The free market at work in Houston

[Dim Bulb]

But constitutional lawyers will tell you that there is no right to money.

I'm sorry, that's simply not true. Money IS property. You have an inalienable right to your property in this country.

I'm afraid there is no constitutional right to not be price gouged. Which means that your theoretical balance between free market and constitutional rights doesn't really apply.

Well it depends on what you consider "price gouging." I explained two different scenarios above. One involving hotel rooms during the eclipse and the other regarding bottled water during the hurricane. One is price gouging, the other is not. I explained the nuance between the two and you want to call it "theory" instead of trying to understand what I said.

We are supporting free market interference because it "feels" like the right result.

My argument has nothing to do with feelings. Interfering with exploitation is not interfering with free markets. It's actually protecting honest free markets. Free market depends on honest and fair voluntary transaction between parties. If it's dishonest, unfair and involuntary, it cannot be free market. This works both for the supplier and consumer.

No disrespect. Your argument is not unintillectual, but incorrect. You have no inalienable right to property in the constitution. You do have a right to not be deprived of your property without due process. Property rights are a complex web of state laws and due process rights.

I feel your need to have an intellectual construct to explain why you are really still a free marketer. I get it because I'm there too. But in this case it's all about feelings. The constitutional argument won't hunt.

"Honest free markets" are fair. Who decides what's fair?

 

[OnePercenter]

1. Fact: There is NO free market, never has been, never will be. Those that promote a free market are deluded by fallacy.

2. Price gouging is a crime. If you price gouge, you are a criminal.

3. If you charge somebody to park on your property, and said property isn't zoned correctly, and the property isn't licensed and insured for business use, you are committing a criminal act.

 

[Boss]

No disrespect. Your argument is not unintillectual, but incorrect. You have no inalienable right to property in the constitution. You do have a right to not be deprived of your property without due process. Property rights are a complex web of state laws and due process rights.

I feel your need to have an intellectual construct to explain why you are really still a free marketer. I get it because I'm there too. But in this case it's all about feelings. The constitutional argument won't hunt.

"Honest free markets" are fair. Who decides what's fair?

I'm sorry but you're wrong about private property rights. You certainly do have constitutional rights to property protected by the constitution. It's one of our cornerstone principles. No right is purely absolute... even the right to life. There are circumstances where any of your rights might be revoked.

Again, this has nothing to do with my feelings and everything to do with exploitation and the government's responsibility to protect it's citizenry.

What's fair? In a free market transaction, what is fair is determined by the supplier and consumer based on supply and demand in the prevailing marketplace. If the exchange is voluntary, the exchange is fair. With the disaster you have an unintended consequence which is not the fault of the supplier or consumer. Just as it is exploitation to charge the consumer $99 for bottled water, it is also exploitation for the consumer to demand free bottled water from the supplier. Neither exploitation is practicing of honest free market capitalism.

So we see that there must be some remedy here. It's not based on feelings but rather conditions. Our system is designed to mitigate this dilemma. This is where the government is empowered to step in and protect both the supplier and consumer from undue exploitation or exploitation of the free market system. This actually protects the integrity of the system itself.

 

[Boss]

1. Fact: There is NO free market, never has been, never will be. Those that promote a free market are deluded by fallacy.

2. Price gouging is a crime. If you price gouge, you are a criminal.

3. If you charge somebody to park on your property, and said property isn't zoned correctly, and the property isn't licensed and insured for business use, you are committing a criminal act.

Fact: You're a fucking Communist.

Dismissed!

 

[Dim Bulb]

No disrespect. Your argument is not unintillectual, but incorrect. You have no inalienable right to property in the constitution. You do have a right to not be deprived of your property without due process. Property rights are a complex web of state laws and due process rights.

I feel your need to have an intellectual construct to explain why you are really still a free marketer. I get it because I'm there too. But in this case it's all about feelings. The constitutional argument won't hunt.

"Honest free markets" are fair. Who decides what's fair?

