So this guy from Chicago, shows up at a Florida Convenience store showing the clerk he has a gun. Clerk shows robber his gun. Yeah for 2nd amend.

[Blues Man]

Not really. The gun stores sell 250,000 guns that cross the border every year... The only reason they balked was because the ATF was "watching".



The problem is that it won't solve the problem. It will just mean a lot of black kids will end up in the grinder of the Prison Industrial Complex while white kids get good lawyers and please.

There is simply no problem where "Lock more people Up' is the right answer. EVER!

Wrong again

The take rights away from everyone bullshit because a few people commit crimes isn't the answer EVER

 

[Hollie]

Not really. The gun stores sell 250,000 guns that cross the border every year... The only reason they balked was because the ATF was "watching".



The problem is that it won't solve the problem. It will just mean a lot of black kids will end up in the grinder of the Prison Industrial Complex while white kids get good lawyers and please.

There is simply no problem where "Lock more people Up' is the right answer. EVER!

The ''Prison Industrial Complex".

Wow. We're in a time warp. It's the mid 1960's and the hippies are making a come-back.

 

[JoeB131]

wrong...liar. The ATF under obama needed to get guns sold to the cartels.....

Now you are getting into Dale Smith level crazy.

 

[JoeB131]

Wrong again

The take rights away from everyone bullshit because a few people commit crimes isn't the answer EVER

Gun ownership isn't a right. It's a privilege.

The ''Prison Industrial Complex".

Wow. We're in a time warp. It's the mid 1960's and the hippies are making a come-back.

You don't have to be a hippy to see the downsides of mass institutional incarcerations, which is why every other industrialized democratic country avoids this sort of thing.

We lock up 2 million people.
We have another 7 million on probation or parole.
100 million Americans have a police record.

Do you feel any safer? I don't.

 

[Vagabond63]

Yes....criminals are going to hurt innocent people...but in the U.S. we can and do fight back....according to the Centers for Disease control this happens about 1.1 million times a year....according to our Department of Justice it happens 1.5 million times a year....rapes, robberies, murders, beatings, stabbings and mass public shootings...stopped by armed citizens.....

Meanwhile, in Europe....your woman are raped without the ability to protect themselves....when your criminals decide to kill, your people are defenseless....

And, again, if you think British criminals are going to stay the same as your crime rates go up.....you are really delusional....

 

[Vagabond63]

Yes....and in America it is the same....criminals primarily murder other criminals, and then their friends and family get caught up in the violence.....you are also seeing more of this in Britain and across Europe as your drug gangs become less concerned about collateral damage...

Nine-year-old Olivia was shot in her home in Dovecot, Liverpool, on Monday, August 22, when a gunman chased convicted burglar Joseph Nee into her home.

Thomas Cashman, 34, has been charged with her murder and appeared in court earlier this week.

Public told 'do your duty' to ensure justice is done for Olivia

"There is a duty on us all to actually ensure that justice is done."

www.liverpoolecho.co.uk

You are really dumb if you think drug gangs in Britain aren't going to get worse and worse as you attack your own police with leftist drivel, and start to get soft on crime....

You can thank a decade or more of Right wing Conservative "governments" for cutting Police funding here. But that's beside the point, even if we were all armed to the teeth, we couldn't stop such tragedies as Olivia's. You are just fearmongering with your BS as usual.

 

[Blues Man]

Gun ownership isn't a right. It's a privilege.



You don't have to be a hippy to see the downsides of mass institutional incarcerations, which is why every other industrialized democratic country avoids this sort of thing.

We lock up 2 million people.
We have another 7 million on probation or parole.
100 million Americans have a police record.

Do you feel any safer? I don't.

Not according to the Constitution.

ANd I do not feel unsafe because I am not afraid of the world like you are.

And how many times do you need to be told we lock up the wrong people. More people are in prison for minor drug possession and property crimes than violent crimes

 

[2aguy]

You can thank a decade or more of Right wing Conservative "governments" for cutting Police funding here. But that's beside the point, even if we were all armed to the teeth, we couldn't stop such tragedies as Olivia's. You are just fearmongering with your BS as usual.

No, you can thank leftists and their out of control spending in Britain.........you guys spend and spend and then think you will never run out of other people's money....

 

[JoeB131]

Not according to the Constitution.

ANd I do not feel unsafe because I am not afraid of the world like you are.

And how many times do you need to be told we lock up the wrong people. More people are in prison for minor drug possession and property crimes than violent crimes

We lock up too many people.
We give them no job prospects when they get out.
Then we wonder why they turn to crime.

 

[Bob Blaylock]

Gun ownership isn't a right. It's a privilege.

The Constitution of the United States, the highest law in this nation, explicitly says otherwise.

