The Imaginary Greatness of FDR

[Oddball]

John Kenneth Galbraith, is that you?

 

[8537]

John Kenneth Galbraith, is that you?

Very well-presented rebuttal. Thank you for displaying your depth of understanding.

 

[Oddball]

Since you've already discounted UCLA economists and those at the Mackinac Center, with nothing more substantive than the back-handed haughty little "if anyone actually knows what they are talking about" comment, what sort of substantive rebuttal do you believe you deserved?

 

[8537]

Since you've already discounted UCLA economists and those at the Mackinac Center,

I've dismissed the people who rely - repeatedly - on those two sources and are never able to answer the question:

If the new deal was a failure, why did bank failures go from 3000 to 7, why did we experience record, broad-based growth across almost all sectors, why did unemployment fall by almost 40% and why did a similar program of fiscal stimulus writ large eventualy drive unemployment so low?

with nothing more substantive than the back-handed haughty little "if anyone actually knows what they are talking about" comment, what sort of substantive rebuttal do you believe you deserved?

I don't know. Perhaps you could give it a try.

 

[Oddball]

You can prove anything you want with statistics, especially those you specifically cherry pick to "prove" whatever point you think you're proving. There are a boatload of other stats out there, which show the depression was a double-dip and that FDR's programs very probably exacerbated the problem.

You get what you give. And to this point, your nothing is getting all the consideration it deserves.

 

[Gadawg73]

Find someone in your family that was alive in the 20s and ask them what they think it accomplished.
Most are dead but you will find NONE of them that would claim it accomplished nothing.
Modern day poser "conservatives" are stupid.

 

[8537]

You can prove anything you want with statistics, especially those you specifically cherry pick to "prove" whatever point you think you're proving.

I'm not sure one can consider GDP, Employent and Investment spending "cherry picking". Inf fact, they are pretty much three of most critical measures.

There are a boatload of other stats out there, which show the depression was a double-dip and that FDR's programs very probably exacerbated the problem.

Why don't you show us some of those stats?

You get what you give. And to this point, your nothing is getting all the consideration it deserves.

If you have nothing to offer in terms of actual information, you aren't obliged to respond.

 

[Oddball]

Find someone in your family that was alive in the 20s and ask them what they think it accomplished.
Most are dead but you will find NONE of them that would claim it accomplished nothing.
Modern day poser "conservatives" are stupid.

My grandparents operated a farm near LaCrosse, WI at the time...FDR's stupid programs both confiscated all their gold savings and ran them off the farm, after their crops were purposefully destroyed by his idiotic Ag Department toadies.

If those are "accomplishments" worth crowing about, you can have them, pal.

 

[johnrocks]

Find someone in your family that was alive in the 20s and ask them what they think it accomplished.
Most are dead but you will find NONE of them that would claim it accomplished nothing.
Modern day poser "conservatives" are stupid.

My grandparents operated a farm near LaCrosse, WI at the time...FDR's stupid programs both confiscated all their gold savings and ran them off the farm after their crops wer purposefully destroyed by his idiotic Ag Department toadies.

If those are "accomplishments" you can have them, pal.

My Mom is 89 and was raised on a farm, said that they did not even realize there was a Depression until they moved to town during the war they were so far back in the sticks

 

[newpolitics]

What was it the New Deal was supposed to accomplish?

It wasn't supposed to accomplish anything. It was an effort to make things better. You can't FIX a depression. That's ridiculous. I could point to so much shit republican leaders have done, but I am not going to back track almost a century simply to slander the other side. You're really pathetic dude.

Q: What was it the New Deal was supposed to accomplish?

It wasn't supposed to accomplish anything.

BWAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA!



That is some of the dumbest but funniest shit I have seen here in a while, and that's saying a great deal!

It is HI-fucking-LARIOUS!

The "great" FDR promised a "New Deal" but it wasn't intended to accomplish anything!

That is the classic lib defense of FDR and his socialism! It is the funniest political commentary I have EVER seen!



My fucking sides are aching from laughter.

Holy shit.

SNORT!

I am sincerely glad that you had such a good laugh at what I wrote. That was not my intention, and had you tried to understand why I wrote what I did, you might not be laughing so hard. In fact, you might realize, the joke is on you my friend.

