No Cake for You

[JoeB131]

If your sole purpose is to destroy a business instead of giving them business, then you are taking place in militant activism. You are purposefully targeting someone in order to expose and destroy them because of a difference in beliefs. You have crossed the line from holding a mere opinion to using that opinion to inflict damage on other individuals. I'm sorry, but I don't believe for one moment those two ladies had any intention of buying a cake. The law is clear, but the intent was not commercial. Those two women, in fact, were repeat customers there and knowing full well the beliefs of the proprietor(s). But suddenly out of the blue they ask them to bake a cake for a same sex wedding. To me, that is the definition of "ulterior motive."

If they were repeat customers and had patronized that business a bunch of times, they should have had a reasonable expectation that the business would meet their needs. and as you say, the law is clear.

Every business owner has their own beliefs, their own convictions, and suddenly they have to sacrifice them just to run a business in compliance with the law, and yes, sacrifices must be made. But here's the catch: that's wrong. There is something woefully wrong. Yes, the law is important, and rules are rules; don't misunderstand me here.

Yes, the business owner can have whatever beliefs they want, but they STILL have to follow the law. That business ONLY exists because the public pays for the infrastructure to allow it to operate. Utilities, police and fire protection, roads, commerce. Which means when a member of the public comes into a story looking for the goods and services you advertised, they should get it. Period.

But if you have to sacrifice something sacred to you in order to succeed in business and appease the rule of law, then this is justice run amok. I agree, business is business, and money is money and rightly so; but as someone who admires the law, the law also isn't perfect. There are good laws, and not so well thought out ones. Though, until the law changes, people must obey it. To be succinct, however, obedience should not come at the price of your own morals and convictions.

Guy, I realize you've never been able to hold down a job for more than a week, but guess what, we all have to make sacrifices if we aspire to doing more than live of relatives instead of the government. It's called, "having to work with other people". The Public Accommodation laws are there for a good reason- to make sure everyone has access to goods and services.

Call me a homophobe, a bigot, ignorant, stupid, misguided or whatever you like, but that is my observation on this topic. I don't hate gay people, but I don't like the ones who would force other people to accept their lifestyle. I mean, if the act of forcing your religious beliefs on others is wrong, just imagine how they feel when the same is done to them! Behavior like such is only self serving and only widens the chasm between supporters and opposition. It breeds more hatred than understanding. If respect and acceptance is the goal, then one must strive to show it also. The double edged sword sitting next to me would agree.

Oh, please, you had no problem forcing your beliefs when your opinion was in the majority. Now you've lost the argument, and you are saying, "please, please, please let me have this little corner wehre I can continue to be a bigot!"

And the rest of us are saying, "No".

 

[martybegan]

The PA law cases did not involve the exercise of religion (the ones that have made it past the lower courts that is).

And constitutional laws can still be stupid, or misapplied. Your definition of a PA that encompasses all businesses is wrong.

The Supreme Court DID have the opportunity to hear one of your "religious liberty" cases. They chose not to, leaving the lower court ruling in place. What was the ruling?

They also ignored plenty of gay marriage cases until taking ones that they liked. Deciding not hear a case is not deciding against a position. There could have been technical reasons for denying cert.

Yes, you keep clinging to that hope.

Fact is, these are the laws in some places. Follow the law or suffer the consequences.

Once again, stop being a vindictive twat.

Uh huh...all those black folks wanting to eat at the Woolworth's counter...they were "vindictive twats" too?

Sure took you an awful long time to get really mad about PA laws...51 years...and you're not even attacking the Federal PA laws, just the little state and local ones. Some "states rights" advocate you are.

Again, that was systemic government mandated racism, at a point of sale, with no customization or moral background issues. You are trying to compare apples and Volkswagons.

Race and sexual orientation are two different things no matter how much you want them to be the same so you can fuck over people who disagree with you, and worse, you government to do your dirty work.

 

[JoeB131]

Again, that was systemic government mandated racism, at a point of sale, with no customization or moral background issues. You are trying to compare apples and Volkswagons.

Race and sexual orientation are two different things no matter how much you want them to be the same so you can fuck over people who disagree with you, and worse, you government to do your dirty work.

You homophobes had no problem with the government doing your dirty work when you had the majority on this issue.