 

[Blues Man]

We lock up too many people.
We give them no job prospects when they get out.
Then we wonder why they turn to crime.

We lock up the wrong people and feel free to hire all the excons you want

 

[2aguy]

We lock up too many people.
We give them no job prospects when they get out.
Then we wonder why they turn to crime.

Too many of our people have been destroyed by the democrat party and its policies....creating generational poverty, fatherlessness which then creates more and more violent criminals...you are the problem, you and your slave rapist political party.

 

[Batcat]

Not the point.

The point is, the Gun Lobby sells stupid people on the notion that a gun in the home is going to protect them from phantom bad guys.

When in fact, it is more likely to be used during a domestic argument or because their teenager got depressed and killed himself.

I've known exactly ZERO people who have killed a bad guy with a gun.

I know of three people who died in the circumstances I mentioned. One guy in the neighborhood I was growing up shot his wife during an argument, and two people I know had suicides in their families. One of those was my next door neighbor.

The fact that you know zero bad guys who were killed with a gun proves nothing.

In the first place often a gun itself is enough to scare away a bad guy without even being fired.

The burglar alarm in my home was sounding so my daughter walked into the kitchen to find a guy halfway through the sliding glass door he was forcing open.

She pointed the large caliber revolver she had with her at him and he wisely decided to run.

She called the police and they responded quickly but never caught the guy.

 

[JoeB131]

The Constitution of the United States, the highest law in this nation, explicitly says otherwise.

It specifically mentions militias and it doesn't mention guns at all.

The fact that you know zero bad guys who were killed with a gun proves nothing.

In the first place often a gun itself is enough to scare away a bad guy without even being fired.

Your boring "I know a guy" story aside... the fact is, the few number of ACTUAL incidents are dwarfed by the number of murders, suicides, accidents, and injuries guns cause.

Too many of our people have been destroyed by the democrat party and its policies....creating generational poverty, fatherlessness which then creates more and more violent criminals...you are the problem, you and your slave rapist political party.

Bullshit, guy. France has a out of wedlock birth rate of almost 70%, and they have NOWHERE NEAR our crime rates.

You also work on the assumption the OOW birth rate has anything to do with government relief programs, or that out of wedlock means fatherless, and neither of these are really true, either.

 

[Batcat]

Your boring "I know a guy" story aside... the fact is, the few number of ACTUAL incidents are dwarfed by the number of murders, suicides, accidents, and injuries guns cause.

.

A high percentage if not the majority of self defense uses of firearms do not involve anyone being shot. Consequently they are not reported for the statistics that are used for crime.

My daughter for example called the cops about the intruder but since she never fired the revolver what chances do you think that incident was ever used in statistics?

How Often Are Guns Used in Self Defense? | Stats [2024]

A 2021 survey2 estimated that guns are used 1.67 million times per year in self defense in the United States.

americangunfacts.com

Guns used in self defense stats often try to measure the duck that didn’t quack. In other words, there may not be a police report or any other record when no crime was committed or reported. Most of the time a gun is used to prevent a crime, there is no record.

As a result, data on defensive use of force and averted crimes due to the presence of a defensive gun are controversial, contentious, and range widely. Defensive gun use (DGU) statistics generally rely on self-reporting, interviews, police, and media reports which are then extrapolated to the national population using a variety of statistical methods which produce contradictory and often wildly inconsistent estimates.

***snip***

How Guns Were Used – Were Shots Fired?​

No shots were fired in 81.9% of those defensive use cases. 50.9% of the time, displaying the firearm was sufficient to scare off the attacker; 31% of the time, simply telling someone they were armed prevented the attack from taking place. Only 18.1% of the time was firing the gun required to defend their life.

Data Visualization | Defensive Gun Uses in the U.S. | The Heritage Foundation

According to almost every major study on the issue, Americans use their firearms defensively between 500,000 and 3 million times each year. From @HeritageDataViz

datavisualizations.heritage.org

All of the law-abiding citizens featured in this database successfully defended their liberties, lives, or livelihoods with the lawful use of a firearm. These cases are not based on hearsay, but on verifiable reports found through public sources.

According to the Centers for Disease Control and Prevention, almost every major study on defensive gun use has found that Americans use their firearms defensively between 500,000 and 3 million times each year. There’s good reason to believe that most defensive gun uses are never reported to law enforcement, much less picked up by local or national media outlets. …emphasis added

This database, therefore, is not intended to be comprehensive. Instead, it highlights just a fraction of the incredible number of times Americans relied on the Second Amendment—not the government getting there in time—to protect their inalienable rights. Despite the limitations on data, these confirmed cases of defensive gun use help prove that the “good guy with a gun” is not a myth, but an integral part of American society.

 

[Woodznutz]

Or we recognize a gun in the home is 43 times more likely to kill a household member than a criminal...

