The "social contract" that doesn't exist

[NYcarbineer]

A nation is a social contract between peoples.

We agree to pay taxes, have one constitution,etc.

lol, yes, this could have been a much shorter thread if the OP understood that.

 

[bripat9643]

A nation is a social contract between peoples.

We agree to pay taxes, have one constitution,etc.

lol, yes, this could have been a much shorter thread if the OP understood that.

When did I agree to pay taxes?

 

[bripat9643]

A nation is a social contract between peoples.

We agree to pay taxes, have one constitution,etc.

When did I agree to pay taxes or obey any law issued by the gang of criminals in DC?

 

[bripat9643]

The constitution is our contract.

It's not a contract. No one now living every agreed to it.

Learn what a contract is.

 

[ScienceRocks]

The fact that you're a citizen using the services of the society you pay taxes.

 

[bripat9643]

The fact that you're a citizen using the services of the society you pay taxes.

Wrong. I am forced to pay for those services. It's not voluntary. I can't choose not to pay sales tax or income tax.

If you would read through the thread you would find that all these idiotic arguments have already been addressed.

The Constitution is in no way a contract or even a "compact," and no one living ever agreed to it. Even when it became law, only a small percentage of Americans living at the time actually consented to it.

 

[kaz]

But that's the point. It shouldn't be boiling. It shouldn't be scalding.

Use a bit of common sense. I mean, I know you guys are generally willing to throw yourselves in the middle of the road to protect big corporations, but apply a little common sense.

WTF are you talking about? Coffee is boiling water run through coffee grinds. Coffee sucks if you run warm water though coffee grinds. That is what it is ... boiling water ... coffee grinds. You seriously didn't know that? Really? How old are you? How could you possibly live in this country and not know what "coffee" is? It's not possible to protect mental simpletons like you from life dude no matter how hard you try.

Okay, guy, I know you are really trying here...

But it should not be STILL Scalding or Boiling when the customer gets it.

Seriously, what kind of retard are you?

For the record, not a coffee drinker.

Why is there steam when they make coffee? Do you know how steam is created?

So take a cup of freshly brewed coffee, hold it over your lap, and ask yourself this question. "If I dump this into my lap, is that going to do some serious damage?

If you answer "no" to that question, then seriously, stay away from stoves.

 

[Not2BSubjugated]

It's a bit more complicated than that.

To start with, the reason WHY Miller had to be decided was that effectively, "Militias" were eliminated when states created National Guards. So a redefinition of "Militias" and who could own a gun was called for.

Hense, we didn't want Al Capone and his boys owning Tommy Guns and mowing down Bugs Moran's Gang. That wasn't "A Well-Regulated Militia". It was actually, you know, Common Sense. And you had 80 years of additional decisions that saw it was common sense that cities, states and the Feds should regulate guns and who owns them.

Conversely, what Heller was is nothing near common sense. It's Scalia and the other right wingers being owned by the gun lobby.

Understanding that there was a reason why things were changed the way they were still doesn't dictate original intent.

When the constitution was written, militia was defined as every able bodied male between like, 15 and 50 (can't remember the exact number).

I stand by my position, albeit a small one.

Well, it's a stupid point.

When the constitution was written, bleeding people was still considered a valid medical technique.

The laws have to change with the times. And you don't hold a slavish view of "original intent".

Don't care what you think of the point. Yours was incorrect, I was setting it right. Apparently I did, because you haven't backed the original intent argument. I'll take that as your concession

 

[Not2BSubjugated]

A nation is a social contract between peoples.

We agree to pay taxes, have one constitution,etc.

lol, yes, this could have been a much shorter thread if the OP understood that.

IT's really not the OP that's lacking in understanding, here.

What you don't seem to understand is that agreement isn't passive. You can't truly unknowingly agree to something, either. Agreement -must- be conscious and willing. Anything else is coercion, which is what the "social contract" in any given modern society actually is.

You don't really agree to the laws and taxes. You obey and pay them to avoid punishment. Not same-same.

If you're handed a contract by a guy with a gun to your head who says sign it or else, even if you sign it you didn't really agree to anything. You were forced into some shit. That's not a real contract, that's succumbing to a threat. The government's threat is less obvious, but it's still just as real as any gangster's pistol.

