Stand your ground will protect shooter

[2aguy]

If this is the case, the law needs to be changed and taken on a separate base of the incidence. One size should not fit all.

here ..... a primer on Stand Your Ground ....

 

[strollingbones]

i think the sheriff was too quick to claim the stand your ground protection....does it really just depend on the shooter feeling threatened?

 

[strollingbones]

castle laws, stand your ground, make my day, shot first....all nics for the various law.....i am sorry i will just go with the old saw....better to be judged by 12 than carried by 6

 

[Montrovant]

Did he "just walk up to a stranger, and shove them that hard" or was it instigated?

I'm not speaking in legal terms, I'm just pointing out that your description makes it sound as if the guy walked up to a random stranger for no reason and shoved him to the ground. According to the story the shooter was arguing with the wife about where the car was parked. Who knows what might have been said? Describing the man as "likely used to violence" seems to be getting a lot more out of limited information than I can see.

Also, the article gives the names of the shooter and the man who was shot. It gives their races. It gives their ages and it says that the shooting victim was a father to 3 children. It gives the name and age of the girlfriend and the ages of the 3 children. It tells us that one of the children was named after his father. The article even describes where the couple met. I'm not sure where you get the idea that "we know nothing about the guy who physically assaulted a stranger over an argument." The article isn't overflowing with information, but there's some about all the main parties involved.

Do you know if the attacker has a criminal record? We have been told in story after story that the victim used to bitch about people parking in handicapped spots..

And watching the video, you see the first one to make physical contact is the attacker against the victim.... no matter what someone says in an argument, it is the guy who throws the first punch who is breaking the law....

I'm not arguing that the shove was anything other than assault.

The article in the OP doesn't say anything about the shooter having a history of complaining about people using handicapped spots who should not. Other articles might, but I haven't read them.

The anti gun, democrat journalists are focusing on the background of the victim.... and they are not even looking at the attacker.

Does it seem like the attacker has a problem using physical violence...or hesitates before the attack?

I didn't see any hesitation, but it took a while for him to walk there from the store. Also, I have no idea what was said, so it's pretty damned hard to judge whether there was any sort of justification for the assault. If the shooter had just said something threatening to the girlfriend, who was in the car with young children, would you feel differently about the situation?

My point is that there doesn't seem to be enough information to make a solid judgement about the propriety of the shooting. I'm trying to base my opinions on the information available without assuming anything beyond that.

Would I feel differently....up to the point of the physical attack...keep in mind, everyone is saying the guy who was just violently attacked and knocked to the ground should have used more sense...versus the guy who was 30-40 feet away who could have called the police instead of violently attacking the guy who hadn't done anything physical to the girlfriend.

So if the shooter had just said something along the lines of "I'm going to fucking kill you!" you don't think it's understandable that the boyfriend might have reacted violently to that threat? Obviously there is nothing in the video or article which indicates anything of the sort happened, but there is a lack of details involved here.

I haven't said he should use more sense. However, I find the idea that a person feels the need to pull a gun after a single shove disheartening. There could have been things said which would make shooting the man make more sense to me, but shooting someone seems like a reaction out of proportion to a shove. Did the man who got shot say anything to put the shooter in fear for his life? Did the girlfriend? Did some other factor come into play? I don't know, hence my lack of a firm opinion. Going only by the video and the limited information in the OP article, the reaction seemed excessive to me.

I'm more than happy to let law enforcement and, if it comes to it, a judge and jury make the decisions about the legal nature of the incident.

 

[LuckyDuck]

Why a trial? The video clearly shows the guy assaulting the shooter. The guy had every right to properly ventilate the guy.

I'm 100% pro-gun, concealed and open carry, but in this particular case, the guy only shoved the other one, which was, in itself, physical assault (battery), but he didn't continue the attack and wasn't armed with anything more than his hands/fists. If the attack had continued, I might have agreed with this one, but in this case, the shooter should have gone to trial.

 

[Defiant1]

If this is the case, the law needs to be changed and taken on a separate base of the incidence. One size should not fit all.

Do you live in Florida?
Mind the laws in your state and leave ours alone.

 

[SassyIrishLass]

I'm glad he's dead.

Should have shot the girl for parking in a handicapped space.

I'm glad he's dead.

Should have shot the girl for parking in a handicapped space.

