The US and UK encouraged Ukraine to not negotiate and extend the war. What geopolitical goals are accomplished by extending the war?

[ColonelAngus]

To weaken Russia?
To enrich the military industrial complex?


Why is it in the best interest of the West to keep this war going?

Whatever those benefits are, is it worth the thousands of killed and millions displaced?

I do not understand why the West does not want peace.

 

[gipper]

Human mass extinction.

 

[Marener]

You don’t reward bad behavior.

 

[easyt65]

Putin is losing his reputation of being a badass with an extremeky powerful military no one can stand against.

His military has been devastated

His top general's have been targeted and killed

His mercenaries were defeated quickly

His conscripts were taken to task

His military's morale is extremely low


He has had to initiate a draft at home

- He lied to his people by telling them the war was going great - no worties. They now know he was lying.

- A noted Russian artist reportedly killed himself last week rather than comply with Putin's draft

His support back at home is faltering
- Wealthy Putin donors / supporters have been having fatal 'accidents'
- There have reportedly been several attempted assassinations on Putin

Putin's only true military power, it has been exposed, is his nuclear arsenal and his potential willingness to use it.

China, Russia's ally, now sees Russia will he of little help in a conventional war and is only valuable to them because of their energy resources.

The longer this Ukraine-Russian war goes on the weaker both Russia and Putin become.

 

[forkup]

To weaken Russia?
To enrich the military industrial complex?


Why is it in the best interest of the West to keep this war going?

Whatever those benefits are, is it worth the thousands of killed and millions displaced?

I do not understand why the West does not want peace.

Maybe because the West has some very good examples over what happens when you appease aggressive nations.

At the moment Russia has not just taken the Crimea, annexed it although it was part of another nation. But they have now done so for other regions. What possible reason you imagine Ukraine has to accept this situation when they are winning on the battlefield?

Neither the West nor the Ukraine choose this situation and yet you are suggesting that the one person who did gets rewarded.

 

[ColonelAngus]

Maybe because the West has some very good examples over what happens when you appease aggressive nations.

At the moment Russia has not just taken the Crimea, annexed it although it was part of another nation. But they have now done so for other regions. What possible reason you imagine Ukraine has to accept this situation when they are winning on the battlefield?

Neither the West nor the Ukraine choose this situation and yet you are suggesting that the one person who did gets rewarded.

What do you see as the resolution?
Its a flat out war between the US and Russia.
The US government is GOVERNING UKRAINE.

You do not want peace because Putin bad? You certainly are not losing any family members.

Wow.

You people who WANT war are fascinating.

Let me just guess…you voted for Biden.

Its seems those who now want war are Biden voters.

 

[forkup]

What do you see as the resolution?
Its a flat out war between the US and Russia.
The US government is GOVERNING UKRAINE.

You do not want peace because Putin bad? You certainly are not losing any family members.

Wow.

You people who WANT war are fascinating.

Let me just guess…you voted for Biden.

Its seems those who now want war are Biden voters.

Lol I'm European. The school she goes too had to start a class to teach the close to 20 new Ukrainian students that were enrolled. My energy bill has more than doubled. Gas has more than tripled since last year.

I have more skin in the game than you do.

The reason I still support this war is because I'm a student of history. And I know what happened to for instance Chechoslovakia. When the West tried to appease Hitler and ended up in a war anyway.

People like Putin don't stop until you make them stop. And I rather take a stand before they actually do become to powerful.

As my resolution. Hopefully with enough discontent Putin will be deposed. Ukraine will probably win on the battlefield. To be honest I don't know.

Neither do you though. Their is no guarantee Putin will honour any agreement, or for that matter if giving in doesn't encourage other nations to exploit the proof that the West will give in if you just threaten enough violence.

So if neither of us knows I rather do the right thing.

 

[ColonelAngus]

Lol I'm European. The school she goes too had to start a class to teach the close to 20 new Ukrainian students that were enrolled. My energy bill has more than doubled. Gas has more than tripled since last year.

I have more skin in the game than you do.

The reason I still support this war is because I'm a student of history. And I know what happened to for instance Chechoslovakia. When the West tried to appease Hitler and ended up in a war anyway.

People like Putin don't stop until you make them stop. And I rather take a stand before they actually do become to powerful.

As my resolution. Hopefully with enough discontent Putin will be deposed. Ukraine will probably win on the battlefield. To be honest I don't know.

Neither do you though. Their is no guarantee Putin will honour any agreement, or for that matter if giving in doesn't encourage other nations to exploit the proof that the West will give in if you just threaten enough violence.

So if neither of us knows I rather do the right thing.

I see. You are very biased.

I certainly understand you bias.

America has plenty of its own problems at home.

Homelessness, substance abuse, inflation, a corrupt President, and incompetent Congress, massive debt, housing crash on the brink, stock market crashing.

Let Europe pay for the war.

I do not want MY MONEY paying for bombs to drop on Ukraine.

 

[ColonelAngus]

How does it benefit ME that MY money is paying for bombs for Ukraine?