Perhaps it was a poor choice of words to have said "It was not supposed to accomplish anything", and perhaps I deserve to have gotten laughed at for it. Fair enough, but try to at least hear me out before typing out a poster-sized reply and enlarging my quote as some elementary school-level way of trying to make a mockery of my name. If anything, it only is testament to your maturity level, and by that I mean it is extraordinarilty low for one who is trying to participate on a political forum, where we discuss very serious and mature-minded things. Perhaps you shouldn't be here. Perhaps you should join a gamers board or something so you can tell somebody they got "PWNED!."

You actually exemplify my point quite well: You seem as one who is quite intellectually incapable and incurious, so, in looking back on the Great Depression, you might see FDR as having failed due to the New Deal not succeeding in terms numbers as you thought they should have. Being as you weren't even close to alive when it happened, that is all you have to go on. You're desire to discount any liberal is your downfall. You are not taking into account intangible leadership qualities that may very well hold together a population when it simply needs someone to look up to during a time of great struggle, as we all would. What I was getting at, is that these people who designed, drafted, and signed the New Deal, tried, to the best of their knowledge, to fix this problem. They couldn't predict the future. I don't think you can FIX a depression with one signed document and the ensuing action taken in its accordance. That is absurd, and is what you insinuate when you insult them for it not having worked, as you see it. I disagree, and others as well have shown you on this board how in many ways, the New Deal did help this country a great deal. Yet, you as a hard-headed conservative, would never admit that even to yourself. You only continue to fight and complain about liberalism. Like I say to so many cons on this site: Grow up. Get a perspective. Try not to be so one-sided. Peace...

 

[newpolitics]

You can prove anything you want with statistics, especially those you specifically cherry pick to "prove" whatever point you think you're proving. There are a boatload of other stats out there, which show the depression was a double-dip and that FDR's programs very probably exacerbated the problem.

You get what you give. And to this point, your nothing is getting all the consideration it deserves.

The main contention of the initial posting for this thread was based on a statistic, so what you are saying here to try and insult this person goes the same for you. Nice job

 

[Oddball]

Stuff it.

There are plenty of scholarly and credible works, from people a lot smarter than you or I, who've concluded that the aw Deal was a total disaster that did far more harm than the good for which it has been given credit.

Funny how Keynesian fundamentalists always have their eyes on externalities, except when it comes to those of their know-it-all Utopian economic intrusions.

 

[8537]

Stuff it.

There are plenty of scholarly and credible works, from people a lot smarter than you or I, who've concluded that the aw Deal was a total disaster that did far more harm than the good for which it has been given credit.

Yet when asked for information about those, you come up cold. No data. Nothing. And When presented with employment, GDP and investment you claim I'm "cherry picking" yet offer no other suggestions for more relevant data.

Funny how Keynesian fundamentalists always have their eyes on externalities, except when it comes to those of their know-it-all Utopian economic intrusions.

1. Can you describe a Keynesian fundamentalist?
2. What do "Keynesian fundamentalist" believe about externalities that neoclassical economists don't?

 

[Oddball]

What would you accept?

 

[newpolitics]

Stuff it.

There are plenty of scholarly and credible works, from people a lot smarter than you or I, who've concluded that the aw Deal was a total disaster that did far more harm than the good for which it has been given credit.

Funny how Keynesian fundamentalists always have their eyes on externalities, except when it comes to those of their know-it-all Utopian economic intrusions.

I'm just going on what you said bro. You seem to have a lot of shit to say, and are always trying to insult people and be some righteous crusader of conservatism. This time, you did it to yourself. Just let this one go.

 

[Liability]

It wasn't supposed to accomplish anything. It was an effort to make things better. You can't FIX a depression. That's ridiculous. I could point to so much shit republican leaders have done, but I am not going to back track almost a century simply to slander the other side. You're really pathetic dude.

Q: What was it the New Deal was supposed to accomplish?

It wasn't supposed to accomplish anything.

BWAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA!



That is some of the dumbest but funniest shit I have seen here in a while, and that's saying a great deal!

It is HI-fucking-LARIOUS!

The "great" FDR promised a "New Deal" but it wasn't intended to accomplish anything!

That is the classic lib defense of FDR and his socialism! It is the funniest political commentary I have EVER seen!



My fucking sides are aching from laughter.

Holy shit.

