The Death of a Presidency

[auditor0007]

Maybe. But CA and WA are the states with strong exchanges, so that's probably not a problem.

again, the onus has been shifted back to Big Insurance.

And again we are reminded that insurance companies have no business being in the business of health care, and that's how we got here today.

It's an inherent truth: You are born with a body that will need care. So the concept of purchasing insurance to avoid the inevitable is absurd. Other first world countries know this and have adapted. Why can't we?

Insurance should stick to risk humans take for CHOICES such as boats, houses, cars, commercial enterprise, business ventures, and liability for exposing others to your choices.

If you don't agree, then please accept personal responsibility: Start having babies at home, cure yourself when you get sick and please, heal your family when they get sick and when you get old?... die at home, too. Stop making huge profits for insurance companies that KNOW the odds are on their side, not ours.

HUGE profits???? Prove that statement!
First DEFINE "HUGE"!
Second what will happen when those "HUGE" profits disappear?
Where will the $100 billion a year paid by insurance companies in Federal/state/local taxes are gone and your property taxes GO UP when those companies close their buildings?

More importantly What will happen to the 400,000 people employed by insurance companies? Calculated that cost??

Finally ... THERE would NEVER be an ACA if the truth was told there were never 46 million "uninsured".. not when 10 million are not citizens! 14 million are covered byMedicaid and
18 million under 34 making over $50k don't want and don't NEED their employers' health plans!
So that leaves ONLY 4 million!
A $5,000 premium for each of the 4 million could come from taxing lawyers 10% LIKE ACA TAXES tanning salons because tanning causes cancer.. WELL Lawyers cause according
to 90% of doctors $850 billion a year! $850 billion in wasted duplicate tests,etc. all out of fear of lawsuits!

So ONE solution reduces uninsured to zero that want insurance!
ONE solution REDUCES the $850 billion easily by 20%!
THAT reduction in claims of $850 billion paid by insurance companies MEANS lower premiums!

But see most idiots haven't the faintest idea how risk management, premiums are calculated, medical liability ratios... too much over you idiots' HEADS!
So you react to what the MSM ignorati publish i.e. 46 million uninsured.. evil health insurance companies... etc...

I am constantly amazed at how TRULY dumb most of you people are ! YOU can't even subtract 42 million that are either not citizens, already covered or don't want or need..leaving
4 million !

Disgusting how truly stupid you people are!!!

Over and over again you tell us how 18 million under the age of 34 don't need health insurance. I find that laughable. Here is the argument. Not as many younger people become so sick that they cannot afford to pay their medical bills out of pocket. It's the same argument as saying since only a few home owners actually ever use their homeowners insurance, nobody really needs homeowner's insurance. It's a waste of money. Why pay it? Oh yea, unless you hold the deed to your property, the bank makes you buy it. Of course, why not drop it once you pay your home off? I would. Hell, chances of my house being destroyed are really small. It would be stupid to pay for homeowner's insurance. Same for renter's insurance. People who buy that are throwing their money away.

Anyway, what do you suggest a young person does if they do become seriously sick and can't pay for their medical care? Oh, I know, they can just file for bankruptcy and the rest of us will pay for it in higher insurance premiums.

My wife died at 41. Her best friend died at 34. Both had cancer, leukemia and breast cancer respectively. But they didn't need insurance because young people don't get sick. And yea, I know plenty of even younger people who need and use their health insurance.

 

[The T]

Spoken like a true Obama drone

Think for yourself much?

-Geaux

*Emphatically NO* Joey is a talking points Commie dupe. NO WAY he was ever a Conservative, much less Republican as he claims. He's a poseur as others like Fakey Starkey.

Because you've been with me every step of my 51 years on Earth, and know exactly what my life is?

Joey? I've been around for TWO MORE than YOU and YOU still haven't got a lick of common sense that I can ascertain...and you never will. YOU are a dupe and an enemy to yourself and your own liberty not to mention hundreds of millions of your fellow Americans.

Learn it, Live it, KNOW IT.

 

[bripat9643]

It may be a bit long winded but still. I do believe this law is and will be the death of Obama's presidency. For the remaining years to come, he will be haunted by the lies he told and the promises he broke.

I just wish it was the death of the Democrat party. If it gets repealed, the dims will never get another chance to put a similar scheme over on the American public. Millions of people are out right now scrapping the Obama bumper stickers of their cars.

 

[bripat9643]

Oh, I wouldn't get your jockey straps hiked up too high, after all GHW Bush survived "Read my lips, no new taxes".

No he didn't.

 

[TemplarKormac]

It may be a bit long winded but still. I do believe this law is and will be the death of Obama's presidency. For the remaining years to come, he will be haunted by the lies he told and the promises he broke.

