Jesus on Marriage...

[PLYMCO_PILGRIM]

Yeah, that's what usually happens after somebody indicates repeatedly that LALALALALALLAAAAA!! They can't HEAR YOU!

I've been reading the thread all along waiting for someone to show where that religous text accepts homosexuality as being "Ok" instead of being a "sin". I have yet to see anyone post something that does so.

Again, you are deflecting away from that question by doing the easy thing...attacking the messanger.

No one is saying Jesus called homosexual sex "OK" or not a "sin", so why would a "messenger" pose such a strawman as an OP... AS IF anyone could ever provide evidence of such...that Jesus was "pro-gay marriage"?


It's the only kind of OP this dishonest coward named mal can post on and feel "right" while he pounds his fist on the table over and over for proof which does not exist.


Still, the gospel provides all sorts of verses and parables and lessons for how to treat each other. Nowhere does God say he wants people to slam the door of Christianity in the face of "sinners"; Jesus' message was in fact quite to the contrary...


Mal's "sin" du jour happens to be be gay sex but married people who are heterosexual are also "sinners" in other ways. You could literally go on and on ad infinitum.


I didn't see anyone claim Jesus would be "pro-gay marriage" as the OP cleverly poised himself to defend that strawman, but so what? Fact is, there are several Christian denominations which recognize and respect gay people in their community, so not all Christians are into demonizing gay people and condemning them from the Church community. IMO Christians who do that are an embarrassment to Christianity...


As far as civil Marriage, we are a Constitutional Republic which preserves the proper separation of Church and State and which defends the civil liberties of ALL Citizens, even the "sinners".

All that being said you just agreed with Mal's opening post. You agreed that the bible does not accept nor condone homosexual behavior.

 

[PLYMCO_PILGRIM]

Mal, I dub thee the dumbest fuck on the board.

So you're saying the Shellfish Reference is in Moral Law in Chapter 18?...

Interesting...

Link it.

Or you are the Dumbest, Most Dishonest Twat on these Forums.



peace...

Okay, and you're the dumbest twat as well.

You are being bad here BDBoop, I have neg repped you for being what I feel is dishonest in this thread.....my first one in 5 months

The spinning and ignoring the facts you are doing is just bad. Sorry if you are offended by my criticism of you in this thread.

 

[Valerie]

I've been reading the thread all along waiting for someone to show where that religous text accepts homosexuality as being "Ok" instead of being a "sin". I have yet to see anyone post something that does so.

Again, you are deflecting away from that question by doing the easy thing...attacking the messanger.

No one is saying Jesus called homosexual sex "OK" or not a "sin", so why would a "messenger" pose such a strawman as an OP... AS IF anyone could ever provide evidence of such...that Jesus was "pro-gay marriage"?


It's the only kind of OP this dishonest coward named mal can post on and feel "right" while he pounds his fist on the table over and over for proof which does not exist.


Still, the gospel provides all sorts of verses and parables and lessons for how to treat each other. Nowhere does God say he wants people to slam the door of Christianity in the face of "sinners"; Jesus' message was in fact quite to the contrary...


Mal's "sin" du jour happens to be be gay sex but married people who are heterosexual are also "sinners" in other ways. You could literally go on and on ad infinitum.


I didn't see anyone claim Jesus would be "pro-gay marriage" as the OP cleverly poised himself to defend that strawman, but so what? Fact is, there are several Christian denominations which recognize and respect gay people in their community, so not all Christians are into demonizing gay people and condemning them from the Church community. IMO Christians who do that are an embarrassment to Christianity...


As far as civil Marriage, we are a Constitutional Republic which preserves the proper separation of Church and State and which defends the civil liberties of ALL Citizens, even the "sinners".

All that being said you just agreed with Mal's opening post. You agreed that the bible does not accept nor condone homosexual behavior.

Right, the Bible doesn't condone sin...Apparently that's like breaking news to some people.


The United Church of Christ
Marriage Equality

 

[PLYMCO_PILGRIM]

are episcopalians christians?