 

[Seawytch]

The Supreme Court DID have the opportunity to hear one of your "religious liberty" cases. They chose not to, leaving the lower court ruling in place. What was the ruling?

They also ignored plenty of gay marriage cases until taking ones that they liked. Deciding not hear a case is not deciding against a position. There could have been technical reasons for denying cert.

Yes, you keep clinging to that hope.

Fact is, these are the laws in some places. Follow the law or suffer the consequences.

Once again, stop being a vindictive twat.

Uh huh...all those black folks wanting to eat at the Woolworth's counter...they were "vindictive twats" too?

Sure took you an awful long time to get really mad about PA laws...51 years...and you're not even attacking the Federal PA laws, just the little state and local ones. Some "states rights" advocate you are.

Again, that was systemic government mandated racism, at a point of sale, with no customization or moral background issues. You are trying to compare apples and Volkswagons.

Race and sexual orientation are two different things no matter how much you want them to be the same so you can fuck over people who disagree with you, and worse, you government to do your dirty work.

You do realize that race is not the only protected class in PA laws, right? You can't keep playing the "you gays don't have it as bad as blacks did" card since religion, gender, country of origin are ALL included.

Discrimination is discrimination. Go ahead and get rid of all PA laws, but you gotta start with the Federal ones, not these little local laws. Where is your "states rights" defense? You don't like states rights when the laws protect the gays do you?

 

[martybegan]

Again, that was systemic government mandated racism, at a point of sale, with no customization or moral background issues. You are trying to compare apples and Volkswagons.

Race and sexual orientation are two different things no matter how much you want them to be the same so you can fuck over people who disagree with you, and worse, you government to do your dirty work.

You homophobes had no problem with the government doing your dirty work when you had the majority on this issue.

How can I be a homophobe if I would vote for gay marriage to be made legal via state legislative action, or would glady attend a gay wedding?

My issue is with forcing others to accept all this via government power, not the end result.

 

[martybegan]

They also ignored plenty of gay marriage cases until taking ones that they liked. Deciding not hear a case is not deciding against a position. There could have been technical reasons for denying cert.

Yes, you keep clinging to that hope.

Fact is, these are the laws in some places. Follow the law or suffer the consequences.

Once again, stop being a vindictive twat.

Uh huh...all those black folks wanting to eat at the Woolworth's counter...they were "vindictive twats" too?

Sure took you an awful long time to get really mad about PA laws...51 years...and you're not even attacking the Federal PA laws, just the little state and local ones. Some "states rights" advocate you are.

Again, that was systemic government mandated racism, at a point of sale, with no customization or moral background issues. You are trying to compare apples and Volkswagons.

Race and sexual orientation are two different things no matter how much you want them to be the same so you can fuck over people who disagree with you, and worse, you government to do your dirty work.

You do realize that race is not the only protected class in PA laws, right? You can't keep playing the "you gays don't have it as bad as blacks did" card since religion, gender, country of origin are ALL included.

Discrimination is discrimination. Go ahead and get rid of all PA laws, but you gotta start with the Federal ones, not these little local laws. Where is your "states rights" defense? You don't like states rights when the laws protect the gays do you?

These laws protect some people at the expense of punishing others. The end result is not worthy of the use of government to ruin someone.

The whole idea of "Protected Classes" is an abomination, making some people more equal than others to right wrongs, that did happen, yes, but more and more are done out of spite and vitriol.

 

[Skull Pilot]

I am still waiting for someone to present a cogent argument as to how baking a cake somehow is forcing the baker to betray his faith.

Surely that baker has made cakes for gay people, adulterers, pedophiles etc without even knowing or caring about those sins.

IMO this is plain old hypocrisy that one must be a yoga master to perform the stretch required to justify

Its not up to anyone else, especially the government to demand a person explain their religious beliefs or practices. The document explicitly states "Free Exercise Thereof." The most you can do is refuse to associate with such a person.

I have yet to see baking a cake equated with the practice of a religion in a logical way.

These so called deeply held religious beliefs of bigots seem to be selective to me.

A gay couple getting married offends them but children born of adultery don't as birthday cakes for bastard children are made all the time with no complaint.

That said I am all for a business owner reserving the right to refuse service. But I am also for the right of the public to apply pressure to those businesses for their bigotry.

 

[martybegan]

I am still waiting for someone to present a cogent argument as to how baking a cake somehow is forcing the baker to betray his faith.

