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"Torture" isn't torture. It is "enhanced interrogation". But now, I see that the spin has moved on to "stress induced debriefing". Next, it will spin to "interrogation with prejudice". I am sure that if anyone had died, it would have been called, "accelerated inevitable termination"
The left still thinks these murderers can be reasoned with.
The twisted logic in the OP is amazing to behold. "So you think shooting a guy in the head is murder? Let me show you what a REAL murder looks like!"
Lovely false equivocation. Inducing discomfort, which produces ABSOLUTELY NO injury to the individual, cannot be 'torture'.
Your concession is duly noted and summarily accepted.
Physical injury. I will give you the benefit of the doubt and assume you meant to write that.
In my mind, and many others that I have known on the right and the left, it was never do what you can regardless of law...it was do what you can, but always within the law....I never once thought they would torture, we as a nation were too good for that in my mind and many other citizen's minds, on both sides of the aisle, though fewer on the right side vs the left side, but still plenty on the right were NOT happy with their government torturing and abusing, especially in Abu Garaib...My only complaint about the Torture report -- why weren't they doing all that BEFORE 9/11?!
The report indicates that they weren't very organized in the early stages and the program wasn't run as efficiently as it could have been. Okay.
However, I have no trouble with anything that was done -- if it was done to a truly innocent person who had no ties to terrorists, then that sin is on us ALL. Not just the CIA.
On the morning of 9/11 I remember watching the live broadcasts and seeing people jumping to their death from the burning towers. In the final moments of their lives, they were forced to choose between burning to death and jumping.
War is ugly - the ugliest and most horrible of human endeavors. We ask the military and CIA, FBI to protect us. We expect them to keep us safe. We blamed them for failing to do so and demanded that they hunt down the terrorist. In the days following 9/11 we asked them to do whatever it takes to bring down those that attacked us. Fear pushed the entire country to a place where they said - whatever it takes, get them!
It is dead wrong to turn around twelve years later and call them "war criminals" or paint what they did because America wanted them to as 'evil'. Fear drove us all to a bad place.
I'm no fan of tricky Dicky Cheney or Donald Dumbsfeld, but we should not throw the CIA and Military under the bus for doing the things we wanted them to do.
Be upset about them being less then honest about the faults and shortcoming of the program, but the self-righteous indignation coming from some on the left re: the specifics of what was done, feels disingenuous to me.
The left doesn't get it. How we obtain lifesaving information doesn't matter. American lives are at stake.In my mind, and many others that I have known on the right and the left, it was never do what you can regardless of law...it was do what you can, but always within the law....I never once thought they would torture, we as a nation were too good for that in my mind and many other citizen's minds, on both sides of the aisle, though fewer on the right side vs the left side, but still plenty on the right were NOT happy with their government torturing and abusing, especially in Abu Garaib...My only complaint about the Torture report -- why weren't they doing all that BEFORE 9/11?!
The report indicates that they weren't very organized in the early stages and the program wasn't run as efficiently as it could have been. Okay.
However, I have no trouble with anything that was done -- if it was done to a truly innocent person who had no ties to terrorists, then that sin is on us ALL. Not just the CIA.
On the morning of 9/11 I remember watching the live broadcasts and seeing people jumping to their death from the burning towers. In the final moments of their lives, they were forced to choose between burning to death and jumping.
War is ugly - the ugliest and most horrible of human endeavors. We ask the military and CIA, FBI to protect us. We expect them to keep us safe. We blamed them for failing to do so and demanded that they hunt down the terrorist. In the days following 9/11 we asked them to do whatever it takes to bring down those that attacked us. Fear pushed the entire country to a place where they said - whatever it takes, get them!
It is dead wrong to turn around twelve years later and call them "war criminals" or paint what they did because America wanted them to as 'evil'. Fear drove us all to a bad place.
I'm no fan of tricky Dicky Cheney or Donald Dumbsfeld, but we should not throw the CIA and Military under the bus for doing the things we wanted them to do.
Be upset about them being less then honest about the faults and shortcoming of the program, but the self-righteous indignation coming from some on the left re: the specifics of what was done, feels disingenuous to me.
In my mind, and many others that I have known on the right and the left, it was never do what you can regardless of law...it was do what you can, but always within the law....I never once thought they would torture, we as a nation were too good for that in my mind and many other citizen's minds, on both sides of the aisle, though fewer on the right side vs the left side, but still plenty on the right were NOT happy with their government torturing and abusing, especially in Abu Garaib...My only complaint about the Torture report -- why weren't they doing all that BEFORE 9/11?!
The report indicates that they weren't very organized in the early stages and the program wasn't run as efficiently as it could have been. Okay.
