Liberal Seeks To Understand #2: DeVos and the Education Department

[wjmacguffin]

Unlike some liberals, I want to understand instead of judge. That's why I'm asking some questions to conservatives here. I may not agree with you, but I'm hoping to improve my understanding and empathy by seeking first to understand. As usual, respectful answers get respectful replies.

The question: Why is Betsy DeVos a good choice for Secretary of Education?

What is her appeal to conservatives? From what I've read, she is a wealthy political insider who has no experience in public schools (which she is now in charge of) and doesn't understand public school law. DeVos doesn't appear qualified or experienced (which would not even get you an interview in many professional jobs). Is it just because she advocates for school choice?

FINE PRINT: Let's try to not get mired in the school choice debate. This is just about why conservatives like DeVos.

 

[Soggy in NOLA]

You'll first have to tell us what exactly is "public school law".

 

[wjmacguffin]

You'll first have to tell us what exactly is "public school law".

Actually, I'm just asking why conservatives like DeVos. But to answer your question, "public school law" includes the laws, rules, regulations, and court rulings that apply to public schools in the US.

 

[IcebergSlim]

You'll first have to tell us what exactly is "public school law".

Actually, I'm just asking why conservatives like DeVos. But to answer your question, "public school law" includes the laws, rules, regulations, and court rulings that apply to public schools in the US.

You are asking people, entirely disinclined to cogitate, to formulate an argument to support their "feelings".....

This demands a capacity to link two THOUGHTS in rational sequence......I suggest that you start slowly.....invite them to link an urge and an itch......

 

[Iceweasel]

Unlike some liberals, I want to understand instead of judge. That's why I'm asking some questions to conservatives here. I may not agree with you, but I'm hoping to improve my understanding and empathy by seeking first to understand. As usual, respectful answers get respectful replies.

The question: Why is Betsy DeVos a good choice for Secretary of Education?

What is her appeal to conservatives? From what I've read, she is a wealthy political insider who has no experience in public schools (which she is now in charge of) and doesn't understand public school law. DeVos doesn't appear qualified or experienced (which would not even get you an interview in many professional jobs). Is it just because she advocates for school choice?

FINE PRINT: Let's try to not get mired in the school choice debate. This is just about why conservatives like DeVos.

This is typical for liberals. You demand respectful replies but are insulting to the hilt in framing your question. You already reached a decision and pretend to be above it all. I'm sick of it and call libs out when I see it.

First off, she's highly successful. An employer would be a idiot to not hire her. I have no idea how you arrived at her not qualified or experienced enough for even an interview. What are YOUR accomplishments?

Secondly, Jimmy Carter started the Dept. of Education, somehow we managed until then. Out of the 11 that served only 4 have an educator degree. And it was never a problem before now. Ask yourself why, Mr. Honest Liberal.

Betsy DeVos tapped by Donald Trump for education secretary
DeVos' background is a fit for Trump's plans to boost school choice in the U.S., particularly for high-poverty students. She is on the board of directors for the Great Lakes Education Project, which advocates for school choice and charter schools. She also chairs the board of directors of the American Federation for Children, another choice advocacy group.

DeVos and her husband led a failed effort to amend the Michigan constitution to provide vouchers that would allow students to attend private schools at public expense. That's a centerpiece of Trump's education plan. He would invest $20 billion in federal money toward school choice, and expect states to kick in $110 billion of their own money, to provide $12,000 each in school choice funds to the 11 million school-age children living in poverty.

 

[IcebergSlim]

Unlike some liberals, I want to understand instead of judge. That's why I'm asking some questions to conservatives here. I may not agree with you, but I'm hoping to improve my understanding and empathy by seeking first to understand. As usual, respectful answers get respectful replies.

The question: Why is Betsy DeVos a good choice for Secretary of Education?

What is her appeal to conservatives? From what I've read, she is a wealthy political insider who has no experience in public schools (which she is now in charge of) and doesn't understand public school law. DeVos doesn't appear qualified or experienced (which would not even get you an interview in many professional jobs). Is it just because she advocates for school choice?

FINE PRINT: Let's try to not get mired in the school choice debate. This is just about why conservatives like DeVos.

This is typical for liberals. You demand respectful replies but are insulting to the hilt in framing your question. You already reached a decision and pretend to be above it all. I'm sick of it and call libs out when I see it.

