What is the goal of capitalism?

[Toddsterpatriot]

It's the fossil fuel industry that funds the conspiracy theorists against global warming and any industry that undermines its profits, including of course nuclear energy.

If I see a commercial touting the reliability of cheap power from natural gas, I'm going to agree.

I haven't seen any arguing against reliable nuclear power lately. Have you?

 

[Red Front]

Capitalism prefers long-term treatments to cures

That's awful!

Where are the commie cures?

You often resort to death toll arguments in your cheap rhetoric against socialism, and conveniently forget to factor in the much high death toll of capitalism

You should list those capitalism death tolls again. Pick your 3 favorites so we can discuss.

Read the points I made and stop ignoring them. Socialism/Communism is whenever the government gets involved according to your fellow Libertarians. AOC is supposedly a "commie", and so is the whole democratic party. So if you want to talk about "commie cures", that's it. Government can do it, without your beloved imaginary "free-market".

 

[Toddsterpatriot]

Read the points I made and stop ignoring them. Socialism/Communism is whenever the government gets involved according to your fellow Libertarians. AOC is supposedly a "commie", and so is the whole democratic party. So if you want to talk about "commie cures", that's it. Government can do it, without your beloved imaginary "free-market".

No cancer curing pill came out of the USSR?
What about from Cuba? Venezuela?

I'm willing to listen to your evidence.

 

[Red Front]

Show all the oil spending that's stopping new nuclear power.
Any anti-nuclear commercials funded by Exxon?

I already did, you need to comprehend what you read. All of the lobby money and funds that support the anti-global warming conspiracy movement. It's the fossil fuel industry that fuels it.

 

[Red Front]

No cancer curing pill came out of the USSR?
What about from Cuba? Venezuela?

I'm willing to listen to your evidence.

Interestingly enough, Cuba developed an effective Covid vaccine, despite the sanctions and other challenges. You're completely ignoring all the points I made. Nothing you're saying is relevant.

 

[Toddsterpatriot]

I already did, you need to comprehend what you read. All of the lobby money and funds that support the anti-global warming conspiracy movement. It's the fossil fuel industry that fuels it.

When was the last anti-nuclear commercial or print ad that you saw which was funded by big oil?

I agree, they fund a lot of stuff against the current green idiocy.

It's not a conspiracy to point out that the Green New Deal is beyond moronic.

 

[Red Front]

If I see a commercial touting the reliability of cheap power from natural gas, I'm going to agree.

I haven't seen any arguing against reliable nuclear power lately. Have you?

There's a huge movement against nuclear power that is fueled by the fossil-fuel industry. They hate the data for global warming, supported by practically all of science, and they contribute to the fearmongering against nuclear. It's somewhat similar to how alcohol companies lobby Congress against marijuana legalization. They don't want another recreational substance on the market to compete with. The private prison lobby and prison guard lobby also fund legislation against the legalization of marijuana, along with the alcohol lobby. That's how capitalism functions. Cronyism is endemic to capitalism, concentrating capital and political power at the top, turning democracy into a plutocracy and oligarchy.

It's not in their interest for us to drive electric cars and rely on nuclear energy. Hello?

 

[Toddsterpatriot]

Interestingly enough, Cuba developed an effective Covid vaccine, despite the sanctions and other challenges. You're completely ignoring all the points I made. Nothing you're saying is relevant.

Was it anything beyond stolen western IP?

It's true, I ignored all your cancer cures that didn't cure cancer.

 

[Toddsterpatriot]

There's a huge movement against nuclear power that is fueled by the fossil-fuel industry. They hate the data for global warming, supported by practically all of science, and they contribute to the fearmongering against nuclear. It's somewhat similar to how alcohol companies lobby Congress against marijuana legalization. They don't want another recreational substance on the market to compete with. The private prison lobby and prison guard lobby also fund legislation against the legalization of marijuana, along with the alcohol lobby. That's how capitalism functions. Cronyism is endemic to capitalism, concentrating capital and political power at the top, turning democracy into a plutocracy and oligarchy.

It's not in their interest for us to adopt electric cars and rely on nuclear energy. Hello?

There's a huge movement against nuclear power that is fueled by the fossil-fueled industry.

Post your evidence.

They hate the data for global warming,

There is something to be said for affordable, reliable fossil fuels.
If you want to trust your mother's respirator to solar power, just say so.

 

[Red Front]

Was it anything beyond stolen western IP?

