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It is noted that what you want has failed over and over and you still refuse to admit the facts. Trump did what you want on steel. Now we have layoffs and a huge drop in stock. Way to go. How is that good for the country?Ah you continue to dodge. Fact is trump did for steel what you claim is great for our country. What happened? Oh layoffs and huge drop in stocks. Failure. How is that good for us?Isn’t it time you admit defeat? Your tariffs fail again and you aren’t honest enough to admit it. Steel layoffs. US steel stock down 80%. Stop being so dishonest.1. Yes you did.
2. I'm saying they have all combined to help lead to low wages. These are what we should be working on. We have the jobs, now we need to help the worker. Tariffs don't work, see the steel industry.
1. Nope. Didn't. Aren't you overdue for a change of subject?
2. Yet, you just ignore trade deficits, which results on lost manufacturing jobs, which traditionally have had higher wages, AND outsourcing, which also, results in lost manufacturing jobs, which traditionally have had higher wages. How do you determine that those factors should be ignored?
That was weird. I made a point about trade deficits and outsourcing reducing manufacturing jobs, which historical have had higher wages,
and your response, did not address it at all.
All you did was spout your standard talking point(s).
Does that mean that on some level, you know that my point about manufacturing jobs, and trade, is true, and you don't know how to counter it?
Your pretense that this is a simple system, with only one variable is noted and laughed at.
What about the massive industrial growth of the US in the post Civil War era, of high tariffs? FOR ONE EXAMPLE
In the post Civil War era it took longer to get across the country than it now takes to get across the Atlantic, while the pacific took. We also had a glut of cheap labor at the time, and there was no such thing as unions or worker protections or safety regulations.
Your pretense that this is a simple system, with only one variable is noted and laughed at.
Is that any different than you blaming everything on China?
Yes they worked great as a tax then. The growth would have been more without them. Unless you think taxes are good for an economy.No actually you don't have examples of them working as anything but a tax. They have never created jobs or saved jobs. They never work for anything but another tax.You are just weaseling out of the fact tariffs didn’t help steel by blaming the business cycle. History is full of examples of tariffs not working.Of course 2% growth doesn't tell you much about demand for steel. So, you're just putting a number out there and kind of assuming... what? That it supports your position without explaining how?
And of examples of them working. History is big.
What about the massive industrial growth of the US in the post Civil War era, of high tariffs? FOR ONE EXAMPLE
What about the massive industrial growth of the US in the post Civil War era, of high tariffs? FOR ONE EXAMPLE
In the post Civil War era it took longer to get across the country than it now takes to get across the Atlantic, while the pacific took. We also had a glut of cheap labor at the time, and there was no such thing as unions or worker protections or safety regulations.
Oh, so suddenly, when the example supports MY side of the debate, suddenly you remembered that there are all this other factors in a complex system.
Huh. Funny that.
Your pretense that this is a simple system, with only one variable is noted and laughed at.
Is that any different than you blaming everything on China?
I don't blame everything on China. Nothing I have said could be sanely be interpreted that way.
It is noted that what you want has failed over and over and you still refuse to admit the facts. Trump did what you want on steel. Now we have layoffs and a huge drop in stock. Way to go. How is that good for the country?Ah you continue to dodge. Fact is trump did for steel what you claim is great for our country. What happened? Oh layoffs and huge drop in stocks. Failure. How is that good for us?Isn’t it time you admit defeat? Your tariffs fail again and you aren’t honest enough to admit it. Steel layoffs. US steel stock down 80%. Stop being so dishonest.1. Nope. Didn't. Aren't you overdue for a change of subject?
2. Yet, you just ignore trade deficits, which results on lost manufacturing jobs, which traditionally have had higher wages, AND outsourcing, which also, results in lost manufacturing jobs, which traditionally have had higher wages. How do you determine that those factors should be ignored?
That was weird. I made a point about trade deficits and outsourcing reducing manufacturing jobs, which historical have had higher wages,
and your response, did not address it at all.
All you did was spout your standard talking point(s).
Does that mean that on some level, you know that my point about manufacturing jobs, and trade, is true, and you don't know how to counter it?
Your pretense that this is a simple system, with only one variable is noted and laughed at.