First off, she's highly successful. An employer would be a idiot to not hire her. I have no idea how you arrived at her not qualified or experienced enough for even an interview. What are YOUR accomplishments?

Secondly, Jimmy Carter started the Dept. of Education, somehow we managed until then. Out of the 11 that served only 4 have an educator degree. And it was never a problem before now. Ask yourself why, Mr. Honest Liberal.

Betsy DeVos tapped by Donald Trump for education secretary
DeVos' background is a fit for Trump's plans to boost school choice in the U.S., particularly for high-poverty students. She is on the board of directors for the Great Lakes Education Project, which advocates for school choice and charter schools. She also chairs the board of directors of the American Federation for Children, another choice advocacy group.

DeVos and her husband led a failed effort to amend the Michigan constitution to provide vouchers that would allow students to attend private schools at public expense. That's a centerpiece of Trump's education plan. He would invest $20 billion in federal money toward school choice, and expect states to kick in $110 billion of their own money, to provide $12,000 each in school choice funds to the 11 million school-age children living in poverty.

IceIce TRIES to persist through his butthurt to step up on behalf of his Tribe.....

After the predictable preamble, IceIce reaches for some propaganda extolling Devos' qualifications...

The woman majored in "business something", and married rich......the experience you cite is entirely "honorary".....when asked about THE METRICS relating to determining student achievement and progress, the woman was COMPLETELY without a clue....and she PLAGIARIZED at least two responses to the Committee......that is an offense punishable by dismissal, withholding, or even revocation of a degree.....

Compare her cv to that of Arne Duncan........it is beyond tragic...

 

[sartre play]

She bought the job, now we will have to wait and see what will happen to public schools, the place where most children go to school.

 

[BlackFlag]

First off, she's highly successful. An employer would be a idiot to not hire her. I have no idea how you arrived at her not qualified or experienced enough for even an interview.

Please explain. Does marrying into money count as successful? Does using that money to sway political opinions for years count as a qualification?

 

[wjmacguffin]

This is typical for liberals. You demand respectful replies but are insulting to the hilt in framing your question. You already reached a decision and pretend to be above it all. I'm sick of it and call libs out when I see it.

First off, she's highly successful. An employer would be a idiot to not hire her. I have no idea how you arrived at her not qualified or experienced enough for even an interview. What are YOUR accomplishments?

Secondly, Jimmy Carter started the Dept. of Education, somehow we managed until then. Out of the 11 that served only 4 have an educator degree. And it was never a problem before now. Ask yourself why, Mr. Honest Liberal.

Betsy DeVos tapped by Donald Trump for education secretary
DeVos' background is a fit for Trump's plans to boost school choice in the U.S., particularly for high-poverty students. She is on the board of directors for the Great Lakes Education Project, which advocates for school choice and charter schools. She also chairs the board of directors of the American Federation for Children, another choice advocacy group.

DeVos and her husband led a failed effort to amend the Michigan constitution to provide vouchers that would allow students to attend private schools at public expense. That's a centerpiece of Trump's education plan. He would invest $20 billion in federal money toward school choice, and expect states to kick in $110 billion of their own money, to provide $12,000 each in school choice funds to the 11 million school-age children living in poverty.

1) I did not demand respect. I said I'd return respect if its given. This isn't my message board, so you can be as rude as you feel the need to be. If you want to call me out, at least call me out on something I actually wrote.

2) Sorry for the miscommunication about qualifications. Let me clarify what I meant. A person with a BA in Chemistry and 20 years' experience as a chemist is very successful -- but if she applied for a Director of Marketing position, her lack of relevant education and experience would mean she'd never get hired. That's how DeVos looks to me, but I could be wrong. If I am, I'd be thankful if you could explain or link to why.

3) You're correct about education degrees and Education Secretaries. Is that why you approve of her nomination, that she doesn't need a degree because others did not? (For the record, I'm not saying she's bad. I'm just trying to understand your perspective.)

4) Yeah, I know about DeVos' commitment to school choice. Is that the big reason for your support? I'm guessing so given the lines you devoted to it, but I don't want to put words in your mouth.

 

[wjmacguffin]

Betsy DeVos tapped by Donald Trump for education secretary
DeVos' background is a fit for Trump's plans to boost school choice in the U.S., particularly for high-poverty students. She is on the board of directors for the Great Lakes Education Project, which advocates for school choice and charter schools. She also chairs the board of directors of the American Federation for Children, another choice advocacy group.