It's true, I ignored all your cancer cures that didn't cure cancer.

The issue isn't whether we now have a cure for cancer in China or from another supposed communist government, but whether capitalism impedes the development of cures in the United States and I've already provided evidence of that.

"Richter cited Gilead Sciences’ treatments for hepatitis C, which achieved cure rates of more than 90 percent. The company’s U.S. sales for these hepatitis C treatments peaked at $12.5 billion in 2015, but have been falling ever since. Goldman estimates the U.S. sales for these treatments will be less than $4 billion this year, according to a table in the report.

GILD is a case in point, where the success of its hepatitis C franchise has gradually exhausted the available pool of treatable patients,” the analyst wrote. “In the case of infectious diseases such as hepatitis C, curing existing patients also decreases the number of carriers able to transmit the virus to new patients, thus the incident pool also declines … Where an incident pool remains stable (eg, in cancer) the potential for a cure poses less risk to the sustainability of a franchise."

Goldman Sachs asks in biotech research report: 'Is curing patients a sustainable business model?'​

Goldman Sachs warns sales from the most successful disease treatments are difficult to maintain.

www.cnbc.com
It's not profitable for capitalists to cure the disease, just to keep it stable and people alive with the disease as long as possible.

When What’s Good For The World Is Bad For Business | Current Affairs​

www.currentaffairs.org

Commercial viability or profitability doesn't always align with societal needs or the public good. In a socialist society, we will focus on a permanent, effective cure. Whether we've developed one in the past or have one now is irrelevant to the point that's being made. You're also ignoring your claim that all valuable products or goods that serve the public, are commercially viable. I showed how that's not the case at all.

 

[BothWings]

Capitalism gives everyone a chance at wealth.
If you apply yourself even the poorest person can achieve success.
While socialism wants everyone to be equal...equally poor that is.
There's an old russian saying....we pretend to work because they pretend to pay us.
With socialism/communism there's no incentive to work harder because you'll still be paid the same.

Execept when organized and highly selfish parties take over certain areas of the market and slam the door on any noobs coming in and setting up shop. Just look at Walmart in the early 2000's. Small businesses were dropping like flies...and it had nothing to do with socialism. Walmart was moving into small towns and took over neighborhood after neighborhood. Only another megacorporation could possibly compete with that. Is that what we want? Colossal megacorporations clashing for supremacy in the name of capitalism? If they have had their way without having to follow rules of fair play, small businesses wouldn't have a chance.

 

[Toddsterpatriot]

The issue isn't whether we now have a cure for cancer in China or from another supposed communist government, but whether capitalism impedes the development of cures in the United States and I've already provided evidence of that.

"Richter cited Gilead Sciences’ treatments for hepatitis C, which achieved cure rates of more than 90 percent. The company’s U.S. sales for these hepatitis C treatments peaked at $12.5 billion in 2015, but have been falling ever since. Goldman estimates the U.S. sales for these treatments will be less than $4 billion this year, according to a table in the report.

GILD is a case in point, where the success of its hepatitis C franchise has gradually exhausted the available pool of treatable patients,” the analyst wrote. “In the case of infectious diseases such as hepatitis C, curing existing patients also decreases the number of carriers able to transmit the virus to new patients, thus the incident pool also declines … Where an incident pool remains stable (eg, in cancer) the potential for a cure poses less risk to the sustainability of a franchise."

Goldman Sachs asks in biotech research report: 'Is curing patients a sustainable business model?'​

Goldman Sachs warns sales from the most successful disease treatments are difficult to maintain.

www.cnbc.com
It's not profitable for capitalists to cure the disease, just to keep it stable and people alive with the disease as long as possible.

When What’s Good For The World Is Bad For Business | Current Affairs​

www.currentaffairs.org

Commercial viability or profitability doesn't always align with societal needs or the public good. In a socialist society, we will focus on a permanent, effective cure. Whether we've developed one in the past or have one now is irrelevant to the point that's being made. You're also ignoring your claim that all valuable products or goods that serve the public, are commercially viable. I showed how that's not the case at all.

The issue isn't whether we now have a cure for cancer in China or from another supposed communist government, but whether capitalism impedes the development of cures in the United States and I've already provided evidence of that.

No capitalistic impeding in the USSR or Red China. No cures either, obviously.

GILD is a case in point, where the success of its hepatitis C franchise has gradually exhausted the available pool of treatable patients,”

They cured most of the patients and made tens of billions. Just awful!
A company that did the same for cancer would make hundreds of billions for decades.
Not to mention the Nobel Prizes, magazine covers, supermodel girlfriends.