However, for those of you still unconvinced, come on down to SE Portland, I'll have a couple buddies of mine rob you at gun point, and when you give them your money, I'll remind you that you actually agreed and gave them your money willingly, and that it wasn't a robbery so much as a business transaction.

 

[JoeB131]

[quot

Actually dumb-ass, Somailia is what happens when Dumbocrats get their policy. First of all, what is closer to a lawless, 3rd world, shit-hole right now - Detroit (collapsed because of Dumbocrat policy), or Dallas (flourishing because of conservative policy). Furthermore, Somalia is the result of a manicial fanatic wanting to control others (what is more Dumbocrat than that?!?). Would you like to try again junior?

Somalia is the Right Wing Wet Dream.

No Government
Crazy Religion
Lots and lots of guns.

And sorry, man, Dallas is a real shithole.

 

[JoeB131]

WTF are you talking about? Coffee is boiling water run through coffee grinds. Coffee sucks if you run warm water though coffee grinds. That is what it is ... boiling water ... coffee grinds. You seriously didn't know that? Really? How old are you? How could you possibly live in this country and not know what "coffee" is? It's not possible to protect mental simpletons like you from life dude no matter how hard you try.

Okay, guy, I know you are really trying here...

But it should not be STILL Scalding or Boiling when the customer gets it.

Seriously, what kind of retard are you?

For the record, not a coffee drinker.

Why is there steam when they make coffee? Do you know how steam is created?

So take a cup of freshly brewed coffee, hold it over your lap, and ask yourself this question. "If I dump this into my lap, is that going to do some serious damage?

If you answer "no" to that question, then seriously, stay away from stoves.

Again, it should not be boiling or scalding when the customer gets it.

Seriously, are you some kind of retard or something?

 

[NYcarbineer]

A nation is a social contract between peoples.

We agree to pay taxes, have one constitution,etc.

lol, yes, this could have been a much shorter thread if the OP understood that.

IT's really not the OP that's lacking in understanding, here.

What you don't seem to understand is that agreement isn't passive. You can't truly unknowingly agree to something, either. Agreement -must- be conscious and willing. Anything else is coercion, which is what the "social contract" in any given modern society actually is.

You don't really agree to the laws and taxes. You obey and pay them to avoid punishment. Not same-same.

If you're handed a contract by a guy with a gun to your head who says sign it or else, even if you sign it you didn't really agree to anything. You were forced into some shit. That's not a real contract, that's succumbing to a threat. The government's threat is less obvious, but it's still just as real as any gangster's pistol.

However, for those of you still unconvinced, come on down to SE Portland, I'll have a couple buddies of mine rob you at gun point, and when you give them your money, I'll remind you that you actually agreed and gave them your money willingly, and that it wasn't a robbery so much as a business transaction.

And your better idea is?

 

[bripat9643]

[quot

Actually dumb-ass, Somailia is what happens when Dumbocrats get their policy. First of all, what is closer to a lawless, 3rd world, shit-hole right now - Detroit (collapsed because of Dumbocrat policy), or Dallas (flourishing because of conservative policy). Furthermore, Somalia is the result of a manicial fanatic wanting to control others (what is more Dumbocrat than that?!?). Would you like to try again junior?

Somalia is the Right Wing Wet Dream.

No Government
Crazy Religion
Lots and lots of guns.

And sorry, man, Dallas is a real shithole.

Somalia has plenty of government. In fact, it has hundreds of them, all with the power of life and death over you.

 

[bripat9643]

Okay, guy, I know you are really trying here...

But it should not be STILL Scalding or Boiling when the customer gets it.

Seriously, what kind of retard are you?

For the record, not a coffee drinker.

Why is there steam when they make coffee? Do you know how steam is created?

So take a cup of freshly brewed coffee, hold it over your lap, and ask yourself this question. "If I dump this into my lap, is that going to do some serious damage?

If you answer "no" to that question, then seriously, stay away from stoves.

Again, it should not be boiling or scalding when the customer gets it.

Seriously, are you some kind of retard or something?

So you think that McDonald's should pour you a hot cup of coffee and then wait for 20 minutes until it cools down to what you consider a "safe" temperature?