Ok so what were we importing during that time? Were imports cheaper than domestic products with or without tariffs? What domestic jobs were protected. Be specific.Yes they worked great as a tax then. The growth would have been more without them. Unless you think taxes are good for an economy.No actually you don't have examples of them working as anything but a tax. They have never created jobs or saved jobs. They never work for anything but another tax.You are just weaseling out of the fact tariffs didn’t help steel by blaming the business cycle. History is full of examples of tariffs not working.
And of examples of them working. History is big.
What about the massive industrial growth of the US in the post Civil War era, of high tariffs? FOR ONE EXAMPLE
I think protecting domestic jobs from foreign competitors, can be good for an economy. And imo, that is what the massive growth of the US, during that time frame shows.
And they have done such a good job with steel. Guy is crazy.Your pretense that this is a simple system, with only one variable is noted and laughed at.
Is that any different than you blaming everything on China?
I don't blame everything on China. Nothing I have said could be sanely be interpreted that way.
Of course you do, that is why you want the government to swoop in and save the day.
Tariffs did not make the American economy great - AEIWhat about the massive industrial growth of the US in the post Civil War era, of high tariffs? FOR ONE EXAMPLE
In the post Civil War era it took longer to get across the country than it now takes to get across the Atlantic, while the pacific took. We also had a glut of cheap labor at the time, and there was no such thing as unions or worker protections or safety regulations.
Oh, so suddenly, when the example supports MY side of the debate, suddenly you remembered that there are all this other factors in a complex system.
Huh. Funny that.
What about the massive industrial growth of the US in the post Civil War era, of high tariffs? FOR ONE EXAMPLE
In the post Civil War era it took longer to get across the country than it now takes to get across the Atlantic, while the pacific took. We also had a glut of cheap labor at the time, and there was no such thing as unions or worker protections or safety regulations.
Oh, so suddenly, when the example supports MY side of the debate, suddenly you remembered that there are all this other factors in a complex system.
Huh. Funny that.
Like I have ever suggested otherwise, but every other factor that I bring up you dismiss as having no impact. Then you want to compare today to the 1880s....you are just a mess.
Your pretense that this is a simple system, with only one variable is noted and laughed at.
Is that any different than you blaming everything on China?
I don't blame everything on China. Nothing I have said could be sanely be interpreted that way.
Of course you do, that is why you want the government to swoop in and save the day.
Ok so what were we importing during that time? Were imports cheaper than domestic products with or without tariffs? What domestic jobs were protected. Be specific.Yes they worked great as a tax then. The growth would have been more without them. Unless you think taxes are good for an economy.No actually you don't have examples of them working as anything but a tax. They have never created jobs or saved jobs. They never work for anything but another tax.And of examples of them working. History is big.
What about the massive industrial growth of the US in the post Civil War era, of high tariffs? FOR ONE EXAMPLE
I think protecting domestic jobs from foreign competitors, can be good for an economy. And imo, that is what the massive growth of the US, during that time frame shows.
No, I have stated it works as a tax. There is no evidence they are good for an economy, even after the civil war. As I proved with my link. And the much more recent steel tariffs have led to layoffs. You really have nothing but failure.Ok so what were we importing during that time? Were imports cheaper than domestic products with or without tariffs? What domestic jobs were protected. Be specific.Yes they worked great as a tax then. The growth would have been more without them. Unless you think taxes are good for an economy.No actually you don't have examples of them working as anything but a tax. They have never created jobs or saved jobs. They never work for anything but another tax.
What about the massive industrial growth of the US in the post Civil War era, of high tariffs? FOR ONE EXAMPLE
I think protecting domestic jobs from foreign competitors, can be good for an economy. And imo, that is what the massive growth of the US, during that time frame shows.
Specifically, you claimed that there were no examples of tariffs working. So , this is a huge example of it working, over many decades. Your desire to muddy that up by focusing on minor details, is noted, and dismissed.
No, I have stated it works as a tax. There is no evidence they are good for an economy, even after the civil war. As I proved with my link. And the much more recent steel tariffs have led to layoffs. You really have nothing but failure.Ok so what were we importing during that time? Were imports cheaper than domestic products with or without tariffs? What domestic jobs were protected. Be specific.Yes they worked great as a tax then. The growth would have been more without them. Unless you think taxes are good for an economy.What about the massive industrial growth of the US in the post Civil War era, of high tariffs? FOR ONE EXAMPLE
I think protecting domestic jobs from foreign competitors, can be good for an economy. And imo, that is what the massive growth of the US, during that time frame shows.