I'm not religious but google says "The Episcopal Church (also officially known as the Protestant Episcopal Church in the United States of America) is a mainline Anglican Christian church"

 

[PLYMCO_PILGRIM]

are episcopalians christians?

Not according to mal.

Not according to the Old and New Testaments.

Embracing and giving Sanction to Sin and Abomination is Inherently UnChristian.

Fact not Fiction.

Find another Faith.



peace...

How do the testaments make it non-christian? Serious question by me I'm truly curious so keep that in mind please

 

[Caroljo]

An open mind and positive demeanor. How refreshing!
Okay so let's start with something basic and which the others ran from like the wind.

Matt. 5:31 - 32. So everyone who has gotten a divorce and remarried (other than for adultery) cannot go to heaven because they intentionally live in a state of adultery, which they do not try to repent from.

I don't subscribe to this belief.

But then, I don't think slaves should obey their masters either, so I'm kinda radical.

My take on "other than adultry" does not necessarily mean just having an affair with another person. Adultry in a marriage could mean many things...maybe it's the love of yourself more than you love your wife (or husband). This love of yourself more could also have something to do with how you treat your spouse. It could get violent if he or she doesn't feel the same way about you...you think he or she should love you the same way you love yourself. When that doesn't happen...that's where abuse comes in.

This is why i've always believed God would never want someone stay with anyone who abuses them. There are no other reasons to get a divorce.

So it all comes down to what does God "entirely" mean by adultry?

Actually, the ancient Aramaic word used very specific (I believe it was guara) and pertaining only to sex with someone other than a spouse. This was congruent with the ancient Greek texts as well. This is one of those text that every original maunscript is exact on.
My view of it is different than yours. Like many, many things in the Bible, it is one that needs understanding of the cultural context. I don't know if you're aware of it but at the time, men would marry girls between the age of 12 - 15. Then when they hit their 20's, they were stronger, more independent and "old". They could not legall divorce their husbands BUT the hubbies would see young girls walking around and well Hmmmm. Unfortunately, wives require feeding and such. Too many can make you broke. Same with kids. So they would divorce the wife and decide whether any kids through them were worth keeping. If not, they're all on the streets. Since the wife was no longer a virgin, no man would marry her. So she was left with two options: Begging or prostitution. Nice guys, those ancient Jews, eh?
So my take on this verse? I simply ignore it. I know that sounds like GASP!!!! What a heretic! But seriously, all Christians do that with lots of verses. And for good reason. A lot of verses were written specifically for the cultural circumstances of the time.
Also, keep in mind, there were HUNDREDS of Gospels, epistles etc... Lots of them directly contradicted what eventually became Catholic doctrine, so they were simply thrown out. Which means that tens of thousands of verses were dumped already. Well heck. If a bunch of power-hungry control freaks can dump 70%+ of the original Bible, I can take my understanding of the context and let me heart guide me.

Did I mention I have my degree in Christian theology? I actually thought about another career path, once upon a time but there is an old saying "No one comes out of seminary with the beliefs they went in with." Happens. )

No you didn't say you had a degree...
I do know the Bible isn't complete...because of what you pointed out. So i do know too that what i take from the Bible i need to follow my heart to know what to believe and how to interpret it. None of us are going to know exactly what God was say in most of it because "times have changed". Much of what was spoken about had to do with THAT time, not this. We won't know for sure of anything until we're out of this world and with God.

There are so many interpretations of the Bible and so many different types of people and beliefs it's no wonder everyone has problems understanding. But, some things are VERY clear. Especially in the NT where Jesus teaches us...what He says i take literally. Like with this OP...it's very clear what Jesus said about homosexuality. But many people will come right out and say that it's not even in the Bible!

I wish i had the time to really study the Bible like i should. I really want to know the truth about all of it. I really don't even believe that someone that gets a degree, like you have, REALLY knows the complete truth...you "were" taught by man. But you're probably closer to it than i am .

