USMB Abortion poll

[IsaacNewton]

A fertilized egg is a cell, not a person.

Please post the legal definition for what a "natural person" is and tell me why a human being - even in the first days of their life - does not meet that definition.

I'm not interested in 'definitions' or 'parsing of words' or any other nonsense like this. I generally don't get involved in abortion discussions because it always devolves into someone thinking a dictionary is the almighty authority of the universe.

Believe what you want. Be happy.

 

[Chuz Life]

A fertilized egg is a cell, not a person.

Please post the legal definition for what a "natural person" is and tell me why a human being - even in the first days of their life - does not meet that definition.

I'm not interested in 'definitions' or 'parsing of words' or any other nonsense like this. I generally don't get involved in abortion discussions because it always devolves into someone thinking a dictionary is the almighty authority of the universe.

Believe what you want. Be happy.

First of all, no one forced you to jump into this thread or conversation, did they? Did they?

Did you not expect to be questioned on any of it?

I don't think even our legal dictionaries are infallible but why not at least use them as a starting point?

Abortion is as much a legal and Constitutional matter as it is anything else. So, pretending that the legal definitions and the Constitution doesn't matter seems kind of illogical to me.

 

[IsaacNewton]

A fertilized egg is a cell, not a person.

Please post the legal definition for what a "natural person" is and tell me why a human being - even in the first days of their life - does not meet that definition.

I'm not interested in 'definitions' or 'parsing of words' or any other nonsense like this. I generally don't get involved in abortion discussions because it always devolves into someone thinking a dictionary is the almighty authority of the universe.

Believe what you want. Be happy.

First of all, no one forced you to jump into this thread or conversation, did they? Did they?

Did you not expect to be questioned on any of it?

I don't think even our legal dictionaries are infallible but why not at least use them as a starting point?

Abortion is as much a legal and Constitutional matter as it is anything else. So, pretending that the legal definitions and the Constitution doesn't matter seems kind of illogical to me.

I responded to a poll and I'm pretty sure, really without even checking with the dictionary or anyone else, that everyone is free to post or not post at their own discretion. But you carry on, I'm sure you have a long list of flames to toss out so I won't keep you.

 

[Maryland Patriot]

Rape, incest or health of the mother. or a baby that will be born severely deformed or some other birth defect that will leave them with a very poor quality of life.
other than that there is only one reason left, and thats not a good enough reason for abortion.

Do children with birth defects have less a right to their life than typical "normal" healthy kids do?

depends on the severity of the defect. In some cases it could be considered showing mercy. As I said, leave them with a VERY POOR QUALITY OF LIFE.

I think I have a very poor quality of life sometimes. So, I hope you can appreciate my concern about the sentiments you have expressed.

I think that I answered even this question previously.
Do you have a poor quality of life every day? do people have to care for you 24/7? can you feed yourself? live without machines doing the job of your organs?
I hope you can appreciate what I mean by the sentiments that I have expressed.

 

[Maryland Patriot]

A fertilized egg is a cell, not a person.

Please post the legal definition for what a "natural person" is and tell me why a human being - even in the first days of their life - does not meet that definition.

I'm not interested in 'definitions' or 'parsing of words' or any other nonsense like this. I generally don't get involved in abortion discussions because it always devolves into someone thinking a dictionary is the almighty authority of the universe.

Believe what you want. Be happy.

First of all, no one forced you to jump into this thread or conversation, did they? Did they?

Did you not expect to be questioned on any of it?

I don't think even our legal dictionaries are infallible but why not at least use them as a starting point?

Abortion is as much a legal and Constitutional matter as it is anything else. So, pretending that the legal definitions and the Constitution doesn't matter seems kind of illogical to me.

something that seems illogical to me is that I can be fined and put in jail for disturbing a turtle egg because it is or could kill a turtle. Yet, the human embryo, and even the fetus that has already developed arms and legs, has movement, feelings etc... is not considered a human life yet.
It is a shame that we give the life of a turtle more value than the life of a human.

 

[Chuz Life]

A fertilized egg is a cell, not a person.

Please post the legal definition for what a "natural person" is and tell me why a human being - even in the first days of their life - does not meet that definition.

I'm not interested in 'definitions' or 'parsing of words' or any other nonsense like this. I generally don't get involved in abortion discussions because it always devolves into someone thinking a dictionary is the almighty authority of the universe.

Believe what you want. Be happy.

First of all, no one forced you to jump into this thread or conversation, did they? Did they?

Did you not expect to be questioned on any of it?

I don't think even our legal dictionaries are infallible but why not at least use them as a starting point?

Abortion is as much a legal and Constitutional matter as it is anything else. So, pretending that the legal definitions and the Constitution doesn't matter seems kind of illogical to me.

I responded to a poll and I'm pretty sure, really without even checking with the dictionary or anyone else, that everyone is free to post or not post at their own discretion. But you carry on, I'm sure you have a long list of flames to toss out so I won't keep you.

