Russia's Unreasonable Demands for Peace Deal!

[ESay]

Yes, of course. Italy (as a linguistic and cultural space) existed long before official start of the Roman history

Cool, but the Romans are still called Romans, not the Italians.

I'm not sure, that Biden's regime actually wants to win the hearts and minds of Ukrainians. Looks like that they are searching the way to damage control

Stop clowning, dude. I was talking about the Putin regime.

 

[krichton]

Russia has already reduced the Ukraine's 34 million population to about half and that by only destroying a small per centage of Ukraine's territory.

Russia appears to be bent on reducing it still further, and that would make the remainder compliant to Russia's advance.

The people of the Ukraine know very well that they can ask for peace and Russia will grant it to them. No puppet Russian government will ever be necessary.

Only America stands in the way of peace now.

You literally sound like the biggest kremlin stooge right now.

 

[Silver Cat]

Cool, but the Romans are still called Romans, not the Italians.

It depends on your practical goals. "Romans" is more a political term, "Italians" usually is a wider geographical, political and linguistic term. They rarely actively opposed each other, for example during Social War (91-87 BC), when both were political terms. Or, for example, modern Rumanians pretend to be Romans, but don't pretend to be Italians.
The question "Who is the true heir, and who is just a fraud? " is one of the most inflammable matters.

 

[José]

To say that Russia existed at those times as 'cultural and linguistic space'
is the same as to say Italy existed in the Roman times.

Stop nitpicking and splitting hairs, cat.

What he's trying to say is that the nation state of Italy and the modern Italian people with all the cultural elements that form their national identity (the italian language, the italian cuisine (pasta, pizzas, etc, etc...)) didn't exist in Roman times.

Sheesh... Talk about derailing a good conversation over nothing!!

 

[Silver Cat]

To say that Russia existed at those times as 'cultural and linguistic space'
is the same as to say Italy existed in the Roman times.

Stop nitpicking and splitting hairs, cat.

What he's trying to say is that the nation state of Italy and the modern Italian people with all the cultural elements that form their national identity (the italian language, the italian cuisine (pasta, pizzas, etc, etc...)) didn't exist in Roman times.

Sheesh... Talk about derailing a good conversation over nothing!!

No one of now living human being didn't exist even two hundred years ago. Are modern Americans true heirs of the first colonists, or of American rebels, or Cowboys, or gold-seekers, or slave-traders? We believe - yes. Are moderns Italians or Rumanians true heirs of the Ancient Rome? They belive - yes. Are modern Russians or Ukrainians true heirs of Medieval Russia, or of the Golden Horde, or of the Vikings, or the Russian Empire, or of the Soviet Union? They believe - yes.
Who are we to discuss about it? It's their identity, their myths.

 

[José]

Originally posted by Silver Cat
No one of now living human being didn't exist even two hundred years ago. Are modern Americans true heirs of the first colonists, or of American rebels, or Cowboys, or gold-seekers, or slave-traders? We believe - yes. Are moderns Italians or Rumanians true heirs of the Ancient Rome? They belive - yes. Are modern Russians or Ukrainians true heirs of Medieval Russia, or of the Golden Horde, or of the Vikings, or the Russian Empire, or of the Soviet Union? They believe - yes.
Who are we to discuss about it? It's their identity, their myths.

Ok, if your point is that none of the modern eastern slavic peoples existed in the 10th century I wholeheartedly agree.

 

[Mac-7]

This is a war that never should have happened. Didn't need to happen. Only happened because it conveniently laundered money into the Biden pockets.

Russia was never and is never going to tolerate NATO on its doorstep. The reasons we used to reach the brink of nuclear war over Cuba applies here. All those people died for nothing. All that destruction for nothing. Now it's keep the killing going for American pride. It's disgusting. This is only going to end one way. There will be no NATO Ukraine. Or there will be no Ukraine.

Russia suffers from delusions of grandeur

Its a third rate nation in every sense except military power

And flatters itself that NATO would even want to invade it

 

[Silver Cat]

Ok, if your point is that none of the modern eastern slavic peoples existed in the 10th century I wholeheartedly agree.

