Obama's budget is a nervous breakdown on paper

[Quantum Windbag]

Because by inflation they usually mean CPI, not the change in milk price. By redefining the meaning of a widely used term you only confuse everyone around you.

So, your suggesting the price of other consumer goods have gone down? link. Your the one confusing the issue by proposing inflation has not occurred.

When was the last time you have been in the electronics section? Or, for that matter, the last time you've bought a fabric softener?

When was the last time you ate something from the electronics section? Or, for that matter, drank fabric softener?

 

[ilia25]

So, your suggesting the price of other consumer goods have gone down? link. Your the one confusing the issue by proposing inflation has not occurred.

When was the last time you have been in the electronics section? Or, for that matter, the last time you've bought a fabric softener?

When was the last time you ate something from the electronics section? Or, for that matter, drank fabric softener?

Your point being?..

 

[ilia25]

Why do you deny that doubling the price of milk is inflation?

Because by inflation they usually mean CPI, not the change in milk price. By redefining the meaning of a widely used term you only confuse everyone around you.

CPI usually means consumer price index, which is related to, but does not equal, inflation.

CPI means consumer price index not just usually, this is what CPI stands for. So what is your definition of inflation? And how it should be measured?

 

[bripat9643]

When was the last time you have been in the electronics section? Or, for that matter, the last time you've bought a fabric softener?

Why shouldn't the price of milk be included?

 

[FA_Q2]

When was the last time you have been in the electronics section? Or, for that matter, the last time you've bought a fabric softener?

When was the last time you ate something from the electronics section? Or, for that matter, drank fabric softener?

Your point being?..

I can't speak for QW but MY point was that necessities are increasing drastically and that means inflation, to the consumer, is increasing drastically. Just because the nice things are offsetting the disaster on some bullshit chart does not mean that the average consumer does not feel the hit and feel it hard. To claim that inflation is not occurring because the numbers are offset in optional goods is dishonest.

 

[Quantum Windbag]

When was the last time you have been in the electronics section? Or, for that matter, the last time you've bought a fabric softener?

When was the last time you ate something from the electronics section? Or, for that matter, drank fabric softener?

Your point being?..

My point is that pointing to what the 1% can afford and claiming that proves there is no inflation is really stupid.

 

[saveliberty]

What goods and services does the CPI cover?
The CPI represents all goods and services purchased for consumption by the reference population (U or W) BLS has classified all expenditure items into more than 200 categories, arranged into eight major groups. Major groups and examples of categories in each are as follows:

FOOD AND BEVERAGES (breakfast cereal, milk, coffee, chicken, wine, full service meals, snacks)
HOUSING (rent of primary residence, owners' equivalent rent, fuel oil, bedroom furniture)
APPAREL (men's shirts and sweaters, women's dresses, jewelry)
TRANSPORTATION (new vehicles, airline fares, gasoline, motor vehicle insurance)
MEDICAL CARE (prescription drugs and medical supplies, physicians' services, eyeglasses and eye care, hospital services)
RECREATION (televisions, toys, pets and pet products, sports equipment, admissions);
EDUCATION AND COMMUNICATION (college tuition, postage, telephone services, computer software and accessories);
OTHER GOODS AND SERVICES (tobacco and smoking products, haircuts and other personal services, funeral expenses).

Consumer Price Index Frequently Asked Questions

I see 27 items on that list which cost more now. Several more that are at least as expensive out of a total of 40. Oh, and about the milk....

 

[Quantum Windbag]

Because by inflation they usually mean CPI, not the change in milk price. By redefining the meaning of a widely used term you only confuse everyone around you.

CPI usually means consumer price index, which is related to, but does not equal, inflation.

CPI means consumer price index not just usually, this is what CPI stands for. So what is your definition of inflation? And how it should be measured?

Inflation, by definition, is a persistent, substantial rise in the general level of prices related to an increase in the volume of money and resulting in the loss of value of currency. You could measure inflation by tracking the change in CPI over a period of time, but you cannot measure it by measuring the CPI.

 

[saveliberty]

Kind of like a recession right QW? Economists tell you were in one or came out of one after the fact.

 

[ilia25]

When was the last time you ate something from the electronics section? Or, for that matter, drank fabric softener?

Your point being?..

I can't speak for QW but MY point was that necessities are increasing drastically and that means inflation, to the consumer, is increasing drastically. Just because the nice things are offsetting the disaster on some bullshit chart does not mean that the average consumer does not feel the hit and feel it hard. To claim that inflation is not occurring because the numbers are offset in optional goods is dishonest.

First, I never said that inflation is not occurring. I don't think anyone but me remembers who brought inflation into this thread:

Oh yes, because all that monetary expansion over the last several years could NEVER bring inflation back. Course, if it did, the economy would contract.

To which I replied that recently there was no rise in inflation, hence we would not need to hurt the economy in order to reverse that rise.

So we have a modest overall consumer inflation (aka CPI), just as before 2008 -- around 2-3%.

Second, the prices for some items were rising faster than CPI. Now make no mistake, CPI is designed to reflect the basket of an average consumer, so he/she should see that 2-3% overall inflation. Some people have different basket structure and they could see a higher inflation. Or it could be an illusion -- some average consumers simply tend to worry specifically about the price of the "necessities", although they spend most of their money on other things (like an apartment rental). Or did anyone notice the price of the natural gas heating falling recently?

