Nelson Mandela dead

[bigrebnc1775]

LOL


If it gets anymore stupid in here, I'm going to have to throw a Stupid Party.

Whining? Stfu, I drop knowledge.

All these ppl hating on King, Mandela, and Obama.

While those men are the ones who face racism all their lives from whites.

But for some reason, many ppl feel the need to bash THEM, and not the racists that they faced!




LOL


STFU

King Mandela ok they faced racism, but obama? Really?
What racism did he face

 

[paperview]

What about those soldiers in the south?

Those were the ones fighting on behalf of a government who started a war to preserve and perpetuate slavery.

You haven't study the war have you, using talking points you've been fed because it's a simple thing to believe in is not a point of argument.

Not only have I studied the war, I make my living in history. I have personally handled literally tens of thousands of original Civil War letters, diaries and documents, some of which now reside in the Smithsonian, LOC, and various Museums and Historical Societies throughout the country. I occasionally get asked for advice by these institutions, and have been paid to give talks to Historical Societies and Civil War Roundtables.

I've held in my hands documents once held by Abraham Lincoln, Jefferson Davis, as well as personal letters from General Grant and Robert E. Lee, (I'll add: this rare opportunity few people in the world get to experience, is quite humbling) -- as well as many, many other Generals and officers. North and South.

I get paid a decent penny to analyze and research these items and have for decades. It's purchased my lovely house and gorgeous acreage. I'm pretty sure my CW history background and credentials are above and beyond the average Lost Cause pluck who deems himself an expert.

I know it makes you feel like you are some sort of special to discard anyone who disagrees with you by chirping out "that's what you've been fed," but really, it just makes you look stupid.

 

[Black_Man1]

Well let's just stop right there with King and Mandela facing racism.

Ok, so WHY are King and Mandela being slandered this topic FAR MORE than the unjust racist they faced?

See what I mean?



Dig That...

 

[bigrebnc1775]

Those were the ones fighting on behalf of a government who started a war to preserve and perpetuate slavery.

You haven't study the war have you, using talking points you've been fed because it's a simple thing to believe in is not a point of argument.

Not only have I studied the war, I make my living in history. I have personally handled literally tens of thousands of original Civil War letters, diaries and documents, some of which now reside in the Smithsonian, LOC, and various Museums and Historical Societies throughout the country. I occasionally get asked for advice by these institutions, and have been paid to give talks to Historical Societies and Civil War Roundtables.

I've held in my hands documents once held by Abraham Lincoln, Jefferson Davis, as well as personal letters from General Grant and Robert E. Lee, (I'll add: this rare opportunity few people in the world get to experience, is quite humbling) -- as well as many, many other Generals and officers. North and South.

I get paid a decent penny to analyze and research these items and have for decades. It's purchased my lovely house and gorgeous acreage. I'm pretty sure my CW history background and credentials are above and beyond the average Lost Cause pluck who deems himself an expert.

I know it makes you feel like you are some sort of special to discard anyone who disagrees with you by chirping out "that's what you've been fed," but really, it just makes you look stupid.

You know I to have viewed in person private letters of soldiers from that period. I'm a living historian of that time period.

 

[Pennywise]

Good catch...

Yeah, good catch, you could say the same about Bin Laden.

Yes, you could. The same could be said of Thomas Jefferson and almost every member of the Continental Congress

Except Bin Laden was not imprisoned: I suppose in your Alternative Universe, niether was Mandela, and Mandela became the leader of an international terrorist organization that killed thousands of innocent people.

It must be a comfort for the simple minded to use one color with one brush to paint their world-view.

Irrelevant whether Bin Laden went to prison, your supposed brilliant angle was that some rich kid followed his beliefs, regardless of family position, just like Osama.

The rest of your posts are just so much fluff. I'm glad they make you smile into the mirror though. Good for you, sweetheart.

 

[bigrebnc1775]

Well let's just stop right there with King and Mandela facing racism.

