Opposition to Gay Marriage - Any Basis Other Than Intolerance and Bigotry?

[brono921]

Got it. Now, can we move past all the moral grandstanding and just say it's about money?

That's what's in the box. Their self righteousness is the wrapping.

 

[brono921]

every American cannot have the special marriage of their choice

The disappointment your cat must feel is heartbreaking.

 

[logical4u]

There are some (not saying you) that want to deflect away from religious observance as a factor and would prefer to play the race card and advocate (or admonish as the case may be) that it was the blacks that passed Prop 8. The fact is that mathematically their impact was relatively small.
>>>>>

Whatever their reason for pushing that meme, the "blame the blacks" strategy didn't work. We don't blame the blacks for the passage of prop 8. Mostly we blame the lies paid for by the Mormons and other religious groups.

With marriage equality, poll after poll shows that opposition is an age and religion thing, period.

Please, list those lies.

The polls just show that the homosexual indoctrination being done in schools is working. Give them ten years in the adult world and check again, experience tells.

 

[kaz]

I have studies to back up my points...do you?

Study: Same-Sex Parents Raise Well-Adjusted Kids

I'll happily stack my kids up against any of ya'lls any old day.

The ideal situation for kids is two parents, a man and a woman. I never said kids can't grow up and function without that, but it's not ideal. If you took kids who didn't have that, then you certainly performed a great service for them. But to say it makes no difference? Wow, a liberal study saying the sky isn't blue. Yet I look up and it is. You're a dogmatic wacko. That makes it entertaining to listen to you but no one's going to take you seriously. I support leaving you alone, yet you can't tell the difference between me and someone who condemns you to hell. 1% against me, you are 100% against me!

Are you one of those nut jobs who says anyone who thinks men are taller or stronger then women on average is a sexist?

No it doesn't make a difference and is just as ideal as heterosexual raising kids. The IDEAL situation for children is two parents who love them, period.

A period at the end of a sentence doesn't make the sentence to not have been full of crap. Look if you adopted hard to place kids then I applaud you and you have made a great difference in their lives.



But to say that a random kid is as good with two fathers or two mothers as a father and mother (all else being equal) then you are just ignorant, and no liberal study with a pre-determined outcome is going to change that.

 

[Seawytch]

It's pretty obvious that you aren't "aware" of a lot of things. Science must be a new concept for you as well.
Hmmm.....this should be fun.

Being gay does not "nix out" biological functions of procreation. We still have the ability and the desire to procreate...we just use that foreign concept of science to do it...like so many heterosexual couples do these days.
These days. Was that same science available, say, 50 years ago? How 'bout 100? 1,000? Or even 10,000?
Ooops.
So went your so called "gene".

What the fuck are you talking about? I'm talking about using science to create our families, just like heterosexuals do. You know...artificial insemination, surrogacy, etc?

Nobody, and I mean NOBODY is claiming a "gay gene", but scientist all pretty much universally agree that being gay isn't a choice and that there IS a genetic predisposition for sexual orientation.

Presently. You've failed to account for a gene that doesn't propogate itself being present after hundreds of thousands of years of evolution, without artificial encimination. And you thought you knew shit about science? Silly liberal.

Your parents were related weren't they? Ask a Geneticist

 

[bodecea]

Got it. Now, can we move past all the moral grandstanding and just say it's about money?

That's what's in the box. Their self righteousness is the wrapping.

So, that's what it is for Heteros too....interesting.

 

[Seawytch]

What exactly can't you do?

Tax Benefits
Filing joint income tax returns with the IRS and state taxing authorities.Creating a "family partnership" under federal tax laws, which allows you to divide business income among family members.

Estate Planning Benefits
Inheriting a share of your spouse's estate.Receiving an exemption from both estate taxes and gift taxes for all property you give or leave to your spouse.Creating life estate trusts that are restricted to married couples, including QTIP trusts, QDOT trusts, and marital deduction trusts.Obtaining priority if a conservator needs to be appointed for your spouse -- that is, someone to make financial and/or medical decisions on your spouse's behalf.

Government Benefits
Receiving Social Security, Medicare, and disability benefits for spouses.Receiving veterans' and military benefits for spouses, such as those for education, medical care, or special loans.Receiving public assistance benefits.Employment BenefitsObtaining insurance benefits through a spouse's employer.Taking family leave to care for your spouse during an illness.Receiving wages, workers' compensation, and retirement plan benefits for a deceased spouse.Taking bereavement leave if your spouse or one of your spouse's close relatives dies.

Medical Benefits
Visiting your spouse in a hospital intensive care unit or during restricted visiting hours in other parts of a medical facility.Making medical decisions for your spouse if he or she becomes incapacitated and unable to express wishes for treatment.Death BenefitsConsenting to after-death examinations and procedures.Making burial or other final arrangements.