However, I have no trouble with anything that was done -- if it was done to a truly innocent person who had no ties to terrorists, then that sin is on us ALL. Not just the CIA.
On the morning of 9/11 I remember watching the live broadcasts and seeing people jumping to their death from the burning towers. In the final moments of their lives, they were forced to choose between burning to death and jumping.
War is ugly - the ugliest and most horrible of human endeavors. We ask the military and CIA, FBI to protect us. We expect them to keep us safe. We blamed them for failing to do so and demanded that they hunt down the terrorist. In the days following 9/11 we asked them to do whatever it takes to bring down those that attacked us. Fear pushed the entire country to a place where they said - whatever it takes, get them!
It is dead wrong to turn around twelve years later and call them "war criminals" or paint what they did because America wanted them to as 'evil'. Fear drove us all to a bad place.
I'm no fan of tricky Dicky Cheney or Donald Dumbsfeld, but we should not throw the CIA and Military under the bus for doing the things we wanted them to do.
Be upset about them being less then honest about the faults and shortcoming of the program, but the self-righteous indignation coming from some on the left re: the specifics of what was done, feels disingenuous to me.
Really? Then why did the US prosecute Japanese soldiers who waterboarded US prisoners for torture if it wasn't torture?The twisted logic in the OP is amazing to behold. "So you think shooting a guy in the head is murder? Let me show you what a REAL murder looks like!"
Lovely false equivocation. Inducing discomfort, which produces ABSOLUTELY NO injury to the individual, cannot be 'torture'.
Your concession is duly noted and summarily accepted.
Enhanced interrogation or tortureThe left doesn't get it. How we obtain lifesaving information doesn't matter. American lives are at stake.In my mind, and many others that I have known on the right and the left, it was never do what you can regardless of law...it was do what you can, but always within the law....I never once thought they would torture, we as a nation were too good for that in my mind and many other citizen's minds, on both sides of the aisle, though fewer on the right side vs the left side, but still plenty on the right were NOT happy with their government torturing and abusing, especially in Abu Garaib...My only complaint about the Torture report -- why weren't they doing all that BEFORE 9/11?!
The report indicates that they weren't very organized in the early stages and the program wasn't run as efficiently as it could have been. Okay.
However, I have no trouble with anything that was done -- if it was done to a truly innocent person who had no ties to terrorists, then that sin is on us ALL. Not just the CIA.
On the morning of 9/11 I remember watching the live broadcasts and seeing people jumping to their death from the burning towers. In the final moments of their lives, they were forced to choose between burning to death and jumping.
War is ugly - the ugliest and most horrible of human endeavors. We ask the military and CIA, FBI to protect us. We expect them to keep us safe. We blamed them for failing to do so and demanded that they hunt down the terrorist. In the days following 9/11 we asked them to do whatever it takes to bring down those that attacked us. Fear pushed the entire country to a place where they said - whatever it takes, get them!
It is dead wrong to turn around twelve years later and call them "war criminals" or paint what they did because America wanted them to as 'evil'. Fear drove us all to a bad place.
I'm no fan of tricky Dicky Cheney or Donald Dumbsfeld, but we should not throw the CIA and Military under the bus for doing the things we wanted them to do.
Be upset about them being less then honest about the faults and shortcoming of the program, but the self-righteous indignation coming from some on the left re: the specifics of what was done, feels disingenuous to me.
Bullshit.Enhanced interrogation or tortureThe left doesn't get it. How we obtain lifesaving information doesn't matter. American lives are at stake.In my mind, and many others that I have known on the right and the left, it was never do what you can regardless of law...it was do what you can, but always within the law....I never once thought they would torture, we as a nation were too good for that in my mind and many other citizen's minds, on both sides of the aisle, though fewer on the right side vs the left side, but still plenty on the right were NOT happy with their government torturing and abusing, especially in Abu Garaib...My only complaint about the Torture report -- why weren't they doing all that BEFORE 9/11?!
The report indicates that they weren't very organized in the early stages and the program wasn't run as efficiently as it could have been. Okay.
However, I have no trouble with anything that was done -- if it was done to a truly innocent person who had no ties to terrorists, then that sin is on us ALL. Not just the CIA.
On the morning of 9/11 I remember watching the live broadcasts and seeing people jumping to their death from the burning towers. In the final moments of their lives, they were forced to choose between burning to death and jumping.
War is ugly - the ugliest and most horrible of human endeavors. We ask the military and CIA, FBI to protect us. We expect them to keep us safe. We blamed them for failing to do so and demanded that they hunt down the terrorist. In the days following 9/11 we asked them to do whatever it takes to bring down those that attacked us. Fear pushed the entire country to a place where they said - whatever it takes, get them!