Until people actually check out their exchange and find out they can get the same or better coverage for the same price or even save some money. Supposedly 5 million people have received cancellation notices, according to Fox News. 1.5 million have registered on the health exchanges, most all before the 5 million received their cancellation notices. This tells us one important fact; those who have received cancellations have not even checked out their exchange to see what is now available for them. Once they do check out their exchange, a lot of them are going to be in for a big surprise when they start to understand that they are getting a better policy for the same amount or less, and some will even be eligible for a subsidy that will further reduce how much it is going to cost them.

Now, there will be those who do end up paying more. The way it is set up is not perfect for everyone, but the fact is that more are going to benefit than be screwed. And I'm not talking out my ass here. I am one of those who is losing my insurance come the end of the year. I got my cancellation notice, and I've found a plan I am going to be very happy with. It is just slightly cheaper than what I had, and the benefits are comparable to what I had, and that is with no subsidy.

Gee, Auditor...what I'm seeing is higher premiums pretty much across the board for people going on the exchanges without getting subsidies. I checked mine out and the comparable plan on the exchange here in Florida is about 25% higher for me. Where are you at that your premiums went down?

He would have to live in one of these states to see any drop in premium:

Colorado
New Jersey
New York
Ohio
Rhode Island

 

[The T]

*Emphatically NO* Joey is a talking points Commie dupe. NO WAY he was ever a Conservative, much less Republican as he claims. He's a poseur as others like Fakey Starkey.

Because you've been with me every step of my 51 years on Earth, and know exactly what my life is?

Wow. You're 51 years old? Doesn't it bother you to get routinely pounded by a 26 year old? You should be. Someone my age normally wouldn't catch how utterly deceptive and dishonest you are. But I do and have. To be as gullible as you are at that age is pathetic. How can you defend a law that is inherently flawed? How do you continue plodding on in defense of Obama even after he has been undone by his own hand?

I'm genuinely shocked.

Shocked? LOL! Dripping with sarcasm I suspect...

 

[bripat9643]

Obabble said he 'was not informed directly" that the website was in trouble before the launch...so I guess he was informed indirectly?? How does that work when youre the CINC???

I think the players involved thought the impact of canceled policies was going to be too small to matter, or else they were fearful of the blowback.....Or, the insurance companies themselves lied to Obama about the cancellations.

Hmmmmm...A insurance company lying about it's policies....what a concept......

No, that's not a "concept." It's fraud, and it's illegal. Unlike the President and every POS libturd in this forum, Insurance companies cannot lie about their policies.

Libturds think everyone lies because they know they are all no-good POS liars.

But I seriously doubt a guy who has been on the defense for 5 years would set himself up like this.

Obama on "defense?" Surely you jest.

 

[The T]

Oh, I wouldn't get your jockey straps hiked up too high, after all GHW Bush survived "Read my lips, no new taxes".

No he didn't.

he got roundly pounded for that statement...notice he hasn't been back?

 

[Oldstyle]

Auditor's location says Toledo, Ohio which tells me that he's full of Grade A horse manure if he's claiming his premiums went down. The Society of Actuaries projected increases of 80% on average for Ohioans.

Gotta love the Obama apologists! They can't bring themselves to admit that this thing is DOA.

 

[bripat9643]

Oh, I wouldn't get your jockey straps hiked up too high, after all GHW Bush survived "Read my lips, no new taxes".

No he didn't. He was a one term president. He lost his re-election campaign because he broke that promise. Please educate yourself on history. That is a prime example of what happens when people figure out they've been lied to.

I didn't say he was a two-term president. He lost to Clinton because of the unsuccessful Gulf War in 1991.

ROFL! "Unsuccessful?" After GW I, Bush's favorability rating was 90%

 

[auditor0007]

Until people actually check out their exchange and find out they can get the same or better coverage for the same price or even save some money. Supposedly 5 million people have received cancellation notices, according to Fox News. 1.5 million have registered on the health exchanges, most all before the 5 million received their cancellation notices. This tells us one important fact; those who have received cancellations have not even checked out their exchange to see what is now available for them. Once they do check out their exchange, a lot of them are going to be in for a big surprise when they start to understand that they are getting a better policy for the same amount or less, and some will even be eligible for a subsidy that will further reduce how much it is going to cost them.

Now, there will be those who do end up paying more. The way it is set up is not perfect for everyone, but the fact is that more are going to benefit than be screwed. And I'm not talking out my ass here. I am one of those who is losing my insurance come the end of the year. I got my cancellation notice, and I've found a plan I am going to be very happy with. It is just slightly cheaper than what I had, and the benefits are comparable to what I had, and that is with no subsidy.