Family Benefits
Filing for stepparent or joint adoption.Applying for joint foster care rights.Receiving equitable division of property if you divorce.Receiving spousal or child support, child custody, and visitation if you divorce.

Housing Benefits
Living in neighborhoods zoned for "families only."Automatically renewing leases signed by your spouse.

Consumer Benefits
Receiving family rates for health, homeowners', auto, and other types of insurance.Receiving tuition discounts and permission to use school facilities.Other consumer discounts and incentives offered only to married couples or families.

Other Legal Benefits and Protections
Suing a third person for wrongful death of your spouse and loss of consortium (loss of intimacy).Suing a third person for offenses that interfere with the success of your marriage, such as alienation of affection and criminal conversation (these laws are available in only a few states).Claiming the marital communications privilege, which means a court can't force you to disclose the contents of confidential communications between you and your spouse during your marriage.Receiving crime victims' recovery benefits if your spouse is the victim of a crime.Obtaining immigration and residency benefits for noncitizen spouse.Visiting rights in jails and other places where visitors are restricted to immediate family.

Marriage Rights and Benefits - Free Legal Information - Nolo

Exactly, it's about money. Finally you're being honest. And that's why you were full of crap comparing gay rights to black rights as well. I've been trying to get you to admit it. So you can't feel equal unless you can stick your hand in the wallet someone else's pants? BTW, if you're reading all my posts you know I oppose all these for straight couples as well.

And yet you are legally married aren't you? So will you be honest and admit you are a fucking hypocrite?

We want to get married for the EXACT SAME reasons STR8TS do...period.

 

[Seawytch]

The ideal situation for kids is two parents, a man and a woman. I never said kids can't grow up and function without that, but it's not ideal. If you took kids who didn't have that, then you certainly performed a great service for them. But to say it makes no difference? Wow, a liberal study saying the sky isn't blue. Yet I look up and it is. You're a dogmatic wacko. That makes it entertaining to listen to you but no one's going to take you seriously. I support leaving you alone, yet you can't tell the difference between me and someone who condemns you to hell. 1% against me, you are 100% against me!

Are you one of those nut jobs who says anyone who thinks men are taller or stronger then women on average is a sexist?

No it doesn't make a difference and is just as ideal as heterosexual raising kids. The IDEAL situation for children is two parents who love them, period.

Wrongo. The ideal is healthy and functional heterosexual household.

Prove it.

 

[logical4u]

and certain animals once they mate, mate for life. Are you suggesting because animals do, then people should as well?

Wrong, Its been shown Dolphins have sex purely for fun.

Are you saying god was wrong?

You were the one holding up the "animal kingdom" as something as a model. I was asking if it was only your particular agenda that you wanted followed, or if you would except all the behaviors. Who says dolphins have sex 'purely for fun'? Are they Doctor Dolittle? Have they actually had a discussion with dolphins? Is this considered scientific research? What is the scientist moral slant?

The Lord made us weak to particular temptations. We all have our own, personal temptations that we strive to overcome (it makes us better people with discipline). Only the homosexuals supporters are telling people to use self control in all aspects of life, except when it comes to sex.

jesus go educate yourself.
I have no reason to argue with religious nutballs.

I take it that your point was made invalid, and instead of showing a reasonable counterpoint, you response is to discriminate against what "you" believe is a religious affiliation? It says volumes for the "homosexual marriage agenda": there is no rational reason to re-define marriage or legalize "homosexual unions". It is the demands of spoiled people throwing a tantrum to get what they "want", no matter what the cost is for others.

 

[mattskramer]

Check this out:

COLAGE: People with a Lesbian, Gay, Bisexual, Transgender, or Queer Parent

Rescue these kids. Tell them that they have been deprived.
Take them to be raised by heterosexual couples.
Tell them that they would be better off with other adults.
Hurry before it is too late.

 

[kaz]

And yet you are legally married aren't you? So will you be honest and admit you are a fucking hypocrite?

We want to get married for the EXACT SAME reasons STR8TS do...period.

The same reasons?

I said I wanted to get my wife past her parents, but I oppose government marriage having any effect on anything else. I oppose the death tax for all, I oppose having different tax treatments.

You said you wanted gay marriage to stick your hand in other people's wallets.

In what possible way are those the same?

But I do like the hypocrisy attack. Which I handed to you and you think was clever. I pay income tax and oppose income taxes, I pay corporate tax (I own two businesses) and pay corporate taxes, I pay unemployment tax and oppose government unemployment insurance. The list goes on. So seriously, your argument is I recognize the reality of what I have to do because of government? I would only be a hypocrite if I actually wanted things that government marriage offers and chose it, I don't.

