The curious timeline for taking down Trump

[iceberg]

The curious timeline for taking down Trump

Among those who predicted he could never win the election — or that he might have been conspiring with Hillary Clinton all along, worked for Russia’s President Putin, would crash the U.S. stock market his first week in office, would ban all Muslims, would send illegal immigrants home en masse on buses and trains, and would start a nuclear war — there have been real concerns.

But to others, there are different concerns that have borne out. We continue to get evidence of an orchestrated effort among government insiders and the well-connected to take down President Trump at all costs. The public evidence indicates that the effort was hatched even before he took office.

Trump critics would argue that there was good reason to devise plots against him before he was inaugurated. His supporters would argue that the opposition has crossed the line into unlawful actions involving wiretapping and attempts to frame Trump and his associates.

In any event, we can build an oversimplified timeline to make the point:
----------
you can follow links to the various stories, but this tries to centralize what happened, when. the fact of the matter *is* we have proof the "coup" (pick your own word if you don't like that one) was in play as soon as he was elected.

tweets saying COUP
text messages saying "insurance policy"

all of these things those who hate trump ignore, or feel justified in using because they feel the end justifies the means. OF WHICH got us into this predicament to begin with.

i continue to use Kavanaugh as a prime example of the left willing to destroy lives with a lie in order to get their own goals at any expense. i am NOT saying the right is above this, i'm saying i don't have a similar example to offer that went to the extremes kavanaugh went to.

the focus on 1 line from a trump phone call while yet bypassing tweets/texts and other reports of much greater information amazes me but points back to - the end justifies the means. to get to trump, they will use any means necessary.

to be clear - i am not defending trump, i am against the methods the left is using to prove they are "right" - if they even are. i would be furious at either side doing this to any sitting president. we continue to allow more and more to to unchecked for no other reason than "revenge politics".

that is what is taking down this country, in my humble opinion.

 

[iceberg]

this was funny:

Sept. 9, 2019: The inspector general notifies the House Intelligence Committee about the complaint. Although Committee Chairman Adam Schiff (D-Calif.) initially denies doing so, it turns out that he and his staff already had met with — or conspired with, depending on your view — the alleged whistleblower.
-----
how can he deny something he openly tweeted about, validating that he knew this far ahead of time? if his meeting with said whistleblower was in fact proper, why deny it at all?

if he lied cause he wasn't supposed to do that, where's the appropriate level of rage from the left at the "improper behavior"?

 

[MisterBeale]

Thanks. Totally respect your posts, but. .. You should probably notify the left;

"By Sharyl Attkisson, opinion contributor — 11/08/19 09:00 AM EST 1,150
The views expressed by contributors are their own and not the view of The Hill"

 

[OldLady]

The curious timeline for taking down Trump

Among those who predicted he could never win the election — or that he might have been conspiring with Hillary Clinton all along, worked for Russia’s President Putin, would crash the U.S. stock market his first week in office, would ban all Muslims, would send illegal immigrants home en masse on buses and trains, and would start a nuclear war — there have been real concerns.

But to others, there are different concerns that have borne out. We continue to get evidence of an orchestrated effort among government insiders and the well-connected to take down President Trump at all costs. The public evidence indicates that the effort was hatched even before he took office.

Trump critics would argue that there was good reason to devise plots against him before he was inaugurated. His supporters would argue that the opposition has crossed the line into unlawful actions involving wiretapping and attempts to frame Trump and his associates.

In any event, we can build an oversimplified timeline to make the point:
----------
you can follow links to the various stories, but this tries to centralize what happened, when. the fact of the matter *is* we have proof the "coup" (pick your own word if you don't like that one) was in play as soon as he was elected.

tweets saying COUP
text messages saying "insurance policy"

all of these things those who hate trump ignore, or feel justified in using because they feel the end justifies the means. OF WHICH got us into this predicament to begin with.

i continue to use Kavanaugh as a prime example of the left willing to destroy lives with a lie in order to get their own goals at any expense. i am NOT saying the right is above this, i'm saying i don't have a similar example to offer that went to the extremes kavanaugh went to.

the focus on 1 line from a trump phone call while yet bypassing tweets/texts and other reports of much greater information amazes me but points back to - the end justifies the means. to get to trump, they will use any means necessary.

to be clear - i am not defending trump, i am against the methods the left is using to prove they are "right" - if they even are. i would be furious at either side doing this to any sitting president. we continue to allow more and more to to unchecked for no other reason than "revenge politics".

that is what is taking down this country, in my humble opinion.

Trump admitted to Leslie Stahl in 2016 that the reason he attacks the media and calls them "fake news" is so that when he does something wrong, his supporters won't believe the facts.
That is not surprising; we all knew that before he admitted it, but it's nice to know he has no compunction about those kind of tactics. It's just the kind of guy he is.

What is sad, and if successful what COULD take down this country is gullible people who swallow the fairy tale conspiracy theories and Trump's lies.
The Dems make a lot of noise, but the Mueller Investigation and this Impeachment Investigation are both playing by the rules. All the Trumpians can come up with is ad hominem attacks and imaginative stories of what might have been....and sheer flat out denial of what the President is documented as doing. It's dishonest as hell and "outting" the whistleblower, bragging about it and then running from any personal responsibility for it....that's just plain wrong, poor upbringing and something you or I would never consider. Because I know you're a decent human being. Trump isn't and neither are the folks who slavishly defend his behavior.
I am really really beginning to agree that we shouldn't wait until 2020 to give this guy the bum's rush. What's taking them so long?

 

[MisterBeale]

i am NOT saying the right is above this, i'm saying i don't have a similar example to offer that went to the extremes kavanaugh went to.

that is what is taking down this country, in my humble opinion.

Agreed. All sides are corrupt.

It’s the DNC, Stupid: Democratic Party, Not Russia, Has Delegitimized the Democratic Process
It’s the DNC, Stupid: Democratic Party, Not Russia, Has Delegitimized the Democratic Process

". . .On the Republican side, a recent episode of CNLive! featured discussion of the Cambridge Analytica scandal, in which undecided voters were micro-targeted with tailored advertising narrowed with the combined use of big data and artificial intelligence known collectively as “dark strategy.” CNLive! Executive Producer Cathy Vogan noted that SCL, Cambridge Analytica’s parent company, provides data, analytics and strategy to governments and military organizations “worldwide,” specializing in behavior modification. Though Cambridge Analytica shut down in 2018, related companies remain.

The Clinton camp was hardly absent from social media during the 2016 race. The barely-legal activities of Clintonite David Brock were previously reported by this author to have included $2 million in funding for the creation of an online “troll army” under the name Shareblue. The LA Times described the project as meant to “to appear to be coming organically from people and their social media networks in a groundswell of activism, when in fact it is highly paid and highly tactical.” In other words, the effort attempted to create a false sense of consensus in support for the Clinton campaign. . . "

<snip>

" . . . Debacles followed both contests, including improper vote counts, illegal ballot destruction, improper transportation of ballots, and generally shameless displays of cronyism. After the controversial results of the initial primary race against Wasserman Schultz, Canova sought to have ballots checked for irregularities, as the Sun-Sentinel reported at the time:

“[Canova] sought to look at the paper ballots in March 2017 and took Elections Supervisor Brenda Snipes to court three months later when her office hadn’t fulfilled his request. Snipes approved the destruction of the ballots in September, signing a certification that said no court cases involving the ballots were pending.”

Ultimately, Canova was granted a summary judgment against Snipes, finding that she had committed what amounted to multiple felonies. Nonetheless, Snipes was not prosecuted and remained elections supervisor through to the 2018 midterms.

Republicans appear no more motivated to protect voting integrity than the Democrats, with The Nation reporting that the GOP-controlled Senate blocked a bill this week that would have “mandated paper-ballot backups in case of election machine malfunctions.”

Study of Corporate Power

A 2014 study published by Princeton University found that corporate power had usurped the voting rights of the public: “Economic elites and organized groups representing business interests have substantial independent impacts on U.S. government policy, while average citizens and mass-based interest groups have little or no independent influence.”

In reviewing this sordid history, we see that the Democratic Party establishment has done everything in its power to disrespect voters and outright overrule them in the democratic primary process, defending their right to do so in the DNC fraud lawsuit. We’ve noted that interests transcending the DNC also represent escalating threats to election integrity as demonstrated in 2016. . . ."

 

[MisterBeale]

The curious timeline for taking down Trump

Among those who predicted he could never win the election — or that he might have been conspiring with Hillary Clinton all along, worked for Russia’s President Putin, would crash the U.S. stock market his first week in office, would ban all Muslims, would send illegal immigrants home en masse on buses and trains, and would start a nuclear war — there have been real concerns.

