Orthodox Jews and Zionism

[Art__Allm]

As for Neturei Karta, they should make a decision. Either they obey our laws and behave accordingly, or they don't. If they don't, then the cash they take from national security is not well deserved.

What laws are you talking about?

The religious laws or the civil laws?

 

[Lipush]

As for Neturei Karta, they should make a decision. Either they obey our laws and behave accordingly, or they don't. If they don't, then the cash they take from national security is not well deserved.

What laws are you talking about?

The religious laws or the civil laws?

The laws of the state of Israel (If they have Israeli citizenship).

 

[Lipush]

NK are NOT 'Orthodox' Jews: they are not part of the Orthodox movement of Judaism.

Yeah, that, too.

 

[amity1844]

The Synagogue incident does look disturbing, I don't remember that being discussed.

Israel does suppress news. That is very likely what happened here.

 

[Lipush]

The Synagogue incident does look disturbing, I don't remember that being discussed.

Israel does suppress news. That is very likely what happened here.

Maybe it wasn't properly reported. Maybe I just missed it.

 

[MHunterB]

As for Neturei Karta, they should make a decision. Either they obey our laws and behave accordingly, or they don't. If they don't, then the cash they take from national security is not well deserved.

What laws are you talking about?

The religious laws or the civil laws?

"In it but not of it" is a Christian concept and POV which Judaism and Israel does not hold. See 'the wicked son' in the Haggadah for more of an explanation....... There are plenty of 'support' ways to serve in any modern military: 'combat arms' is not even 10% of staffing.

 

[amity1844]

Work it out with the orthodox. This is obviously a more fundamental problem and a greater challenge to Israel's legitimacy than I had realized.

Please see the Rabbi Yaakov Shapiro thread.

 

[MHunterB]

They are not 'the Orthodox': "Orthodox" in terms of Judaism is a specific movement (like a 'denomination'), and these people are not part of that.

You have consistently mis-used the term here, and mis-representing who this Rabbi is speaking for: it's certainly not the Orthodox movement.

Why don't you 'work it out' with the FLDS?

 

[amity1844]

Again, there you are at a loss for words, so you elect to just waste bandwidth rather than say something substantive.

I used the term "orthodox Jews" because the speaker used it to self-describe. Everyone gets to self-identify, its a right they have, and you and I don't often get to say "no, he's not what he thinks he is."

 

[Lipush]

Again, there you are at a loss for words, so you elect to just waste bandwidth rather than say something substantive.

I used the term "orthodox Jews" because the speaker used it to self-describe. Everyone gets to self-identify, its a right they have, and you and I don't often get to say "no, he's not what he thinks he is."

Because they're not.

As I said many times before, you can put on a beak and feathers, it still won't make you a duck.

They can study Torah all day and put on a black suit. It still doesn't make them orthodox. They're always are, always will be, bullies with Kippahs.

Your lack of understandment is to the roof. We know who they are, and don't fall to what they pretend to be.

What they say they are is deception, not self definition.

 

[Phoenall]

When I posted my list of Jewish individuals, organizations, and publications who have opposed Zionism, several people responded that Orthodox Jews were not opposed to Zionism per se, but only to Israel's secular existence.

I was fairly sure that some at least were definitively anti-Zionist. So, you know me, I went to You Tube to hear it from orthodox Jews themselves.

There are differences among individuals and groups here, but there are definitely some seriously anti-Zionist orthodox Jews, and lots of them, make no mistake.
And it doesn't sound like they are having it any easier in Israel than the Palestinians are, actually:


Rabbi Josef Antebi:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DIT9sLz29iQ


Rabbi Dovid Weiss (Neturei Karta):
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JHj5aH4Mox8

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=l2SYMj41Q9U


Rabbi Yakov Mermelstein and others:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IapWP8hq9Mc


10,000+ Jews Against Israel (U.S. Media Blackout):
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nMQ9C6vni0w

(by the way .... can it be?? Yes!! Yes !!!!! he is speaking Yiddish!!! and 10,000 people right there understand him)


Jews Against Zionism:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=awCOSRg-gks


Shocking! How Jews are Treated in Israel:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JNH8Vuuymp0

Orthodox Jews Protest Israel "con job":
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tylDFfzJ7zc

Haredi: The ultra orthodox society in Israel (part 1 of 5):
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FGJg1lHPPZw

this is making me want to go watch Ushpizin one of my favorite movies!

Try again LOSER as this shows the extremist Jews and not the Orthodox, it would be like me claiming that A.Q. were the voice of all islam.

More ISLAMONAZI PROPAGANDA

 

[Phoenall]

I wonder how these rabbis are treated in Israel?


President Ahmadinejad Meets Neturei Karta Rabbis - 9/24/2007 - YouTube

With distrust and derision as they are the real moochers who refuse to work. If the Iranians knew what they believed they would have executed them years ago. If you knew what they believed you would be calling for their blood.

 

[Phoenall]

I wonder how these rabbis are treated in Israel?


President Ahmadinejad Meets Neturei Karta Rabbis - 9/24/2007 - YouTube

Not very well, according to them. One says he has been tortured. And if you watch the videos one shows many instances of them being roughed up by Israelis and Israeli police.

