Republicans be Warned: Blocking Gun Control Debate will Hurt You

[chikenwing]

Actually OP's article is right.
This might be one of those times to set your values aside and win votes. Right now the majority supports universal background checks. It might be time to swallow the pill and support it, at least until the next election cycle.

..........................

That would be a no!!

The left want action while they can keep the sympathy support afloat,can't waste a crisis stall some and it not a winner for the anti rights group.Hasn't been in the past,won't be now.

I would suspect that many see i as a compromise,but its certainly not.

 

[007]

1. They don't have the ability to stop a debate or a vote, they can only delay and force a required 60 votes to pass.

2. I don't care if the 96% of idiots in America want Universal Background Checks, they don't understand what a Universal Background Check means. A Universal Background Check law means a gun registry, and historically gun registries precede gun confiscation. Think it can't happen? They did it in Australia, they did it in Britain, did it to New Orleans during Katrina. Gun confiscation is real.

 

[legaleagle_45]

There is NO way to defend ownership of this kind of military gun,

It would indeed be more difficult to defend opposition to the assault weapon bans if the object of the ban was military grade weaponry. Unfortunately for you, assault weapons are not "military grade" weapons, they are "military style" weapons. Modern military battle rifles are fully automatic -- select fire weapons capable of firing more than one round with each pull of the trigger. Assualt weapons are incapable of full auto-- select fire operation and will fire only one round at a time. No modern military force employs or even would want to employ these "assault weapons" as their main battle rifle as they are not nearly as capable and deadly as the full auto-- select fire rifles employed.

Instead, "assault weapons" are designed for the civilian market and are functionally equivalent to many other quite legal firearms... the only distinction being some cosmetic features which make them LOOOK like a military grade weapon.... sorta like painting a racing stripe on your Hyundai and thinking that you now have a NASCAR race car capable of winning the Daytona 500. You will be disheartend when you find out the Hyundai with the racing stripe still has the same engine and does not have a chance at Daytona... But it still looks faster!

 

[Spoonman]

It will be quite easy for the Republicans to avoid the problem. All they need do is propose an alternative bill calling for Universal Background Checks without the record keeping requirement which Chuck Schumer is insisting upon (and which amounts to backdoor gun registration). Then the dems will have two choices, approve the republican bill or have nothing and be blamed for torpedoing Universal Background Checks by insisting upon gun registration, something that even Obama is on record opposing.

or agree to universal background checks with the removal of limitations on what people who pass these checks can own. If these background checks will really work as the anti gun crowd claims they will, there is no longer the need to limit what people who pass these checks should be able to own.

 

[Circe]

There is NO way to defend ownership of this kind of military gun,

It would indeed be more difficult to defend opposition to the assault weapon bans if the object of the ban was military grade weaponry. Unfortunately for you, assault weapons are not "military grade" weapons, they are "military style" weapons. Modern military battle rifles are fully automatic -- select fire weapons capable of firing more than one round with each pull of the trigger. Assualt weapons are incapable of full auto-- select fire operation and will fire only one round at a time. No modern military force employs or even would want to employ these "assault weapons" as their main battle rifle as they are not nearly as capable and deadly as the full auto-- select fire rifles employed.

Instead, "assault weapons" are designed for the civilian market and are functionally equivalent to many other quite legal firearms... the only distinction being some cosmetic features which make them LOOOK like a military grade weapon.... sorta like painting a racing stripe on your Hyundai and thinking that you now have a NASCAR race car capable of winning the Daytona 500. You will be disheartend when you find out the Hyundai with the racing stripe still has the same engine and does not have a chance at Daytona... But it still looks faster!

Whatever.

If the gun-stockpiling right ends up getting guns banned across America because of their crazy defense of this crazy gun used by crazies to do mass shootings, it's not going to be a joke to people like us on farms, who actually USE guns week in and out. This is way too big and wild a country for everyone to have to do without guns, and there are way too many criminals. I think it's time for you all to get serious and throw out your ballast.

 

[legaleagle_45]

The quote from Reno is bogus. It originates with a claim by Fred Diamond in 1995 who claimed to have heard Reno say that in 1984 during a speech at Coral Gables, Florida.

Reno denies ever saying such a thing and no other attendees of the event have backed Diamond's version of events. It is termed the The "B'nai B'rith" speech.

GunCite - Gun Control: Bogus gun control quotes

 

[Erand7899]

With ban on semi-automatic weapons out, Congress now spars over universal background checks | Fox News




If the GOP filibusters and/or continues to block even debate on proposed legislation, they will feel the voter's wrath in 2014 and again in 2016. With 80% of voters supporting enhanced background checks, the GOP could lose the House in 2014, if they continue to deal for the NRA. I guess they enjoy those fat checks from the NRA more than anyone realized.

Not when the bill has other onerous provisions in it, like assault weapon band magazine bans and registry of owners.