Gee, Auditor...what I'm seeing is higher premiums pretty much across the board for people going on the exchanges without getting subsidies. I checked mine out and the comparable plan on the exchange here in Florida is about 25% higher for me. Where are you at that your premiums went down?

He would have to live in one of these states to see any drop in premium:

Colorado
New Jersey
New York
Ohio
Rhode Island

I live in Ohio. I do know that for those over 60, the plans tend to be more expensive. Your age will have a big impact on the final numbers. Younger people are getting pretty good deals. We seem to forget that if you get your insurance through a company, age doesn't come into play because companies get their insurance rated based on the average age of all the employees at the company. This means that they young 25 year old pays the same as the 63 year old. Employees don't really see that because the employer is paying the bulk of the premium to begin with. Personally, I think the exchanges should have been rated on a much less progressive scale where older people only paid up to two times as much as younger people rather than up to three times, and that three times is questionable because from what I've seen, a lot of plans for those 60 and above seem to be much more than three times the premium than for those in their twenties.

 

[TemplarKormac]

It may be a bit long winded but still. I do believe this law is and will be the death of Obama's presidency. For the remaining years to come, he will be haunted by the lies he told and the promises he broke.

Or not.

Actually, he kind of outsmarted Big Insurance. "OH, gosh, you can keep your policy if Big Insurance will give it to you!"

And the thing is, Big Insurance used ObamaCare as an excuse to dump all the people who were too old and too sick to make a profit off of.

So now, when the insurance companies don't renew those policies anyway, those folks will end up going to the exchanges and finding out, "Geez, I never realized how badly they were ripping me off!"

Joe, he didn't outsmart anyone, except maybe you. He had you thinking for five years that this law was going to be a boon for the uninsured. You and 64 million others were taken for the ride of your life, only to be dumped into a fiery pit of reality.

 

[Oldstyle]

Gee, Auditor...what I'm seeing is higher premiums pretty much across the board for people going on the exchanges without getting subsidies. I checked mine out and the comparable plan on the exchange here in Florida is about 25% higher for me. Where are you at that your premiums went down?

He would have to live in one of these states to see any drop in premium:

Colorado
New Jersey
New York
Ohio
Rhode Island

Ohio

How did YOUR premiums go down, Auditor when everyone else seems to have had theirs go up in Ohio?

 

[The T]

It may be a bit long winded but still. I do believe this law is and will be the death of Obama's presidency. For the remaining years to come, he will be haunted by the lies he told and the promises he broke.

Or not.

Actually, he kind of outsmarted Big Insurance. "OH, gosh, you can keep your policy if Big Insurance will give it to you!"

And the thing is, Big Insurance used ObamaCare as an excuse to dump all the people who were too old and too sick to make a profit off of.

So now, when the insurance companies don't renew those policies anyway, those folks will end up going to the exchanges and finding out, "Geez, I never realized how badly they were ripping me off!"

Joe, he didn't outsmart anyone, except maybe you. He had you thinking for five years that this law was going to be a boon for the uninsured. You and 64 million others were taken for the ride of your life, only to be dumped into a fiery pit of reality.

Only one thing I would change TK? Willingly duped into reality...and now that reality is setting in...and the Dems are now going to reap their reward come next year. there is NO escape for any of them.

 

[TemplarKormac]

Gee, Auditor...what I'm seeing is higher premiums pretty much across the board for people going on the exchanges without getting subsidies. I checked mine out and the comparable plan on the exchange here in Florida is about 25% higher for me. Where are you at that your premiums went down?

He would have to live in one of these states to see any drop in premium:

Colorado
New Jersey
New York
Ohio
Rhode Island

Ohio

There you have it. But 45 other states didn't see drops. While I'm happy that it at least worked for you, you may want to remain on your toes. This law is in serious danger of collapsing. If you're on a government sponsored insurance plan when it does, you'll lose that too.

In my state, premiums have jumped almost 170%. I would be paying an arm and a leg for even the most basic form of insurance under Obamacare.

 

[Quantum Windbag]

A gesture that refocuses the problem where it belongs- on the insurance companies.

Obama didn't cancel ONE policy. Not one.

Cigna and United Health Care and Blue Cross and Blue Sheild did.

Because they could no longer pretend that these policies really were anything more than paying your money for wishful thinking.

Tell you what, show me the part of the law that allows Obama to hand out retroactive waivers and I will admit you are right about everything, and switch my support fully behind Obamacare.

What will you do if you are wrong?

The salient links are,

The Act;

http://www.gpo.gov/fdsys/pkg/PLAW-111publ148/html/PLAW-111publ148.htm



The subsequent regulations;

http://www.gpo.gov/fdsys/pkg/FR-2012-02-15/pdf/2012-3547.pdf

They won't help, him.

