tell congress ..if you dont need health care..they dont need it either

[rightwinger]

Absolutely. Let them try the free market. They don't like socialized health care then they need to get off it.

Before we can "let them try the free market" we'd actually have to have a free market, as of right now it doesn't exist but I'm all for creating one, we can start by removing the monopoly control of the money supply exercised by private bankers and then move on to stripping away the 10's of thousands of pages of state and federal regulations and tax and redistribute schemes that control pretty much every aspect of the current market.

"Government's view of the economy could be summed up in a few short phrases: If it moves, tax it. If it keeps moving, regulate it. And if it stops moving, subsidize it." -- Ronald Reagan

Free market healthcare sounds great.........until you are sick from something that wasn't covered in your plan, or had a preexisting condition not covered. Now no insurance will cover you. Better suck it up and pay free market prices for care because no insurance company will cover you, if you can't afford it too bad. Sell your house and car and cash out your investments, no govt aid for you pull up your bootstraps and get an extra job freeloader.

Free market healthcare would be cheaper and higher quality than what you have now, it's just like everything else private enterprise does when it has to compete on a free and level playing field, as opposed to government intervention which destroys competition resulting in higher prices and lower quality. Business can't price their customers out of the market and survive which is why they just love government interference because it gives them a perfect avenue for looting the public treasury to subsidize un-affordable prices while at the same time using the regulatory regime to lock out competitors so they don't have worry about quality either.

You don't have a free market in healthcare and haven't had anything remotely resembling one since prior to WW II, what you have is a government controlled market with a massive system of crony capitalism, how's that working out so far?

Absolutely. Let them try the free market. They don't like socialized health care then they need to get off it.

Before we can "let them try the free market" we'd actually have to have a free market, as of right now it doesn't exist but I'm all for creating one, we can start by removing the monopoly control of the money supply exercised by private bankers and then move on to stripping away the 10's of thousands of pages of state and federal regulations and tax and redistribute schemes that control pretty much every aspect of the current market.

"Government's view of the economy could be summed up in a few short phrases: If it moves, tax it. If it keeps moving, regulate it. And if it stops moving, subsidize it." -- Ronald Reagan

There is no free market system in which a guy that is barely making ends meet gets a heart surgery or cancer treatment.

In a free market he gets to die.

LOL, define "barely making ends meet"?

Would that be somebody that is at or below the poverty line ?
Or someone that doesn't set financial priorities appropriately?

Someone making 30k-40k a year with a kid or two to take care of.

There is no way it hell this person can pay for $60k heart attack surgery and hospital stay, especially considering high odds of long term unemployment that will follow it.

Healthcare is not a luxury, it is risky, often expensive NECESSITY very badly suited by pure free market's bottom line drivers. .

Someone making 30K-40K isn't below the poverty line and can afford health insurance even under the current system of government induced price inflation, the "kid or two" part is completely irrelevant since encouraging people to have kids they can't afford to properly care for by subsidizing it is a completely asinine approach and acts an enabler for creating more poverty.

People need to take responsibility for their own lives and stop expecting everybody else to subsidize their bad choices, either that or you gub'mint worshipers need to start putting your money where you mouth is and start writing checks instead of using government to steal from everybody else to subsidize your economy destroying WANTS. You folks don't give a fuck about ANYBODY else, all you care about is power for your criminal organizations commonly known as the two major political parties, so spare me your faux egalitarianism, if you were interested in actually helping others you wouldn't be so wedded to the current system that fucks them over six ways from Sunday.

You righty ideologues just can't get that simple concept through your thick, naive head

LOL! you have a lot of nerve calling anybody an ideologue or naive since you're clearly so encased in that thick fog of gub'mint worshiper propaganda that you cannot even begin to consider alternative approaches to the current fascist system that is in place and clearly you have no grasp of economic realities or what a free market actually entails which makes YOU the naive one.

Do some homework and practice some critical thinking for a change instead of just relying on what hyper-Keynsian talking heads and politicians with a "D" behind there names telling what to think, until you endeavor to do that you're nothing but a hyper-partisan parrot.

If someone makes $30-40,000 you think they can afford to pay 20% of a $100,000 hospital stay?

 

[AntonToo]

Absolutely. Let them try the free market. They don't like socialized health care then they need to get off it.