SNORT!

I am sincerely glad that you had such a good laugh at what I wrote. That was not my intention, and had you tried to understand why I wrote what I did, you might not be laughing so hard. In fact, you might realize, the joke is on you my friend.

Perhaps it was a poor choice of words to have said "It was not supposed to accomplish anything", and perhaps I deserve to have gotten laughed at for it. Fair enough, but try to at least hear me out before typing out a poster-sized reply and enlarging my quote as some elementary school-level way of trying to make a mockery of my name. If anything, it only is testament to your maturity level, and by that I mean it is extraordinarilty low for one who is trying to participate on a political forum, where we discuss very serious and mature-minded things. Perhaps you shouldn't be here. Perhaps you should join a gamers board or something so you can tell somebody they got "PWNED!."

You actually exemplify my point quite well: You seem as one who is quite intellectually incapable and incurious, so, in looking back on the Great Depression, you might see FDR as having failed due to the New Deal not succeeding in terms numbers as you thought they should have. Being as you weren't even close to alive when it happened, that is all you have to go on. You're desire to discount any liberal is your downfall. You are not taking into account intangible leadership qualities that may very well hold together a population when it simply needs someone to look up to during a time of great struggle, as we all would. What I was getting at, is that these people who designed, drafted, and signed the New Deal, tried, to the best of their knowledge, to fix this problem. They couldn't predict the future. I don't think you can FIX a depression with one signed document and the ensuing action taken in its accordance. That is absurd, and is what you insinuate when you insult them for it not having worked, as you see it. I disagree, and others as well have shown you on this board how in many ways, the New Deal did help this country a great deal. Yet, you as a hard-headed conservative, would never admit that even to yourself. You only continue to fight and complain about liberalism. Like I say to so many cons on this site: Grow up. Get a perspective. Try not to be so one-sided. Peace...

well I guess you told me, bitch.

But seriously ...

YOU said it, dipshit.

Own it.

It was very stupid.

The balance of your "point" was also quite vapid.

I will deign to educate you when time permits. But for now, be advised (since you appear to have been shielded from the knowledge): you are a dumbass and say a great deal of magnificently ridiculous stuff.

 

[Londoner]

The Great Depression ended because of the largest government spending project in history: war manufacturing for WWII. Without military Keynesianism, the US would have sunk further.

FDR made things worse with his major economic initiative, "The Economy Act" of 1933, which slashed government spending by 500 million. He should have spent like Reagan from the beginning, but he was convinced that balanced budgets were necessary.

The real legacy of FDR is the creation of the middle class and 40 years of financial stability stemming from his financial regulations. Reagan (and all the presidents after him) destroyed FDR's middle class, and they got rid of crucial financial regualtions. The result is a black hole that will take generations to repair. America is headed for another long gilded age with massive poverty surrounded by pockets of unfathomable wealth.

Concentrated wealth translates into concentrated political power -- this is the real legacy of Reagan.

For those who think the wealth on top will trickle down, don't hold your breath. That wealth would rather go to the Wall Street speculative casino, and to Washington, looking for a corrupt advantage. Little of it will reach the real economy if the Bush years are the model. America got so terribly fooled in 1980.

 

[Oddball]

More pure baloney.

WWII caused shortages, rationing, imprisonment of a large sector of the potential labor force, and an horrific loss of human lives.

Anyone who looks at WWII as an honest and credible economic stimulus seriously needs their head examined.

 

[elvis]

I still think he was better than Truman.

 

[Oddball]

Stuff it.

There are plenty of scholarly and credible works, from people a lot smarter than you or I, who've concluded that the aw Deal was a total disaster that did far more harm than the good for which it has been given credit.

Funny how Keynesian fundamentalists always have their eyes on externalities, except when it comes to those of their know-it-all Utopian economic intrusions.

I'm just going on what you said bro. You seem to have a lot of shit to say, and are always trying to insult people and be some righteous crusader of conservatism. This time, you did it to yourself. Just let this one go.

I do have a lot to say...No doubt about it.

All I did in the exchange in question was call bullshit on someone who used extremely limited criteria for the reputed "success" of FDR and the Raw Deal, while he simultaneously, and quite superciliously, dismissed sources who produced extremely well sourced and footnoted research.

Maybe you're the one who should let this one go, Skippy.