Surely that baker has made cakes for gay people, adulterers, pedophiles etc without even knowing or caring about those sins.

IMO this is plain old hypocrisy that one must be a yoga master to perform the stretch required to justify

Its not up to anyone else, especially the government to demand a person explain their religious beliefs or practices. The document explicitly states "Free Exercise Thereof." The most you can do is refuse to associate with such a person.

I have yet to see baking a cake equated with the practice of a religion in a logical way.

These so called deeply held religious beliefs of bigots seem to be selective to me.

A gay couple getting married offends them but children born of adultery don't as birthday cakes for bastard children are made all the time with no complaint.

That said I am all for a business owner reserving the right to refuse service. But I am also for the right of the public to apply pressure to those businesses for their bigotry.

It's not your place, and it is certainly not government's place to say how a person practices their religion, barring activities that are 1) illegal (illegal illegal, not naughty illegal). 2) actively imposing directly on other people (not hurting their feeewings or making them drive around another 10 minutes).

By all means use your own personal power of the purse, and right to assemble like minded people to show your disapproval both verbally/written, and economically, but leave government out of it.

 

[Seawytch]

Yes, you keep clinging to that hope.

Fact is, these are the laws in some places. Follow the law or suffer the consequences.

Once again, stop being a vindictive twat.

Uh huh...all those black folks wanting to eat at the Woolworth's counter...they were "vindictive twats" too?

Sure took you an awful long time to get really mad about PA laws...51 years...and you're not even attacking the Federal PA laws, just the little state and local ones. Some "states rights" advocate you are.

Again, that was systemic government mandated racism, at a point of sale, with no customization or moral background issues. You are trying to compare apples and Volkswagons.

Race and sexual orientation are two different things no matter how much you want them to be the same so you can fuck over people who disagree with you, and worse, you government to do your dirty work.

You do realize that race is not the only protected class in PA laws, right? You can't keep playing the "you gays don't have it as bad as blacks did" card since religion, gender, country of origin are ALL included.

Discrimination is discrimination. Go ahead and get rid of all PA laws, but you gotta start with the Federal ones, not these little local laws. Where is your "states rights" defense? You don't like states rights when the laws protect the gays do you?

These laws protect some people at the expense of punishing others. The end result is not worthy of the use of government to ruin someone.

The whole idea of "Protected Classes" is an abomination, making some people more equal than others to right wrongs, that did happen, yes, but more and more are done out of spite and vitriol.

That's a delightful story. Funny that all this upset over PA laws has only come upon ya'll recently...like in oh about the last 5-10 years when STATES and LOCALITIES started protecting their gays from discrimination. 51 years we've had PA laws on the books.

Work your little fingers to the bone to get rid of them. I wish you the best of luck in your quest and I hope it brings you great joy...but shouldn't you be working on them at the Federal level and leave the states alone?

 

[Ravi]

Yes, you keep clinging to that hope.

Fact is, these are the laws in some places. Follow the law or suffer the consequences.

Once again, stop being a vindictive twat.

Uh huh...all those black folks wanting to eat at the Woolworth's counter...they were "vindictive twats" too?

Sure took you an awful long time to get really mad about PA laws...51 years...and you're not even attacking the Federal PA laws, just the little state and local ones. Some "states rights" advocate you are.

Again, that was systemic government mandated racism, at a point of sale, with no customization or moral background issues. You are trying to compare apples and Volkswagons.

Race and sexual orientation are two different things no matter how much you want them to be the same so you can fuck over people who disagree with you, and worse, you government to do your dirty work.

You do realize that race is not the only protected class in PA laws, right? You can't keep playing the "you gays don't have it as bad as blacks did" card since religion, gender, country of origin are ALL included.

Discrimination is discrimination. Go ahead and get rid of all PA laws, but you gotta start with the Federal ones, not these little local laws. Where is your "states rights" defense? You don't like states rights when the laws protect the gays do you?

These laws protect some people at the expense of punishing others. The end result is not worthy of the use of government to ruin someone.

The whole idea of "Protected Classes" is an abomination, making some people more equal than others to right wrongs, that did happen, yes, but more and more are done out of spite and vitriol.

So you'd rather the gay people be punished by not allowing them to shop at their local bakery.

 

[martybegan]

Once again, stop being a vindictive twat.

