strongly suspect they are. IOW, they're stories, and they know it.

So maybe start by dividing up the faiths that are mythology and the ones who claim they're not.

 

[Mac1958]

Seems to me that the horrors we see on this planet every single day are an indication that God doesn't exist.

I'm agnostic, but holy crap, this thread asks a weird question.

Okay, I'll accept your agnosticism. However, I consider agnostics the same as atheists except they are ignorant.

I do agree on the horrors, but we are all born with sin and the god of the world and the prince of the air influences all of us. It's not the true God as you claim who does nothing to stop it. Instead, the truth is God does exist. See, this shows that you are ignorant.

When you can prove it, I'm right here.

There is a difference between faith and fact.
.

I can prove you are agnostic. You still are ignorant. I just got through saying there is no proof, but through faith one can finally see the truth that God exists. That there is evidence which can be presented and an argument can be made to show why people believe God exists. However, you really don't care about that because you do not want to believe. Or else you would educate yourself and come to your own conclusions.

There is a difference between faith in Christianity and other faiths and that only one is the truth and that is the Word of God in the Bible. You act like you already know that Christianity doesn't deal with facts. Nothing can be further from the truth. Atheists are usually wrong.

We humans have always created gods - sometimes multiple gods at one time - to provide us with guidance, comfort and answers.

Believers of these various gods have always been convinced, down to their very bones, that they had The Answer and that everyone else was just wrong.

Okay. That's fine. That still has never made those various gods real. And if you really don't see the difference between fact & faith, there's nothing I can say.
.

True, we have always invented gods. Many religions, however, know their gods are invented--or at least strongly suspect they are. IOW, they're stories, and they know it.

So maybe start by dividing up the faiths that are mythology and the ones who claim they're not.

Tough to tell them apart, and either way, I don't have proof that any of them actually exist.

Hey, I'm open to anything. When I become convinced of something, I'll run with it.
.

 

[SweetSue92]

Atheists always claim they have to have evidence that God exists, but history shows us different. Once you provide the evidence, then they end up forgetting like that which happened to Jesus Christ or they want even more evidence such that every atheist must be convinced.

The Bible says otherwise. The existence of God cannot be proved or disproved. The Bible says that we must accept by faith the fact that God exists:

"Jesus performed countless miracles, yet the vast majority of people did not believe in Him. If God performed miracles today as He did in the past, the result would be the same. People would be amazed and would believe in God for a short time. That faith would be shallow and would disappear the moment something unexpected or frightening occurred. A faith based on miracles is not a mature faith. God performed the greatest “God miracle” of all time in coming to earth as the Man Jesus Christ to die on the cross for our sins (Romans 5:8) so that we could be saved (John 3:16). God does still perform miracles—many of them simply go unnoticed or are denied. However, we do not need more miracles. What we need is to believe in the miracle of salvation through faith in Jesus Christ."

Does God still perform miracles?

Lawrence Krauss is a professor of physics at Arizona State University. He said evidence for God would be as follows.

"Now, it would be easy to have evidence for God. If the stars rearrange themselves tonight and I looked up tonight—well not here, but in a place where you could see the stars, in Arizona, say,—and I looked up tonight and I saw the stars rearrange themselves say, “I am here.”

The Craig - Krauss Debate at North Carolina State University | Reasonable Faith

Later, another atheist responded that he would not accept the stars rearranging themselves because people south of the equator would not be able to see this.

Thus, the only way I see to convince every single atheist is pain and suffering. If they knew God brought this upon them, then they would have to believe. It's like they brought it upon themselves. You asked for it. You got it. Of course, this is what I think happens in the afterlife. The existence of God cannot be proved or disproved in this life.

I have a video on pain and suffering. Maybe this is one of the methods.

I really think Romans 1 has the best "evidence" about unbelievers there is. They are without excuse:

For what can be known about God is plain to them, because God has shown it to them. 20 For his invisible attributes, namely, his eternal power and divine nature, have been clearly perceived, ever since the creation of the world,7 in the things that have been made. So they are without excuse. 21 For although they knew God, they did not honor him as God or give thanks to him, but they became futile in their thinking, and their foolish hearts were darkened. 22 Claiming to be wise, they became fools, 23 and exchanged the glory of their immortal God for images resembling mortal man and birds and animals and creeping things.

24 Therefore God gave them up in the lusts of their hearts to impurity, to the dishonoring of their bodies among themselves, 25 because they exchanged the truth about God for ua lie and worshiped and served the creature rather than the Creator, who is blessed forever! Amen.

 

[SweetSue92]

Okay, I'll accept your agnosticism. However, I consider agnostics the same as atheists except they are ignorant.

I do agree on the horrors, but we are all born with sin and the god of the world and the prince of the air influences all of us. It's not the true God as you claim who does nothing to stop it. Instead, the truth is God does exist. See, this shows that you are ignorant.

When you can prove it, I'm right here.

There is a difference between faith and fact.
.

