We Are Close to The End: “The Con Job Is Up”

[KevinWestern]

If you're concerned about a solar flare - you need mental help man.

Listen, I'm not quitting my day job to go speak at conferences about solar flares, or putting protective metal casings around my house. It's just a concern. Read this link; this topic is discussed/debated in scientific journals, by NASA, by NAS, and many other respectable institutions. I'm not pulling this out of my ass.

Is it fair to say those folks are mental as well? It would be consistent to do so, wouldn't it?

And I say that as a friend.

Thanks

Your quality of life can be enhanced tremendously if you let go of things you cannot control. & I do know you're a 9/11 truther. Mebbe I'm a bit skewed in my views of you.

But what are you saying, that we shouldn't prepare for events that are outside of our control? Maybe we should get rid of tornado shelters, or medicine stockpiles (for epidemics), etc. I'm just raising some concerns.

Also, I never directly implicated our Gov't in 9/11; I simply believe some weird shit went down and that we haven't been given the full story. Many respectable, highly educated, and well researched individuals share my view. I think if you're not skeptical of the Gov'ts "official" account of 9/11 you'd be in the minority of Americans.

 

[G.T.]

If you're concerned about a solar flare - you need mental help man.

Listen, I'm not quitting my day job to go speak at conferences about solar flares, or putting protective metal casings around my house. It's just a concern. Read this link; this topic is discussed/debated in scientific journals, by NASA, by NAS, and many other respectable institutions. I'm not pulling this out of my ass.

Is it fair to say those folks are mental as well? It would be consistent to do so, wouldn't it?

And I say that as a friend.

Thanks

Your quality of life can be enhanced tremendously if you let go of things you cannot control. & I do know you're a 9/11 truther. Mebbe I'm a bit skewed in my views of you.

But what are you saying, that we shouldn't prepare for events that are outside of our control? Maybe we should get rid of tornado shelters, or medicine stockpiles (for epidemics), etc. I'm just raising some concerns.

Also, I never directly implicated our Gov't in 9/11; I simply believe some weird shit went down and that we haven't been given the full story. Many respectable, highly educated, and well researched individuals share my view. I think if you're not skeptical of the Gov'ts "official" account of 9/11 you'd be in the minority of Americans.

No -

I'm not saying don't prepare to a reasonable degree. And the more reasonable the threat, the more reasonably you should prepare.

 

[R.C. Christian]

We'll be fine. If you're spending your time thinking the entire economic world will fully collapse - you're day dreaming. When everyone lost their shirts in the great depression, most everyone got a shirt back.

When (not even close to) everyone lost their shirts from the latest collapse, most of them got their shirt back.

Most people don't "hear about a fake recovery from the media," no, most people go outside and can see it with their eyeballs.

This whole conspiracy theorist tripe about "all your sheep listen to the MEDIA!!!!" bullshit is one gigantic P-R-O-J-E-C-T-I-O-N.

It is THEY who listen to CONSPIRACY THEORIST media, 9/11 truthers, etc. and bite on it hook line and sinker. Why? Because their brains think that the world is a cartoon, and it's more "fun" to believe the farcified suspenseful version of reality.

Fail, ROFLMAO ^^

 

[william the wie]

If you're concerned about a solar flare - you need mental help man.

Listen, I'm not quitting my day job to go speak at conferences about solar flares, or putting protective metal casings around my house. It's just a concern. Read this link; this topic is discussed/debated in scientific journals, by NASA, by NAS, and many other respectable institutions. I'm not pulling this out of my ass.

Is it fair to say those folks are mental as well? It would be consistent to do so, wouldn't it?

And I say that as a friend.

Thanks

Your quality of life can be enhanced tremendously if you let go of things you cannot control. & I do know you're a 9/11 truther. Mebbe I'm a bit skewed in my views of you.

But what are you saying, that we shouldn't prepare for events that are outside of our control? Maybe we should get rid of tornado shelters, or medicine stockpiles (for epidemics), etc. I'm just raising some concerns.