Specifically, you claimed that there were no examples of tariffs working. So , this is a huge example of it working, over many decades. Your desire to muddy that up by focusing on minor details, is noted, and dismissed.
I’ve linked full refutes. You however have nothing, the massive growth was in areas not effected by tariffs. Why do you choose to ignore facts? How’s steel doing?No, I have stated it works as a tax. There is no evidence they are good for an economy, even after the civil war. As I proved with my link. And the much more recent steel tariffs have led to layoffs. You really have nothing but failure.Ok so what were we importing during that time? Were imports cheaper than domestic products with or without tariffs? What domestic jobs were protected. Be specific.Yes they worked great as a tax then. The growth would have been more without them. Unless you think taxes are good for an economy.
I think protecting domestic jobs from foreign competitors, can be good for an economy. And imo, that is what the massive growth of the US, during that time frame shows.
Specifically, you claimed that there were no examples of tariffs working. So , this is a huge example of it working, over many decades. Your desire to muddy that up by focusing on minor details, is noted, and dismissed.
We have massive growth of the economy, jobs, wages, ect, behind high tariffs. THat is a fine example of tariffs working for a good economy.
Your inability to refute it, undermines your position.
Your inability to be honest about that, undermines your credibility.
1. Yes you did.1. So yes you made it up.1. You are making it up and hence can't prove it.
2. I've explained over and over why they are not high paying jobs. Our policy has been anti worker for a long time.
1. NO. Change the subject with your circular arguing. It is what you would do next anyways. Let's just skip ONE step. COme on.
2. How can you tell which factors contribute and which do not?
2. I can back up each of my factors with a study. And there is no downside to fixing most of them. Unlike trade where you can see the downside by what is happening with steel.
1. Totally didn't.
2. I'm not denying that the issues you care about had impact. I'm asking you how you know which factors had an impact and which did not. Because you are the one doing that, not me.
2. I'm saying they have all combined to help lead to low wages. These are what we should be working on. We have the jobs, now we need to help the worker. Tariffs don't work, see the steel industry.
1. Nope. Didn't. Aren't you overdue for a change of subject?
2. Yet, you just ignore trade deficits, which results on lost manufacturing jobs, which traditionally have had higher wages, AND outsourcing, which also, results in lost manufacturing jobs, which traditionally have had higher wages. How do you determine that those factors should be ignored?
I’ve linked full refutes. You however have nothing, the massive growth was in areas not effected by tariffs. Why do you choose to ignore facts? How’s steel doing?No, I have stated it works as a tax. There is no evidence they are good for an economy, even after the civil war. As I proved with my link. And the much more recent steel tariffs have led to layoffs. You really have nothing but failure.Ok so what were we importing during that time? Were imports cheaper than domestic products with or without tariffs? What domestic jobs were protected. Be specific.I think protecting domestic jobs from foreign competitors, can be good for an economy. And imo, that is what the massive growth of the US, during that time frame shows.
Specifically, you claimed that there were no examples of tariffs working. So , this is a huge example of it working, over many decades. Your desire to muddy that up by focusing on minor details, is noted, and dismissed.
We have massive growth of the economy, jobs, wages, ect, behind high tariffs. THat is a fine example of tariffs working for a good economy.
Your inability to refute it, undermines your position.
Your inability to be honest about that, undermines your credibility.
Don’t you read? How do you arrive at your crazy beliefs?I’ve linked full refutes. You however have nothing, the massive growth was in areas not effected by tariffs. Why do you choose to ignore facts? How’s steel doing?No, I have stated it works as a tax. There is no evidence they are good for an economy, even after the civil war. As I proved with my link. And the much more recent steel tariffs have led to layoffs. You really have nothing but failure.Ok so what were we importing during that time? Were imports cheaper than domestic products with or without tariffs? What domestic jobs were protected. Be specific.
Specifically, you claimed that there were no examples of tariffs working. So , this is a huge example of it working, over many decades. Your desire to muddy that up by focusing on minor details, is noted, and dismissed.
We have massive growth of the economy, jobs, wages, ect, behind high tariffs. THat is a fine example of tariffs working for a good economy.
Your inability to refute it, undermines your position.
Your inability to be honest about that, undermines your credibility.
Save the drama for the tourists.
Explain how growth of the post civil war era was on sectors of the economy, "not effected by tariffs".