I'm sorry but you're wrong about private property rights. You certainly do have constitutional rights to property protected by the constitution. It's one of our cornerstone principles. No right is purely absolute... even the right to life. There are circumstances where any of your rights might be revoked.

Again, this has nothing to do with my feelings and everything to do with exploitation and the government's responsibility to protect it's citizenry.

What's fair? In a free market transaction, what is fair is determined by the supplier and consumer based on supply and demand in the prevailing marketplace. If the exchange is voluntary, the exchange is fair. With the disaster you have an unintended consequence which is not the fault of the supplier or consumer. Just as it is exploitation to charge the consumer $99 for bottled water, it is also exploitation for the consumer to demand free bottled water from the supplier. Neither exploitation is practicing of honest free market capitalism.

So we see that there must be some remedy here. It's not based on feelings but rather conditions. Our system is designed to mitigate this dilemma. This is where the government is empowered to step in and protect both the supplier and consumer from undue exploitation or exploitation of the free market system. This actually protects the integrity of the system itself.

Nope. You have no constitutional property right other than to not be deprived of your property without due process.

 

[Boss]

Nope. You have no constitutional property right other than to not be deprived of your property without due process.

Right... which IS your right to private property.

 

[Missouri_Mike]

Hey, price gouging is gonna happen ANY time that people think they can get away with it.

Went up to Alliance NE to watch the eclipse, and stopped off in a town that was about 100 miles away. Not only were there zero hotel rooms in the entire town, ,but the guy at the one I stopped at told me that even if I had showed up and there was a cancellation, the room would still run me 450 for one night. In Alliance , the motels were running 1,000 per night the night before the eclipse, and in Cheyanne they were getting up to 3,000 for the night before the eclipse.

The next day, I saw people paying farmers 20 to 50 dollars for about 3 hours worth of parking in a field with no facilities.

Nope, people will price gouge whenever they think they can get away with it.

Price gouging stupid tourists is a-okay.

Price gouging people who've been through hell and are in a disaster area for needed essentials like clean drinking water is as abhorrent an act as you could possibly engage in.

So I'm sitting at home watching a hurricane bear down on my town and I go purchase some food supplies and bottled water. My neighbor doesn't do that. The hurricane hits and he needs food and water. What should the price be for me to sell him some items?

 

[ColonelAngus]

Hey, price gouging is gonna happen ANY time that people think they can get away with it.

Went up to Alliance NE to watch the eclipse, and stopped off in a town that was about 100 miles away. Not only were there zero hotel rooms in the entire town, ,but the guy at the one I stopped at told me that even if I had showed up and there was a cancellation, the room would still run me 450 for one night. In Alliance , the motels were running 1,000 per night the night before the eclipse, and in Cheyanne they were getting up to 3,000 for the night before the eclipse.

The next day, I saw people paying farmers 20 to 50 dollars for about 3 hours worth of parking in a field with no facilities.

Nope, people will price gouge whenever they think they can get away with it.

I was there! We parked along the railroad track on the way into town. We drove from Denver.

Great place to see the eclipse.

 

[OnePercenter]

1. Fact: There is NO free market, never has been, never will be. Those that promote a free market are deluded by fallacy.

2. Price gouging is a crime. If you price gouge, you are a criminal.

3. If you charge somebody to park on your property, and said property isn't zoned correctly, and the property isn't licensed and insured for business use, you are committing a criminal act.

Fact: You're a fucking Communist.

Dismissed!

That's an ignorant childish comment.

If you want to answer like an adult, you should.

 

[OnePercenter]

Hey, price gouging is gonna happen ANY time that people think they can get away with it.

Went up to Alliance NE to watch the eclipse, and stopped off in a town that was about 100 miles away. Not only were there zero hotel rooms in the entire town, ,but the guy at the one I stopped at told me that even if I had showed up and there was a cancellation, the room would still run me 450 for one night. In Alliance , the motels were running 1,000 per night the night before the eclipse, and in Cheyanne they were getting up to 3,000 for the night before the eclipse.