Also, I never directly implicated our Gov't in 9/11; I simply believe some weird shit went down and that we haven't been given the full story. Many respectable, highly educated, and well researched individuals share my view. I think if you're not skeptical of the Gov'ts "official" account of 9/11 you'd be in the minority of Americans.

Solar flares are also a great sales pitch for aluminum siding.

 

[Toddsterpatriot]

Here is my answer. There is a universal adolescent male fantasy where the world is ending and the hero of the piece will be left to carry on with a large number of nubile female companions, hopefully repopulating the planet. It's so old, it's in the Bible (Story of Lot's daughters, but there it was the nubile females who decided to get their father drunk enough to schtoop them and repopulate the world!).

That's the scientific answer provided by sociologists and psychologists for the free-floating fear and anticipation of the "end of the world" or coming catastrophe. For over three thousand years it probably has been number one on the masturbatory fantasy hit list. There is a female counterpart as well (the menaced princess threatened with rapine by the hoards of barbarians rescued by the gallant knight who will ravish her slightly more gently, producing the progeny to repopulate the reconstituted world of good as the barbarian world of evil is vanquished).

So when I hear this story again with no analysis or definite course of action that makes any sense, I file the comment under well repressed sexual fantasies. Economic policy might be a whole lot easier if people had sex more often.

Some day the sky will indeed fall and most people will be totally unprepared. Many of them will suffer icky and gruesome deaths. The survivors will undoubtedly comfort each other and nine months later there will be an uptick in births, which the media will duly note. It happens every disaster. So if I take any action in anticipation of such an event, it will be to stockpile condoms. Can you make them out of foil hats?

Thanks for response, and here's mine. Sure, a lot of folks over exaggerate things (and are ultra-cynical all the time), however I think we live in a completely unprecedented time with a lot of very scary things happening that have never before occurred in history as far as we know it:

Scary Stuff Specific to Our Time:
1.) Solar Flare. Before you call me crazy, hear me out. Giant flares are relatively common (ie happen every couple hundred years or so), and a big enough one today has the potential to take out ALL ELECTRONICS in North America, lol. This isn't a "theory" or "prophecy", this is simply a natural thing that happens all of the time (last one was in late 1800's (which of course was not as big of a deal for obvious reasons). If you're not concerned, I'd like to know why.

2.) The Economy. The Fed has been printing trillions of dollars over the past 5 years and continues to buy toxic assets from the Big Banks. Our country is at an estimated $17 Trillion in debt, but more in-depth estimates put that closer to $100+ Trillion. The banks still hold (too) over $700 trillion of derivatives on their books (ie what crashed the economy rd 1) and have not been reprimanded or forced to make any significant changes since the crash. All of these factors added up scare the hell out of me, if they don't you then why?

3.) The Gov't. I hate being cynical but you have to admit it's alarming that we have an NSA spying on every aspect of our lives (phone calls, social networks, emails, gps location, etc) & gathering data into a permanent record book (when has that level of privacy invasion ever occurred in history?), we have a gov't that's cracking down on the free press (ie AP scandal), lying to us repeatedly (ie "it was a movie that provoked a mob in Benghazi", "you can keep your plan", "this will be the most transparent admin in history" - lol, "lets go after these fat cats", etc). I don't think America has ever looked this bad, and quite frankly it's concerning.

In summary, in the past when there were collapses, declines, etc the world wasn't half as interconnected as it is today and therefore the damage was limited.

Today, with ultra powerful weapons, Governments that know the precise time and location each citizen jerks off, and our total dependence on technology to survive just (to me) are good reasons to be nervous about a major disaster.

It's not a fantasy, and if you think it is you're going to be blindsided.

The Fed has been printing trillions of dollars over the past 5 years and continues to buy toxic assets from the Big Banks.

Yes to the first, no to the second.
The Fed only buys guaranteed bonds, no toxic assets.