 

[bripat9643]

The Republicans hated Obama from the first day and were determined to destroy his Presidency. Their goal was to filibuster and obstruct this rookie into the ground. Bush had no problem nominating judges or getting all the funding he needed for Iraq, even after it became unpopular. Obama on the other hand has faced more filibusters than the last 3 presidents combined, and they refuse to let him undertake basic court nominations even with center right candidates.

Any Republican who supports any piece of Obama's legislation - even if that legislation was first proposed by a republican - is threatened with a primary challenge. Any Republican that does anything to let Obama govern is called a traitor.

The republicans are at war with the democrats. They believe their country has been stolen and destroying Obama is their way of taking it back.

They can't have a repeat of the Clinton years where the economy thrived under a democrat. They are having trouble winning the presidency and in danger of only being an obstructionist party that only serves the wealthy elite. If they fail to destroy ObamaCare and tif they fail to destroy he Obama economy, than Hillary will win in 2016. Destroying Obama is literally a matter of survival. It is non- negotiable.

oh.

Another variation of "it's all BOOOOOOOOOOOOOOSH's fault!"

 

[Quantum Windbag]

It may be a bit long winded but still. I do believe this law is and will be the death of Obama's presidency. For the remaining years to come, he will be haunted by the lies he told and the promises he broke.

Until people actually check out their exchange and find out they can get the same or better coverage for the same price or even save some money. Supposedly 5 million people have received cancellation notices, according to Fox News. 1.5 million have registered on the health exchanges, most all before the 5 million received their cancellation notices. This tells us one important fact; those who have received cancellations have not even checked out their exchange to see what is now available for them. Once they do check out their exchange, a lot of them are going to be in for a big surprise when they start to understand that they are getting a better policy for the same amount or less, and some will even be eligible for a subsidy that will further reduce how much it is going to cost them.

Now, there will be those who do end up paying more. The way it is set up is not perfect for everyone, but the fact is that more are going to benefit than be screwed. And I'm not talking out my ass here. I am one of those who is losing my insurance come the end of the year. I got my cancellation notice, and I've found a plan I am going to be very happy with. It is just slightly cheaper than what I had, and the benefits are comparable to what I had, and that is with no subsidy.

No one is getting better coverage for the same, or a lower, price.

 

[The T]

He would have to live in one of these states to see any drop in premium:

Colorado
New Jersey
New York
Ohio
Rhode Island

Ohio

There you have it. But 45 other states didn't see drops. While I'm happy that it at least worked for you, you may want to remain on your toes. This law is in serious danger of collapsing. If you're on a government sponsored insurance plan when it does, you'll lose that too.

In my state, premiums have jumped almost 170%. I would be paying an arm and a leg for even the most basic form of insurance under Obamacare.

Not much different here in Florida. And good luck getting back what you had. Delayed one year? really?

Only sensible course of action is to trash this abomination of a law.

 

[JoeB131]

[

1) Allow people the choice of what insurance they want.
2) See 1
3) See 1
4) Eliminate cancellations based on preexisting conditions
5) Give tax credits to doctors who perform care for the indigent

Okay.

So long as when people get the insurance they want, the Insurance companies can't come back and cheat them later.

Oh. Wait. That was the problem.

They WERE cheating their customers.

They were calling acne pre-existing cancerous conditions and liver transplants "expiramental surgery"

Get it?

This was the problem that ACA was meant to address. Not just the 46 million who couldn't get insurance, but the folks who thought they had perfectly good insurance until they actually got sick and found out, not so much.

No. I don't get it.

You're just bent on arguing, Joe. You can't get it through that thick skull of yours that the ACA has failed miserably. There are parts of the ACA with merit, but the law as a whole was a sham. This is the case where the sum of the parts were greater than the whole.

Now are we going to spout rhetoric and talking points like a mindless automaton, or will you actually make a cogent point, Joe?

That you are incapable or unwilling to understand the points I've made isn't my problem, guy.

It is unacepptable that we have 46 million uninsured and 25 million underinsured.

It is unacceptable that 62% of personal bankruptcies are because someone in the family got sick.

It is unacceptable that we spend more than any nation in the world in terms of real dollars, per capita or as a percentage of GDP, and yet get the worst overall results in the advanced world.

These might be talking points to you, but in my universe, they are really problems.

The ACA has tried to fix these problems. It HAS fixed some of them. Six million people who didn't have insurance now do. Medical inflation has slowed to its lowest rate in 30 years.

When I see something struggle, I wonder why it is struggling, and who is trying to do so.

And frankly, I see a lot of interests with too much money and not enough decency.