 

[Douger]

C'mon man. If GaWd didn't want it to be you'd have a tiny asshole and shit like a rabbit !

 

[Valerie]

are episcopalians christians?

I'm not religious but google says "The Episcopal Church (also officially known as the Protestant Episcopal Church in the United States of America) is a mainline Anglican Christian church"

He was being facetious.

 

[Caroljo]

Why is that? Is it maybe because so very many churches are actually spiritually toxic?

I think you're right. I would call it toxic for a church to teach people only parts of God's word. We're to teach the Gospels in all parts of the world...that means the ENTIRE WORD OF GOD. I call myself a Christian because i believe in God's word and believe in his only son Jesus Christ. But what bothers me most is that so many people call themselves Christians but they've never really heard the entire word of God. Many believe if their preacher has not told them about it, then it must be a lie.

I'm kinda puzzled by people who call themselves Christians but who don't believe that Christ was resurrected.

No kidding!! There's a woman i work with that says she's christian and goes to church (i don't know which one) but she's NEVER heard of the Book of Revelation!!!

 

[PLYMCO_PILGRIM]

No one is saying Jesus called homosexual sex "OK" or not a "sin", so why would a "messenger" pose such a strawman as an OP... AS IF anyone could ever provide evidence of such...that Jesus was "pro-gay marriage"?


It's the only kind of OP this dishonest coward named mal can post on and feel "right" while he pounds his fist on the table over and over for proof which does not exist.


Still, the gospel provides all sorts of verses and parables and lessons for how to treat each other. Nowhere does God say he wants people to slam the door of Christianity in the face of "sinners"; Jesus' message was in fact quite to the contrary...


Mal's "sin" du jour happens to be be gay sex but married people who are heterosexual are also "sinners" in other ways. You could literally go on and on ad infinitum.


I didn't see anyone claim Jesus would be "pro-gay marriage" as the OP cleverly poised himself to defend that strawman, but so what? Fact is, there are several Christian denominations which recognize and respect gay people in their community, so not all Christians are into demonizing gay people and condemning them from the Church community. IMO Christians who do that are an embarrassment to Christianity...


As far as civil Marriage, we are a Constitutional Republic which preserves the proper separation of Church and State and which defends the civil liberties of ALL Citizens, even the "sinners".

All that being said you just agreed with Mal's opening post. You agreed that the bible does not accept nor condone homosexual behavior.

Right, the Bible doesn't condone sin...Apparently that's like breaking news to some people.


The United Church of Christ
Marriage Equality

it is, and yes that is funny!

 

[PLYMCO_PILGRIM]

are episcopalians christians?

I'm not religious but google says "The Episcopal Church (also officially known as the Protestant Episcopal Church in the United States of America) is a mainline Anglican Christian church"

He was being facetious.

I figured but I try to not assume things when I respond .

I don't get all these different versions of religions....i just believe in a power greater than mankind which I call GOD, the man-written stories of the world's religious texts have no bearing on that belief for me. I have a great disdain for religions.

 

[BDBoop]

I'm not religious but google says "The Episcopal Church (also officially known as the Protestant Episcopal Church in the United States of America) is a mainline Anglican Christian church"

He was being facetious.

I figured but I try to not assume things when I respond .

I don't get all these different versions of religions....i just believe in a power greater than mankind which I call GOD, the man-written stories of the world's religious texts have no bearing on that belief for me. I have a great disdain for religions.

And THAT would be what I was saying. I left the Bible behind after a couple of decades of being abused with it. *No, I'm not a slow learner. I just had it in my head that you couldn't be a person of 'that' faith without going to church.*

My faith is my own. I believe Jesus was who he said he was, and did what he came to do. I believe God has gotten me through some of the darkest days of my soul. I believe there are Christian gays. I believe this shit hole is tough enough without helping each other through it, and believe me when I tell you; judging and condemnation are of the devil. Mal has some serious issues, and he's using God and the Bible to do as much damage as possible.