Suicide. The ultimate freedom of choice.

Regarding accidental shootings, "You can't fix stupid."

 

[JoeB131]

A high percentage if not the majority of self defense uses of firearms do not involve anyone being shot. Consequently they are not reported for the statistics that are used for crime.

My daughter for example called the cops about the intruder but since she never fired the revolver what chances do you think that incident was ever used in statistics?

Actually, probably pretty good. They had to report the call and the incident.

But let's look at it another way. If you have an encounter between a gun owner and a crook where the crook saw a gun and moved on, did that really "prevent" a crime? Did the Criminal Find Jesus that day and walked the straight an narrow. Nope. He just moved on to an easier target, like a home he was sure no one was home at. So no crimes are actually prevented if you haven't either killed or wounded the bad guy.

 

[JoeB131]

Okay, let's look at your bullshit stats.

No shots were fired in 81.9% of those defensive use cases. 50.9% of the time, displaying the firearm was sufficient to scare off the attacker; 31% of the time, simply telling someone they were armed prevented the attack from taking place. Only 18.1% of the time was firing the gun required to defend their life.

So if the 200 fatalities are in the 18% where shots were fired, then the number of non-shot fired incidents are the other 82% That means you've had only about 1000 DGU, not 3 million.

According to the Centers for Disease Control and Prevention, almost every major study on defensive gun use has found that Americans use their firearms defensively between 500,000 and 3 million times each year. There’s good reason to believe that most defensive gun uses are never reported to law enforcement, much less picked up by local or national media outlets. …emphasis added

Um, yeah, the CDC isn't allowed to study guns since Kellerman found a gun in the home is more dangerous to the people living in the home.

All the CDC did was compile all the bullshit reports the NRA has paid for for Ammosexual clowns like Lott.

 

[Hollie]

Gun ownership isn't a right. It's a privilege.



You don't have to be a hippy to see the downsides of mass institutional incarcerations, which is why every other industrialized democratic country avoids this sort of thing.

We lock up 2 million people.
We have another 7 million on probation or parole.
100 million Americans have a police record.

Do you feel any safer? I don't.

Well, yes, SJW’s are incensed that criminals are held liable and responsible for their crimes. Let’s see how the leftist social justice experiment works when criminals are held to even lesser standards.

America's 'most dangerous' law? Illinois candidate warns of 'anarchy' after criminal justice overhaul

Orland Park Mayor and congressional candidate for Illinois’ 6th district Keith Pekau says the SAFE-T Act could create potential 'anarchy' in the state.

www.foxnews.com

The Illinois Safety, Accountability, Fairness and Equity-Today (SAFE-T) Act changes multiple parts of Illinois' justice system with provisions like ending cash bail; limiting how flights determine whether defendants are flight risks; and allows defendants under electronic monitoring to leave home for 48 hours before they can be charged with escape.



Sounds like a SJW’s little slice of leftist heaven.



The party has already started.

Chicago shootings: 9 juveniles among 51 shot, 10 fatally, in weekend violence, police say

Nine juveniles are among at least 51 people shot, 10 fatally, in Chicago so far this weekend, police said.

abc7chicago.com

“Gun ownership isn't a right. It's a privilege.”

That’s odd. Is there a new, modified SJW revision to the Constitution I’m not aware of?

Maybe you’ve fallen down and bumped your head again having one of those Biden moments?

 

[JoeB131]

Well, yes, SJW’s are incensed that criminals are held liable and responsible for their crimes. Let’s see how the leftist social justice experiment works when criminals are held to even lesser standards.

Let's get real, Crime rose to record highs under Trump.

You guys keep trying to pretend 2020 didn't happen.

The Illinois Safety, Accountability, Fairness and Equity-Today (SAFE-T) Act changes multiple parts of Illinois' justice system with provisions like ending cash bail; limiting how flights determine whether defendants are flight risks; and allows defendants under electronic monitoring to leave home for 48 hours before they can be charged with escape.

Here's the thing... I actually had a discussion with a Police Officer on Saturday, who admitted most of what is being said about the SAFE-T Act is bullshit.

The part of the law states that if a prosecutor can't prove a defendant is an immediate danger or a flight risk, then you have to give him release until his trial. What we had before was the criminalization of poverty... Poor people of color staying in jail for the same petty offenses that white people can get bail for. And it was ridiculous.

Gun ownership isn't a right. It's a privilege.”

That’s odd. Is there a new, modified SJW revision to the Constitution I’m not aware of?

Maybe you’ve fallen down and bumped your head again having one of those Biden moments?

Not at all. For most our history, the courts have ruled that the second amendment is about MILITIAS, not gun ownership. Only after Heller did we have the insanity that we have now.

Even the NRA supported sensible gun laws at one point.