Ok, so WHY are King and Mandela being slandered this topic FAR MORE than the unjust racist they faced?

See what I mean?



Dig That...

Who has slandered King?
From what I read in this thread no one has slandered Mandela.
Calling him a communist is not slander, nor is being called a terrorist slander. They are discussing his action and cause for his being arrested, some view it as a terrorist, but war is hell and some times nice men will do bad things.

 

[Derideo_Te]

Well let's just stop right there with King and Mandela facing racism.

Ok, so WHY are King and Mandela being slandered this topic FAR MORE than the unjust racist they faced?

See what I mean?



Dig That...

Who has slandered King?
From what I read in this thread no one has slandered Mandela.
Calling him a communist is not slander, nor is being called a terrorist slander. They are discussing his action and cause for his being arrested, some view it as a terrorist, but war is hell and some times nice men will do bad things.

Given that Mandela was not a communist that is slander!

 

[Black_Man1]

Please read the bold writing from just ONE page ago.

Because they are made into something they never were! The sole reason they are transformed into something they never were is because they are black. The reality is totally supplanted by a mythic construct.

Look @ this foolishness.


We have their entire lives on videotape, and these ass bandits are trying to say we are being hoodwinked about who they were.

Because they are on videotape, it's much harder to replace reality with a mythic construct. But, somehow it's done.

Martin Luther King was an alcoholic and a womanizer. Had he not been assassinated he would have been indicted for embezzling money from the Ebenezer Church that he pastored. He spent the money on booze and white whores. He was partial to blondes.

Mandiba Mandela rejected his "white name". He was a vicious killer who delighted in torturing his victims.

Yet we seem impelled to create totally false personas of these men that make them saints when they weren't at all. If they are to be remembered, remember them for everything they do.

 

[bigrebnc1775]

Please read the bold writing from just ONE page ago.

Look @ this foolishness.


We have their entire lives on videotape, and these ass bandits are trying to say we are being hoodwinked about who they were.

Because they are on videotape, it's much harder to replace reality with a mythic construct. But, somehow it's done.

Martin Luther King was an alcoholic and a womanizer. Had he not been assassinated he would have been indicted for embezzling money from the Ebenezer Church that he pastored. He spent the money on booze and white whores. He was partial to blondes.

Mandiba Mandela rejected his "white name". He was a vicious killer who delighted in torturing his victims.

Yet we seem impelled to create totally false personas of these men that make them saints when they weren't at all. If they are to be remembered, remember them for everything they do.

Is it a true statement that he was an alcoholic and a womanizer? If it's true it does not meet the standard for slander

 

[bigrebnc1775]

Well let's just stop right there with King and Mandela facing racism.

Ok, so WHY are King and Mandela being slandered this topic FAR MORE than the unjust racist they faced?

See what I mean?



Dig That...

Who has slandered King?
From what I read in this thread no one has slandered Mandela.
Calling him a communist is not slander, nor is being called a terrorist slander. They are discussing his action and cause for his being arrested, some view it as a terrorist, but war is hell and some times nice men will do bad things.

Given that Mandela was not a communist that is slander!

He was a communist that much is true.

 

[Black_Man1]

This is the part in the topic where you say "OK, I stand corrected. You are right Black Man1."




Let's see how you respond though....

 

[Black_Man1]

See what I mean?

It's not considered slander at all to call Mandela a "vicious killer that delighted in the pain of others".

Sensible people KNOW that the vicious killing of his ppl and unjust racism done by racists...is what Mandela would have "had pleasure" in seeing it stop.


Also, to some ppl, it is not slander to say Dr. King spent his money on whores and was an alcoholic.


I mean, EVEN IF Dr. King had a drink, that is a far cry from an alcoholic.

SLANDER.

And the truth is...Dr. King was a famous and powerful man. I tell you the truth, famous and powerful men do not have to pay money for sex. Women throw themselves at them.