The banks still hold (too) over $700 trillion of derivatives on their books (ie what crashed the economy rd 1)

Yes, that big, notional number is scary. Actual "Value at Risk" is much, much smaller. The crash was caused by too many bad mortgages, not derivatives. If you know of a single bank that failed because of derivatives, please let me know.

 

[oldfart]

Thanks for response, and here's mine. Sure, a lot of folks over exaggerate things (and are ultra-cynical all the time), however I think we live in a completely unprecedented time with a lot of very scary things happening that have never before occurred in history as far as we know it:

Scary Stuff Specific to Our Time:
1.) Solar Flare. Before you call me crazy, hear me out. Giant flares are relatively common (ie happen every couple hundred years or so), and a big enough one today has the potential to take out ALL ELECTRONICS in North America, lol. This isn't a "theory" or "prophecy", this is simply a natural thing that happens all of the time (last one was in late 1800's (which of course was not as big of a deal for obvious reasons). If you're not concerned, I'd like to know why.

2.) The Economy. The Fed has been printing trillions of dollars over the past 5 years and continues to buy toxic assets from the Big Banks. Our country is at an estimated $17 Trillion in debt, but more in-depth estimates put that closer to $100+ Trillion. The banks still hold (too) over $700 trillion of derivatives on their books (ie what crashed the economy rd 1) and have not been reprimanded or forced to make any significant changes since the crash. All of these factors added up scare the hell out of me, if they don't you then why?

3.) The Gov't. I hate being cynical but you have to admit it's alarming that we have an NSA spying on every aspect of our lives (phone calls, social networks, emails, gps location, etc) & gathering data into a permanent record book (when has that level of privacy invasion ever occurred in history?), we have a gov't that's cracking down on the free press (ie AP scandal), lying to us repeatedly (ie "it was a movie that provoked a mob in Benghazi", "you can keep your plan", "this will be the most transparent admin in history" - lol, "lets go after these fat cats", etc). I don't think America has ever looked this bad, and quite frankly it's concerning.

I was aiming at the unspecific free-floating sense of doom. Indeed there are some very scary scenarios out there. Generally they divide into two types:

1. High probability processes that cause widespread decline in quality of life. My short list here includes overpopulation, global warming, water shortages, stress related to overcrowding, treatment resistant microbes, and social disintegration.

2. Low probability events with catastrophic consequences. Consider nuclear accidents including accidental launches, biological and radiological terrorism, war by misadventure, pandemics of mutated viruses with high mortality rates, catastrophic climate change, mega-volcanoes, astronomical events such as supernova bursts or asteroid strikes, ecological collapse resulting from lack of biodiversity, and of course Skynet deciding to take over.

The first type is a certainty. The only issue is how we choose to mitigate those changes and if we can create compensating improvements. These are remedies we can only accomplish as a society though, not as groups or individuals. The second type is also best addressed as a society.

In summary, in the past when there were collapses, declines, etc the world wasn't half as interconnected as it is today and therefore the damage was limited.

Today, with ultra powerful weapons, Governments that know the precise time and location each citizen jerks off, and our total dependence on technology to survive just (to me) are good reasons to be nervous about a major disaster.

It's not a fantasy, and if you think it is you're going to be blindsided.

Since no one knows which threat will be the BIG ONE or when, we have limited capacity to prepare for everything on the list. We will most assuredly be blindsided, we just don't by what and when. I posit that a rational response is not to pick the scenario we think most likely or damaging, but to concentrate on those measures which increase our capability to deal with sudden or unforeseen threats. If anything will save us, it will be increasing our generalized ability to respond and find radically new solutions.

 

[expat_panama]

... High probability processes that cause widespread decline in quality of life. My short list here includes overpopulation, global warming, water shortages, stress related to overcrowding...

Hardly.