Before we can "let them try the free market" we'd actually have to have a free market, as of right now it doesn't exist but I'm all for creating one, we can start by removing the monopoly control of the money supply exercised by private bankers and then move on to stripping away the 10's of thousands of pages of state and federal regulations and tax and redistribute schemes that control pretty much every aspect of the current market.

"Government's view of the economy could be summed up in a few short phrases: If it moves, tax it. If it keeps moving, regulate it. And if it stops moving, subsidize it." -- Ronald Reagan

Free market healthcare sounds great.........until you are sick from something that wasn't covered in your plan, or had a preexisting condition not covered. Now no insurance will cover you. Better suck it up and pay free market prices for care because no insurance company will cover you, if you can't afford it too bad. Sell your house and car and cash out your investments, no govt aid for you pull up your bootstraps and get an extra job freeloader.

Free market healthcare would be cheaper and higher quality than what you have now, it's just like everything else private enterprise does when it has to compete on a free and level playing field, as opposed to government intervention which destroys competition resulting in higher prices and lower quality. Business can't price their customers out of the market and survive which is why they just love government interference because it gives them a perfect avenue for looting the public treasury to subsidize un-affordable prices while at the same time using the regulatory regime to lock out competitors so they don't have worry about quality either.

You don't have a free market in healthcare and haven't had anything remotely resembling one since prior to WW II, what you have is a government controlled market with a massive system of crony capitalism, how's that working out so far?

Absolutely. Let them try the free market. They don't like socialized health care then they need to get off it.

Before we can "let them try the free market" we'd actually have to have a free market, as of right now it doesn't exist but I'm all for creating one, we can start by removing the monopoly control of the money supply exercised by private bankers and then move on to stripping away the 10's of thousands of pages of state and federal regulations and tax and redistribute schemes that control pretty much every aspect of the current market.

"Government's view of the economy could be summed up in a few short phrases: If it moves, tax it. If it keeps moving, regulate it. And if it stops moving, subsidize it." -- Ronald Reagan

There is no free market system in which a guy that is barely making ends meet gets a heart surgery or cancer treatment.

In a free market he gets to die.

LOL, define "barely making ends meet"?

Would that be somebody that is at or below the poverty line ?
Or someone that doesn't set financial priorities appropriately?

Someone making 30k-40k a year with a kid or two to take care of.

There is no way it hell this person can pay for $60k heart attack surgery and hospital stay, especially considering high odds of long term unemployment that will follow it.

Healthcare is not a luxury, it is risky, often expensive NECESSITY very badly suited by pure free market's bottom line drivers. .

Someone making 30K-40K isn't below the poverty line and can afford health insurance even under the current system of government induced price inflation

Yes they can, BECAUSE IT IS NOT A FREE MARKET AND THEIR PREMIUMS ARE SUBSIDIZED BY ACA.

Without the subsidies there is no way in hell they can afford what would be 7-10k a year for just the premium.

This is not theory, this was a fact of life in pre-ACA days. Most people with above-poverty line income could not afford insurance unless their employer provided it.

 

[AntonToo]

People need to take responsibility for their own lives and stop expecting everybody else to subsidize their bad choices.

Yes, and DYING or living as a cripple is the responsibility you say they must take if they can't pay for that expensive surgery or treatment in a free market system.

I can't in good conscience agree and I don't understand how you can.

 

[NightFox]

Before we can "let them try the free market" we'd actually have to have a free market, as of right now it doesn't exist but I'm all for creating one, we can start by removing the monopoly control of the money supply exercised by private bankers and then move on to stripping away the 10's of thousands of pages of state and federal regulations and tax and redistribute schemes that control pretty much every aspect of the current market.

"Government's view of the economy could be summed up in a few short phrases: If it moves, tax it. If it keeps moving, regulate it. And if it stops moving, subsidize it." -- Ronald Reagan

Free market healthcare sounds great.........until you are sick from something that wasn't covered in your plan, or had a preexisting condition not covered. Now no insurance will cover you. Better suck it up and pay free market prices for care because no insurance company will cover you, if you can't afford it too bad. Sell your house and car and cash out your investments, no govt aid for you pull up your bootstraps and get an extra job freeloader.

Free market healthcare would be cheaper and higher quality than what you have now, it's just like everything else private enterprise does when it has to compete on a free and level playing field, as opposed to government intervention which destroys competition resulting in higher prices and lower quality. Business can't price their customers out of the market and survive which is why they just love government interference because it gives them a perfect avenue for looting the public treasury to subsidize un-affordable prices while at the same time using the regulatory regime to lock out competitors so they don't have worry about quality either.