FACT


As far as Dr. King cheating on his wife, we have yet to see the video footage or find a confession ftom him saying that.

Yet WE KNOW the revered Thomas Jefferson and other presidents fit the role of cheating spouse FAR BETTER than Dr. King EVER could.


Check yourself...

 

[paperview]

The black soldiers?
Do you have any clue what the causFighting to sustain a system under which one group can subjugate another in perpetual e was, other than the misconception that you have been fed is?

Fighting to sustain an economic system that allows the subjugation of people in perpetual slavery is not a noble cause. It cannot be honestly defended or rationalized as noble and honorable. Such a system of enslavement does not deserve respect nor admiration. Such systems and causes must be utterly purged from humanity and never allowed to be instituted, championed or celebrated.

Black Confederates? Why haven’t we heard more about them? National Park Service historian, Ed Bearrs, stated, “I don’t want to call it a conspiracy to ignore the role of Blacks both above and below the Mason-Dixon line, but it was definitely a tendency that began around 1910” Historian, Erwin L. Jordan, Jr., calls it a “cover-up” which started back in 1865. He writes, “During my research, I came across instances where Black men stated they were soldiers, but you can plainly see where ‘soldier’ is crossed out and ‘body servant’ inserted, or ‘teamster’ on pension applications.” Another black historian, Roland Young, says he is not surprised that blacks fought. He explains that “…some, if not most, Black southerners would support their country” and that by doing so they were “demonstrating it’s possible to hate the system of slavery and love one’s country.” This is the very same reaction that most African Americans showed during the American Revolution, where they fought for the colonies, even though the British offered them freedom if they fought for them.

Black Confederates in the Civil War

More Lost Cause garbage.

A few, a very few black Confederates fought for the South. Something on the order of a few hundred, maybe 3 to 500. No where near the tens of thousands (and even up to 80,000 - Ha!) the Lost Causers like to push.

On your silly cite:

Do a Google search for “Black Confederates” and “Ed Bearss” and you will get 675 hits. No surprise that many of the sites have been created by SCV chapters and others who believe that significant numbers of blacks fought as soldiers in the Confederate army. Just about all of these sites utilize all or part of the following quote that is attributed to Ed Bearrs, who served as Chief Historian of the National Park Service from 1981 to 1994:

I don’t want to call it a conspiracy to ignore the role of Blacks both above and below the Mason-Dixon line, but it was definitely a tendency that began around 1910.
​

Unfortunately, I’ve been unable to locate the source of this quote and reliable sources have told me that Bearss has never said anything that would place him in the Black Confederate camp.

While I was not able to find a source for the above quote, I did find this 14 minute video of Bearss that was done for Black History Month. ...

In it Bearss is asked to discuss the role that blacks played in the Civil War. What is instructive is what he does not say.

At no time does he suggest that there was any kind of conspiracy surrounding the recognition of black Confederates. And when he gets to commenting on the Louisiana Native Guard Bearss emphasizes that the first units raised for the defense of Louisiana were never accepted for service in the Confederate army. Again, decide for yourself, but there is nothing in this video that would suggest that Bearss believes anything close to what these websites attribute to him.

Ed Bearss on Black Confederates

Many, many Historians with no 'south/north' agenda other than honesty to the facts and documentation available, have concluded the evidence just does not exist to support this recently touted meme of Black Confederates soldiers.

Steiner, the Civilian who worked for the US Sanitary Commission (a private relief agency) is also noted in the piece you offered. His report has blaring inconsistencies, and is not backed up by contemporary sources, and any devoted CW historian knows this. They also know part of what the private relief agency did was print war propaganda. Amazing, huh? That people utilized war propaganda to build sympathy and support for the war. Blows a mind, eh?

Do Lost Causers acknowledge this about Steiner? No. Because that would upset their applecart of Southern devotion.

Answer me this REB: What was the one thing Southern slaveholders feared the most?