The next day, I saw people paying farmers 20 to 50 dollars for about 3 hours worth of parking in a field with no facilities.

Nope, people will price gouge whenever they think they can get away with it.

Price gouging stupid tourists is a-okay.

Price gouging people who've been through hell and are in a disaster area for needed essentials like clean drinking water is as abhorrent an act as you could possibly engage in.

So I'm sitting at home watching a hurricane bear down on my town and I go purchase some food supplies and bottled water. My neighbor doesn't do that. The hurricane hits and he needs food and water. What should the price be for me to sell him some items?

Price gouging during an emergency would be the 'neighborly' thing to do.

 

[Dim Bulb]

Nope. You have no constitutional property right other than to not be deprived of your property without due process.

Right... which IS your right to private property.

Right. Which is a mile away from an "inalienable right" that you first mentioned. So we agree.

 

[Missouri_Mike]

Hey, price gouging is gonna happen ANY time that people think they can get away with it.

Went up to Alliance NE to watch the eclipse, and stopped off in a town that was about 100 miles away. Not only were there zero hotel rooms in the entire town, ,but the guy at the one I stopped at told me that even if I had showed up and there was a cancellation, the room would still run me 450 for one night. In Alliance , the motels were running 1,000 per night the night before the eclipse, and in Cheyanne they were getting up to 3,000 for the night before the eclipse.

The next day, I saw people paying farmers 20 to 50 dollars for about 3 hours worth of parking in a field with no facilities.

Nope, people will price gouge whenever they think they can get away with it.

Price gouging stupid tourists is a-okay.

Price gouging people who've been through hell and are in a disaster area for needed essentials like clean drinking water is as abhorrent an act as you could possibly engage in.

So I'm sitting at home watching a hurricane bear down on my town and I go purchase some food supplies and bottled water. My neighbor doesn't do that. The hurricane hits and he needs food and water. What should the price be for me to sell him some items?

Price gouging during an emergency would be the 'neighborly' thing to do.

Who cares about neighborly, maybe his dog barked all night and he was a dick. The point is that in a market you need a product to sell and a buyer who doesn't have that product but needs or wants it. The circumstances of that need or want don't mean much. You're preferring charity over business. Which can be noble but only if it comes from you not forced on others.

So to answer my question. At what price do I sell food and water to people who didn't prepare ahead of time?

 

[OnePercenter]

Hey, price gouging is gonna happen ANY time that people think they can get away with it.

Went up to Alliance NE to watch the eclipse, and stopped off in a town that was about 100 miles away. Not only were there zero hotel rooms in the entire town, ,but the guy at the one I stopped at told me that even if I had showed up and there was a cancellation, the room would still run me 450 for one night. In Alliance , the motels were running 1,000 per night the night before the eclipse, and in Cheyanne they were getting up to 3,000 for the night before the eclipse.

The next day, I saw people paying farmers 20 to 50 dollars for about 3 hours worth of parking in a field with no facilities.

Nope, people will price gouge whenever they think they can get away with it.

Price gouging stupid tourists is a-okay.

Price gouging people who've been through hell and are in a disaster area for needed essentials like clean drinking water is as abhorrent an act as you could possibly engage in.

So I'm sitting at home watching a hurricane bear down on my town and I go purchase some food supplies and bottled water. My neighbor doesn't do that. The hurricane hits and he needs food and water. What should the price be for me to sell him some items?

Price gouging during an emergency would be the 'neighborly' thing to do.

Who cares about neighborly, maybe his dog barked all night and he was a dick. The point is that in a market you need a product to sell and a buyer who doesn't have that product but needs or wants it. The circumstances of that need or want don't mean much. You're preferring charity over business. Which can be noble but only if it comes from you not forced on others.

So to answer my question. At what price do I sell food and water to people who didn't prepare ahead of time?

Price gouging during an emergency is a criminal act. Why would you want to commit an illegal act, other then running to church and being absolved.

 

[OnePercenter]

Nope. You have no constitutional property right other than to not be deprived of your property without due process.