You are blessed, no one is going to demand you get a government marriage. I am telling you to kiss the sky and thank your lucky stars. Exactly how is that "hypocrisy?"

 

[Too Tall]

I don't have a problem with polygamy either. My only point of concern is how much of a say should wife #1 get in the marriage between the husband and wife #2 that he marries at a later date. Since a contract between him and #2 could effect the split of assets or whatever with #1, I'm wondering if she should have some legal ground to prevent that marriage. I guess it could just be up to the three of them to work out. Probably just one of many headaches for having multiple spouses.

maybe they use the seniority system....

Nah! I pick the one with the biggest boobs.

 

[mattskramer]

.............

The polls just show that the homosexual indoctrination being done in schools is working. Give them ten years in the adult world and check again, experience tells.

When schools were desegregated in the 1950's and 1960's in the USA, was that "negro indoctrination"?

 

[kaz]

No it doesn't make a difference and is just as ideal as heterosexual raising kids. The IDEAL situation for children is two parents who love them, period.

Wrongo. The ideal is healthy and functional heterosexual household.

Prove it.

Hmm...we have the experiences of growing up in a family, having families, having friends and acquaintances with families.

You have a liberal study that wanted to prove your point and claims they did.

Let's see, who has the stronger argument here...

 

[Seawytch]

There are some (not saying you) that want to deflect away from religious observance as a factor and would prefer to play the race card and advocate (or admonish as the case may be) that it was the blacks that passed Prop 8. The fact is that mathematically their impact was relatively small.
>>>>>

Whatever their reason for pushing that meme, the "blame the blacks" strategy didn't work. We don't blame the blacks for the passage of prop 8. Mostly we blame the lies paid for by the Mormons and other religious groups.

With marriage equality, poll after poll shows that opposition is an age and religion thing, period.

Please, list those lies.

The polls just show that the homosexual indoctrination being done in schools is working. Give them ten years in the adult world and check again, experience tells.

Prop 8 Lies

 

[Bass v 2.0]

.............

The polls just show that the homosexual indoctrination being done in schools is working. Give them ten years in the adult world and check again, experience tells.

"homosexual indoctrination being done in schools" what does that phrase mean?

How do schools "indoctrinate" homosexuality? Do only homosexuals do the "indoctrination"? Do only homosexuals get "indoctrinated"?

Got any facts to go along with your assertions? Or do you just make it up as you go along?

Whan schools were desegregated in the 1950's and 1960's in the USA, was that "negro indoctrination"?

Nice try with your weak association of blacks with fags, separate but equal was never equal in the first place. The goal was better schools, not to kick our feet with whites and wade in the water. Homosexuality is a sexual lifestyle, being black is not.

 

[kaz]

It is the demands of spoiled people throwing a tantrum to get what they "want", no matter what the cost is for others.

It's not just "no matter" the cost, she admitted it's her goal. She can't feel equality without the money, money, money, give her the money. Then she'll feel equal.

 

[Seawytch]

The ideal situation for kids is two parents, a man and a woman. I never said kids can't grow up and function without that, but it's not ideal. If you took kids who didn't have that, then you certainly performed a great service for them. But to say it makes no difference? Wow, a liberal study saying the sky isn't blue. Yet I look up and it is. You're a dogmatic wacko. That makes it entertaining to listen to you but no one's going to take you seriously. I support leaving you alone, yet you can't tell the difference between me and someone who condemns you to hell. 1% against me, you are 100% against me!

Are you one of those nut jobs who says anyone who thinks men are taller or stronger then women on average is a sexist?

No it doesn't make a difference and is just as ideal as heterosexual raising kids. The IDEAL situation for children is two parents who love them, period.

A period at the end of a sentence doesn't make the sentence to not have been full of crap. Look if you adopted hard to place kids then I applaud you and you have made a great difference in their lives.



But to say that a random kid is as good with two fathers or two mothers as a father and mother (all else being equal) then you are just ignorant, and no liberal study with a pre-determined outcome is going to change that.

No, I didn't adopt, I had children. I have two children of my own and I was a surrogate for a gay male couple...twice.

Wanna compare kids? I'll win...No "liberal" study needed, just good parenting skills and those don't have a sexual orientation.

Where's your study?

 

[Seawytch]

It is the demands of spoiled people throwing a tantrum to get what they "want", no matter what the cost is for others.

It's not just "no matter" the cost, she admitted it's her goal. She can't feel equality without the money, money, money, give her the money. Then she'll feel equal.

Why did you get legally married?

 

[kaz]

Wanna compare kids? I'll win...

What is your standard for "winning" since you know nothing about my kids?