(from the BBC)

It's a largely untold story - gradually, steadily the demographic forces that drove the global population growth in the 20th Century have shifted. Fifty years ago the world average fertility rate - the number of babies born per woman - was five. Since then, this most important number in demography has dropped to 2.5 - something unprecedented in human history - and fertility is still trending downwards. It's all thanks to a powerful combination of female education, access to contraceptives and abortion, and increased child survival.

Fifty years ago, the average life expectancy in the world was 60 years. Today it's 70 years. What's more, that average of 60 years in the 1960s masked a huge gap between long lifespans in "developed" and short lifespans in "developing" countries.

--and from Global-warming-No-actually-were-cooling-claim-scientists.html]Global warming? No, actually we're cooling, claim scientists - Telegraph and And now it's global COOLING! Return of Arctic ice cap as it grows by 29% in a year | Mail Online

... was aiming at the unspecific free-floating sense of doom...

Agreed. An adult can safely drive a car at 65 mph even while every second can represent instant flaming crushing death. All that's required is remaining an adult. In the same way we need to watch it with the economy, foreign crazies, domestic crazies, and the importance of the rule of law.

 

[KevinWestern]

Thanks for response, and here's mine. Sure, a lot of folks over exaggerate things (and are ultra-cynical all the time), however I think we live in a completely unprecedented time with a lot of very scary things happening that have never before occurred in history as far as we know it:

Scary Stuff Specific to Our Time:
1.) Solar Flare. Before you call me crazy, hear me out. Giant flares are relatively common (ie happen every couple hundred years or so), and a big enough one today has the potential to take out ALL ELECTRONICS in North America, lol. This isn't a "theory" or "prophecy", this is simply a natural thing that happens all of the time (last one was in late 1800's (which of course was not as big of a deal for obvious reasons). If you're not concerned, I'd like to know why.

2.) The Economy. The Fed has been printing trillions of dollars over the past 5 years and continues to buy toxic assets from the Big Banks. Our country is at an estimated $17 Trillion in debt, but more in-depth estimates put that closer to $100+ Trillion. The banks still hold (too) over $700 trillion of derivatives on their books (ie what crashed the economy rd 1) and have not been reprimanded or forced to make any significant changes since the crash. All of these factors added up scare the hell out of me, if they don't you then why?

3.) The Gov't. I hate being cynical but you have to admit it's alarming that we have an NSA spying on every aspect of our lives (phone calls, social networks, emails, gps location, etc) & gathering data into a permanent record book (when has that level of privacy invasion ever occurred in history?), we have a gov't that's cracking down on the free press (ie AP scandal), lying to us repeatedly (ie "it was a movie that provoked a mob in Benghazi", "you can keep your plan", "this will be the most transparent admin in history" - lol, "lets go after these fat cats", etc). I don't think America has ever looked this bad, and quite frankly it's concerning.

I was aiming at the unspecific free-floating sense of doom. Indeed there are some very scary scenarios out there. Generally they divide into two types:

1. High probability processes that cause widespread decline in quality of life. My short list here includes overpopulation, global warming, water shortages, stress related to overcrowding, treatment resistant microbes, and social disintegration.

2. Low probability events with catastrophic consequences. Consider nuclear accidents including accidental launches, biological and radiological terrorism, war by misadventure, pandemics of mutated viruses with high mortality rates, catastrophic climate change, mega-volcanoes, astronomical events such as supernova bursts or asteroid strikes, ecological collapse resulting from lack of biodiversity, and of course Skynet deciding to take over.

The first type is a certainty. The only issue is how we choose to mitigate those changes and if we can create compensating improvements. These are remedies we can only accomplish as a society though, not as groups or individuals. The second type is also best addressed as a society.

In summary, in the past when there were collapses, declines, etc the world wasn't half as interconnected as it is today and therefore the damage was limited.

Today, with ultra powerful weapons, Governments that know the precise time and location each citizen jerks off, and our total dependence on technology to survive just (to me) are good reasons to be nervous about a major disaster.

It's not a fantasy, and if you think it is you're going to be blindsided.