I have nothing to gain by flaming you or anyone else.

I sincerely wished that you have answered my questions. If not for me, maybe for yourself.

If you takes a stand as you did, Why not show that you don't lack the courage to defend those / your own convictions?

 

[IsaacNewton]

A fertilized egg is a cell, not a person.

Please post the legal definition for what a "natural person" is and tell me why a human being - even in the first days of their life - does not meet that definition.

I'm not interested in 'definitions' or 'parsing of words' or any other nonsense like this. I generally don't get involved in abortion discussions because it always devolves into someone thinking a dictionary is the almighty authority of the universe.

Believe what you want. Be happy.

First of all, no one forced you to jump into this thread or conversation, did they? Did they?

Did you not expect to be questioned on any of it?

I don't think even our legal dictionaries are infallible but why not at least use them as a starting point?

Abortion is as much a legal and Constitutional matter as it is anything else. So, pretending that the legal definitions and the Constitution doesn't matter seems kind of illogical to me.

I responded to a poll and I'm pretty sure, really without even checking with the dictionary or anyone else, that everyone is free to post or not post at their own discretion. But you carry on, I'm sure you have a long list of flames to toss out so I won't keep you.

I have nothing to gain by flaming you or anyone else.

I sincerely wished that you have answered my questions. If not for me, maybe for yourself.

If you takes a stand as you did, Why not show that you don't lack the courage to defend your convictions?

I've lived long enough to see all sides. If what I posted isn't enough, sorry.

End of line.......

 

[Chuz Life]

Rape, incest or health of the mother. or a baby that will be born severely deformed or some other birth defect that will leave them with a very poor quality of life.
other than that there is only one reason left, and thats not a good enough reason for abortion.

Do children with birth defects have less a right to their life than typical "normal" healthy kids do?

depends on the severity of the defect. In some cases it could be considered showing mercy. As I said, leave them with a VERY POOR QUALITY OF LIFE.

I think I have a very poor quality of life sometimes. So, I hope you can appreciate my concern about the sentiments you have expressed.

I think that I answered even this question previously.
Do you have a poor quality of life every day? do people have to care for you 24/7? can you feed yourself? live without machines doing the job of your organs?
I hope you can appreciate what I mean by the sentiments that I have expressed.

Can we agree that it's subjective?

 

[Chuz Life]

Please post the legal definition for what a "natural person" is and tell me why a human being - even in the first days of their life - does not meet that definition.

I'm not interested in 'definitions' or 'parsing of words' or any other nonsense like this. I generally don't get involved in abortion discussions because it always devolves into someone thinking a dictionary is the almighty authority of the universe.

Believe what you want. Be happy.

First of all, no one forced you to jump into this thread or conversation, did they? Did they?

Did you not expect to be questioned on any of it?

I don't think even our legal dictionaries are infallible but why not at least use them as a starting point?

Abortion is as much a legal and Constitutional matter as it is anything else. So, pretending that the legal definitions and the Constitution doesn't matter seems kind of illogical to me.

I responded to a poll and I'm pretty sure, really without even checking with the dictionary or anyone else, that everyone is free to post or not post at their own discretion. But you carry on, I'm sure you have a long list of flames to toss out so I won't keep you.

I have nothing to gain by flaming you or anyone else.

I sincerely wished that you have answered my questions. If not for me, maybe for yourself.

If you takes a stand as you did, Why not show that you don't lack the courage to defend your convictions?

I've lived long enough to see all sides. If what I posted isn't enough, sorry.

End of line.......

Maybe others will read our exchange and answer the questions for themselves then.

 

[Illya. K. Makrus]

As a moderate conservative, abortion right is something on which I don't have a very strong opinion.
I think if the health or life of the mother is at stake, she should be allowed the option of abortion with a medical proof.
If a woman is raped, she should have the option of abortion as well. However, the abortion should be carried out at an early stage of pregnancy (e.g. 4 months).

 

[Chuz Life]

something that seems illogical to me is that I can be fined and put in jail for disturbing a turtle egg because it is or could kill a turtle. Yet, the human embryo, and even the fetus that has already developed arms and legs, has movement, feelings etc... is not considered a human life yet.
It is a shame that we give the life of a turtle more value than the life of a human.

Very well stated. But it's more than that.

It's all that you said - PLUS - it's during a time that we also have Fetal Homicide laws on the books that DO already recognize a child in the womb as a human being and already make it a crime of MURDER to kill one in a criminal act.

Then. . .

Just to make life crazier, those laws make exceptions to themselves to keep abortions legal.

Leaving the turtle eggs and butterflies more protected (as you said) than a child is while in the womb.

 

[Maryland Patriot]

Rape, incest or health of the mother. or a baby that will be born severely deformed or some other birth defect that will leave them with a very poor quality of life.
other than that there is only one reason left, and thats not a good enough reason for abortion.

Do children with birth defects have less a right to their life than typical "normal" healthy kids do?

depends on the severity of the defect. In some cases it could be considered showing mercy. As I said, leave them with a VERY POOR QUALITY OF LIFE.