You don't have a free market in healthcare and haven't had anything remotely resembling one since prior to WW II, what you have is a government controlled market with a massive system of crony capitalism, how's that working out so far?

Before we can "let them try the free market" we'd actually have to have a free market, as of right now it doesn't exist but I'm all for creating one, we can start by removing the monopoly control of the money supply exercised by private bankers and then move on to stripping away the 10's of thousands of pages of state and federal regulations and tax and redistribute schemes that control pretty much every aspect of the current market.

"Government's view of the economy could be summed up in a few short phrases: If it moves, tax it. If it keeps moving, regulate it. And if it stops moving, subsidize it." -- Ronald Reagan

There is no free market system in which a guy that is barely making ends meet gets a heart surgery or cancer treatment.

In a free market he gets to die.

LOL, define "barely making ends meet"?

Would that be somebody that is at or below the poverty line ?
Or someone that doesn't set financial priorities appropriately?

Someone making 30k-40k a year with a kid or two to take care of.

There is no way it hell this person can pay for $60k heart attack surgery and hospital stay, especially considering high odds of long term unemployment that will follow it.

Healthcare is not a luxury, it is risky, often expensive NECESSITY very badly suited by pure free market's bottom line drivers. .

Someone making 30K-40K isn't below the poverty line and can afford health insurance even under the current system of government induced price inflation

Yes they can, BECAUSE IT IS NOT A FREE MARKET AND THEIR PREMIUMS ARE SUBSIDIZED BY ACA.

No that's not the reason it's affordable to someone making 30-40K a year, it's one of the reasons it's so difficult to afford (but someone making that much CAN afford it WITHOUT STEALING FROM OTHER TAXPAYERS if they put a high enough priority on their own health and act in a financially responsible manner) , it's government interference that's made the cost of health insurance and health care provisioning so high in the first place. All the ACA does is exacerbate the problem that government created and adds more debt, more debt service costs and more competition destroying crony capitalism to boot.

Without all this interference, market manipulation, crony capitalism and the debt based monetary system, health insurance would be far cheaper and higher quality not to mention we'd have at least GDP twice as big as what it is now and in case you're unaware that's good for EVERYBODY. If you actually gave a fuck about your fellow citizens you wouldn't be advocating for strengthening the system that has put them in such dire financial distress to begin with, it's like telling a drug addict that his problem is that he's not taking enough drugs.

The results speak for themselves, the government is in full control of the health care system and it's become a mess so complex that even "experts" are completely befuddled as where to begin addressing all the problems.

When the financial chickens really come home to roost you're going to learn that your faith in government and that crime family you call a political party has been sorely misplaced which hopefully will entice you to start exercising some critical thinking for a change.

Ciao

 

[AntonToo]

Free market healthcare sounds great.........until you are sick from something that wasn't covered in your plan, or had a preexisting condition not covered. Now no insurance will cover you. Better suck it up and pay free market prices for care because no insurance company will cover you, if you can't afford it too bad. Sell your house and car and cash out your investments, no govt aid for you pull up your bootstraps and get an extra job freeloader.

Free market healthcare would be cheaper and higher quality than what you have now, it's just like everything else private enterprise does when it has to compete on a free and level playing field, as opposed to government intervention which destroys competition resulting in higher prices and lower quality. Business can't price their customers out of the market and survive which is why they just love government interference because it gives them a perfect avenue for looting the public treasury to subsidize un-affordable prices while at the same time using the regulatory regime to lock out competitors so they don't have worry about quality either.

You don't have a free market in healthcare and haven't had anything remotely resembling one since prior to WW II, what you have is a government controlled market with a massive system of crony capitalism, how's that working out so far?

There is no free market system in which a guy that is barely making ends meet gets a heart surgery or cancer treatment.

In a free market he gets to die.

LOL, define "barely making ends meet"?

Would that be somebody that is at or below the poverty line ?
Or someone that doesn't set financial priorities appropriately?

Someone making 30k-40k a year with a kid or two to take care of.

There is no way it hell this person can pay for $60k heart attack surgery and hospital stay, especially considering high odds of long term unemployment that will follow it.

Healthcare is not a luxury, it is risky, often expensive NECESSITY very badly suited by pure free market's bottom line drivers. .