Since no one knows which threat will be the BIG ONE or when, we have limited capacity to prepare for everything on the list. We will most assuredly be blindsided, we just don't by what and when. I posit that a rational response is not to pick the scenario we think most likely or damaging, but to concentrate on those measures which increase our capability to deal with sudden or unforeseen threats. If anything will save us, it will be increasing our generalized ability to respond and find radically new solutions.

Yes, all good points. I agree with many too.

However, just need to emphasize that I’m not in the same class of “doomsday” predictor as a guy saying it in 500 AD or 500 BC. And why? Because the changes that impacted the human race in the 20th century are completely and utterly unique to anything that we’ve experienced in recorded history. The invention and proliferation of the “computer” is as pivotal and revolutionary as the discovery of fire.

In the past rulers had primitive guns/swords to control the population, and this is literally the start of recorded history - 1900. Now they have nuclear bombs, jet planes, and computers. The potential to destroy ourselves literally jumped 100 fold in the past 100 years, and that is why I am raising various alarms in my postings. And although a "total apocalypse scenario" is quite unlikely, I think (because of all these advances in weapons, etc) the shocks will be much more shocking than we've ever seen before and I don't think we're doing enough to prepare.

Those are my two cents. I don't think people fully realize the uniqueness of the time we live in.

 

[SteadyMercury]

However, just want to emphasize (you must not forget) that we are living in a truly unique time that is unlike any other in history.

Same can be said for any moment in history.

Hey we have industrialization, this is like no other time in history. Hey we have ICBMs this is like no other time in history. Hey we invented the plow. Hey we have antibiotics. Bronze. Democracy. Electricity. Space travel. The wheel. Birth control.

Etc.

 

[KevinWestern]

However, just want to emphasize (you must not forget) that we are living in a truly unique time that is unlike any other in history.

Same can be said for any moment in history.

Hey we have industrialization, this is like no other time in history. Hey we have ICBMs this is like no other time in history. Hey we invented the plow. Hey we have antibiotics. Bronze. Democracy. Electricity. Space travel. The wheel. Birth control.

Etc.

Perhaps I could rephrase and say "everything changed" at the start of the Industrialization era. If you look again at your list, antibiotics/democracy (on such a wide scale)/electricity/Space travel/birth control - most of the items on your list - happen to fall within the last 200 years or so.

The only two you list prior to that is bronze/the wheel.

Point is I can list more world changing devices/inventions/concepts that have emerged in the past 200 years than in the previous 10k. Cars, planes, internet, nuclear bomb, biological weapons, high powered firearms, etc, etc.

And what about my main point - our potential to destroy ourselves. What leap in weaponry (in history) rivaled the creation of the nuclear bomb + fighter jet + targeting computer? A sword? A wheel? Not even comparable.

 

[HereWeGoAgain]

I find it rather odd that the libs here want to mock people who prepare for a possible disaster and say we are nuts.
Yet they constantly talk about the end of the world due to global warming?
WTF Libs??
So which is it? Is global warming a huge threat or not? Apparently you dont think so...

 

[william the wie]

... High probability processes that cause widespread decline in quality of life. My short list here includes overpopulation, global warming, water shortages, stress related to overcrowding...

Hardly.

(from the BBC)

It's a largely untold story - gradually, steadily the demographic forces that drove the global population growth in the 20th Century have shifted. Fifty years ago the world average fertility rate - the number of babies born per woman - was five. Since then, this most important number in demography has dropped to 2.5 - something unprecedented in human history - and fertility is still trending downwards. It's all thanks to a powerful combination of female education, access to contraceptives and abortion, and increased child survival.

Fifty years ago, the average life expectancy in the world was 60 years. Today it's 70 years. What's more, that average of 60 years in the 1960s masked a huge gap between long lifespans in "developed" and short lifespans in "developing" countries.