I think I have a very poor quality of life sometimes. So, I hope you can appreciate my concern about the sentiments you have expressed.

I think that I answered even this question previously.
Do you have a poor quality of life every day? do people have to care for you 24/7? can you feed yourself? live without machines doing the job of your organs?
I hope you can appreciate what I mean by the sentiments that I have expressed.

Can we agree that it's subjective?

I think that would be a good start.

 

[Maryland Patriot]

I think a big part of the problem with this topic is that there are many out there that say no to abortion for whatever reason they have, yet at the same time they realize that there are instances where maybe abortion should be considered.
For instance, I think that rape or incest should allow for abortion. Yet, that contradicts my objection to abortion because its taking a human life. And even though I firmly believe that abortion is acceptable in those cases, I still have to ask myself, does that child being aborted have any less right to live simply due to the circumstances surrounding its conception.

 

[Carla_Danger]

When do the unborn babies get their rights? So some dumbass woman is too stupid to use proper birth control and she gets pregnant.

Murder is the solution for her stupidity. Hell, why not wait till the kid is 5-6 years old and kill him then? Why not wait till he graduates High School and off him then?

Sorry, but the options are not realistic. You lefties believe that a "fetus" (that term makes it less "personal" to you) isn't a "human" until it's born. That nonsense has been disproven by medical science, but you will not accept it.

So, since the idiot couldn't use simple birth control, and since the "rights" of the mother trump the "rights" of the unborn, the mother should be able to kill the child forever. Hell, why not? That would be right up your alleys, wouldn't it?

This has got to be the most ignorant post I've read today.

If the mother is a dumb ass and irresponsible, why do you want to force her to have a child? Isn't she the last person you'd want raising a child?

 

[Carla_Danger]

If men carried babies, we wouldn't be having this conversation, considering the fact that most men won't even change a diaper. lol

 

[Never3ndr]

I believe in the right to an abortion whenever. My reasoning is simply based upon weighing freedom of choice (for the woman and her body) and sanctity of life (for the unborn child) and leaning in favor of freedom of choice. It is primarily based upon the fact that I see that, until the woman stops supporting the child physically, it is part of her body and her decision on how to handle that body.

With that said, believing in the right to an abortion is not necessarily the same as encouraging abortion. I think that, especially given the decreasing birth rates of first world countries, that adoption should be the primary option for unwanted child...there are tons of families out there without the ability to reproduce that would love for the opportunity to raise a child of their own.

 

[Chuz Life]

I think a big part of the problem with this topic is that there are many out there that say no to abortion for whatever reason they have, yet at the same time they realize that there are instances where maybe abortion should be considered.
For instance, I think that rape or incest should allow for abortion. Yet, that contradicts my objection to abortion because its taking a human life. And even though I firmly believe that abortion is acceptable in those cases, I still have to ask myself, does that child being aborted have any less right to live simply due to the circumstances surrounding its conception.

I think you and I could have a very interesting and maybe even a productive exchange on the rape exception.

Interested?

 

[Chuz Life]

If men carried babies, we wouldn't be having this conversation, considering the fact that most men won't even change a diaper. lol

Yeah well, I was a single father with custody for over nine years and I have changed way more than my fair share of diapers.

Also, your comment suggests that you are completely unaware of how many women are just as anti-abortion as anyone else is.

 

[Chuz Life]

I believe in the right to an abortion whenever. My reasoning is simply based upon weighing freedom of choice (for the woman and her body) and sanctity of life (for the unborn child) and leaning in favor of freedom of choice. It is primarily based upon the fact that I see that, until the woman stops supporting the child physically, it is part of her body and her decision on how to handle that body.

With that said, believing in the right to an abortion is not necessarily the same as encouraging abortion. I think that, especially given the decreasing birth rates of first world countries, that adoption should be the primary option for unwanted child...there are tons of families out there without the ability to reproduce that would love for the opportunity to raise a child of their own.

The obvious response to that for me is to ask you if you believe that all persons have a right to their life?

If your answer to that is Yes. . . then please explain what good a person's right to their life is if it doesn't begin when their life does?

 

[Maryland Patriot]

I think a big part of the problem with this topic is that there are many out there that say no to abortion for whatever reason they have, yet at the same time they realize that there are instances where maybe abortion should be considered.
For instance, I think that rape or incest should allow for abortion. Yet, that contradicts my objection to abortion because its taking a human life. And even though I firmly believe that abortion is acceptable in those cases, I still have to ask myself, does that child being aborted have any less right to live simply due to the circumstances surrounding its conception.

I think you and I could have a very interesting and maybe even a productive exchange on the rape exception.

Interested?

Only problem with that is others that will join in.
but I do welcome the exchange. Not sure I would change my mind for various reasons, like, carrying and giving birth to the baby of either circumstance could cause psychological problems for the woman, so that goes back to the health of the mother. Its how I come to terms with it.