I can prove you are agnostic. You still are ignorant. I just got through saying there is no proof, but through faith one can finally see the truth that God exists. That there is evidence which can be presented and an argument can be made to show why people believe God exists. However, you really don't care about that because you do not want to believe. Or else you would educate yourself and come to your own conclusions.

There is a difference between faith in Christianity and other faiths and that only one is the truth and that is the Word of God in the Bible. You act like you already know that Christianity doesn't deal with facts. Nothing can be further from the truth. Atheists are usually wrong.

We humans have always created gods - sometimes multiple gods at one time - to provide us with guidance, comfort and answers.

Believers of these various gods have always been convinced, down to their very bones, that they had The Answer and that everyone else was just wrong.

Okay. That's fine. That still has never made those various gods real. And if you really don't see the difference between fact & faith, there's nothing I can say.
.

True, we have always invented gods. Many religions, however, know their gods are invented--or at least strongly suspect they are. IOW, they're stories, and they know it.

So maybe start by dividing up the faiths that are mythology and the ones who claim they're not.

Tough to tell them apart, and either way, I don't have proof that any of them actually exist.

Hey, I'm open to anything. When I become convinced of something, I'll run with it.
.

There is no evidence that the Norse gods exist, for example. It is mythology. There is plenty of evidence that people worshipped the Norse gods, but no historical evidence for their existence.

There is historical evidence for the man Jesus Christ, however, that historians accept. Most historians accept the existence of a man named Jesus. They do not accept the existence of god named Odin, just for starters. So you can start with that.

 

[Mac1958]

When you can prove it, I'm right here.

There is a difference between faith and fact.
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I can prove you are agnostic. You still are ignorant. I just got through saying there is no proof, but through faith one can finally see the truth that God exists. That there is evidence which can be presented and an argument can be made to show why people believe God exists. However, you really don't care about that because you do not want to believe. Or else you would educate yourself and come to your own conclusions.

There is a difference between faith in Christianity and other faiths and that only one is the truth and that is the Word of God in the Bible. You act like you already know that Christianity doesn't deal with facts. Nothing can be further from the truth. Atheists are usually wrong.

We humans have always created gods - sometimes multiple gods at one time - to provide us with guidance, comfort and answers.

Believers of these various gods have always been convinced, down to their very bones, that they had The Answer and that everyone else was just wrong.

Okay. That's fine. That still has never made those various gods real. And if you really don't see the difference between fact & faith, there's nothing I can say.
.

True, we have always invented gods. Many religions, however, know their gods are invented--or at least strongly suspect they are. IOW, they're stories, and they know it.

So maybe start by dividing up the faiths that are mythology and the ones who claim they're not.

Tough to tell them apart, and either way, I don't have proof that any of them actually exist.

Hey, I'm open to anything. When I become convinced of something, I'll run with it.
.

There is no evidence that the Norse gods exist, for example. It is mythology. There is plenty of evidence that people worshipped the Norse gods, but no historical evidence for their existence.

There is historical evidence for the man Jesus Christ, however, that historians accept. Most historians accept the existence of a man named Jesus. They do not accept the existence of god named Odin, just for starters. So you can start with that.

I'm not on any kind of search. If something presents itself, great. Until then, I'm perfectly comfy assuming that I'll never know The Answer.
.

 

[SweetSue92]

I can prove you are agnostic. You still are ignorant. I just got through saying there is no proof, but through faith one can finally see the truth that God exists. That there is evidence which can be presented and an argument can be made to show why people believe God exists. However, you really don't care about that because you do not want to believe. Or else you would educate yourself and come to your own conclusions.

There is a difference between faith in Christianity and other faiths and that only one is the truth and that is the Word of God in the Bible. You act like you already know that Christianity doesn't deal with facts. Nothing can be further from the truth. Atheists are usually wrong.

We humans have always created gods - sometimes multiple gods at one time - to provide us with guidance, comfort and answers.

Believers of these various gods have always been convinced, down to their very bones, that they had The Answer and that everyone else was just wrong.

Okay. That's fine. That still has never made those various gods real. And if you really don't see the difference between fact & faith, there's nothing I can say.
.

True, we have always invented gods. Many religions, however, know their gods are invented--or at least strongly suspect they are. IOW, they're stories, and they know it.

So maybe start by dividing up the faiths that are mythology and the ones who claim they're not.

Tough to tell them apart, and either way, I don't have proof that any of them actually exist.

Hey, I'm open to anything. When I become convinced of something, I'll run with it.
.

There is no evidence that the Norse gods exist, for example. It is mythology. There is plenty of evidence that people worshipped the Norse gods, but no historical evidence for their existence.

There is historical evidence for the man Jesus Christ, however, that historians accept. Most historians accept the existence of a man named Jesus. They do not accept the existence of god named Odin, just for starters. So you can start with that.

I'm not on any kind of search. If something presents itself, great. Until then, I'm perfectly comfy assuming that I'll never know The Answer.
.

That seems incurious, doesn't it?