I didn't say "peoples". I said "human beings". The question if, say, the people of modern Israel and people of Bronze Age Israel are same people or different - it's quite complicated and inflammable question. It's mostly the question of the state-sponsored mythology, political declarations, pseudo-historical stories and some sort of identity.

 

[Silver Cat]

Russia suffers from delusions of grandeur

Why "suffers"? They enjoy it.

Its a third rate nation in every sense except military power

Do you really want to rate the nations?

And flatters itself that NATO would even want to invade it

Actually, the countries which now are members of NATO have been invading Russia at least one time a century for more than a thousand of years. The Russians have quite specific and traumatic experience of their relationships with the Western neighbors.

 

[Mac-7]

Why "suffers"? They enjoy it.


Do you really want to rate the nations?


Actually, the countries which now are members of NATO have been invading Russia at least one time a century for more than a thousand of years. The Russians have quite specific and traumatic experience of their relationships with the Western neighbors.

You have a long memory

Germany invaded in 1941 and France in 1812

There is no danger of NATO invading in the 21 Century

 

[Silver Cat]

You have a long memory

Germany invaded in 1941 and France in 1812

There is no danger of NATO invading in the 21 Century

England and France invaded in 1853, as well as Germany invaded in 1914, and 14 countries (including the USA) invaded Russia in 1918.
Sweden invaded Russia in 1741, Poland invaded Russia in 1609, say nothing about numerous invasions of Lithuania, Livonia and Northern Crusades.

Right now NATO totally supports discrimination and genocide of the Russians in Ukraine and Baltic states and American politicians deliberately destroyed almost the whole system of weapon control. From the Russian point of view (may be, a bit paranoidal) it looks like preparations for the war against Russia. Anyway, it's not about intentions. It's about capabilities.

 

[toomuchtime_]

I didn't say "peoples". I said "human beings". The question if, say, the people of modern Israel and people of Bronze Age Israel are same people or different - it's quite complicated and inflammable question. It's mostly the question of the state-sponsored mythology, political declarations, pseudo-historical stories and some sort of identity.

You didn't say anything. Nations are defined by laws and treaties, not you your Nazi inspired race theories.

 

[Silver Cat]

You didn't say anything. Nations are defined by laws and treaties, not you your Nazi inspired race theories.

It's not about race. It's about identity.

 

[toomuchtime_]

It's not about race. It's about identity.

No, what you are trying to do is assign identity based on race.

 

[Mac-7]

England and France invaded in 1853, as well as Germany invaded in 1914, and 14 countries (including the USA) invaded Russia in 1918.
Sweden invaded Russia in 1741, Poland invaded Russia in 1609, say nothing about numerous invasions of Lithuania, Livonia and Northern Crusades.

Right now NATO totally supports discrimination and genocide of the Russians in Ukraine and Baltic states and American politicians deliberately destroyed almost the whole system of weapon control. From the Russian point of view (may be, a bit paranoidal) it looks like preparations for the war against Russia. Anyway, it's not about intentions. It's about capabilities.

1918, 1609, 1741

We live in a different time today

If Switzerland can live peacefully with NATO on its border so can Russia

 

[José]

1918, 1609, 1741

We live in a different time today

If Switzerland can live peacefully with
NATO on its border so can Russia

​

This is what NATO members said to Libya in 2003 when they finally convinced Gaddafi to destroy his weapons.

 

[Silver Cat]

No, what you are trying to do is assign identity based on race.

Of course, no. Racial, cultural and linguistic groups are quite different things.

 

[Silver Cat]

1918, 1609, 1741

We live in a different time today

If Switzerland can live peacefully with NATO on its border so can Russia

Time is always the same. If NATO support discrimination and genocide of the Russians in Ukraine and Baltic states and want to take the Russian land - there can't be peaceful coexistence between Russia and NATO.

 

[Mac-7]

Time is always the same. If NATO support discrimination and genocide of the Russians in Ukraine and Baltic states and want to take the Russian land - there can't be peaceful coexistence between Russia and NATO.

NATO is not taking russian land

Russia is taking land that is not its

 

[Silver Cat]

NATO is not taking russian land

Russia is taking land that is not its

From the Russian point of view it is Russian land. The Russian people live there, and European invaders and their local collaborants (as they usually do) discriminate, kill, rape and torture them.