It is dead wrong to turn around twelve years later and call them "war criminals" or paint what they did because America wanted them to as 'evil'. Fear drove us all to a bad place.
I'm no fan of tricky Dicky Cheney or Donald Dumbsfeld, but we should not throw the CIA and Military under the bus for doing the things we wanted them to do.
Be upset about them being less then honest about the faults and shortcoming of the program, but the self-righteous indignation coming from some on the left re: the specifics of what was done, feels disingenuous to me.
does not provide any more information than using their normal interrogation methods that they perfected and used the previous 50 years....
Bullshit. Leon panetta says they extracted info on Osama.Enhanced interrogation or tortureThe left doesn't get it. How we obtain lifesaving information doesn't matter. American lives are at stake.In my mind, and many others that I have known on the right and the left, it was never do what you can regardless of law...it was do what you can, but always within the law....I never once thought they would torture, we as a nation were too good for that in my mind and many other citizen's minds, on both sides of the aisle, though fewer on the right side vs the left side, but still plenty on the right were NOT happy with their government torturing and abusing, especially in Abu Garaib...My only complaint about the Torture report -- why weren't they doing all that BEFORE 9/11?!
The report indicates that they weren't very organized in the early stages and the program wasn't run as efficiently as it could have been. Okay.
However, I have no trouble with anything that was done -- if it was done to a truly innocent person who had no ties to terrorists, then that sin is on us ALL. Not just the CIA.
On the morning of 9/11 I remember watching the live broadcasts and seeing people jumping to their death from the burning towers. In the final moments of their lives, they were forced to choose between burning to death and jumping.
War is ugly - the ugliest and most horrible of human endeavors. We ask the military and CIA, FBI to protect us. We expect them to keep us safe. We blamed them for failing to do so and demanded that they hunt down the terrorist. In the days following 9/11 we asked them to do whatever it takes to bring down those that attacked us. Fear pushed the entire country to a place where they said - whatever it takes, get them!
It is dead wrong to turn around twelve years later and call them "war criminals" or paint what they did because America wanted them to as 'evil'. Fear drove us all to a bad place.
I'm no fan of tricky Dicky Cheney or Donald Dumbsfeld, but we should not throw the CIA and Military under the bus for doing the things we wanted them to do.
Be upset about them being less then honest about the faults and shortcoming of the program, but the self-righteous indignation coming from some on the left re: the specifics of what was done, feels disingenuous to me.
does not provide any more information than using their normal interrogation methods that they perfected and used the previous 50 years....
Senate Torture Report: CIA Tactics Ineffective, Brutal - WOWT.com
Senate Torture Report CIA Tactics Ineffective Brutal
3 days ago ... awake for as long as 180 hours, standing or in stress positions.
Yeah, it is torture.
Enhanced interrogation or tortureThe left doesn't get it. How we obtain lifesaving information doesn't matter. American lives are at stake.In my mind, and many others that I have known on the right and the left, it was never do what you can regardless of law...it was do what you can, but always within the law....I never once thought they would torture, we as a nation were too good for that in my mind and many other citizen's minds, on both sides of the aisle, though fewer on the right side vs the left side, but still plenty on the right were NOT happy with their government torturing and abusing, especially in Abu Garaib...My only complaint about the Torture report -- why weren't they doing all that BEFORE 9/11?!
The report indicates that they weren't very organized in the early stages and the program wasn't run as efficiently as it could have been. Okay.
However, I have no trouble with anything that was done -- if it was done to a truly innocent person who had no ties to terrorists, then that sin is on us ALL. Not just the CIA.
On the morning of 9/11 I remember watching the live broadcasts and seeing people jumping to their death from the burning towers. In the final moments of their lives, they were forced to choose between burning to death and jumping.
War is ugly - the ugliest and most horrible of human endeavors. We ask the military and CIA, FBI to protect us. We expect them to keep us safe. We blamed them for failing to do so and demanded that they hunt down the terrorist. In the days following 9/11 we asked them to do whatever it takes to bring down those that attacked us. Fear pushed the entire country to a place where they said - whatever it takes, get them!
It is dead wrong to turn around twelve years later and call them "war criminals" or paint what they did because America wanted them to as 'evil'. Fear drove us all to a bad place.
I'm no fan of tricky Dicky Cheney or Donald Dumbsfeld, but we should not throw the CIA and Military under the bus for doing the things we wanted them to do.
Be upset about them being less then honest about the faults and shortcoming of the program, but the self-righteous indignation coming from some on the left re: the specifics of what was done, feels disingenuous to me.
does not provide any more information than using their normal interrogation methods that they perfected and used the previous 50 years....