DeVos and her husband led a failed effort to amend the Michigan constitution to provide vouchers that would allow students to attend private schools at public expense. That's a centerpiece of Trump's education plan. He would invest $20 billion in federal money toward school choice, and expect states to kick in $110 billion of their own money, to provide $12,000 each in school choice funds to the 11 million school-age children living in poverty.

Sorry, one last question. On the surface, it looks like DeVos had been an advocate for school choice but lacks any management or education experience. Again, I'm fine with being wrong. Is it that DeVos is experienced with politics about school choice?

 

[dannyboys]

Unlike some liberals, I want to understand instead of judge. That's why I'm asking some questions to conservatives here. I may not agree with you, but I'm hoping to improve my understanding and empathy by seeking first to understand. As usual, respectful answers get respectful replies.

The question: Why is Betsy DeVos a good choice for Secretary of Education?

What is her appeal to conservatives? From what I've read, she is a wealthy political insider who has no experience in public schools (which she is now in charge of) and doesn't understand public school law. DeVos doesn't appear qualified or experienced (which would not even get you an interview in many professional jobs). Is it just because she advocates for school choice?

FINE PRINT: Let's try to not get mired in the school choice debate. This is just about why conservatives like DeVos.

Fuck off! Don't come here and start demanding any 'respect' you haven't earned!
Permanent Ignore!

 

[Iceweasel]

First off, she's highly successful. An employer would be a idiot to not hire her. I have no idea how you arrived at her not qualified or experienced enough for even an interview.

Please explain. Does marrying into money count as successful? Does using that money to sway political opinions for years count as a qualification?

First off, she's highly successful. An employer would be a idiot to not hire her. I have no idea how you arrived at her not qualified or experienced enough for even an interview.

Please explain. Does marrying into money count as successful? Does using that money to sway political opinions for years count as a qualification?

No, asshole. I gave some reasons. If you want to pop your had out of your ass for a few minutes and read up on her ...

Betsy DeVos

 

[Iceweasel]

This is typical for liberals. You demand respectful replies but are insulting to the hilt in framing your question. You already reached a decision and pretend to be above it all. I'm sick of it and call libs out when I see it.

First off, she's highly successful. An employer would be a idiot to not hire her. I have no idea how you arrived at her not qualified or experienced enough for even an interview. What are YOUR accomplishments?

Secondly, Jimmy Carter started the Dept. of Education, somehow we managed until then. Out of the 11 that served only 4 have an educator degree. And it was never a problem before now. Ask yourself why, Mr. Honest Liberal.

Betsy DeVos tapped by Donald Trump for education secretary
DeVos' background is a fit for Trump's plans to boost school choice in the U.S., particularly for high-poverty students. She is on the board of directors for the Great Lakes Education Project, which advocates for school choice and charter schools. She also chairs the board of directors of the American Federation for Children, another choice advocacy group.

DeVos and her husband led a failed effort to amend the Michigan constitution to provide vouchers that would allow students to attend private schools at public expense. That's a centerpiece of Trump's education plan. He would invest $20 billion in federal money toward school choice, and expect states to kick in $110 billion of their own money, to provide $12,000 each in school choice funds to the 11 million school-age children living in poverty.

1) I did not demand respect. I said I'd return respect if its given. This isn't my message board, so you can be as rude as you feel the need to be. If you want to call me out, at least call me out on something I actually wrote.

2) Sorry for the miscommunication about qualifications. Let me clarify what I meant. A person with a BA in Chemistry and 20 years' experience as a chemist is very successful -- but if she applied for a Director of Marketing position, her lack of relevant education and experience would mean she'd never get hired. That's how DeVos looks to me, but I could be wrong. If I am, I'd be thankful if you could explain or link to why.

3) You're correct about education degrees and Education Secretaries. Is that why you approve of her nomination, that she doesn't need a degree because others did not? (For the record, I'm not saying she's bad. I'm just trying to understand your perspective.)

4) Yeah, I know about DeVos' commitment to school choice. Is that the big reason for your support? I'm guessing so given the lines you devoted to it, but I don't want to put words in your mouth.

The tone of your post was condescending, you can polish it up all you want but it will be no sale.