I know some AMAZING Christian people. I have a woman in my life who literally personifies Christ. I've never felt so much love, certainly not from my own mother. So I know what the 'real deal' looks like. And sunshine? This ain't it.

 

[BDBoop]

So you're saying the Shellfish Reference is in Moral Law in Chapter 18?...

Interesting...

Link it.

Or you are the Dumbest, Most Dishonest Twat on these Forums.



peace...

Okay, and you're the dumbest twat as well.

You are being bad here BDBoop, I have neg repped you for being what I feel is dishonest in this thread.....my first one in 5 months

The spinning and ignoring the facts you are doing is just bad. Sorry if you are offended by my criticism of you in this thread.

And now you know why.

 

[BDBoop]

I hope you don't like shellfish.

Jewish Ceremonial Law and it's not in Leviticus 18...

Beastiality and Homosexuality are... And Homosexuality is called Abomination... Beastiality is called Confusion.

Don't bear False Witness.



peace...

No, it's not in Leviticus 18. But then, I didn't say it was, did I.


Lev 11:10

Whatsoever hath no fins nor scales in the waters, that shall be an abomination unto you.

 

[BDBoop]

Actually, the ancient Aramaic word used very specific (I believe it was guara) and pertaining only to sex with someone other than a spouse. This was congruent with the ancient Greek texts as well. This is one of those text that every original maunscript is exact on.
My view of it is different than yours. Like many, many things in the Bible, it is one that needs understanding of the cultural context. I don't know if you're aware of it but at the time, men would marry girls between the age of 12 - 15. Then when they hit their 20's, they were stronger, more independent and "old". They could not legall divorce their husbands BUT the hubbies would see young girls walking around and well Hmmmm. Unfortunately, wives require feeding and such. Too many can make you broke. Same with kids. So they would divorce the wife and decide whether any kids through them were worth keeping. If not, they're all on the streets. Since the wife was no longer a virgin, no man would marry her. So she was left with two options: Begging or prostitution. Nice guys, those ancient Jews, eh?
So my take on this verse? I simply ignore it. I know that sounds like GASP!!!! What a heretic! But seriously, all Christians do that with lots of verses. And for good reason. A lot of verses were written specifically for the cultural circumstances of the time.
Also, keep in mind, there were HUNDREDS of Gospels, epistles etc... Lots of them directly contradicted what eventually became Catholic doctrine, so they were simply thrown out. Which means that tens of thousands of verses were dumped already. Well heck. If a bunch of power-hungry control freaks can dump 70%+ of the original Bible, I can take my understanding of the context and let me heart guide me.

Did I mention I have my degree in Christian theology? I actually thought about another career path, once upon a time but there is an old saying "No one comes out of seminary with the beliefs they went in with." Happens. )

You rock.

 

[Douger]

I hope you don't like shellfish.

Jewish Ceremonial Law and it's not in Leviticus 18...

Beastiality and Homosexuality are... And Homosexuality is called Abomination... Beastiality is called Confusion.

Don't bear False Witness.



peace...

No, it's not in Leviticus 18. But then, I didn't say it was, did I.

Lev 11:10

Whatsoever hath no fins nor scales in the waters, that shall be an abomination unto you.

That's so the scribes could have an abundance for themselves.

 

[PLYMCO_PILGRIM]

Okay, and you're the dumbest twat as well.

You are being bad here BDBoop, I have neg repped you for being what I feel is dishonest in this thread.....my first one in 5 months

The spinning and ignoring the facts you are doing is just bad. Sorry if you are offended by my criticism of you in this thread.