 

[P@triot]

Well, it's a stupid point.

When the constitution was written, bleeding people was still considered a valid medical technique.

The laws have to change with the times. And you don't hold a slavish view of "original intent".

Well, that's a stupid point.

The Constitution stays, you go.

Or we get sensible, progressive judges on the bench, and guess what, we apply common fucking sense.

Like Corporaitons aren't really people.

and

Adam Lanza is not a Well-Regulated Militia.

First of all, if the times have changed so much that the Constitution needs updating, then legally and properly amend the Constitution. But you don't. Why? Because you're an unhinged little asshole who is in the extreme minority of proud communists. To this day, the Constitution is still flawless and still functions perfectly for the United States when applied correctly (in other words, when we don't allow Dumbocrats to interpret it with their fucked up ideology).

Second of all, as I already pointed out (and humiliated you in the process by exposing your extraordinary ignorance) - the Constitution does not say "the right of a well-regulated militia". It says "the right of the people to keep and bear arms shall not be infringed". You'd think after I school you this bad you'd stop with your insane, uninformed, and inaccurate narrative. But nope, like a typical Dumbocrat, you go right back to the well thinking that a lie told often enough will become "truth". Typical self-admitted communist.

Adam Lanza happened because extremely ignorant libtards (such as yourself) in Congress led by Tip O'Neill created an ignorant bill outlawing firearms at schools - creating a VICTIM ZONE where maniacs like Lanza know they can mow everyone down. There's a reason Lanza didn't walk into a Police Department to attempt his killing spree - because everyone there is armed stupid.

 

[bripat9643]

lol, yes, this could have been a much shorter thread if the OP understood that.

IT's really not the OP that's lacking in understanding, here.

What you don't seem to understand is that agreement isn't passive. You can't truly unknowingly agree to something, either. Agreement -must- be conscious and willing. Anything else is coercion, which is what the "social contract" in any given modern society actually is.

You don't really agree to the laws and taxes. You obey and pay them to avoid punishment. Not same-same.

If you're handed a contract by a guy with a gun to your head who says sign it or else, even if you sign it you didn't really agree to anything. You were forced into some shit. That's not a real contract, that's succumbing to a threat. The government's threat is less obvious, but it's still just as real as any gangster's pistol.

However, for those of you still unconvinced, come on down to SE Portland, I'll have a couple buddies of mine rob you at gun point, and when you give them your money, I'll remind you that you actually agreed and gave them your money willingly, and that it wasn't a robbery so much as a business transaction.

And your better idea is?

Whether anyone has a better idea is irrelevant to the issue of whether you consented to the dictates of the criminal gang that inhabits the capitol building.

One thing is certain: the fact that you haven't consented to anything Washington does means it should do no more than it absolutely has to.

 

[bripat9643]

A nation is a social contract between peoples.

We agree to pay taxes, have one constitution,etc.

lol, yes, this could have been a much shorter thread if the OP understood that.

IT's really not the OP that's lacking in understanding, here.

What you don't seem to understand is that agreement isn't passive. You can't truly unknowingly agree to something, either. Agreement -must- be conscious and willing. Anything else is coercion, which is what the "social contract" in any given modern society actually is.

You don't really agree to the laws and taxes. You obey and pay them to avoid punishment. Not same-same.

If you're handed a contract by a guy with a gun to your head who says sign it or else, even if you sign it you didn't really agree to anything. You were forced into some shit. That's not a real contract, that's succumbing to a threat. The government's threat is less obvious, but it's still just as real as any gangster's pistol.

However, for those of you still unconvinced, come on down to SE Portland, I'll have a couple buddies of mine rob you at gun point, and when you give them your money, I'll remind you that you actually agreed and gave them your money willingly, and that it wasn't a robbery so much as a business transaction.

You're wasting your time on this brainwashed dope. Your post indicates you actually think this moron is capable of absorbing logic. You'd make more effective of your time if you just ridiculed him/her.

 

[JoeB131]

[

First of all, if the times have changed so much that the Constitution needs updating, then legally and properly amend the Constitution. But you don't. Why? Because you're an unhinged little asshole who is in the extreme minority of proud communists. To this day, the Constitution is still flawless and still functions perfectly for the United States when applied correctly (in other words, when we don't allow Dumbocrats to interpret it with their fucked up ideology).