You know the answer. A slave uprising. John Brown shook those fears heartily. Talk of it ruled the day. The slave revolts in the Caribbean were still fresh on their minds.

They were petrified of slaves getting enough courage to break their chains and leave for the natural state of man: an aching desire for freedom.
Now pretend you're a slaveowner - do you give your slaves guns? Hell no you don't.

They thought it, in their words, a "suicidal policy."

That's why the confederacy forbade it.

"Our position with the North and before the world will not allow the employment as armed soldiers of negroes."
CSA Secretary of War James A. SeddonLINK: The War of the Rebellion: a compilation of the official records

...and why they were arguing as late as 1865 - near the very, very end - if they should allow the negroes to fight. This is a matter of record.

It was only when the south was beat to a bloody pulp, with not much more to lose, they considered doing so. And even then many would not hear of it. Even then.

So take your Lost Cause Jarbage and stuff it in your rebel cap while you march around whistling Dixie pretending you know dick all about it.

 

[Peach]

can we stop politicizing this man's death please? Geez. Why do people feel the need to make politics out of death? He's one of the iconic figures of the 20th century, and all we can do is how it impacts us politically? For pete's sakes, knock it off.

he was a communist.

That's a fact, junior.

Gonna have to suck it up and move on...

briefly.

 

[Black_Man1]

As far as this King with a hooker theory...


you want us to believe J. Edgar Hoover?


The hypocritical, racist, homosexual liar?

Who was dedicated to destroying all yhings that blacks did to attain some semblage of equality?


HIM?


That is where we are supposed to get intel on a man that stood up like Dr. King?
We supposed to believe HOOVER?



G

T

F

O

H!

 

[R.C. Christian]

Dumbass, the founding fathers, created insurrection wore uniforms and fought uniformed soldiers. Your boy was a terrorist and went to jail for being a terrorist. That's the indiscriminate bombing of white people which I'm certain you don't care about.

 

[Black_Man1]

Dumbass, the founding fathers, created insurrection wore uniforms and fought uniformed soldiers. Your boy was a terrorist and went to jail for being a terrorist. That's the indiscriminate bombing of white people which I'm certain you don't care about.

For some unknown reason, I thought this site was better than this.


When whites do it, it's "insurrection" and "righteous rebellion", when blacks do it (who don't need a UNIFORM because their fucking skin WAS the uniform, it's "terrorism".



STFU

 

[R.C. Christian]

In today's world, Mandela would ruled a terrorist. He would be hunted down and droned. Makes no difference if he thought he was fighting racist intolerance. All terrorists are fighting against something.

 

[bigrebnc1775]

Fighting to sustain an economic system that allows the subjugation of people in perpetual slavery is not a noble cause. It cannot be honestly defended or rationalized as noble and honorable. Such a system of enslavement does not deserve respect nor admiration. Such systems and causes must be utterly purged from humanity and never allowed to be instituted, championed or celebrated.

Black Confederates? Why haven’t we heard more about them? National Park Service historian, Ed Bearrs, stated, “I don’t want to call it a conspiracy to ignore the role of Blacks both above and below the Mason-Dixon line, but it was definitely a tendency that began around 1910” Historian, Erwin L. Jordan, Jr., calls it a “cover-up” which started back in 1865. He writes, “During my research, I came across instances where Black men stated they were soldiers, but you can plainly see where ‘soldier’ is crossed out and ‘body servant’ inserted, or ‘teamster’ on pension applications.” Another black historian, Roland Young, says he is not surprised that blacks fought. He explains that “…some, if not most, Black southerners would support their country” and that by doing so they were “demonstrating it’s possible to hate the system of slavery and love one’s country.” This is the very same reaction that most African Americans showed during the American Revolution, where they fought for the colonies, even though the British offered them freedom if they fought for them.

Black Confederates in the Civil War

More Lost Cause garbage.