But to others, there are different concerns that have borne out. We continue to get evidence of an orchestrated effort among government insiders and the well-connected to take down President Trump at all costs. The public evidence indicates that the effort was hatched even before he took office.

Trump critics would argue that there was good reason to devise plots against him before he was inaugurated. His supporters would argue that the opposition has crossed the line into unlawful actions involving wiretapping and attempts to frame Trump and his associates.

In any event, we can build an oversimplified timeline to make the point:
----------
you can follow links to the various stories, but this tries to centralize what happened, when. the fact of the matter *is* we have proof the "coup" (pick your own word if you don't like that one) was in play as soon as he was elected.

tweets saying COUP
text messages saying "insurance policy"

all of these things those who hate trump ignore, or feel justified in using because they feel the end justifies the means. OF WHICH got us into this predicament to begin with.

i continue to use Kavanaugh as a prime example of the left willing to destroy lives with a lie in order to get their own goals at any expense. i am NOT saying the right is above this, i'm saying i don't have a similar example to offer that went to the extremes kavanaugh went to.

the focus on 1 line from a trump phone call while yet bypassing tweets/texts and other reports of much greater information amazes me but points back to - the end justifies the means. to get to trump, they will use any means necessary.

to be clear - i am not defending trump, i am against the methods the left is using to prove they are "right" - if they even are. i would be furious at either side doing this to any sitting president. we continue to allow more and more to to unchecked for no other reason than "revenge politics".

that is what is taking down this country, in my humble opinion.

Trump admitted to Leslie Stahl in 2016 that the reason he attacks the media and calls them "fake news" is so that when he does something wrong, his supporters won't believe the facts.
That is not surprising; we all knew that before he admitted it, but it's nice to know he has no compunction about those kind of tactics. It's just the kind of guy he is.

What is sad, and if successful what COULD take down this country is gullible people who swallow the fairy tale conspiracy theories and Trump's lies.
The Dems make a lot of noise, but the Mueller Investigation and this Impeachment Investigation are both playing by the rules. All the Trumpians can come up with is ad hominem attacks and imaginative stories of what might have been....and sheer flat out denial of what the President is documented as doing. It's dishonest as hell and "outting" the whistleblower, bragging about it and then running from any personal responsibility for it....that's just plain wrong, poor upbringing and something you or I would never consider. Because I know you're a decent human being. Trump isn't and neither are the folks who slavishly defend his behavior.
I am really really beginning to agree that we shouldn't wait until 2020 to give this guy the bum's rush. What's taking them so long?

sigh. . . .

OL. . .

You know what you remind me of?

You are like some old surfer bum out on the Cali beaches that would get high every day and smoke a pack a day. And then, one day, get lung cancer, and blame the fact that he can't surf anymore on the lung cancer.



We've been at war for twenty years. We have had untenable and unsustainable economic policies that will not work indefinitely since at least Nixon.

The system is teetering on the brink, folks have had enough, and now? You want to what? Blame a clown in office? Even if you boot him from office, it won't solve any of the underlying problems.

Trump is just the cancer at the end dear. Don't blame the symptom, blame the cause.

Trump, Impeachment & Forgetting What Brought Him to the White House
Trump, Impeachment & Forgetting What Brought Him to the White House

". . . . Holding promised security assistance hostage unless a foreign leader agrees to do you political favors is obviously and indisputably wrong. Trump’s antics regarding Ukraine may even meet some definition of criminal. Still, how does such misconduct compare to the calamities engineered by the “centrists” who preceded him? Consider, in particular, the George W. Bush administration’s decision to invade Iraq in 2003 (along with the spin-off wars that followed). Consider, too, the reckless economic policies that produced the Great Recession of 2007-2008. As measured by the harm inflicted on the American people (and others), the offenses for which Trump is being impeached qualify as mere misdemeanors.

Honest people may differ on whether to attribute the Iraq War to outright lies or monumental hubris. When it comes to tallying up the consequences, however, the intentions of those who sold the war don’t particularly matter. The results include thousands of Americans killed; tens of thousands wounded, many grievously, or left to struggle with the effects of PTSD; hundreds of thousands of non-Americans killed or injured; millions displaced; trillions of dollars expended; radical groups like ISIS empowered (and in its case even formed inside a U.S. prison in Iraq); and the Persian Gulf region plunged into turmoil from which it has yet to recover. How do Trump’s crimes stack up against these?

The Great Recession stemmed directly from economic policies implemented during the administration of President Bill Clinton and continued by his successor. Deregulating the banking sector was projected to produce a bonanza in which all would share. Yet, as a direct result of the ensuing chicanery, nearly 9 million Americans lost their jobs, while overall unemployment shot up to 10 percent. Roughly 4 million Americans lost their homes to foreclosure. The stock market cratered and millions saw their life savings evaporate. Again, the question must be asked: How do these results compare to Trump’s dubious dealings with Ukraine?

Trump’s critics speak with one voice in demanding accountability. Yet virtually no one has been held accountable for the pain, suffering, and loss inflicted by the architects of the Iraq War and the Great Recession. Why is that? As another presidential election approaches, the question not only goes unanswered, but unasked.. . . "

 

[iceberg]

The curious timeline for taking down Trump

Among those who predicted he could never win the election — or that he might have been conspiring with Hillary Clinton all along, worked for Russia’s President Putin, would crash the U.S. stock market his first week in office, would ban all Muslims, would send illegal immigrants home en masse on buses and trains, and would start a nuclear war — there have been real concerns.

But to others, there are different concerns that have borne out. We continue to get evidence of an orchestrated effort among government insiders and the well-connected to take down President Trump at all costs. The public evidence indicates that the effort was hatched even before he took office.

Trump critics would argue that there was good reason to devise plots against him before he was inaugurated. His supporters would argue that the opposition has crossed the line into unlawful actions involving wiretapping and attempts to frame Trump and his associates.

In any event, we can build an oversimplified timeline to make the point:
----------
you can follow links to the various stories, but this tries to centralize what happened, when. the fact of the matter *is* we have proof the "coup" (pick your own word if you don't like that one) was in play as soon as he was elected.

tweets saying COUP
text messages saying "insurance policy"

all of these things those who hate trump ignore, or feel justified in using because they feel the end justifies the means. OF WHICH got us into this predicament to begin with.

i continue to use Kavanaugh as a prime example of the left willing to destroy lives with a lie in order to get their own goals at any expense. i am NOT saying the right is above this, i'm saying i don't have a similar example to offer that went to the extremes kavanaugh went to.

the focus on 1 line from a trump phone call while yet bypassing tweets/texts and other reports of much greater information amazes me but points back to - the end justifies the means. to get to trump, they will use any means necessary.

to be clear - i am not defending trump, i am against the methods the left is using to prove they are "right" - if they even are. i would be furious at either side doing this to any sitting president. we continue to allow more and more to to unchecked for no other reason than "revenge politics".

that is what is taking down this country, in my humble opinion.

Trump admitted to Leslie Stahl in 2016 that the reason he attacks the media and calls them "fake news" is so that when he does something wrong, his supporters won't believe the facts.
That is not surprising; we all knew that before he admitted it, but it's nice to know he has no compunction about those kind of tactics. It's just the kind of guy he is.

What is sad, and if successful what COULD take down this country is gullible people who swallow the fairy tale conspiracy theories and Trump's lies.
The Dems make a lot of noise, but the Mueller Investigation and this Impeachment Investigation are both playing by the rules. All the Trumpians can come up with is ad hominem attacks and imaginative stories of what might have been....and sheer flat out denial of what the President is documented as doing. It's dishonest as hell and "outting" the whistleblower, bragging about it and then running from any personal responsibility for it....that's just plain wrong, poor upbringing and something you or I would never consider. Because I know you're a decent human being. Trump isn't and neither are the folks who slavishly defend his behavior.
I am really really beginning to agree that we shouldn't wait until 2020 to give this guy the bum's rush. What's taking them so long?

link to where trump said this - not that she said he said it.

and fake news has actually been traced back to google; trump didn't make it up. but again this is investigative reporting by attkisson. you can either show me directly where trump said this *OR* ask me to believe 3rd party info.

given i can show you where and who said THE COUP HAS STARTED and this isn't believed, why should i believe indirect quotes?