Right... which IS your right to private property.

Right. Which is a mile away from an "inalienable right" that you first mentioned. So we agree.

You have to give Boss some room. He's a Libertarian, and as well all know; Libertarianism Makes You Stupid

 

[Dim Bulb]

Nope. You have no constitutional property right other than to not be deprived of your property without due process.

Right... which IS your right to private property.

Right. Which is a mile away from an "inalienable right" that you first mentioned. So we agree.

You have to give Boss some room. He's a Libertarian, and as well all know; Libertarianism Makes You Stupid

I've found in life that you get a lot of mileage out of "hmm, I didn't know that." At least I do. There's a ton of things that I don't know squat about. Constitutional law isn't one of them.

 

[sartre play]

Give it any name you like, its still not a nice thing to do. will it happen any way count on it 100%.

 

[OnePercenter]

Nope. You have no constitutional property right other than to not be deprived of your property without due process.

Right... which IS your right to private property.

Right. Which is a mile away from an "inalienable right" that you first mentioned. So we agree.

You have to give Boss some room. He's a Libertarian, and as well all know; Libertarianism Makes You Stupid

I've found in life that you get a lot of mileage out of "hmm, I didn't know that." At least I do. There's a ton of things that I don't know squat about. Constitutional law isn't one of them.

The constitutional scofflaws like Boss are trying to justify using taxpayer financed services for free. He thinks he's Apple Corp.

 

[Toddsterpatriot]

Laws of supply and demand work......even if politicians are too dumb to realize it.

Of course they work...for the 1%.

They work for everyone. Even for stupid people.

 

[Missouri_Mike]

Hey, price gouging is gonna happen ANY time that people think they can get away with it.

Went up to Alliance NE to watch the eclipse, and stopped off in a town that was about 100 miles away. Not only were there zero hotel rooms in the entire town, ,but the guy at the one I stopped at told me that even if I had showed up and there was a cancellation, the room would still run me 450 for one night. In Alliance , the motels were running 1,000 per night the night before the eclipse, and in Cheyanne they were getting up to 3,000 for the night before the eclipse.

The next day, I saw people paying farmers 20 to 50 dollars for about 3 hours worth of parking in a field with no facilities.

Nope, people will price gouge whenever they think they can get away with it.

Price gouging stupid tourists is a-okay.

Price gouging people who've been through hell and are in a disaster area for needed essentials like clean drinking water is as abhorrent an act as you could possibly engage in.

So I'm sitting at home watching a hurricane bear down on my town and I go purchase some food supplies and bottled water. My neighbor doesn't do that. The hurricane hits and he needs food and water. What should the price be for me to sell him some items?

Price gouging during an emergency would be the 'neighborly' thing to do.

Who cares about neighborly, maybe his dog barked all night and he was a dick. The point is that in a market you need a product to sell and a buyer who doesn't have that product but needs or wants it. The circumstances of that need or want don't mean much. You're preferring charity over business. Which can be noble but only if it comes from you not forced on others.

So to answer my question. At what price do I sell food and water to people who didn't prepare ahead of time?

Price gouging during an emergency is a criminal act. Why would you want to commit an illegal act, other then running to church and being absolved.

It's obvious you're cornered. So setting aside your feelings for a moment can you tell me what the legal definition of price gouging is? Or is it one of liberal constructs of I don't like that price so it must be price gouging?

 

[Missouri_Mike]

Nope. You have no constitutional property right other than to not be deprived of your property without due process.

Right... which IS your right to private property.

Right. Which is a mile away from an "inalienable right" that you first mentioned. So we agree.

You have to give Boss some room. He's a Libertarian, and as well all know; Libertarianism Makes You Stupid

I've found in life that you get a lot of mileage out of "hmm, I didn't know that." At least I do. There's a ton of things that I don't know squat about. Constitutional law isn't one of them.

The constitutional scofflaws like Boss are trying to justify using taxpayer financed services for free. He thinks he's Apple Corp.

How are tax paid government services free? Didn't you already pay for them through taxes?