We just don't go around shooting people in the US , where do you live??

Apparently in trumpanzeeland they want that.

Why a trial? The video clearly shows the guy assaulting the shooter. The guy had every right to properly ventilate the guy.

I'm 100% pro-gun, concealed and open carry, but in this particular case, the guy only shoved the other one, which was, in itself, physical assault (battery), but he didn't continue the attack and wasn't armed with anything more than his hands/fists. If the attack had continued, I might have agreed with this one, but in this case, the shooter should have gone to trial.

Florida says no trial.

Florida is correct

 

[Rustic]

Why a trial? The video clearly shows the guy assaulting the shooter. The guy had every right to properly ventilate the guy.

BS, the shooter had no reason to assault the woman. He is a wimp though, big man with a gun. Men who carry guns think they are tuff and really they are wimps.

Na, He had every right to shoot that motherfucker.
“Stand your ground” is a great thing...

No he didn't. Stand you ground is stupid, you don't go looking for a fight. You would not say that if the victim was white.

Annnnnd there goes the race card.

You darn right its about race. I know whites like you , I see them all the time, I come from areas like that , the white man is so right all the time. My husband comes from a white area, those people are sick and many of them are freeloaders on welfare and the ACA and Medicaid.

I never seen so many fat white cows in the Texas church shooting, done by a white man. I mean they were all overweight and white.

You white people all look the same...

 

[Rustic]

We have parking disputes over here. But because we dont have your crazy gun laws they seldom result in a body count.

If the victim had been british he would be sipping a cold one in his back garden now.

That's why GB was so much crime, no one can defend themselves or their children. Sounds like a muslim paradise and no doubt why so many are there, committing those aforementioned crimes.

You kill people over a parking space. You lose the right to criticise others.

Lol
The Guy attacked him So he shut the motherfucker…you pussy whipped motherfucker so shut the fuck up...

 

[Rustic]

https://nypost.com/2018/07/20/stand...r-in-deadly-fight-over-parking-space-sheriff/

I thought this would go to a trial but guess not

After seeing a better view of the assault I agree it was a justified shooting. Enough force was used in the initial assault to cause severe bodily injury or death. Also, looks the shooter fired at least twice.

Yes he got pushed backwards and fell on his arse after he was verbally assaulting the lady in the car, so loud that patrons were alarmed, and instead of getting back up as the guy was not attacking him , he shot him, and you say twice. Manslaughter.

Sticks and stones....

 

[Brain357]

https://nypost.com/2018/07/20/stand...r-in-deadly-fight-over-parking-space-sheriff/

I thought this would go to a trial but guess not

He pushed the creep to get him away from his wife. You don’t push somebody you want to kill. Guess it’s legal to murder in FL.

 

[Brain357]

I'm glad he's dead.

Should have shot the girl for parking in a handicapped space.

I'm glad he's dead.

Should have shot the girl for parking in a handicapped space.

We just don't go around shooting people in the US , where do you live??

Apparently in trumpanzeeland they want that.

Why a trial? The video clearly shows the guy assaulting the shooter. The guy had every right to properly ventilate the guy.

I'm 100% pro-gun, concealed and open carry, but in this particular case, the guy only shoved the other one, which was, in itself, physical assault (battery), but he didn't continue the attack and wasn't armed with anything more than his hands/fists. If the attack had continued, I might have agreed with this one, but in this case, the shooter should have gone to trial.

Florida says no trial.

Florida is correct

So harassing people till they react and then shoot them dead is legal.

 

[Brain357]

No real man shoots an unarmed person. Too many snowflakes carrying.

 

[night_son]

https://nypost.com/2018/07/20/stand...r-in-deadly-fight-over-parking-space-sheriff/

I thought this would go to a trial but guess not

He pushed the creep to get him away from his wife. You don’t push somebody you want to kill. Guess it’s legal to murder in FL.

But do you shove someone that hard to the ground you don't want to risk killing?

 

[Montrovant]

https://nypost.com/2018/07/20/stand...r-in-deadly-fight-over-parking-space-sheriff/

I thought this would go to a trial but guess not

He pushed the creep to get him away from his wife. You don’t push somebody you want to kill. Guess it’s legal to murder in FL.

But do you shove someone that hard to the ground you don't want to risk killing?