 

[iceberg]

Thanks. Totally respect your posts, but. .. You should probably notify the left;

"By Sharyl Attkisson, opinion contributor — 11/08/19 09:00 AM EST 1,150
The views expressed by contributors are their own and not the view of The Hill"

it's there and hard to hide. i post the headline as the subject so i'm not accused of CLICK BAIT type stuff and then a link directly and the first few relevant paragraphs. i constantly hear "the left" bitch she's a "Right based" reporter but i never see these same people bitch at people left based NOR dispute her "facts". just her as if name calling is suddenly enough to make people go "gosh i better not quote her"

get your point but not going to go too far overboard on a post most are going to ignore anyway because it is step by step what happened and when OF WHICH counters most of their emotional insurance needs around hating trump.

 

[OldLady]

The curious timeline for taking down Trump

Among those who predicted he could never win the election — or that he might have been conspiring with Hillary Clinton all along, worked for Russia’s President Putin, would crash the U.S. stock market his first week in office, would ban all Muslims, would send illegal immigrants home en masse on buses and trains, and would start a nuclear war — there have been real concerns.

But to others, there are different concerns that have borne out. We continue to get evidence of an orchestrated effort among government insiders and the well-connected to take down President Trump at all costs. The public evidence indicates that the effort was hatched even before he took office.

Trump critics would argue that there was good reason to devise plots against him before he was inaugurated. His supporters would argue that the opposition has crossed the line into unlawful actions involving wiretapping and attempts to frame Trump and his associates.

In any event, we can build an oversimplified timeline to make the point:
----------
you can follow links to the various stories, but this tries to centralize what happened, when. the fact of the matter *is* we have proof the "coup" (pick your own word if you don't like that one) was in play as soon as he was elected.

tweets saying COUP
text messages saying "insurance policy"

all of these things those who hate trump ignore, or feel justified in using because they feel the end justifies the means. OF WHICH got us into this predicament to begin with.

i continue to use Kavanaugh as a prime example of the left willing to destroy lives with a lie in order to get their own goals at any expense. i am NOT saying the right is above this, i'm saying i don't have a similar example to offer that went to the extremes kavanaugh went to.

the focus on 1 line from a trump phone call while yet bypassing tweets/texts and other reports of much greater information amazes me but points back to - the end justifies the means. to get to trump, they will use any means necessary.

to be clear - i am not defending trump, i am against the methods the left is using to prove they are "right" - if they even are. i would be furious at either side doing this to any sitting president. we continue to allow more and more to to unchecked for no other reason than "revenge politics".

that is what is taking down this country, in my humble opinion.

Trump admitted to Leslie Stahl in 2016 that the reason he attacks the media and calls them "fake news" is so that when he does something wrong, his supporters won't believe the facts.
That is not surprising; we all knew that before he admitted it, but it's nice to know he has no compunction about those kind of tactics. It's just the kind of guy he is.

What is sad, and if successful what COULD take down this country is gullible people who swallow the fairy tale conspiracy theories and Trump's lies.
The Dems make a lot of noise, but the Mueller Investigation and this Impeachment Investigation are both playing by the rules. All the Trumpians can come up with is ad hominem attacks and imaginative stories of what might have been....and sheer flat out denial of what the President is documented as doing. It's dishonest as hell and "outting" the whistleblower, bragging about it and then running from any personal responsibility for it....that's just plain wrong, poor upbringing and something you or I would never consider. Because I know you're a decent human being. Trump isn't and neither are the folks who slavishly defend his behavior.
I am really really beginning to agree that we shouldn't wait until 2020 to give this guy the bum's rush. What's taking them so long?

sigh. . . .

OL. . .

You know what you remind me of?

You are like some old surfer bum out on the Cali beaches that would get high every day and smoke a pack a day. And then, one day, get lung cancer, and blame the fact that he can't surf anymore on the lung cancer.



We've been at war for twenty years. We have had untenable and unsustainable economic policies that will not work indefinitely since at least Nixon.

The system is teetering on the brink, folks have had enough, and now? You want to what? Blame a clown in office? Even if you boot him from office, it won't solve any of the underlying problems.

Trump is just the cancer at the end dear. Don't blame the symptom, blame the cause.

Trump, Impeachment & Forgetting What Brought Him to the White House
Trump, Impeachment & Forgetting What Brought Him to the White House

". . . . Holding promised security assistance hostage unless a foreign leader agrees to do you political favors is obviously and indisputably wrong. Trump’s antics regarding Ukraine may even meet some definition of criminal. Still, how does such misconduct compare to the calamities engineered by the “centrists” who preceded him? Consider, in particular, the George W. Bush administration’s decision to invade Iraq in 2003 (along with the spin-off wars that followed). Consider, too, the reckless economic policies that produced the Great Recession of 2007-2008. As measured by the harm inflicted on the American people (and others), the offenses for which Trump is being impeached qualify as mere misdemeanors.

Honest people may differ on whether to attribute the Iraq War to outright lies or monumental hubris. When it comes to tallying up the consequences, however, the intentions of those who sold the war don’t particularly matter. The results include thousands of Americans killed; tens of thousands wounded, many grievously, or left to struggle with the effects of PTSD; hundreds of thousands of non-Americans killed or injured; millions displaced; trillions of dollars expended; radical groups like ISIS empowered (and in its case even formed inside a U.S. prison in Iraq); and the Persian Gulf region plunged into turmoil from which it has yet to recover. How do Trump’s crimes stack up against these?

The Great Recession stemmed directly from economic policies implemented during the administration of President Bill Clinton and continued by his successor. Deregulating the banking sector was projected to produce a bonanza in which all would share. Yet, as a direct result of the ensuing chicanery, nearly 9 million Americans lost their jobs, while overall unemployment shot up to 10 percent. Roughly 4 million Americans lost their homes to foreclosure. The stock market cratered and millions saw their life savings evaporate. Again, the question must be asked: How do these results compare to Trump’s dubious dealings with Ukraine?

Trump’s critics speak with one voice in demanding accountability. Yet virtually no one has been held accountable for the pain, suffering, and loss inflicted by the architects of the Iraq War and the Great Recession. Why is that? As another presidential election approaches, the question not only goes unanswered, but unasked.. . . "

So since those two things happened, no leader can be held accountable ever again? That is your argument?

 

[OldLady]

The curious timeline for taking down Trump

Among those who predicted he could never win the election — or that he might have been conspiring with Hillary Clinton all along, worked for Russia’s President Putin, would crash the U.S. stock market his first week in office, would ban all Muslims, would send illegal immigrants home en masse on buses and trains, and would start a nuclear war — there have been real concerns.

But to others, there are different concerns that have borne out. We continue to get evidence of an orchestrated effort among government insiders and the well-connected to take down President Trump at all costs. The public evidence indicates that the effort was hatched even before he took office.

Trump critics would argue that there was good reason to devise plots against him before he was inaugurated. His supporters would argue that the opposition has crossed the line into unlawful actions involving wiretapping and attempts to frame Trump and his associates.

In any event, we can build an oversimplified timeline to make the point:
----------
you can follow links to the various stories, but this tries to centralize what happened, when. the fact of the matter *is* we have proof the "coup" (pick your own word if you don't like that one) was in play as soon as he was elected.

tweets saying COUP
text messages saying "insurance policy"

all of these things those who hate trump ignore, or feel justified in using because they feel the end justifies the means. OF WHICH got us into this predicament to begin with.

i continue to use Kavanaugh as a prime example of the left willing to destroy lives with a lie in order to get their own goals at any expense. i am NOT saying the right is above this, i'm saying i don't have a similar example to offer that went to the extremes kavanaugh went to.

the focus on 1 line from a trump phone call while yet bypassing tweets/texts and other reports of much greater information amazes me but points back to - the end justifies the means. to get to trump, they will use any means necessary.

to be clear - i am not defending trump, i am against the methods the left is using to prove they are "right" - if they even are. i would be furious at either side doing this to any sitting president. we continue to allow more and more to to unchecked for no other reason than "revenge politics".

that is what is taking down this country, in my humble opinion.

Trump admitted to Leslie Stahl in 2016 that the reason he attacks the media and calls them "fake news" is so that when he does something wrong, his supporters won't believe the facts.
That is not surprising; we all knew that before he admitted it, but it's nice to know he has no compunction about those kind of tactics. It's just the kind of guy he is.

What is sad, and if successful what COULD take down this country is gullible people who swallow the fairy tale conspiracy theories and Trump's lies.
The Dems make a lot of noise, but the Mueller Investigation and this Impeachment Investigation are both playing by the rules. All the Trumpians can come up with is ad hominem attacks and imaginative stories of what might have been....and sheer flat out denial of what the President is documented as doing. It's dishonest as hell and "outting" the whistleblower, bragging about it and then running from any personal responsibility for it....that's just plain wrong, poor upbringing and something you or I would never consider. Because I know you're a decent human being. Trump isn't and neither are the folks who slavishly defend his behavior.
I am really really beginning to agree that we shouldn't wait until 2020 to give this guy the bum's rush. What's taking them so long?

link to where trump said this - not that she said he said it.

and fake news has actually been traced back to google; trump didn't make it up. but again this is investigative reporting by attkisson. you can either show me directly where trump said this *OR* ask me to believe 3rd party info.

given i can show you where and who said THE COUP HAS STARTED and this isn't believed, why should i believe indirect quotes?