You realize that the assault weapons ban and the magazine items have been stripped from the bill? The only thing left is the enhanced registration, supported by 88% of voters. The GOP is afraid of losing those envelops with cash that NRA lobby slip to them when they vote the NRA's position. The NRA is lead by the gun industry, not the membership. It all comes down to cash...The Dems will pepper the airwaves with Sandy Hook parents if the GOP blocks debate on this bill. You can bet on it....

Voter enthusiasm for gun control wanes rapidly as time passes and emotion is replaced with common sense. Unless we have another incident between now and 2014, the gun debate will be history.

Besides, once common sense people realize what universal background checks really means, they will no longer support it. Once they realize that the background checks we have today are expensive, time consuming, and absolutely useless in preventing bad people from getting guns, they will no longer support even that.

 

[Circe]

The quote from Reno is bogus. It originates with a claim by Fred Diamond in 1995 who claimed to have heard Reno say that in 1984 during a speech at Coral Gables, Florida.

Reno denies ever saying such a thing and no other attendees of the event have backed Diamond's version of events. It is termed the The "B'nai B'rith" speech.

GunCite - Gun Control: Bogus gun control quotes

Well, I wondered! It seemed a little radical, really, for a national pol.

 

[legaleagle_45]

Whatever.

I thought you might wish to make decisions based on fact and not emotion. So, you must believe that Hyudai with a racing stripe can when the Daytona 500, right?

Many persons in Congress understand the distinction, which is why Harry Reid pulled the plug on the assault weapons ban. It would not have done one bit of good.... at least if you believe the 3 DoJ studies conducted on the previous assault weapons ban.

 

[Circe]

Voter enthusiasm for gun control wanes rapidly as time passes and emotion is replaced with common sense. Unless we have another incident between now and 2014, the gun debate will be history.

Besides, once common sense people realize what universal background checks really means, they will no longer support it. Once they realize that the background checks we have today are expensive, time consuming, and absolutely useless in preventing bad people from getting guns, they will no longer support even that.

The likelihood, however, is that we'll have 50 more such incidents! They are coming fast and furious now; enlivened by the occasional mass stabbing or whatever, like today.

I'm not in favor of the background checks if they don't actually put any psychiatric information on the public record, which they didn't with ANY of the killers in the last few years. And felons and crazies just get someone to buy their stuff. That elderly felon who shot the firefighters in New York State had someone get him his assault rifle. He used it to kill his sister and shoot the firefighters after he fired his house. The Columbine killers got someone to buy the assault rifles and shotguns and whatnot they used -- it was an 18-year-old girl, at a gun show.

It's hard to know how to stop these madman killings! But I don't agree with all the men saying, oh, never mind, it doesn't matter, it's just women and kids getting killed anyway, who cares.

 

[Circe]

Many persons in Congress understand the distinction, which is why Harry Reid pulled the plug on the assault weapons ban. It would not have done one bit of good.... at least if you believe the 3 DoJ studies conducted on the previous assault weapons ban.

No, Reid counted his votes, like he always does, and came up short. Has nothing to do with doing good ----- we are talking about politics here, aren't we?

Could be an interesting vote Thursday.

I'm not especially interested in it, however -- all I want is an assault rifle ban and a ban on the high-capacity magazines, so I don't care about the other stuff and don't even really like it.

 

[kwc57]

With ban on semi-automatic weapons out, Congress now spars over universal background checks | Fox News

Leading gun-control advocate Mark Kelly warned Republican senators that trying to block a vote on new firearms legislation that includes universal background checks could hurt their re-election efforts.

Kelly, a former astronaut and Navy captain, directed his remarks to Sens. Rand Paul and Marco Rubio, among five Republican senators who have suggested they will filibuster a debate and full floor vote.

“They should listen to their constituents” and not get in the way of the debate, Kelly told “Fox News Sunday.”

If the GOP filibusters and/or continues to block even debate on proposed legislation, they will feel the voter's wrath in 2014 and again in 2016. With 80% of voters supporting enhanced background checks, the GOP could lose the House in 2014, if they continue to deal for the NRA. I guess they enjoy those fat checks from the NRA more than anyone realized.

Yes, please........keep telling yourself that. Time will tell.

 

[legaleagle_45]

Well, I wondered! It seemed a little radical, really, for a national pol.

I strive to be accurate regardless if it helps my argument or not, Circe. Which is also why I was trying to set you straight on "assault weapons"... the terminology was adopted by a virulent anti gun proponent named Josh Sugarmann of the Violence Policy Center (VPC)

"Assault weapons—just like armor-piercing bullets, machine guns, and plastic firearms—are a new topic. The weapons' menacing looks, coupled with the public's confusion over fully automatic machine guns versus semi-automatic assault weapons—anything that looks like a machine gun is assumed to be a machine gun—can only increase the chance of public support for restrictions on these weapons. In addition, few people can envision a practical use for these weapons."

-Josh Sugarmann, Assault Weapons and Accessories in America, 1988

In short, he is relying upon people to think that it is something that it is not.