Uh huh...all those black folks wanting to eat at the Woolworth's counter...they were "vindictive twats" too?

Sure took you an awful long time to get really mad about PA laws...51 years...and you're not even attacking the Federal PA laws, just the little state and local ones. Some "states rights" advocate you are.

Again, that was systemic government mandated racism, at a point of sale, with no customization or moral background issues. You are trying to compare apples and Volkswagons.

Race and sexual orientation are two different things no matter how much you want them to be the same so you can fuck over people who disagree with you, and worse, you government to do your dirty work.

You do realize that race is not the only protected class in PA laws, right? You can't keep playing the "you gays don't have it as bad as blacks did" card since religion, gender, country of origin are ALL included.

Discrimination is discrimination. Go ahead and get rid of all PA laws, but you gotta start with the Federal ones, not these little local laws. Where is your "states rights" defense? You don't like states rights when the laws protect the gays do you?

These laws protect some people at the expense of punishing others. The end result is not worthy of the use of government to ruin someone.

The whole idea of "Protected Classes" is an abomination, making some people more equal than others to right wrongs, that did happen, yes, but more and more are done out of spite and vitriol.

That's a delightful story. Funny that all this upset over PA laws has only come upon ya'll recently...like in oh about the last 5-10 years when STATES and LOCALITIES started protecting their gays from discrimination. 51 years we've had PA laws on the books.

Work your little fingers to the bone to get rid of them. I wish you the best of luck in your quest and I hope it brings you great joy...but shouldn't you be working on them at the Federal level and leave the states alone?

Its only recently that these laws are being used this way. The implication is that government can force people to accept acts they find immoral on pain of government punishment.

Being black and living a homosexual lifestyle are two different things, no matter how much you want to make them equivalent in the eyes of the law.

 

[martybegan]

Once again, stop being a vindictive twat.

Uh huh...all those black folks wanting to eat at the Woolworth's counter...they were "vindictive twats" too?

Sure took you an awful long time to get really mad about PA laws...51 years...and you're not even attacking the Federal PA laws, just the little state and local ones. Some "states rights" advocate you are.

Again, that was systemic government mandated racism, at a point of sale, with no customization or moral background issues. You are trying to compare apples and Volkswagons.

Race and sexual orientation are two different things no matter how much you want them to be the same so you can fuck over people who disagree with you, and worse, you government to do your dirty work.

You do realize that race is not the only protected class in PA laws, right? You can't keep playing the "you gays don't have it as bad as blacks did" card since religion, gender, country of origin are ALL included.

Discrimination is discrimination. Go ahead and get rid of all PA laws, but you gotta start with the Federal ones, not these little local laws. Where is your "states rights" defense? You don't like states rights when the laws protect the gays do you?

These laws protect some people at the expense of punishing others. The end result is not worthy of the use of government to ruin someone.

The whole idea of "Protected Classes" is an abomination, making some people more equal than others to right wrongs, that did happen, yes, but more and more are done out of spite and vitriol.

So you'd rather the gay people be punished by not allowing them to shop at their local bakery.

The use of government force to make people comply with a good or service that is readily available from other sources and is not an economic of life necessity is worse than two people having to find another baker and maybe having their feelings hurt.

 

[Seawytch]

Uh huh...all those black folks wanting to eat at the Woolworth's counter...they were "vindictive twats" too?

Sure took you an awful long time to get really mad about PA laws...51 years...and you're not even attacking the Federal PA laws, just the little state and local ones. Some "states rights" advocate you are.

Again, that was systemic government mandated racism, at a point of sale, with no customization or moral background issues. You are trying to compare apples and Volkswagons.

Race and sexual orientation are two different things no matter how much you want them to be the same so you can fuck over people who disagree with you, and worse, you government to do your dirty work.

You do realize that race is not the only protected class in PA laws, right? You can't keep playing the "you gays don't have it as bad as blacks did" card since religion, gender, country of origin are ALL included.

Discrimination is discrimination. Go ahead and get rid of all PA laws, but you gotta start with the Federal ones, not these little local laws. Where is your "states rights" defense? You don't like states rights when the laws protect the gays do you?

These laws protect some people at the expense of punishing others. The end result is not worthy of the use of government to ruin someone.

The whole idea of "Protected Classes" is an abomination, making some people more equal than others to right wrongs, that did happen, yes, but more and more are done out of spite and vitriol.