Why should you believe there is a coup? Do you have any evidence of that or a deep state? No. Forget it, ice. I thought you were still semi-reasonable. I guess I was wrong.

 

[iceberg]

The curious timeline for taking down Trump

Among those who predicted he could never win the election — or that he might have been conspiring with Hillary Clinton all along, worked for Russia’s President Putin, would crash the U.S. stock market his first week in office, would ban all Muslims, would send illegal immigrants home en masse on buses and trains, and would start a nuclear war — there have been real concerns.

But to others, there are different concerns that have borne out. We continue to get evidence of an orchestrated effort among government insiders and the well-connected to take down President Trump at all costs. The public evidence indicates that the effort was hatched even before he took office.

Trump critics would argue that there was good reason to devise plots against him before he was inaugurated. His supporters would argue that the opposition has crossed the line into unlawful actions involving wiretapping and attempts to frame Trump and his associates.

In any event, we can build an oversimplified timeline to make the point:
----------
you can follow links to the various stories, but this tries to centralize what happened, when. the fact of the matter *is* we have proof the "coup" (pick your own word if you don't like that one) was in play as soon as he was elected.

tweets saying COUP
text messages saying "insurance policy"

all of these things those who hate trump ignore, or feel justified in using because they feel the end justifies the means. OF WHICH got us into this predicament to begin with.

i continue to use Kavanaugh as a prime example of the left willing to destroy lives with a lie in order to get their own goals at any expense. i am NOT saying the right is above this, i'm saying i don't have a similar example to offer that went to the extremes kavanaugh went to.

the focus on 1 line from a trump phone call while yet bypassing tweets/texts and other reports of much greater information amazes me but points back to - the end justifies the means. to get to trump, they will use any means necessary.

to be clear - i am not defending trump, i am against the methods the left is using to prove they are "right" - if they even are. i would be furious at either side doing this to any sitting president. we continue to allow more and more to to unchecked for no other reason than "revenge politics".

that is what is taking down this country, in my humble opinion.

Trump admitted to Leslie Stahl in 2016 that the reason he attacks the media and calls them "fake news" is so that when he does something wrong, his supporters won't believe the facts.
That is not surprising; we all knew that before he admitted it, but it's nice to know he has no compunction about those kind of tactics. It's just the kind of guy he is.

What is sad, and if successful what COULD take down this country is gullible people who swallow the fairy tale conspiracy theories and Trump's lies.
The Dems make a lot of noise, but the Mueller Investigation and this Impeachment Investigation are both playing by the rules. All the Trumpians can come up with is ad hominem attacks and imaginative stories of what might have been....and sheer flat out denial of what the President is documented as doing. It's dishonest as hell and "outting" the whistleblower, bragging about it and then running from any personal responsibility for it....that's just plain wrong, poor upbringing and something you or I would never consider. Because I know you're a decent human being. Trump isn't and neither are the folks who slavishly defend his behavior.
I am really really beginning to agree that we shouldn't wait until 2020 to give this guy the bum's rush. What's taking them so long?

link to where trump said this - not that she said he said it.

and fake news has actually been traced back to google; trump didn't make it up. but again this is investigative reporting by attkisson. you can either show me directly where trump said this *OR* ask me to believe 3rd party info.

given i can show you where and who said THE COUP HAS STARTED and this isn't believed, why should i believe indirect quotes?

Why should you believe there is a coup? Do you have any evidence of that or a deep state? No. Forget it, ice. I thought you were still semi-reasonable. I guess I was wrong.

then i should believe the person who said THE COUP HAS STARTED was lying? that an "insurance policy" was like from state farm?

and now you're off on the attacks. here is where i respectfully bow out. being reasonable to you simply seems to mean i agree with what you say and can have no opinions on my own.

 

[MisterBeale]

Thanks. Totally respect your posts, but. .. You should probably notify the left;

"By Sharyl Attkisson, opinion contributor — 11/08/19 09:00 AM EST 1,150
The views expressed by contributors are their own and not the view of The Hill"

it's there and hard to hide. i post the headline as the subject so i'm not accused of CLICK BAIT type stuff and then a link directly and the first few relevant paragraphs. i constantly hear "the left" bitch she's a "Right based" reporter but i never see these same people bitch at people left based NOR dispute her "facts". just her as if name calling is suddenly enough to make people go "gosh i better not quote her"

get your point but not going to go too far overboard on a post most are going to ignore anyway because it is step by step what happened and when OF WHICH counters most of their emotional insurance needs around hating trump.

Thanks, I agree with ALL of that. I just thought fair warning was needed. Most on the left will read something from THE HILL, unless it is from her or Solomon.

 

[jc456]

The curious timeline for taking down Trump

Among those who predicted he could never win the election — or that he might have been conspiring with Hillary Clinton all along, worked for Russia’s President Putin, would crash the U.S. stock market his first week in office, would ban all Muslims, would send illegal immigrants home en masse on buses and trains, and would start a nuclear war — there have been real concerns.

But to others, there are different concerns that have borne out. We continue to get evidence of an orchestrated effort among government insiders and the well-connected to take down President Trump at all costs. The public evidence indicates that the effort was hatched even before he took office.

Trump critics would argue that there was good reason to devise plots against him before he was inaugurated. His supporters would argue that the opposition has crossed the line into unlawful actions involving wiretapping and attempts to frame Trump and his associates.

In any event, we can build an oversimplified timeline to make the point:
----------
you can follow links to the various stories, but this tries to centralize what happened, when. the fact of the matter *is* we have proof the "coup" (pick your own word if you don't like that one) was in play as soon as he was elected.

tweets saying COUP
text messages saying "insurance policy"

all of these things those who hate trump ignore, or feel justified in using because they feel the end justifies the means. OF WHICH got us into this predicament to begin with.

i continue to use Kavanaugh as a prime example of the left willing to destroy lives with a lie in order to get their own goals at any expense. i am NOT saying the right is above this, i'm saying i don't have a similar example to offer that went to the extremes kavanaugh went to.

the focus on 1 line from a trump phone call while yet bypassing tweets/texts and other reports of much greater information amazes me but points back to - the end justifies the means. to get to trump, they will use any means necessary.

to be clear - i am not defending trump, i am against the methods the left is using to prove they are "right" - if they even are. i would be furious at either side doing this to any sitting president. we continue to allow more and more to to unchecked for no other reason than "revenge politics".

that is what is taking down this country, in my humble opinion.

Trump admitted to Leslie Stahl in 2016 that the reason he attacks the media and calls them "fake news" is so that when he does something wrong, his supporters won't believe the facts.
That is not surprising; we all knew that before he admitted it, but it's nice to know he has no compunction about those kind of tactics. It's just the kind of guy he is.

What is sad, and if successful what COULD take down this country is gullible people who swallow the fairy tale conspiracy theories and Trump's lies.
The Dems make a lot of noise, but the Mueller Investigation and this Impeachment Investigation are both playing by the rules. All the Trumpians can come up with is ad hominem attacks and imaginative stories of what might have been....and sheer flat out denial of what the President is documented as doing. It's dishonest as hell and "outting" the whistleblower, bragging about it and then running from any personal responsibility for it....that's just plain wrong, poor upbringing and something you or I would never consider. Because I know you're a decent human being. Trump isn't and neither are the folks who slavishly defend his behavior.
I am really really beginning to agree that we shouldn't wait until 2020 to give this guy the bum's rush. What's taking them so long?

link to where trump said this - not that she said he said it.

and fake news has actually been traced back to google; trump didn't make it up. but again this is investigative reporting by attkisson. you can either show me directly where trump said this *OR* ask me to believe 3rd party info.

given i can show you where and who said THE COUP HAS STARTED and this isn't believed, why should i believe indirect quotes?

Why should you believe there is a coup? Do you have any evidence of that or a deep state? No. Forget it, ice. I thought you were still semi-reasonable. I guess I was wrong.

then i should believe the person who said THE COUP HAS STARTED was lying? that an "insurance policy" was like from state farm?

and now you're off on the attacks. here is where i respectfully bow out. being reasonable to you simply seems to mean i agree with what you say and can have no opinions on my own.

Icedude, it's that way everyday, every post from these fks. All I have asked for I have never received. not one thing. just throw and go's that's it. Thank you for the OP. well done laid out perfectly.