They are hatemongers and will do anything to prolong the war with the arabs as it suits their purpose. Like lepers the world over they are shunned, and it is these Jews that attack muslim and Christian children in Isreal.

 

[Phoenall]

Why not find out for us why this particular group is so popular on the NeoNazi/Islamofacist hate sites? When you get some answer, can you get back to us. There have been in the past many Jewish posters who actually are living in Brooklyn who could tell you that this group is a bunch of phonys and that thankfully their number is very small. It seems that the Jew haters lap up what this group says because it suits their own agenda.

I always love it when you call someone a "Jew-hater", yet can't explain why?

Do you mean like when you call for the massacre of all the Jews by U.S. forces and the destruction of Israel and we call you a Jew Hater. Can you see how you show you hate the Jews by posting this sort of thing.

Now if I posted that the U.S. should invade Palestine and massacre all the muslims you would be the first to claim I hated the muslims wouldn't you

 

[Phoenall]

When I posted my list of Jewish individuals, organizations, and publications who have opposed Zionism, several people responded that Orthodox Jews were not opposed to Zionism per se, but only to Israel's existence as a secular state.

I was fairly sure that some at least were definitively anti-Zionist. So, you know me, I went to You Tube to hear it from orthodox Jews themselves.

There are differences among individuals and groups here, but there are definitely some seriously anti-Zionist orthodox Jews, and lots of them, make no mistake.
And it doesn't sound like they are having it any easier than Palestinians are in Israel:


Rabbi Josef Antebbi:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DIT9sLz29iQ


Rabbi Dovid Weiss (Neturei Karta):
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JHj5aH4Mox8

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=l2SYMj41Q9U


Orthodox Jews protest Zionism:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IapWP8hq9Mc


Hajo Meyer, Auschwitz survivor:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Gsqj3HH4NVk


10,000+ Jews Against Israel (U.S. Media Blackout):
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nMQ9C6vni0w

(by the way .... can it be?? Yes!! Yes !!!!! he is speaking Yiddish!!! and 10,000 people right there understand him)


Jews Against Zionism:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=awCOSRg-gks

Oh how nice, Amity is showing us one of those crazies who is a favorite of the NeoNazi/Islamofascist hate sites. See his beard, Amity. If your beard grows like his, you can accompany him to Iran when he next visits his crazy friends there.
By the way, folks, if you check out some of the hate sites, you will see this guy featured there.

Did you count the numbers of extremist Jews in the video, no more than a thousand if you are lucky, and not one of them does a days work as it is beneath them

 

[Phoenall]

One of my fellow congregants said "If Jesus had been shot would you wear a little gun around your neck? "

The Jews you are extolling and raising on pedestals are the ones that murdered Jesus

 

[Picaro]

Not very well, according to them. One says he has been tortured. And if you watch the videos one shows many instances of them being roughed up by Israelis and Israeli police.

Given their propensity to spit on people, one of them got knocked flat on his ass and his nose broken by me when I was doing some commo work for a satellite company in Jerusalem. He made the mistake of confusing me with the Christians I was walking with to a satellite feed broadcast they were doing. The Israeli policewoman who witnessed the whole thing just told me to move on and go about our business, so I don't know what happened after that; we just heard some loud whining and sniveling fading away as we went down the street. I thought I would be arrested, but apparently these asshats do that crap so often the police don't bother much with pandering to them. The Christians who hired me weren't happy, though.

 

[Picaro]

One of my fellow congregants said "If Jesus had been shot would you wear a little gun around your neck? "

The Jews you are extolling and raising on pedestals are the ones that murdered Jesus

I'm no expert, but I don't think any Jewish sects today bear hardly any resemblance to the Jewish authorities who had Jesus arrested and tried, even the Haredis.

 

[MHunterB]

Again, there you are at a loss for words, so you elect to just waste bandwidth rather than say something substantive.

I used the term "orthodox Jews" because the speaker used it to self-describe. Everyone gets to self-identify, its a right they have, and you and I don't often get to say "no, he's not what he thinks he is."

LOL, well *you* don't have that right here - but I do, and Lipush, and Toasty, and every single other Jew-practicing-Judaism.

'Orthodox' with a capital 'O' means a stream/movement of Judaism: with a small 'o' it means nothing . Judaism doesn't have 'orthodoxy': it is an 'orthopractic' faith community. Meaning that we don't differentiate ourselves from one another according to 'doctrine' - as do Christians - but according to long-established practice/tradition/community custom. ALL of which are still part of what a Jew means by 'Torah' in its broadest sense.

 

[Lipush]

Again, there you are at a loss for words, so you elect to just waste bandwidth rather than say something substantive.

I used the term "orthodox Jews" because the speaker used it to self-describe. Everyone gets to self-identify, its a right they have, and you and I don't often get to say "no, he's not what he thinks he is."

LOL, well *you* don't have that right here - but I do, and Lipush, and Toasty, and every single other Jew-practicing-Judaism.

'Orthodox' with a capital 'O' means a stream/movement of Judaism: with a small 'o' it means nothing . Judaism doesn't have 'orthodoxy': it is an 'orthopractic' faith community. Meaning that we don't differentiate ourselves from one another according to 'doctrine' - as do Christians - but according to long-established practice/tradition/community custom. ALL of which are still part of what a Jew means by 'Torah' in its broadest sense.