You ignored the point that only 4 out of the 11 had an educators' background and there's no particular qualification for the job. Her goals mirrored Trump so I imagine that factored into the equation. The point was no particular degree was necessary but now all of a sudden liberals are deeply concerned. Maybe you can't see the hypocrisy. So if you need it baby walked, that would be the main point, liberal hypocrisy.

Hell yes, I'm for competition in schools. Competing makes one hone their skills. The union stranglehold does the opposite.

 

[BlackFlag]

First off, she's highly successful. An employer would be a idiot to not hire her. I have no idea how you arrived at her not qualified or experienced enough for even an interview.

Please explain. Does marrying into money count as successful? Does using that money to sway political opinions for years count as a qualification?

First off, she's highly successful. An employer would be a idiot to not hire her. I have no idea how you arrived at her not qualified or experienced enough for even an interview.

Please explain. Does marrying into money count as successful? Does using that money to sway political opinions for years count as a qualification?

No, asshole. I gave some reasons. If you want to pop your had out of your ass for a few minutes and read up on her ...

Betsy DeVos

I've already seen that. And as far as I can tell you only gave one reason. And it's that she agrees with Trump that she should give yours and my money to private schools instead of public schools.

 

[Iceweasel]

Betsy DeVos tapped by Donald Trump for education secretary
DeVos' background is a fit for Trump's plans to boost school choice in the U.S., particularly for high-poverty students. She is on the board of directors for the Great Lakes Education Project, which advocates for school choice and charter schools. She also chairs the board of directors of the American Federation for Children, another choice advocacy group.

DeVos and her husband led a failed effort to amend the Michigan constitution to provide vouchers that would allow students to attend private schools at public expense. That's a centerpiece of Trump's education plan. He would invest $20 billion in federal money toward school choice, and expect states to kick in $110 billion of their own money, to provide $12,000 each in school choice funds to the 11 million school-age children living in poverty.

Sorry, one last question. On the surface, it looks like DeVos had been an advocate for school choice but lacks any management or education experience. Again, I'm fine with being wrong. Is it that DeVos is experienced with politics about school choice?

Politics is why presidents pick cabinet members. How can that possibly be news to you? I already addressed the relevance of education backgrounds for the position, I'm not going to repeat it over and over for you.

She's the former chairman of The Windquest Group:

The Windquest Group - a Michigan-based, investment management firm. | The Windquest Group
Welcome to The Windquest Group
The Windquest Group is a Michigan-based, privately held enterprise and investment management firm with diversified projects in technology, manufacturing, clean-tech, hospitality, and nonprofit solutions.

Lacks management experience? You have an odd choice for words. It's probably more than others in the position. Personally the fact that she hasn't been involved with a corrupt public-ed system is a big plus for me.

 

[Iceweasel]

First off, she's highly successful. An employer would be a idiot to not hire her. I have no idea how you arrived at her not qualified or experienced enough for even an interview.

Please explain. Does marrying into money count as successful? Does using that money to sway political opinions for years count as a qualification?

First off, she's highly successful. An employer would be a idiot to not hire her. I have no idea how you arrived at her not qualified or experienced enough for even an interview.

Please explain. Does marrying into money count as successful? Does using that money to sway political opinions for years count as a qualification?

No, asshole. I gave some reasons. If you want to pop your had out of your ass for a few minutes and read up on her ...

Betsy DeVos

I've already seen that. And as far as I can tell you only gave one reason. And it's that she agrees with Trump that she should give yours and my money to private schools instead of public schools.

Yep, I gave one reason, didn't go into it to any great detail because no one needs to sell her to you. What you accept or not doesn't change anything for anyone else.

 

[IcebergSlim]

Betsy DeVos tapped by Donald Trump for education secretary
DeVos' background is a fit for Trump's plans to boost school choice in the U.S., particularly for high-poverty students. She is on the board of directors for the Great Lakes Education Project, which advocates for school choice and charter schools. She also chairs the board of directors of the American Federation for Children, another choice advocacy group.

DeVos and her husband led a failed effort to amend the Michigan constitution to provide vouchers that would allow students to attend private schools at public expense. That's a centerpiece of Trump's education plan. He would invest $20 billion in federal money toward school choice, and expect states to kick in $110 billion of their own money, to provide $12,000 each in school choice funds to the 11 million school-age children living in poverty.