And of course, it never happened. and that's the truth, ask a leftturd.

 

[2aguy]

The curious timeline for taking down Trump

Among those who predicted he could never win the election — or that he might have been conspiring with Hillary Clinton all along, worked for Russia’s President Putin, would crash the U.S. stock market his first week in office, would ban all Muslims, would send illegal immigrants home en masse on buses and trains, and would start a nuclear war — there have been real concerns.

But to others, there are different concerns that have borne out. We continue to get evidence of an orchestrated effort among government insiders and the well-connected to take down President Trump at all costs. The public evidence indicates that the effort was hatched even before he took office.

Trump critics would argue that there was good reason to devise plots against him before he was inaugurated. His supporters would argue that the opposition has crossed the line into unlawful actions involving wiretapping and attempts to frame Trump and his associates.

In any event, we can build an oversimplified timeline to make the point:
----------
you can follow links to the various stories, but this tries to centralize what happened, when. the fact of the matter *is* we have proof the "coup" (pick your own word if you don't like that one) was in play as soon as he was elected.

tweets saying COUP
text messages saying "insurance policy"

all of these things those who hate trump ignore, or feel justified in using because they feel the end justifies the means. OF WHICH got us into this predicament to begin with.

i continue to use Kavanaugh as a prime example of the left willing to destroy lives with a lie in order to get their own goals at any expense. i am NOT saying the right is above this, i'm saying i don't have a similar example to offer that went to the extremes kavanaugh went to.

the focus on 1 line from a trump phone call while yet bypassing tweets/texts and other reports of much greater information amazes me but points back to - the end justifies the means. to get to trump, they will use any means necessary.

to be clear - i am not defending trump, i am against the methods the left is using to prove they are "right" - if they even are. i would be furious at either side doing this to any sitting president. we continue to allow more and more to to unchecked for no other reason than "revenge politics".

that is what is taking down this country, in my humble opinion.

Trump admitted to Leslie Stahl in 2016 that the reason he attacks the media and calls them "fake news" is so that when he does something wrong, his supporters won't believe the facts.
That is not surprising; we all knew that before he admitted it, but it's nice to know he has no compunction about those kind of tactics. It's just the kind of guy he is.

What is sad, and if successful what COULD take down this country is gullible people who swallow the fairy tale conspiracy theories and Trump's lies.
The Dems make a lot of noise, but the Mueller Investigation and this Impeachment Investigation are both playing by the rules. All the Trumpians can come up with is ad hominem attacks and imaginative stories of what might have been....and sheer flat out denial of what the President is documented as doing. It's dishonest as hell and "outting" the whistleblower, bragging about it and then running from any personal responsibility for it....that's just plain wrong, poor upbringing and something you or I would never consider. Because I know you're a decent human being. Trump isn't and neither are the folks who slavishly defend his behavior.
I am really really beginning to agree that we shouldn't wait until 2020 to give this guy the bum's rush. What's taking them so long?

Fairy tales? Illegal FISA warrants, information gathered by hilary using Russians, fake Ukraine call whistle blowers.......

 

[MisterBeale]

The curious timeline for taking down Trump

Among those who predicted he could never win the election — or that he might have been conspiring with Hillary Clinton all along, worked for Russia’s President Putin, would crash the U.S. stock market his first week in office, would ban all Muslims, would send illegal immigrants home en masse on buses and trains, and would start a nuclear war — there have been real concerns.

But to others, there are different concerns that have borne out. We continue to get evidence of an orchestrated effort among government insiders and the well-connected to take down President Trump at all costs. The public evidence indicates that the effort was hatched even before he took office.

Trump critics would argue that there was good reason to devise plots against him before he was inaugurated. His supporters would argue that the opposition has crossed the line into unlawful actions involving wiretapping and attempts to frame Trump and his associates.

In any event, we can build an oversimplified timeline to make the point:
----------
you can follow links to the various stories, but this tries to centralize what happened, when. the fact of the matter *is* we have proof the "coup" (pick your own word if you don't like that one) was in play as soon as he was elected.

tweets saying COUP
text messages saying "insurance policy"

all of these things those who hate trump ignore, or feel justified in using because they feel the end justifies the means. OF WHICH got us into this predicament to begin with.

i continue to use Kavanaugh as a prime example of the left willing to destroy lives with a lie in order to get their own goals at any expense. i am NOT saying the right is above this, i'm saying i don't have a similar example to offer that went to the extremes kavanaugh went to.

the focus on 1 line from a trump phone call while yet bypassing tweets/texts and other reports of much greater information amazes me but points back to - the end justifies the means. to get to trump, they will use any means necessary.

to be clear - i am not defending trump, i am against the methods the left is using to prove they are "right" - if they even are. i would be furious at either side doing this to any sitting president. we continue to allow more and more to to unchecked for no other reason than "revenge politics".

that is what is taking down this country, in my humble opinion.

Trump admitted to Leslie Stahl in 2016 that the reason he attacks the media and calls them "fake news" is so that when he does something wrong, his supporters won't believe the facts.
That is not surprising; we all knew that before he admitted it, but it's nice to know he has no compunction about those kind of tactics. It's just the kind of guy he is.

What is sad, and if successful what COULD take down this country is gullible people who swallow the fairy tale conspiracy theories and Trump's lies.
The Dems make a lot of noise, but the Mueller Investigation and this Impeachment Investigation are both playing by the rules. All the Trumpians can come up with is ad hominem attacks and imaginative stories of what might have been....and sheer flat out denial of what the President is documented as doing. It's dishonest as hell and "outting" the whistleblower, bragging about it and then running from any personal responsibility for it....that's just plain wrong, poor upbringing and something you or I would never consider. Because I know you're a decent human being. Trump isn't and neither are the folks who slavishly defend his behavior.
I am really really beginning to agree that we shouldn't wait until 2020 to give this guy the bum's rush. What's taking them so long?

sigh. . . .

OL. . .

You know what you remind me of?

You are like some old surfer bum out on the Cali beaches that would get high every day and smoke a pack a day. And then, one day, get lung cancer, and blame the fact that he can't surf anymore on the lung cancer.



We've been at war for twenty years. We have had untenable and unsustainable economic policies that will not work indefinitely since at least Nixon.

The system is teetering on the brink, folks have had enough, and now? You want to what? Blame a clown in office? Even if you boot him from office, it won't solve any of the underlying problems.

Trump is just the cancer at the end dear. Don't blame the symptom, blame the cause.

Trump, Impeachment & Forgetting What Brought Him to the White House
Trump, Impeachment & Forgetting What Brought Him to the White House

". . . . Holding promised security assistance hostage unless a foreign leader agrees to do you political favors is obviously and indisputably wrong. Trump’s antics regarding Ukraine may even meet some definition of criminal. Still, how does such misconduct compare to the calamities engineered by the “centrists” who preceded him? Consider, in particular, the George W. Bush administration’s decision to invade Iraq in 2003 (along with the spin-off wars that followed). Consider, too, the reckless economic policies that produced the Great Recession of 2007-2008. As measured by the harm inflicted on the American people (and others), the offenses for which Trump is being impeached qualify as mere misdemeanors.

Honest people may differ on whether to attribute the Iraq War to outright lies or monumental hubris. When it comes to tallying up the consequences, however, the intentions of those who sold the war don’t particularly matter. The results include thousands of Americans killed; tens of thousands wounded, many grievously, or left to struggle with the effects of PTSD; hundreds of thousands of non-Americans killed or injured; millions displaced; trillions of dollars expended; radical groups like ISIS empowered (and in its case even formed inside a U.S. prison in Iraq); and the Persian Gulf region plunged into turmoil from which it has yet to recover. How do Trump’s crimes stack up against these?

The Great Recession stemmed directly from economic policies implemented during the administration of President Bill Clinton and continued by his successor. Deregulating the banking sector was projected to produce a bonanza in which all would share. Yet, as a direct result of the ensuing chicanery, nearly 9 million Americans lost their jobs, while overall unemployment shot up to 10 percent. Roughly 4 million Americans lost their homes to foreclosure. The stock market cratered and millions saw their life savings evaporate. Again, the question must be asked: How do these results compare to Trump’s dubious dealings with Ukraine?

Trump’s critics speak with one voice in demanding accountability. Yet virtually no one has been held accountable for the pain, suffering, and loss inflicted by the architects of the Iraq War and the Great Recession. Why is that? As another presidential election approaches, the question not only goes unanswered, but unasked.. . . "

So since those two things happened, no leader can be held accountable ever again? That is your argument?

Ever again?

I doubt Trump will be held accountable for anything he does in his attempt to fight corruption, and no leader after him will be held accountable either, as none before really have.