Third, when it comes to Fed's money expansion, the resulting inflation, and slowing it down by creating a recession -- for all that Fed watches not even the overall inflation, but the core inflation, which specifically excludes the "necessities" like food and energy. I would not go in into explaining that choice, unless you are interested to know. But in any case, the rising price of milk, however uncomfortable, will not force the Fed to create a recession down the road -- and thank God for that.

 

[saveliberty]

Your point being?..

I can't speak for QW but MY point was that necessities are increasing drastically and that means inflation, to the consumer, is increasing drastically. Just because the nice things are offsetting the disaster on some bullshit chart does not mean that the average consumer does not feel the hit and feel it hard. To claim that inflation is not occurring because the numbers are offset in optional goods is dishonest.

First, I never said that inflation is not occurring. I don't think anyone but me remembers who brought inflation into this thread:

Oh yes, because all that monetary expansion over the last several years could NEVER bring inflation back. Course, if it did, the economy would contract.

To which I replied that recently there was no rise in inflation, hence we would not need to hurt the economy in order to reverse that rise.

So we have a modest overall consumer inflation (aka CPI), just as before 2008 -- around 2-3%.

Second, the prices for some items were rising faster than CPI. Now make no mistake, CPI is designed to reflect the basket of an average consumer, so he/she should see that 2-3% overall inflation. Some people have different basket structure and they could see a higher inflation. Or it could be an illusion -- some average consumers simply tend to worry specifically about the price of the "necessities", although they spend most of their money on other things (like the apartment rental). Or did anyone notice the price of the natural gas heating falling recently?

Third, when it comes to Fed's money expansion, the resulting inflation, and slowing it down by creating a recession -- for all that Fed watches not even the overall inflation, but the core inflation, which specifically excludes the "necessities" like food and energy. I would not go in into explaining that choice, unless you are interested to know. But in any case, the rising price of milk, however uncomfortable, will not force the Fed to create a recession down the road -- and thank God for that.

Wages have basically been frozen for three years or gone down. Under estimating inflation and not considering wages is blatantly wrong. Trying to deceive what people can plainly see and feel is hopeless. Keep trying though, its all you got.

For someone who didn't even understand stagflation, you're really reaching to think we are going to fall for your posts.

 

[ilia25]

My point is that pointing to what the 1% can afford and claiming that proves there is no inflation is really stupid.

You are exaggerating on both accounts -- a) that only 1% can afford a flat screen TV and b) that I claimed that there is no inflation.

You could measure inflation by tracking the change in CPI over a period of time, but you cannot measure it by measuring the CPI.

So my chart showing the rate of change in CPI.

 

[ilia25]

Wages have basically been frozen for three years or gone down. Under estimating inflation and not considering wages is blatantly wrong. Trying to deceive what people can plainly see and feel is hopeless. Keep trying though, its all you got.

So who is trying to deceive you and to what end?

 

[saveliberty]

Inflation is 1.3% higher than last January. Of the eight months prior to January all but two of them were above 3.5%. For 2011, all but two months were higher than 2010.

Current Inflation

 

[saveliberty]

Wages have basically been frozen for three years or gone down. Under estimating inflation and not considering wages is blatantly wrong. Trying to deceive what people can plainly see and feel is hopeless. Keep trying though, its all you got.

So who is trying to deceive you and to what end?

Why don't you answer both questions?

 

[ilia25]

Wages have basically been frozen for three years or gone down. Under estimating inflation and not considering wages is blatantly wrong. Trying to deceive what people can plainly see and feel is hopeless. Keep trying though, its all you got.

So who is trying to deceive you and to what end?

Why don't you answer both questions?

Because you are the only person that could possibly know. Or, rather, imagine.

 

[Quantum Windbag]

You are exaggerating on both accounts -- a) that only 1% can afford a flat screen TV and b) that I claimed that there is no inflation.

I am not exaggerating by any means, I just have a more global viewpoint than you do.

So my chart showing the rate of change in CPI.

Your chart did not show that.

 

[ilia25]

You are exaggerating on both accounts -- a) that only 1% can afford a flat screen TV and b) that I claimed that there is no inflation.

I am not exaggerating by any means, I just have a more global viewpoint than you do.

So my chart showing the rate of change in CPI.

Your chart did not show that.

Seriously? Can you really be that dense?

Look at the chart again. On the top it says "Consumer Price Index". On the vertical access it says "Continuously compounded annual rate of change".

 

[Quantum Windbag]

You are exaggerating on both accounts -- a) that only 1% can afford a flat screen TV and b) that I claimed that there is no inflation.

I am not exaggerating by any means, I just have a more global viewpoint than you do.

So my chart showing the rate of change in CPI.

Your chart did not show that.

Seriously? Can you really be that dense?

Look at the chart again. On the top it says "Consumer Price Index". On the vertical access it says "Continuously compounded annual rate of change".

How does that make me dense? Do you know the difference between compounded rate of change and rate of change?

 

[ilia25]

I am not exaggerating by any means, I just have a more global viewpoint than you do.



Your chart did not show that.

Seriously? Can you really be that dense?

Look at the chart again. On the top it says "Consumer Price Index". On the vertical access it says "Continuously compounded annual rate of change".

How does that make me dense? Do you know the difference between compounded rate of change and rate of change?

The dense part is your inability to comprehend that in both cases it is still the rate of change.