Yes. I doubt most people would even contemplate the possibility of a person dying from getting shoved.

The same would be true had it been a punch. If he had punched the shooter, I wouldn't assume that the idea of killing the shooter ever entered his mind. However, punching the shooter could both have knocked him down and led to his head hitting the concrete, and even just the punch itself could possibly lead to death. That doesn't mean it was the intent or even considered.

It's possible just yelling at the shooter could have triggered a heart attack and death, if we want to look at unlikely possibilities.

The idea that this shove was an intentional attempt to murder, or that the guy doing the shoving thought about the very slight possibility shoving the shooter could lead to his death, seems silly. How often do you think a person that shoves someone else, or throws a punch or kick, first thinks about what extremely rare outcomes might occur?

 

[night_son]

https://nypost.com/2018/07/20/stand...r-in-deadly-fight-over-parking-space-sheriff/

I thought this would go to a trial but guess not

He pushed the creep to get him away from his wife. You don’t push somebody you want to kill. Guess it’s legal to murder in FL.

But do you shove someone that hard to the ground you don't want to risk killing?

Yes. I doubt most people would even contemplate the possibility of a person dying from getting shoved.

The same would be true had it been a punch. If he had punched the shooter, I wouldn't assume that the idea of killing the shooter ever entered his mind. However, punching the shooter could both have knocked him down and led to his head hitting the concrete, and even just the punch itself could possibly lead to death. That doesn't mean it was the intent or even considered.

It's possible just yelling at the shooter could have triggered a heart attack and death, if we want to look at unlikely possibilities.

The idea that this shove was an intentional attempt to murder, or that the guy doing the shoving thought about the very slight possibility shoving the shooter could lead to his death, seems silly. How often do you think a person that shoves someone else, or throws a punch or kick, first thinks about what extremely rare outcomes might occur?

A well reasoned argument, one with which, on a certain purely philosophical level I agree. However, to be bluntly clear in offering for you a different one, allow me to expound from the point of view of one with a small degree of experience in physical altercation, 'foreknowledge' --which I admit--is not common in the thinking or foresight of most adult men facing the situation of giving or receiving such a shove. I have witnessed, first hand, an adult man whose sternum was split from receiving a similar push, and another man whose lung was punctured by a jab from a rigid thumb which initially broke the rib and drove a sharpened shard into said lung; even without such training, an unarmed adult man can be highly deadly--perhaps more so without application of honed hand-to-hand combat experience and the knowing well of his own strength.

We have no way of knowing what fear was coursing through the shooter's mind. Was the breath knocked out of him? Did he mistake that for severer injury? I absolutely wish the two men had not encountered one another that day. However, they did--and great tragedy was the result. No one "won" that day, and the untold victims of the meeting are the children who must now face life without a father. Nevertheless, I remain of the mind that the shooting was justified the moment the larger, younger, stronger man applied what we can agree was potentially lethal force to the shooter's body. Definitely a tragedy.

 

[RealDave]

What's another dead black man. Right Jess Sessions. Right Clearwater Police?

I guess these people thought this unarmed blsck man was going to shoot fire from his eyes to kill that guy over 6 feet away.

 

[ZZ PUPPS]

i think the sheriff was too quick to claim the stand your ground protection....does it really just depend on the shooter feeling threatened?

It went beyond feeling threatened, the shooter was physically assaulted. The illegally parked dude went in big and bad against an old man. He ain't so bad anymore.

 

[hunarcy]

Major lawsuit. Sue the county.

For what? Lmao

Civil lawsuit, it was a public area. He has no right to assault the woman. Or even to go near the car..

Hey, druggie, how was a woman assaulted? Not even she said she was assaulted. She said he was yelling at her for being in a handicapped spot. You're nuts.

 

[hunarcy]

We have parking disputes over here. But because we dont have your crazy gun laws they seldom result in a body count.

If the victim had been british he would be sipping a cold one in his back garden now.

That's why GB was so much crime, no one can defend themselves or their children. Sounds like a muslim paradise and no doubt why so many are there, committing those aforementioned crimes.

You kill people over a parking space. You lose the right to criticise others.

Another nutburger. The guy was physically assaulted by a man for yelling at a person who was parked in a handicapped spot. He did not kill anyone over a parking space.