How old are you? Don't you know this by now?

 

[iceberg]

The curious timeline for taking down Trump

Among those who predicted he could never win the election — or that he might have been conspiring with Hillary Clinton all along, worked for Russia’s President Putin, would crash the U.S. stock market his first week in office, would ban all Muslims, would send illegal immigrants home en masse on buses and trains, and would start a nuclear war — there have been real concerns.

But to others, there are different concerns that have borne out. We continue to get evidence of an orchestrated effort among government insiders and the well-connected to take down President Trump at all costs. The public evidence indicates that the effort was hatched even before he took office.

Trump critics would argue that there was good reason to devise plots against him before he was inaugurated. His supporters would argue that the opposition has crossed the line into unlawful actions involving wiretapping and attempts to frame Trump and his associates.

In any event, we can build an oversimplified timeline to make the point:
----------
you can follow links to the various stories, but this tries to centralize what happened, when. the fact of the matter *is* we have proof the "coup" (pick your own word if you don't like that one) was in play as soon as he was elected.

tweets saying COUP
text messages saying "insurance policy"

all of these things those who hate trump ignore, or feel justified in using because they feel the end justifies the means. OF WHICH got us into this predicament to begin with.

i continue to use Kavanaugh as a prime example of the left willing to destroy lives with a lie in order to get their own goals at any expense. i am NOT saying the right is above this, i'm saying i don't have a similar example to offer that went to the extremes kavanaugh went to.

the focus on 1 line from a trump phone call while yet bypassing tweets/texts and other reports of much greater information amazes me but points back to - the end justifies the means. to get to trump, they will use any means necessary.

to be clear - i am not defending trump, i am against the methods the left is using to prove they are "right" - if they even are. i would be furious at either side doing this to any sitting president. we continue to allow more and more to to unchecked for no other reason than "revenge politics".

that is what is taking down this country, in my humble opinion.

Trump admitted to Leslie Stahl in 2016 that the reason he attacks the media and calls them "fake news" is so that when he does something wrong, his supporters won't believe the facts.
That is not surprising; we all knew that before he admitted it, but it's nice to know he has no compunction about those kind of tactics. It's just the kind of guy he is.

What is sad, and if successful what COULD take down this country is gullible people who swallow the fairy tale conspiracy theories and Trump's lies.
The Dems make a lot of noise, but the Mueller Investigation and this Impeachment Investigation are both playing by the rules. All the Trumpians can come up with is ad hominem attacks and imaginative stories of what might have been....and sheer flat out denial of what the President is documented as doing. It's dishonest as hell and "outting" the whistleblower, bragging about it and then running from any personal responsibility for it....that's just plain wrong, poor upbringing and something you or I would never consider. Because I know you're a decent human being. Trump isn't and neither are the folks who slavishly defend his behavior.
I am really really beginning to agree that we shouldn't wait until 2020 to give this guy the bum's rush. What's taking them so long?

sigh. . . .

OL. . .

You know what you remind me of?

You are like some old surfer bum out on the Cali beaches that would get high every day and smoke a pack a day. And then, one day, get lung cancer, and blame the fact that he can't surf anymore on the lung cancer.



We've been at war for twenty years. We have had untenable and unsustainable economic policies that will not work indefinitely since at least Nixon.

The system is teetering on the brink, folks have had enough, and now? You want to what? Blame a clown in office? Even if you boot him from office, it won't solve any of the underlying problems.

Trump is just the cancer at the end dear. Don't blame the symptom, blame the cause.

Trump, Impeachment & Forgetting What Brought Him to the White House
Trump, Impeachment & Forgetting What Brought Him to the White House

". . . . Holding promised security assistance hostage unless a foreign leader agrees to do you political favors is obviously and indisputably wrong. Trump’s antics regarding Ukraine may even meet some definition of criminal. Still, how does such misconduct compare to the calamities engineered by the “centrists” who preceded him? Consider, in particular, the George W. Bush administration’s decision to invade Iraq in 2003 (along with the spin-off wars that followed). Consider, too, the reckless economic policies that produced the Great Recession of 2007-2008. As measured by the harm inflicted on the American people (and others), the offenses for which Trump is being impeached qualify as mere misdemeanors.

Honest people may differ on whether to attribute the Iraq War to outright lies or monumental hubris. When it comes to tallying up the consequences, however, the intentions of those who sold the war don’t particularly matter. The results include thousands of Americans killed; tens of thousands wounded, many grievously, or left to struggle with the effects of PTSD; hundreds of thousands of non-Americans killed or injured; millions displaced; trillions of dollars expended; radical groups like ISIS empowered (and in its case even formed inside a U.S. prison in Iraq); and the Persian Gulf region plunged into turmoil from which it has yet to recover. How do Trump’s crimes stack up against these?

The Great Recession stemmed directly from economic policies implemented during the administration of President Bill Clinton and continued by his successor. Deregulating the banking sector was projected to produce a bonanza in which all would share. Yet, as a direct result of the ensuing chicanery, nearly 9 million Americans lost their jobs, while overall unemployment shot up to 10 percent. Roughly 4 million Americans lost their homes to foreclosure. The stock market cratered and millions saw their life savings evaporate. Again, the question must be asked: How do these results compare to Trump’s dubious dealings with Ukraine?

Trump’s critics speak with one voice in demanding accountability. Yet virtually no one has been held accountable for the pain, suffering, and loss inflicted by the architects of the Iraq War and the Great Recession. Why is that? As another presidential election approaches, the question not only goes unanswered, but unasked.. . . "

So since those two things happened, no leader can be held accountable ever again? That is your argument?

Ever again?

I doubt Trump will be held accountable for anything he does in his attempt to fight corruption, and no leader after him will be held accountable either, as none before really have.

How old are you? Don't you know this by now?

The continued mantra kf dirt against a political opponant is 100% dependent upon the bidens being 100% innocent.

We are seeing they were far from it.

Wbat we see now is its ok to make up reasons to spy on trump to start investigations on their PUBLICALLY ANNOUNCED COUP, but they do no wrong and are above the same treatment.

 

[MisterBeale]

The curious timeline for taking down Trump

Among those who predicted he could never win the election — or that he might have been conspiring with Hillary Clinton all along, worked for Russia’s President Putin, would crash the U.S. stock market his first week in office, would ban all Muslims, would send illegal immigrants home en masse on buses and trains, and would start a nuclear war — there have been real concerns.

But to others, there are different concerns that have borne out. We continue to get evidence of an orchestrated effort among government insiders and the well-connected to take down President Trump at all costs. The public evidence indicates that the effort was hatched even before he took office.

Trump critics would argue that there was good reason to devise plots against him before he was inaugurated. His supporters would argue that the opposition has crossed the line into unlawful actions involving wiretapping and attempts to frame Trump and his associates.

In any event, we can build an oversimplified timeline to make the point:
----------
you can follow links to the various stories, but this tries to centralize what happened, when. the fact of the matter *is* we have proof the "coup" (pick your own word if you don't like that one) was in play as soon as he was elected.

tweets saying COUP
text messages saying "insurance policy"

all of these things those who hate trump ignore, or feel justified in using because they feel the end justifies the means. OF WHICH got us into this predicament to begin with.

i continue to use Kavanaugh as a prime example of the left willing to destroy lives with a lie in order to get their own goals at any expense. i am NOT saying the right is above this, i'm saying i don't have a similar example to offer that went to the extremes kavanaugh went to.

the focus on 1 line from a trump phone call while yet bypassing tweets/texts and other reports of much greater information amazes me but points back to - the end justifies the means. to get to trump, they will use any means necessary.

to be clear - i am not defending trump, i am against the methods the left is using to prove they are "right" - if they even are. i would be furious at either side doing this to any sitting president. we continue to allow more and more to to unchecked for no other reason than "revenge politics".

that is what is taking down this country, in my humble opinion.

Trump admitted to Leslie Stahl in 2016 that the reason he attacks the media and calls them "fake news" is so that when he does something wrong, his supporters won't believe the facts.
That is not surprising; we all knew that before he admitted it, but it's nice to know he has no compunction about those kind of tactics. It's just the kind of guy he is.

What is sad, and if successful what COULD take down this country is gullible people who swallow the fairy tale conspiracy theories and Trump's lies.
The Dems make a lot of noise, but the Mueller Investigation and this Impeachment Investigation are both playing by the rules. All the Trumpians can come up with is ad hominem attacks and imaginative stories of what might have been....and sheer flat out denial of what the President is documented as doing. It's dishonest as hell and "outting" the whistleblower, bragging about it and then running from any personal responsibility for it....that's just plain wrong, poor upbringing and something you or I would never consider. Because I know you're a decent human being. Trump isn't and neither are the folks who slavishly defend his behavior.
I am really really beginning to agree that we shouldn't wait until 2020 to give this guy the bum's rush. What's taking them so long?

sigh. . . .