That's a delightful story. Funny that all this upset over PA laws has only come upon ya'll recently...like in oh about the last 5-10 years when STATES and LOCALITIES started protecting their gays from discrimination. 51 years we've had PA laws on the books.

Work your little fingers to the bone to get rid of them. I wish you the best of luck in your quest and I hope it brings you great joy...but shouldn't you be working on them at the Federal level and leave the states alone?

Its only recently that these laws are being used this way. The implication is that government can force people to accept acts they find immoral on pain of government punishment.

Being black and living a homosexual lifestyle are two different things, no matter how much you want to make them equivalent in the eyes of the law.

I know you think that race and sexual orientation are being equated. They are not. The discrimination is.

Go ahead and try to get rid of them all, but if you don't start at the Federal level with those laws, you're just showing your hand as anti gay.

 

[Seawytch]

You know what's really funny? The biggest support for gays and PA laws comes from the black community. I wonder why that is?

 

[martybegan]

Again, that was systemic government mandated racism, at a point of sale, with no customization or moral background issues. You are trying to compare apples and Volkswagons.

Race and sexual orientation are two different things no matter how much you want them to be the same so you can fuck over people who disagree with you, and worse, you government to do your dirty work.

You do realize that race is not the only protected class in PA laws, right? You can't keep playing the "you gays don't have it as bad as blacks did" card since religion, gender, country of origin are ALL included.

Discrimination is discrimination. Go ahead and get rid of all PA laws, but you gotta start with the Federal ones, not these little local laws. Where is your "states rights" defense? You don't like states rights when the laws protect the gays do you?

These laws protect some people at the expense of punishing others. The end result is not worthy of the use of government to ruin someone.

The whole idea of "Protected Classes" is an abomination, making some people more equal than others to right wrongs, that did happen, yes, but more and more are done out of spite and vitriol.

That's a delightful story. Funny that all this upset over PA laws has only come upon ya'll recently...like in oh about the last 5-10 years when STATES and LOCALITIES started protecting their gays from discrimination. 51 years we've had PA laws on the books.

Work your little fingers to the bone to get rid of them. I wish you the best of luck in your quest and I hope it brings you great joy...but shouldn't you be working on them at the Federal level and leave the states alone?

Its only recently that these laws are being used this way. The implication is that government can force people to accept acts they find immoral on pain of government punishment.

Being black and living a homosexual lifestyle are two different things, no matter how much you want to make them equivalent in the eyes of the law.

I know you think that race and sexual orientation are being equated. They are not. The discrimination is.

Go ahead and try to get rid of them all, but if you don't start at the Federal level with those laws, you're just showing your hand as anti gay.

That's a cop out, and you know it.

 

[martybegan]

You know what's really funny? The biggest support for gays and PA laws comes from the black community. I wonder why that is?

Ask the question differently, and you would get a different answer.

How about this way?

"Should a business that refuses to provide a service for a gay marriage ceremony be punished by either fining or revocation of their business license?"

At least this poll is honest enough to show the question up front.

 

[Carla_Danger]

If your sole purpose is to destroy a business instead of giving them business, then you are taking place in militant activism. You are purposefully targeting someone in order to expose and destroy them because of a difference in beliefs. You have crossed the line from holding a mere opinion to using that opinion to inflict damage on other individuals. I'm sorry, but I don't believe for one moment those two ladies had any intention of buying a cake. The law is clear, but the intent was not commercial. Those two women, in fact, were repeat customers there and knowing full well the beliefs of the proprietor(s). But suddenly out of the blue they ask them to bake a cake for a same sex wedding. To me, that is the definition of "ulterior motive."

Every business owner has their own beliefs, their own convictions, and suddenly they have to sacrifice them just to run a business in compliance with the law, and yes, sacrifices must be made. But here's the catch: that's wrong. There is something woefully wrong. Yes, the law is important, and rules are rules; don't misunderstand me here.

But if you have to sacrifice something sacred to you in order to succeed in business and appease the rule of law, then this is justice run amok. I agree, business is business, and money is money and rightly so; but as someone who admires the law, the law also isn't perfect. There are good laws, and not so well thought out ones. Though, until the law changes, people must obey it. To be succinct, however, obedience should not come at the price of your own morals and convictions.