Specifically.

 

[forkup]

I see. You are very biased.

I certainly understand you bias.

America has plenty of its own problems at home.

Homelessness, substance abuse, inflation, a corrupt President, and incompetent Congress, massive debt, housing crash on the brink, stock market crashing.

Let Europe pay for the war.

I do not want MY MONEY paying for bombs to drop on Ukraine.

It always amazes me that when people fail to come up with actual counter-arguments they often do so by pretending they are dumb.

When I state that I'm for continuing the war although it ups my energy bill and the refugees are actually putting strain on our education system. I'm stating that I'm for the war DESPITE my bias, not BECAUSE of it.

I gave you my actual reason why I thought so. A reason you aren't actually challenging. The reason for that, I strongly suspect, is that you are unable to articulate a response. So you pretend I'm biased, thinking that that would unburden you from the actual responsibility of defending your position. It is in my view a sign of intellectual dishonesty.

 

[forkup]

How does it benefit ME that MY money is paying for bombs for Ukraine?

Specifically.

It benefits you because it makes it less likely that YOU will have to live in a world where the US doesn't have the influence to steer global events in benificial ways.

 

[ColonelAngus]

It benefits you because it makes it less likely that YOU will have to live in a world where the US doesn't have the influence to steer global events in benificial ways.

If I lose my job in the US recession, I expect Ukraine to pay my mortgage.

 

[ColonelAngus]

Russia has a smaller GDP than Italy.

They are not going to take over the world.

Putin is not Hitler. Putin is Putin.

He is a murderous dictator and a KGB hold over…but to say he is Hitler is showing poor knowledge of history.

 

[ColonelAngus]

We need to deescalate and negotiate peace immediately.

It’s so bizarre that so many people want war.

What is wrong with those of you who love all these dead bodies?

 

[MinTrut]

To weaken Russia?
To enrich the military industrial complex?


Why is it in the best interest of the West to keep this war going?

Whatever those benefits are, is it worth the thousands of killed and millions displaced?

I do not understand why the West does not want peace.

Trump's unexpected victory in 2016 delayed this for 4 years.

Now the elites are back on schedule.

World War III with a possible side of civil war.

Stay tuned!

 

[MinTrut]

We need to deescalate and negotiate peace immediately.

It’s so bizarre that so many people want war.

What is wrong with those of you who love all these dead bodies?

The human death wish is a thing.

 

[forkup]

If I lose my job in the US recession, I expect Ukraine to pay my mortgage.

What has the one to do with the other?

 

[Leviticus]

They weren't encouraged to refuse to negotiate, they were encouraged to stand strong, and only accept terms that were in THEIR favor. Russia has a long and bloody history of invading their neighbors, and causing so much death and destruction that their VICTIMS will accept bad peace terms just to end it.

The US and the UK are encouraging Ukraine to be strong and only accept terms that favor them. They know that the Russian people don't support the war, and many are simply fleeing Russia and trying to get asylum in other counties over Putin's forced conscription policy. Putin is losing a lot of support at home, and by refusing extending the conflict and the negotiations Ukraine has Putin's balls in a vice. Putin knows that if the war continues, he risks losing enough support to be voted out of office, or rather, he'd lose enough support that his corrupt, fake elections would become apparent to enough people in Russia that it would likely cause armed rebellion, and his likely assassination.

 

[forkup]

Russia has a smaller GDP than Italy.

They are not going to take over the world.

Putin is not Hitler. Putin is Putin.

He is a murderous dictator and a KGB hold over…but to say he is Hitler is showing poor knowledge of history.

Way to not answer my premise and at the same time showing how supremely dishonest or dumb (haven't figured out which) you are.

When you compare people, you do so within a context. I'll demonstrate.

Queen Elizabeth and John Kennedy are comparable, in the sense they both have brown hair. They can be as different as you like but in the sense of. hair colour they are the same.

The context in which I compared Hitler and Putin was in the sense that they are both Dictators who have taken over territory before without there being any serious blowback. And they have continued to do so. They are comparable in other ways too but in answer to the premise of your OP this is the comparison that is relevant.

You claiming I don't know my history because Putin was KGB and is therefore not comparable to Hiler is both dumb and a red herring fallacy.

In other words you are derailing your own OP because you are unable to defend it.

 

[forkup]

We need to deescalate and negotiate peace immediately.

It’s so bizarre that so many people want war.

What is wrong with those of you who love all these dead bodies?

I'm not for war. I'm for peace. I am however not naive. Avoiding war by giving in to aggression has never really worked. The aggressor will just keep on asking for more. It's no different then your average schoolyard bully.

The only way you defend yourself against a bully is by assigning consequences to bullying.

Following your logic, if Putin demands Alaska back or risk nuclear war for instance the US should simply give it back in the interest of peace?

As for what is bizarre. It's insanely bizarre in my opinion that a large part of the GOP, the part of Reagan is now arguing the interests of a Russian autocrat over the interests of a Democratically elected government and ally.