OL. . .

You know what you remind me of?

You are like some old surfer bum out on the Cali beaches that would get high every day and smoke a pack a day. And then, one day, get lung cancer, and blame the fact that he can't surf anymore on the lung cancer.



We've been at war for twenty years. We have had untenable and unsustainable economic policies that will not work indefinitely since at least Nixon.

The system is teetering on the brink, folks have had enough, and now? You want to what? Blame a clown in office? Even if you boot him from office, it won't solve any of the underlying problems.

Trump is just the cancer at the end dear. Don't blame the symptom, blame the cause.

Trump, Impeachment & Forgetting What Brought Him to the White House
Trump, Impeachment & Forgetting What Brought Him to the White House

". . . . Holding promised security assistance hostage unless a foreign leader agrees to do you political favors is obviously and indisputably wrong. Trump’s antics regarding Ukraine may even meet some definition of criminal. Still, how does such misconduct compare to the calamities engineered by the “centrists” who preceded him? Consider, in particular, the George W. Bush administration’s decision to invade Iraq in 2003 (along with the spin-off wars that followed). Consider, too, the reckless economic policies that produced the Great Recession of 2007-2008. As measured by the harm inflicted on the American people (and others), the offenses for which Trump is being impeached qualify as mere misdemeanors.

Honest people may differ on whether to attribute the Iraq War to outright lies or monumental hubris. When it comes to tallying up the consequences, however, the intentions of those who sold the war don’t particularly matter. The results include thousands of Americans killed; tens of thousands wounded, many grievously, or left to struggle with the effects of PTSD; hundreds of thousands of non-Americans killed or injured; millions displaced; trillions of dollars expended; radical groups like ISIS empowered (and in its case even formed inside a U.S. prison in Iraq); and the Persian Gulf region plunged into turmoil from which it has yet to recover. How do Trump’s crimes stack up against these?

The Great Recession stemmed directly from economic policies implemented during the administration of President Bill Clinton and continued by his successor. Deregulating the banking sector was projected to produce a bonanza in which all would share. Yet, as a direct result of the ensuing chicanery, nearly 9 million Americans lost their jobs, while overall unemployment shot up to 10 percent. Roughly 4 million Americans lost their homes to foreclosure. The stock market cratered and millions saw their life savings evaporate. Again, the question must be asked: How do these results compare to Trump’s dubious dealings with Ukraine?

Trump’s critics speak with one voice in demanding accountability. Yet virtually no one has been held accountable for the pain, suffering, and loss inflicted by the architects of the Iraq War and the Great Recession. Why is that? As another presidential election approaches, the question not only goes unanswered, but unasked.. . . "

So since those two things happened, no leader can be held accountable ever again? That is your argument?

Ever again?

I doubt Trump will be held accountable for anything he does in his attempt to fight corruption, and no leader after him will be held accountable either, as none before really have.

How old are you? Don't you know this by now?

The continued mantra kf dirt against a political opponant is 100% dependent upon the bidens being 100% innocent.

We are seeing they were far from it.

Wbat we see now is its ok to make up reasons to spy on trump to start investigations on their PUBLICALLY ANNOUNCED COUP, but they do no wrong and are above the same treatment.

. . . and then they tell us, what we see and hear is not what it looks like, EVERYONE supported Biden's corruption, so. .. . . I guess that makes it okay.



. . . but since Trump can't get the bureaucracy to back him up on looking into the corruption or ineptness on CrowdStrike's behavior? Well, that means Trump is a corrupt P.O.S. obviously. . .

One would think after watching this whole Epstein thing pan out, that maybe, just maybe, yeah, the whole damn system CAN be corrupt, so just b/c he doesn't have everyone in his corner doesn't really mean shit. . . .

Who the hell knows. All I know, I won't be told I didn't see, and didn't hear what I just watched. Duh.

 

[jc456]

QUOTE="MisterBeale, post: 23449246, member: 39702"]

Trump admitted to Leslie Stahl in 2016 that the reason he attacks the media and calls them "fake news" is so that when he does something wrong, his supporters won't believe the facts.
That is not surprising; we all knew that before he admitted it, but it's nice to know he has no compunction about those kind of tactics. It's just the kind of guy he is.

What is sad, and if successful what COULD take down this country is gullible people who swallow the fairy tale conspiracy theories and Trump's lies.
The Dems make a lot of noise, but the Mueller Investigation and this Impeachment Investigation are both playing by the rules. All the Trumpians can come up with is ad hominem attacks and imaginative stories of what might have been....and sheer flat out denial of what the President is documented as doing. It's dishonest as hell and "outting" the whistleblower, bragging about it and then running from any personal responsibility for it....that's just plain wrong, poor upbringing and something you or I would never consider. Because I know you're a decent human being. Trump isn't and neither are the folks who slavishly defend his behavior.
I am really really beginning to agree that we shouldn't wait until 2020 to give this guy the bum's rush. What's taking them so long?

sigh. . . .

OL. . .

You know what you remind me of?

You are like some old surfer bum out on the Cali beaches that would get high every day and smoke a pack a day. And then, one day, get lung cancer, and blame the fact that he can't surf anymore on the lung cancer.



We've been at war for twenty years. We have had untenable and unsustainable economic policies that will not work indefinitely since at least Nixon.

The system is teetering on the brink, folks have had enough, and now? You want to what? Blame a clown in office? Even if you boot him from office, it won't solve any of the underlying problems.

Trump is just the cancer at the end dear. Don't blame the symptom, blame the cause.

Trump, Impeachment & Forgetting What Brought Him to the White House
Trump, Impeachment & Forgetting What Brought Him to the White House

". . . . Holding promised security assistance hostage unless a foreign leader agrees to do you political favors is obviously and indisputably wrong. Trump’s antics regarding Ukraine may even meet some definition of criminal. Still, how does such misconduct compare to the calamities engineered by the “centrists” who preceded him? Consider, in particular, the George W. Bush administration’s decision to invade Iraq in 2003 (along with the spin-off wars that followed). Consider, too, the reckless economic policies that produced the Great Recession of 2007-2008. As measured by the harm inflicted on the American people (and others), the offenses for which Trump is being impeached qualify as mere misdemeanors.

Honest people may differ on whether to attribute the Iraq War to outright lies or monumental hubris. When it comes to tallying up the consequences, however, the intentions of those who sold the war don’t particularly matter. The results include thousands of Americans killed; tens of thousands wounded, many grievously, or left to struggle with the effects of PTSD; hundreds of thousands of non-Americans killed or injured; millions displaced; trillions of dollars expended; radical groups like ISIS empowered (and in its case even formed inside a U.S. prison in Iraq); and the Persian Gulf region plunged into turmoil from which it has yet to recover. How do Trump’s crimes stack up against these?

The Great Recession stemmed directly from economic policies implemented during the administration of President Bill Clinton and continued by his successor. Deregulating the banking sector was projected to produce a bonanza in which all would share. Yet, as a direct result of the ensuing chicanery, nearly 9 million Americans lost their jobs, while overall unemployment shot up to 10 percent. Roughly 4 million Americans lost their homes to foreclosure. The stock market cratered and millions saw their life savings evaporate. Again, the question must be asked: How do these results compare to Trump’s dubious dealings with Ukraine?

Trump’s critics speak with one voice in demanding accountability. Yet virtually no one has been held accountable for the pain, suffering, and loss inflicted by the architects of the Iraq War and the Great Recession. Why is that? As another presidential election approaches, the question not only goes unanswered, but unasked.. . . "

So since those two things happened, no leader can be held accountable ever again? That is your argument?

Ever again?

I doubt Trump will be held accountable for anything he does in his attempt to fight corruption, and no leader after him will be held accountable either, as none before really have.

How old are you? Don't you know this by now?

The continued mantra kf dirt against a political opponant is 100% dependent upon the bidens being 100% innocent.

We are seeing they were far from it.

Wbat we see now is its ok to make up reasons to spy on trump to start investigations on their PUBLICALLY ANNOUNCED COUP, but they do no wrong and are above the same treatment.

. . . and then they tell us, what we see and hear is not what it looks like, EVERYONE supported Biden's corruption, so. .. . . I guess that makes it okay.



. . . but since Trump can't get the bureaucracy to back him up on looking into the corruption or ineptness on CrowdStrike's behavior? Well, that means Trump is a corrupt P.O.S. obviously. . .