Second of all, as I already pointed out (and humiliated you in the process by exposing your extraordinary ignorance) - the Constitution does not say "the right of a well-regulated militia". It says "the right of the people to keep and bear arms shall not be infringed". You'd think after I school you this bad you'd stop with your insane, uninformed, and inaccurate narrative. But nope, like a typical Dumbocrat, you go right back to the well thinking that a lie told often enough will become "truth". Typical self-admitted communist.

Adam Lanza happened because extremely ignorant libtards (such as yourself) in Congress led by Tip O'Neill created an ignorant bill outlawing firearms at schools - creating a VICTIM ZONE where maniacs like Lanza know they can mow everyone down. There's a reason Lanza didn't walk into a Police Department to attempt his killing spree - because everyone there is armed stupid.

Somehow, I don't think arming teachers who are already stressed out most of the time was really a solution, Poodle. Love teachers, have teachers in my family, would not want to see most of them packing heat in a classroom.

Okay, one more time, twit.

SCOTUS interprets the constitution. It makes rulings based on the situation of the day.

I would even go so far as to say in 1787, when you had wild animals and native americans and such, the Second Amendment even made a bit of sense.

Today... meh, not so much.

Apply the words to the TIMES.

Kind of like how the Courts had to interpret "Freedom of the Press" when television came out. They had to adapt. That's what we have courts for, is to interpret.

 

[kaz]

Okay, guy, I know you are really trying here...

But it should not be STILL Scalding or Boiling when the customer gets it.

Seriously, what kind of retard are you?

For the record, not a coffee drinker.

Why is there steam when they make coffee? Do you know how steam is created?

So take a cup of freshly brewed coffee, hold it over your lap, and ask yourself this question. "If I dump this into my lap, is that going to do some serious damage?

If you answer "no" to that question, then seriously, stay away from stoves.

Again, it should not be boiling or scalding when the customer gets it.

Seriously, are you some kind of retard or something?

Retard is what you see when you look in the mirror. They make coffee by running boiling water through ground beans. That is how it is made, that is how it tastes good. That government needs to force businesses to let it sit and cool down to stupid proof life for liberals is ridiculous.

Life cannot be liberal proofed, nor should it be. That you can't function without your hand being held and the bar lowered is on you.

 

[hazlnut]

In the past, Republicans thought that the market ought to set wages, and that a combination of government devices—including the earned-income tax credit, housing subsidies, food stamps, Medicaid, and other social-welfare programs—could fill in the gaps to make that social contract work, while also trying to remove disincentives from work via welfare reform.

The Moral and Economic Case for Raising the Minimum Wage

Three points to make here:

• How is it possible that the left is incapable of comprehending that if the minimum wage for flipping a burger goes up 20%, the cost of the burger goes up 20%, which means the cost of shipping that burger to each store goes up 20%, which means the cost of electricity goes up 20%, which means the minimum wage worker is no further ahead than they were before the minimum wage went up 20%? I'm literally astounded by the left's ignorant belief that every action occurs in a vacuum. This is basic stuff that even small children understand.
  
  
• The solution to the problem is pretty damn simple. Stop subsidizing the failure of the individual. If they can't put food on their table, there are 6 mechanisms of safety nets to ensure food gets there that do not include government. If 6 safety nets are not enough, well, then you were destined to go hungry. Just accept it and move on (and we all know that will NEVER happen with 6 safety nets, but that won't stop the liberals on USMB from making outrageous scenario's where those safety nets aren't enough).
  
  
• Once again we see the left literally make stuff up out of thin air. What "social contract"?!? I've never seen one. And I sure as hell never signed one.

Your first paragraph answers your own questions.

"a combination of government devices—including the earned-income tax credit, housing subsidies, food stamps, Medicaid, and other social-welfare programs—could fill in the gaps to make that social contract work, while also trying to remove disincentives from work via welfare reform."

**What happens when the social-welfare programs can't keep up with the cost of living and medical costs??

**Why can't they? -- Wealthy people have lobbied for lowering of income tax rates and more special loopholes and rates, thereby lowering tax revenue that would normally go to those programs.