Call me a homophobe, a bigot, ignorant, stupid, misguided or whatever you like, but that is my observation on this topic. I don't hate gay people, but I don't like the ones who would force other people to accept their lifestyle. I mean, if the act of forcing your religious beliefs on others is wrong, just imagine how they feel when the same is done to them! Behavior like such is only self serving and only widens the chasm between supporters and opposition. It breeds more hatred than understanding. If respect and acceptance is the goal, then one must strive to show it also. The double edged sword sitting next to me would agree.



No Icing on the Cake for Christian Business Owners Who Refused to Bake for Lesbian Couple

Oh Gawd, not this again. So they don't get to use their religion to discriminate.....boo fucking hoo!

Coming from a neo-liberal who cries racism at the drop of a hat, thats hilarious!

This thread isn't about racism, it's about discrimination.

What exactly is racism? A form of discrimination, you dolt.

You idiot, the subject of this thread is based on sexual orientation, not race. I don't know why you want to hijack your own thread.

 

[Ravi]

Uh huh...all those black folks wanting to eat at the Woolworth's counter...they were "vindictive twats" too?

Sure took you an awful long time to get really mad about PA laws...51 years...and you're not even attacking the Federal PA laws, just the little state and local ones. Some "states rights" advocate you are.

Again, that was systemic government mandated racism, at a point of sale, with no customization or moral background issues. You are trying to compare apples and Volkswagons.

Race and sexual orientation are two different things no matter how much you want them to be the same so you can fuck over people who disagree with you, and worse, you government to do your dirty work.

You do realize that race is not the only protected class in PA laws, right? You can't keep playing the "you gays don't have it as bad as blacks did" card since religion, gender, country of origin are ALL included.

Discrimination is discrimination. Go ahead and get rid of all PA laws, but you gotta start with the Federal ones, not these little local laws. Where is your "states rights" defense? You don't like states rights when the laws protect the gays do you?

These laws protect some people at the expense of punishing others. The end result is not worthy of the use of government to ruin someone.

The whole idea of "Protected Classes" is an abomination, making some people more equal than others to right wrongs, that did happen, yes, but more and more are done out of spite and vitriol.

So you'd rather the gay people be punished by not allowing them to shop at their local bakery.

The use of government force to make people comply with a good or service that is readily available from other sources and is not an economic of life necessity is worse than two people having to find another baker and maybe having their feelings hurt.

In your opinion it is worse. Why do you get to decide which is worse for someone else?

 

[NYcarbineer]

Uh huh...all those black folks wanting to eat at the Woolworth's counter...they were "vindictive twats" too?

Sure took you an awful long time to get really mad about PA laws...51 years...and you're not even attacking the Federal PA laws, just the little state and local ones. Some "states rights" advocate you are.

Again, that was systemic government mandated racism, at a point of sale, with no customization or moral background issues. You are trying to compare apples and Volkswagons.

Race and sexual orientation are two different things no matter how much you want them to be the same so you can fuck over people who disagree with you, and worse, you government to do your dirty work.

You do realize that race is not the only protected class in PA laws, right? You can't keep playing the "you gays don't have it as bad as blacks did" card since religion, gender, country of origin are ALL included.

Discrimination is discrimination. Go ahead and get rid of all PA laws, but you gotta start with the Federal ones, not these little local laws. Where is your "states rights" defense? You don't like states rights when the laws protect the gays do you?

These laws protect some people at the expense of punishing others. The end result is not worthy of the use of government to ruin someone.

The whole idea of "Protected Classes" is an abomination, making some people more equal than others to right wrongs, that did happen, yes, but more and more are done out of spite and vitriol.

So you'd rather the gay people be punished by not allowing them to shop at their local bakery.

The use of government force to make people comply with a good or service that is readily available from other sources and is not an economic of life necessity is worse than two people having to find another baker and maybe having their feelings hurt.

Like separate drinking fountains?

 

[Ravi]

You know what's really funny? The biggest support for gays and PA laws comes from the black community. I wonder why that is?

Ask the question differently, and you would get a different answer.

How about this way?

"Should a business that refuses to provide a service for a gay marriage ceremony be punished by either fining or revocation of their business license?"

At least this poll is honest enough to show the question up front.

Not really. Failure to pay fines would be the reason the license was revoked, not for refusing to provide a service.