Sorry, one last question. On the surface, it looks like DeVos had been an advocate for school choice but lacks any management or education experience. Again, I'm fine with being wrong. Is it that DeVos is experienced with politics about school choice?

Politics is why presidents pick cabinet members. How can that possibly be news to you? I already addressed the relevance of education backgrounds for the position, I'm not going to repeat it over and over for you.

She's the former chairman of The Windquest Group:

The Windquest Group - a Michigan-based, investment management firm. | The Windquest Group
Welcome to The Windquest Group
The Windquest Group is a Michigan-based, privately held enterprise and investment management firm with diversified projects in technology, manufacturing, clean-tech, hospitality, and nonprofit solutions.

Lacks management experience? You have an odd choice for words. It's probably more than others in the position. Personally the fact that she hasn't been involved with a corrupt public-ed system is a big plus for me.

The Windquest Group
Do you have any reason to believe that her hubby engaged in a nationwide search before putting her in that position?

 

[BlackFlag]

First off, she's highly successful. An employer would be a idiot to not hire her. I have no idea how you arrived at her not qualified or experienced enough for even an interview.

Please explain. Does marrying into money count as successful? Does using that money to sway political opinions for years count as a qualification?

First off, she's highly successful. An employer would be a idiot to not hire her. I have no idea how you arrived at her not qualified or experienced enough for even an interview.

Please explain. Does marrying into money count as successful? Does using that money to sway political opinions for years count as a qualification?

No, asshole. I gave some reasons. If you want to pop your had out of your ass for a few minutes and read up on her ...

Betsy DeVos

I've already seen that. And as far as I can tell you only gave one reason. And it's that she agrees with Trump that she should give yours and my money to private schools instead of public schools.

Yep, I gave one reason, didn't go into it to any great detail because no one needs to sell her to you. What you accept or not doesn't change anything for anyone else.

This woman has zero experience in implementing that kind of plan. And she's lived as a billionaire for decades, completely out of touch with most of our population. As far as I can tell, she's where she is thanks to throwing around political donations for the last 40 years. Not encouraging.

 

[IcebergSlim]

First off, she's highly successful. An employer would be a idiot to not hire her. I have no idea how you arrived at her not qualified or experienced enough for even an interview.

Please explain. Does marrying into money count as successful? Does using that money to sway political opinions for years count as a qualification?

First off, she's highly successful. An employer would be a idiot to not hire her. I have no idea how you arrived at her not qualified or experienced enough for even an interview.

Please explain. Does marrying into money count as successful? Does using that money to sway political opinions for years count as a qualification?

No, asshole. I gave some reasons. If you want to pop your had out of your ass for a few minutes and read up on her ...

Betsy DeVos

I've already seen that. And as far as I can tell you only gave one reason. And it's that she agrees with Trump that she should give yours and my money to private schools instead of public schools.

Yep, I gave one reason, didn't go into it to any great detail because no one needs to sell her to you. What you accept or not doesn't change anything for anyone else.

Se has NO qualifications.....zero.....none.....agreeing with an uninformed pillock like IceIce is not enough...

 

[Iceweasel]

First off, she's highly successful. An employer would be a idiot to not hire her. I have no idea how you arrived at her not qualified or experienced enough for even an interview.

Please explain. Does marrying into money count as successful? Does using that money to sway political opinions for years count as a qualification?

First off, she's highly successful. An employer would be a idiot to not hire her. I have no idea how you arrived at her not qualified or experienced enough for even an interview.

Please explain. Does marrying into money count as successful? Does using that money to sway political opinions for years count as a qualification?

No, asshole. I gave some reasons. If you want to pop your had out of your ass for a few minutes and read up on her ...

Betsy DeVos

I've already seen that. And as far as I can tell you only gave one reason. And it's that she agrees with Trump that she should give yours and my money to private schools instead of public schools.

Yep, I gave one reason, didn't go into it to any great detail because no one needs to sell her to you. What you accept or not doesn't change anything for anyone else.

This woman has zero experience in implementing that kind of plan. And she's lived as a billionaire for decades, completely out of touch with most of our population. As far as I can tell, she's where she is thanks to throwing around political donations for the last 40 years. Not encouraging.

That's not what a chairman or CEO does. They put together a team and make decisions based on the accumulated information. But I didn't ever hear one liberal complain about Democrats with no experience getting an office.