--and from Global-warming-No-actually-were-cooling-claim-scientists.html]Global warming? No, actually we're cooling, claim scientists - Telegraph and And now it's global COOLING! Return of Arctic ice cap as it grows by 29% in a year | Mail Online

... was aiming at the unspecific free-floating sense of doom...

Agreed. An adult can safely drive a car at 65 mph even while every second can represent instant flaming crushing death. All that's required is remaining an adult. In the same way we need to watch it with the economy, foreign crazies, domestic crazies, and the importance of the rule of law.

A question.

With the demographic data you must have also run across the peak population data as well. with the size of downward revisions growing should that be a separate thread?

 

[Rebelitarian]

So what I always ask when I see these "end is neigh" type threads, how are you guys positioning your finances to be ready? This is an economics forum, lets hear it.

Does anyone actually walk the walk and take action, or does the belief in the coming collapse only inspire action as far as moving fingers over a keyboard? Did you cash out your 401k? Bury gold in the yard? What is the plan?

Join the secesionists and take back America.

That is the plan.

We have the advantage we need to take it and not let it be taken from us.

 

[Rebelitarian]

Thats one of the problems with a global economy. We all sink when the shit hits the fan.

Yup, yet you still see the occasional poster claiming China is going to have a hissy fit and do (insert drastic action here) to destroy the US economy. It doesn't make sense.

Beijing's Secret War On America -
How China Expects To Win


Beijing's Secret War On America - How China Expects To Win

 

[Rebelitarian]

...I don't really see the catastrophe even coming. Just some market corrections.

OK, although there are others that can see twelve million additional jobless since '08, outlays for debt interest that will top a $trillion/year when rates go back up, entrenched federal control over the medical and automotive industries, an emboldened nuclear Iran chanting "Death to America", and a severe erosion of the rule of law.

Let's agree that those are valid concerns that we've really got to address.

How many of those jobless are retirees? How many have gotten their jobs back? How many big corporate companies have lifted their hiring and wage freezes that were caused by the recession (most, if not all - including mine).

Iran's been doing that since the 80's bro. Once 30 years go by, you kind of get the idea that the worst thing that's going to happen is that we have to bomb their tiny 'lil selves and have another useless war.

Our wars don't destroy our economy.

No but the Federal Reserve and hyper-inflation might !!!!!

 

[william the wie]

China has lots of plans but with 50-100 trillion dollars in bad loans and US productivity on course to intercepting the wage differential within two year what do their plans matter?

 

[SteadyMercury]

Perhaps I could rephrase and say "everything changed" at the start of the Industrialization era. If you look again at your list, antibiotics/democracy (on such a wide scale)/electricity/Space travel/birth control - most of the items on your list - happen to fall within the last 200 years or so.

The only two you list prior to that is bronze/the wheel.

I'm sure I could go back a lot farther in time finding more than bronze and the wheel. Gunpowder, the written word, taming of fire, domestication of beasts, intercontinental sailing, irrigation, astronomy, etc.

God I sound like I'm playing Civ 4

 

[SteadyMercury]

Join the secesionists and take back America.

That is the plan.

We have the advantage we need to take it and not let it be taken from us.

Ha ha "we" come on dude you aren't doing shit more than typing on your computer.

 

[expat_panama]

...must have also run across the peak population data as well. with the size of downward revisions growing should that be a separate thread?

Some how it all seems like old news to me. Overpopulation hysteria is like global warming mania; like, it's always been political with no basis in fact.

 

[william the wie]

...must have also run across the peak population data as well. with the size of downward revisions growing should that be a separate thread?

Some how it all seems like old news to me. Overpopulation hysteria is like global warming mania; like, it's always been political with no basis in fact.

At the rate things are going my money is on less than 8 Billion and a peak by 2030. The decline in birthrates and increase in economic growthrates in subSaharan seems to be going hyperbolic. GDP per head had overlapped with Europe in Africa 20 years ago I believe. But then again Frogs is Frogs regardless of skin color, French speaking as opposed to English, Spanish and Portuguese speaking Africa is still the pits.