And now you know why.

yes and I feel like a douche for negging you earlier....wanted to say that publicly

 

[Artevelde]

Actually, the ancient Aramaic word used very specific (I believe it was guara) and pertaining only to sex with someone other than a spouse. This was congruent with the ancient Greek texts as well. This is one of those text that every original maunscript is exact on.
My view of it is different than yours. Like many, many things in the Bible, it is one that needs understanding of the cultural context. I don't know if you're aware of it but at the time, men would marry girls between the age of 12 - 15. Then when they hit their 20's, they were stronger, more independent and "old". They could not legall divorce their husbands BUT the hubbies would see young girls walking around and well Hmmmm. Unfortunately, wives require feeding and such. Too many can make you broke. Same with kids. So they would divorce the wife and decide whether any kids through them were worth keeping. If not, they're all on the streets. Since the wife was no longer a virgin, no man would marry her. So she was left with two options: Begging or prostitution. Nice guys, those ancient Jews, eh?
So my take on this verse? I simply ignore it. I know that sounds like GASP!!!! What a heretic! But seriously, all Christians do that with lots of verses. And for good reason. A lot of verses were written specifically for the cultural circumstances of the time.
Also, keep in mind, there were HUNDREDS of Gospels, epistles etc... Lots of them directly contradicted what eventually became Catholic doctrine, so they were simply thrown out. Which means that tens of thousands of verses were dumped already. Well heck. If a bunch of power-hungry control freaks can dump 70%+ of the original Bible, I can take my understanding of the context and let me heart guide me.

Did I mention I have my degree in Christian theology? I actually thought about another career path, once upon a time but there is an old saying "No one comes out of seminary with the beliefs they went in with." Happens. )

You rock.

Yes, it figures you would like stupidity and hypocrisy.

 

[Ravi]

I hope you don't like shellfish.

Jewish Ceremonial Law and it's not in Leviticus 18...

Beastiality and Homosexuality are... And Homosexuality is called Abomination... Beastiality is called Confusion.

Don't bear False Witness.



peace...

No, it's not in Leviticus 18. But then, I didn't say it was, did I.


Lev 11:10

Whatsoever hath no fins nor scales in the waters, that shall be an abomination unto you.

He only reads the parts of the Bible that excite him.

 

[Artevelde]

Hmmm. So I'm not gay. I'm a Christian, albeit a rather unconventional one. I can easily forgive gays for simply being who they are.
Thus, I am more loving, tolerant, compassionate, understanding and forgiving than God.

Well, at least the interpretation of God I've read about from some of the people here.
Interesting.

Provide one Quote from the Old or New Testaments that has God or Jesus even Tolerant of Homosexuality...
I'll be here.

peace...

Jesus was silent before Pontius Pilate. He knew when it was a waste of time. Thus it is with you. It's not like you have an open mind. You remind me of Muslims who use the Qu'Ran to kill people. You have a religion based on seperation, judgmentalism and hatred.
Oh well. It's not like you're alone or even unusual.
For centuries, prophets have brought messages of love and peace.
And always, The Message has been ignored and worship of the Messenger has been used as justification for petty judgmentalism, violence, elitism etc...

From my book The Las Vegas Times Dictionary (available on Amazon, shameless plug time!)

Bible: n A holy tome which tells people four things:
1. There is one God and He is not found in a church.
2. Don’t judge others, focus on your own path.
3. Love and tolerate everyone. Especially those you might be tempted to look down upon or call your enemies.
4. Don’t go around hurting or murdering each other. Really, it’s not very nice and God doesn’t like it.
The result of man’s interpretation of this book has been:
1. The belief that God can only be found in a church – and it must be the right one.
2. The condemnation by members of one church, of others who do not go to the same church.
3. A self-righteousness and judgmental intolerance of anyone deemed “sinful” by those who consider their own sins to be of superior quality and
4. The Crusades, Spanish Inquisition, KKK, bombing of planned parenthood centers, and the election of Conservative politicians.

So yes, don't worry about that plank in your eye. Tell us how wrong and sinful and what an abomination other people are. Throw the first stone. Judge thy neighbor. Those whom you consider the lowest, will be uh... the lowest. Hate thy enemy. Got it.

So basically, you have the ability to love and accept those of whom you judge worthy of your personal approval and are comfortable with. Impressive brand of religion ya got there...

Must be one of the most anti-Christian postings on this forum.