One would think after watching this whole Epstein thing pan out, that maybe, just maybe, yeah, the whole damn system CAN be corrupt, so just b/c he doesn't have everyone in his corner doesn't really mean shit. . . .

Who the hell knows. All I know, I won't be told I didn't see, and didn't hear what I just watched. Duh.[/QUOTE]

^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^EXACTLY^^^^^^^^^^^^^

There isn't a better video out there to explain quid pro quo and extortion.

 

[iceberg]

QUOTE="MisterBeale, post: 23449246, member: 39702"]

Trump admitted to Leslie Stahl in 2016 that the reason he attacks the media and calls them "fake news" is so that when he does something wrong, his supporters won't believe the facts.
That is not surprising; we all knew that before he admitted it, but it's nice to know he has no compunction about those kind of tactics. It's just the kind of guy he is.

What is sad, and if successful what COULD take down this country is gullible people who swallow the fairy tale conspiracy theories and Trump's lies.
The Dems make a lot of noise, but the Mueller Investigation and this Impeachment Investigation are both playing by the rules. All the Trumpians can come up with is ad hominem attacks and imaginative stories of what might have been....and sheer flat out denial of what the President is documented as doing. It's dishonest as hell and "outting" the whistleblower, bragging about it and then running from any personal responsibility for it....that's just plain wrong, poor upbringing and something you or I would never consider. Because I know you're a decent human being. Trump isn't and neither are the folks who slavishly defend his behavior.
I am really really beginning to agree that we shouldn't wait until 2020 to give this guy the bum's rush. What's taking them so long?

sigh. . . .

OL. . .

You know what you remind me of?

You are like some old surfer bum out on the Cali beaches that would get high every day and smoke a pack a day. And then, one day, get lung cancer, and blame the fact that he can't surf anymore on the lung cancer.



We've been at war for twenty years. We have had untenable and unsustainable economic policies that will not work indefinitely since at least Nixon.

The system is teetering on the brink, folks have had enough, and now? You want to what? Blame a clown in office? Even if you boot him from office, it won't solve any of the underlying problems.

Trump is just the cancer at the end dear. Don't blame the symptom, blame the cause.

Trump, Impeachment & Forgetting What Brought Him to the White House
Trump, Impeachment & Forgetting What Brought Him to the White House

". . . . Holding promised security assistance hostage unless a foreign leader agrees to do you political favors is obviously and indisputably wrong. Trump’s antics regarding Ukraine may even meet some definition of criminal. Still, how does such misconduct compare to the calamities engineered by the “centrists” who preceded him? Consider, in particular, the George W. Bush administration’s decision to invade Iraq in 2003 (along with the spin-off wars that followed). Consider, too, the reckless economic policies that produced the Great Recession of 2007-2008. As measured by the harm inflicted on the American people (and others), the offenses for which Trump is being impeached qualify as mere misdemeanors.

Honest people may differ on whether to attribute the Iraq War to outright lies or monumental hubris. When it comes to tallying up the consequences, however, the intentions of those who sold the war don’t particularly matter. The results include thousands of Americans killed; tens of thousands wounded, many grievously, or left to struggle with the effects of PTSD; hundreds of thousands of non-Americans killed or injured; millions displaced; trillions of dollars expended; radical groups like ISIS empowered (and in its case even formed inside a U.S. prison in Iraq); and the Persian Gulf region plunged into turmoil from which it has yet to recover. How do Trump’s crimes stack up against these?

The Great Recession stemmed directly from economic policies implemented during the administration of President Bill Clinton and continued by his successor. Deregulating the banking sector was projected to produce a bonanza in which all would share. Yet, as a direct result of the ensuing chicanery, nearly 9 million Americans lost their jobs, while overall unemployment shot up to 10 percent. Roughly 4 million Americans lost their homes to foreclosure. The stock market cratered and millions saw their life savings evaporate. Again, the question must be asked: How do these results compare to Trump’s dubious dealings with Ukraine?

Trump’s critics speak with one voice in demanding accountability. Yet virtually no one has been held accountable for the pain, suffering, and loss inflicted by the architects of the Iraq War and the Great Recession. Why is that? As another presidential election approaches, the question not only goes unanswered, but unasked.. . . "

So since those two things happened, no leader can be held accountable ever again? That is your argument?

Ever again?

I doubt Trump will be held accountable for anything he does in his attempt to fight corruption, and no leader after him will be held accountable either, as none before really have.

How old are you? Don't you know this by now?

The continued mantra kf dirt against a political opponant is 100% dependent upon the bidens being 100% innocent.

We are seeing they were far from it.

Wbat we see now is its ok to make up reasons to spy on trump to start investigations on their PUBLICALLY ANNOUNCED COUP, but they do no wrong and are above the same treatment.

. . . and then they tell us, what we see and hear is not what it looks like, EVERYONE supported Biden's corruption, so. .. . . I guess that makes it okay.



. . . but since Trump can't get the bureaucracy to back him up on looking into the corruption or ineptness on CrowdStrike's behavior? Well, that means Trump is a corrupt P.O.S. obviously. . .

One would think after watching this whole Epstein thing pan out, that maybe, just maybe, yeah, the whole damn system CAN be corrupt, so just b/c he doesn't have everyone in his corner doesn't really mean shit. . . .

Who the hell knows. All I know, I won't be told I didn't see, and didn't hear what I just watched. Duh.

^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^EXACTLY^^^^^^^^^^^^^

There isn't a better video out there to explain quid pro quo and extortion.

If what trump said can be interpreted to digging up dirt for political gain, then bidens statement AT LEAST does the very same.

 

[DOTR]

i am NOT saying the right is above this, i'm saying i don't have a similar example to offer that went to the extremes kavanaugh went to.

that is what is taking down this country, in my humble opinion.

Agreed. All sides are corrupt.

It’s the DNC, Stupid: Democratic Party, Not Russia, Has Delegitimized the Democratic Process
It’s the DNC, Stupid: Democratic Party, Not Russia, Has Delegitimized the Democratic Process

". . .On the Republican side, a recent episode of CNLive! featured discussion of the Cambridge Analytica scandal, in which undecided voters were micro-targeted with tailored advertising narrowed with the combined use of big data and artificial intelligence known collectively as “dark strategy.” CNLive! Executive Producer Cathy Vogan noted that SCL, Cambridge Analytica’s parent company, provides data, analytics and strategy to governments and military organizations “worldwide,” specializing in behavior modification. Though Cambridge Analytica shut down in 2018, related companies remain.

The Clinton camp was hardly absent from social media during the 2016 race. The barely-legal activities of Clintonite David Brock were previously reported by this author to have included $2 million in funding for the creation of an online “troll army” under the name Shareblue. The LA Times described the project as meant to “to appear to be coming organically from people and their social media networks in a groundswell of activism, when in fact it is highly paid and highly tactical.” In other words, the effort attempted to create a false sense of consensus in support for the Clinton campaign. . . "

<snip>

" . . . Debacles followed both contests, including improper vote counts, illegal ballot destruction, improper transportation of ballots, and generally shameless displays of cronyism. After the controversial results of the initial primary race against Wasserman Schultz, Canova sought to have ballots checked for irregularities, as the Sun-Sentinel reported at the time:

“[Canova] sought to look at the paper ballots in March 2017 and took Elections Supervisor Brenda Snipes to court three months later when her office hadn’t fulfilled his request. Snipes approved the destruction of the ballots in September, signing a certification that said no court cases involving the ballots were pending.”

Ultimately, Canova was granted a summary judgment against Snipes, finding that she had committed what amounted to multiple felonies. Nonetheless, Snipes was not prosecuted and remained elections supervisor through to the 2018 midterms.

Republicans appear no more motivated to protect voting integrity than the Democrats, with The Nation reporting that the GOP-controlled Senate blocked a bill this week that would have “mandated paper-ballot backups in case of election machine malfunctions.”

Study of Corporate Power

A 2014 study published by Princeton University found that corporate power had usurped the voting rights of the public: “Economic elites and organized groups representing business interests have substantial independent impacts on U.S. government policy, while average citizens and mass-based interest groups have little or no independent influence.”

In reviewing this sordid history, we see that the Democratic Party establishment has done everything in its power to disrespect voters and outright overrule them in the democratic primary process, defending their right to do so in the DNC fraud lawsuit. We’ve noted that interests transcending the DNC also represent escalating threats to election integrity as demonstrated in 2016. . . ."

You are correct in that the DNC, as a campaign strategy, decided to “delegitimize” the US political system. It’s not their first attempt at this.
But they couldn’t attack the US without the oldladys of the country willing to overlook it. It’s corrupt from the bottom up.