A few, a very few black Confederates fought for the South. Something on the order of a few hundred, maybe 3 to 500. No where near the tens of thousands (and even up to 80,000 - Ha!) the Lost Causers like to push.

On your silly cite:

Do a Google search for “Black Confederates” and “Ed Bearss” and you will get 675 hits. No surprise that many of the sites have been created by SCV chapters and others who believe that significant numbers of blacks fought as soldiers in the Confederate army. Just about all of these sites utilize all or part of the following quote that is attributed to Ed Bearrs, who served as Chief Historian of the National Park Service from 1981 to 1994:

I don’t want to call it a conspiracy to ignore the role of Blacks both above and below the Mason-Dixon line, but it was definitely a tendency that began around 1910.
​

Unfortunately, I’ve been unable to locate the source of this quote and reliable sources have told me that Bearss has never said anything that would place him in the Black Confederate camp.

While I was not able to find a source for the above quote, I did find this 14 minute video of Bearss that was done for Black History Month. ...

In it Bearss is asked to discuss the role that blacks played in the Civil War. What is instructive is what he does not say.

At no time does he suggest that there was any kind of conspiracy surrounding the recognition of black Confederates. And when he gets to commenting on the Louisiana Native Guard Bearss emphasizes that the first units raised for the defense of Louisiana were never accepted for service in the Confederate army. Again, decide for yourself, but there is nothing in this video that would suggest that Bearss believes anything close to what these websites attribute to him.

Ed Bearss on Black Confederates

Many, many Historians with no 'south/north' agenda other than honesty to the facts and documentation available, have concluded the evidence just does not exist to support this recently touted meme of Black Confederates soldiers.

Steiner, the Civilian who worked for the US Sanitary Commission (a private relief agency) is also noted in the piece you offered. His report has blaring inconsistencies, and is not backed up by contemporary sources, and any devoted CW historian knows this. They also know part of what the private relief agency did was print war propaganda. Amazing, huh? That people utilized war propaganda to build sympathy and support for the war. Blows a mind, eh?

Do Lost Causers acknowledge this about Steiner? No. Because that would upset their applecart of Southern devotion.

Answer me this REB: What was the one thing Southern slaveholders feared the most?

You know the answer. A slave uprising. John Brown shook those fears heartily. Talk of it ruled the day. The slave revolts in the Caribbean were still fresh on their minds.

They were petrified of slaves getting enough courage to break their chains and leave for the natural state of man: an aching desire for freedom.
Now pretend you're a slaveowner - do you give your slaves guns? Hell no you don't.

They thought it, in their words, a "suicidal policy."

That's why the confederacy forbade it.

"Our position with the North and before the world will not allow the employment as armed soldiers of negroes."
CSA Secretary of War James A. SeddonLINK: The War of the Rebellion: a compilation of the official records

...and why they were arguing as late as 1865 - near the very, very end - if they should allow the negroes to fight. This is a matter of record.

It was only when the south was beat to a bloody pulp, with not much more to lose, they considered doing so. And even then many would not hear of it. Even then.

So take your Lost Cause Jarbage and stuff it in your rebel cap while you march around whistling Dixie pretending you know dick all about it.

Your reply was expect and in such away. I realize it's unpopular to mention it but fact remains blacks fought for the south just as they did for the colonies, even when England offered them freedom if they fought for England.

 

[R.C. Christian]

Dumbass, the founding fathers, created insurrection wore uniforms and fought uniformed soldiers. Your boy was a terrorist and went to jail for being a terrorist. That's the indiscriminate bombing of white people which I'm certain you don't care about.

For some unknown reason, I thought this site was better than this.


When whites do it, it's "insurrection" and "righteous rebellion", when blacks do it (who don't need a UNIFORM because their fucking skin WAS the uniform, it's "terrorism".


STFU

I won't shut up. Your boy targeted and killed civilians with bombs, white people. That's the difference. No reason to touch on the commie part because than in itself is enough.