Josh is also responsible for the mythical plastic gun scare that resulted in a ban on a firearm that never existed... LOL

 

[Erand7899]

There is NO way to defend ownership of this kind of military gun,

It would indeed be more difficult to defend opposition to the assault weapon bans if the object of the ban was military grade weaponry. Unfortunately for you, assault weapons are not "military grade" weapons, they are "military style" weapons. Modern military battle rifles are fully automatic -- select fire weapons capable of firing more than one round with each pull of the trigger. Assualt weapons are incapable of full auto-- select fire operation and will fire only one round at a time. No modern military force employs or even would want to employ these "assault weapons" as their main battle rifle as they are not nearly as capable and deadly as the full auto-- select fire rifles employed.

Instead, "assault weapons" are designed for the civilian market and are functionally equivalent to many other quite legal firearms... the only distinction being some cosmetic features which make them LOOOK like a military grade weapon.... sorta like painting a racing stripe on your Hyundai and thinking that you now have a NASCAR race car capable of winning the Daytona 500. You will be disheartend when you find out the Hyundai with the racing stripe still has the same engine and does not have a chance at Daytona... But it still looks faster!

Whatever.

If the gun-stockpiling right ends up getting guns banned across America because of their crazy defense of this crazy gun used by crazies to do mass shootings, it's not going to be a joke to people like us on farms, who actually USE guns week in and out. This is way too big and wild a country for everyone to have to do without guns, and there are way too many criminals. I think it's time for you all to get serious and throw out your ballast.

What do you throw out next? What do you give up after the next crazy shoots up a bunch of kids? Pretty soon you run out of things to throw out, and you have nothing left.

The anti-gun nuts will never let any tragedy go to waste. At one time, they told us they were only after cheap hand guns, and would never contest the right of Americans to own long guns. That lasted until the first opportunity presented itself to go after some of those long guns. Their goal is the complete elimination of guns from common Americans, and they will never end their demands for another reasonable compromise.

 

[legaleagle_45]

No, Reid counted his votes, like he always does, and came up short. Has nothing to do with doing good

He counted his votes and only had 40 Senators willing to vote for the AWB... because most senators realize that "assault weapons" are not machine guns and banning them would do no good.

 

[Uncensored2008]

I've already instructed my senators that if they don't block it or vote against this, I'll work to remove them from office next year.

I informed my Senators of the same thing.

They wrote back "Fuck off peasant, shut up and obey without question. Yours DiFi and Barby Boxer!"

 

[Circe]

What do you throw out next? What do you give up after the next crazy shoots up a bunch of kids? Pretty soon you run out of things to throw out, and you have nothing left.

The anti-gun nuts will never let any tragedy go to waste. At one time, they told us they were only after cheap hand guns, and would never contest the right of Americans to own long guns. That lasted until the first opportunity presented itself to go after some of those long guns. Their goal is the complete elimination of guns from common Americans, and they will never end their demands for another reasonable compromise.

As recent history has shown, it was such a very, very bad idea to bring back those assault rifles and high-capacity magazines. Combined with Halo and Gears of War and all the other shooter games, these weapons suddenly became the fashion statement of the coming young psychotic all over America, not to mention all the gun-collecting senior citizens whose brains softened in old age.

If we had never brought back those weapons, all this would never have happened and you all could go on as you were, stockpiling armories for the Revolution.

It's not going to be a joke if this leaves everybody weaponless like Australia and Great Britain and the thugs and rioters take over, and if that happens, I myself will be blaming the right for not being willing to help solve the psychotic mass-killing problem.

You all won't help solve this problem, you just argue that it isn't happening at all or that it doesn't matter! Well, it is happening and it does matter, and they are YOUR guns, so FIX it.

 

[Dugdale_Jukes]

> Base decisions on fact, not emotion. - popular sentiment rarely demonstrated

Here is a fact: millions of people like me are going to keep our guns.

We are not going to register them, we are not going to buy liability insurance.

And we are going to pass them on to family or sell them to like-minded people.

---------------

Here is some opinion: if anti-abortion nuts succeed, then real gun control will likely be next. Government is like a Chinese handcuff, the only way to beat it is from the inside like Wall Street, like multinational corporations, and like the insurance companies and the health industry that pretends to oppose Obamacare.

Here is another opinion: if halfwit-partisan America - BOTH corporatocracies pretending to represent natural born Americans instead of paper entities - continues to destroy individual rights and individual quality of life, then there is no telling where it ends. But it is a good bet from here on out the path is downhill.

 

[Uncensored2008]

No, you do not understand the issue. The issue is NOT gun ownership. The issue is more aggressive background checks. Over 80% of the voters support this issue. The GOP is miscalculating badly.

You try so hard.

You tried to strip basic civil rights, and got slapped down. Now you spin it as something other than a frontal assault on basic liberty.

You lost this time, but each assault on rights causes us to waver a bit more. No doubt you will eventually realize your dream of a totalitarian state.

Just not today.

 

[Uncensored2008]

The American people will now KNOW who the republican party really works for

Sorry... who?

The American People.

SEIU and George Soros strongly object to that.