Someone making 30K-40K isn't below the poverty line and can afford health insurance even under the current system of government induced price inflation

Yes they can, BECAUSE IT IS NOT A FREE MARKET AND THEIR PREMIUMS ARE SUBSIDIZED BY ACA.

No that's not the reason

Counter-factual, baseless assertion you can shove up your ass.

There is no way for low income people to afford health insurance that is worth a damn without some sort of subsidy PERIOD

 

[Defiant1]

Before we can "let them try the free market" we'd actually have to have a free market, as of right now it doesn't exist but I'm all for creating one, we can start by removing the monopoly control of the money supply exercised by private bankers and then move on to stripping away the 10's of thousands of pages of state and federal regulations and tax and redistribute schemes that control pretty much every aspect of the current market.

"Government's view of the economy could be summed up in a few short phrases: If it moves, tax it. If it keeps moving, regulate it. And if it stops moving, subsidize it." -- Ronald Reagan

Free market healthcare sounds great.........until you are sick from something that wasn't covered in your plan, or had a preexisting condition not covered. Now no insurance will cover you. Better suck it up and pay free market prices for care because no insurance company will cover you, if you can't afford it too bad. Sell your house and car and cash out your investments, no govt aid for you pull up your bootstraps and get an extra job freeloader.

Free market healthcare would be cheaper and higher quality than what you have now, it's just like everything else private enterprise does when it has to compete on a free and level playing field, as opposed to government intervention which destroys competition resulting in higher prices and lower quality. Business can't price their customers out of the market and survive which is why they just love government interference because it gives them a perfect avenue for looting the public treasury to subsidize un-affordable prices while at the same time using the regulatory regime to lock out competitors so they don't have worry about quality either.

You don't have a free market in healthcare and haven't had anything remotely resembling one since prior to WW II, what you have is a government controlled market with a massive system of crony capitalism, how's that working out so far?

Before we can "let them try the free market" we'd actually have to have a free market, as of right now it doesn't exist but I'm all for creating one, we can start by removing the monopoly control of the money supply exercised by private bankers and then move on to stripping away the 10's of thousands of pages of state and federal regulations and tax and redistribute schemes that control pretty much every aspect of the current market.

"Government's view of the economy could be summed up in a few short phrases: If it moves, tax it. If it keeps moving, regulate it. And if it stops moving, subsidize it." -- Ronald Reagan

There is no free market system in which a guy that is barely making ends meet gets a heart surgery or cancer treatment.

In a free market he gets to die.

LOL, define "barely making ends meet"?

Would that be somebody that is at or below the poverty line ?
Or someone that doesn't set financial priorities appropriately?

Someone making 30k-40k a year with a kid or two to take care of.

There is no way it hell this person can pay for $60k heart attack surgery and hospital stay, especially considering high odds of long term unemployment that will follow it.

Healthcare is not a luxury, it is risky, often expensive NECESSITY very badly suited by pure free market's bottom line drivers. .

Someone making 30K-40K isn't below the poverty line and can afford health insurance even under the current system of government induced price inflation, the "kid or two" part is completely irrelevant since encouraging people to have kids they can't afford to properly care for by subsidizing it is a completely asinine approach and acts an enabler for creating more poverty.

People need to take responsibility for their own lives and stop expecting everybody else to subsidize their bad choices, either that or you gub'mint worshipers need to start putting your money where you mouth is and start writing checks instead of using government to steal from everybody else to subsidize your economy destroying WANTS. You folks don't give a fuck about ANYBODY else, all you care about is power for your criminal organizations commonly known as the two major political parties, so spare me your faux egalitarianism, if you were interested in actually helping others you wouldn't be so wedded to the current system that fucks them over six ways from Sunday.

You righty ideologues just can't get that simple concept through your thick, naive head

LOL! you have a lot of nerve calling anybody an ideologue or naive since you're clearly so encased in that thick fog of gub'mint worshiper propaganda that you cannot even begin to consider alternative approaches to the current fascist system that is in place and clearly you have no grasp of economic realities or what a free market actually entails which makes YOU the naive one.

Do some homework and practice some critical thinking for a change instead of just relying on what hyper-Keynsian talking heads and politicians with a "D" behind there names telling what to think, until you endeavor to do that you're nothing but a hyper-partisan parrot.

If someone makes $30-40,000 you think they can afford to pay 20% of a $100,000 hospital stay?

They will have to make payments.