Where is your evidence they're sitting on cures?

In a socialist society, we will focus on a permanent, effective cure.

Where is your focus? Where is your cure?

Too busy trying not to starve in your worker's paradise?

Whether we've developed one in the past or have one now is irrelevant to the point that's being made.

Why is the socialist failure to do anything close to what capitalists have done ever irrelevant?

 

[Toddsterpatriot]

Walmart was moving into small towns and took over neighborhood after neighborhood.

Greater selection, lower prices. The humanity!!!

 

[Red Front]

Was it anything beyond stolen western IP?

It's true, I ignored all your cancer cures that didn't cure cancer.

"The fossil fuel industry starting from the 1950s was engaging in campaigns against the nuclear industry which it perceived as a threat to their commercial interests.[33][34] Organizations such as the American Petroleum Institute, the Pennsylvania Independent Oil and Gas Association and Marcellus Shale Coalition were engaged in anti-nuclear lobbying in the late 2010s[35] and from 2019, large fossil fuel suppliers started advertising campaigns portraying fossil gas as a "perfect partner for renewables" (wording from Shell and Statoil advertisements).[36][37] Fossil fuel companies such as Atlantic Richfield were also donors to environmental organizations with clear anti-nuclear stances, such as Friends of the Earth.[36][38] Groups like the Sierra Club, Environmental Defense Fund and Natural Resources Defense Council are receiving grants from other fossil fuel companies.[39][36][40] As of 2011, a strategy paper released by Greenpeace titled "Battle of Grids" proposed gradual replacement of nuclear power by fossil gas plants which would provide "flexible backup for wind and solar power".[41]"

Anti-nuclear movement - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

Friends of the Earth :: Works to kill nuclear power around the world and refuses to disclose its donors.

"The American Petroleum Institute, the nation's biggest and most influential lobbying group for the oil and natural gas industry, is fighting nuclear power subsidies across the U.S., poised to oppose any efforts to expand renewable electricity, and telling the Trump administration that its study on the power grid better not hurt natural gas in an effort to help coal and nuclear energy.

Why it matters: The entry of API into the debate over power generation is a turning point in an industry long dominated by coal and nuclear energy. It's also a shift at an organization traditionally known for focusing on drilling and the transportation sector. API's members, including Exxon Mobil Corp., and Royal Dutch Shell, are increasingly producing natural gas, and now the group is fighting to make sure that fuel becomes America's dominant source of electricity.

A decade ago, coal powered almost 50% of U.S. electricity. By last year, that figure had dropped to 30%, and natural gas has made up most of the difference. Here's an Axios card deck primer on America's electricity sources.

Fueled by the oil and natural gas boom over the last decade, API began moving into the electricity business in late 2015, when it acquired another trade group, America's Natural Gas Alliance, whose sole mission was to pump up demand for natural gas. API's broader mission has come into clearer focus over the last few months in three ways."

Loading…

www.axios.com

​

Corporate & Energy Interest Funding for Anti-Nuclear Groups​

Sierra Club :: Has taken $136 million from nat gas/ renewables interests that stand to profit from the closure of nuclear plants.

Natural Resources Defense Council (NRDC) :: Has minimum of $70 million directly invested in oil and gas renewable energy interests that stand to profit from the closure of nuclear plants.

Environmental Defense Fund :: Has received minimum of $60 million from oil, gas, & renewables investors who would directly benefit from EDF's anti-nuclear advocacy.

WISE International :: Funded by renewable energy interests that stand to profit from the closure of nuclear plants.

Environmental Law and Policy Center (ELPC) Funded by natural gas and renewable energy interests that stand to profit from the closure of nuclear plants.

Just google "Fossil Fuel Industry against Nuclear Energy" or "Fossil Fuel Industry Lobby Against Nuclear", and you'll get a mountain of evidence. These fossil fuel companies even fund the "greenies" that you hate. They fund all of that shit.

Capitalists fund liberals as well. This is another issue but nonetheless, it shows how capitalists only care about profits and that's it. All of the gender dysphoria and lunacy, injecting children with puberty blockers. It's funded by very wealthy powerful capitalists. They see this as a lucrative business opportunity. Getting children hooked on expensive hormone treatments and surgeries FOREVER. They love that shit. They'll gladly keep us hooked on fossil fuels when we could be building nuclear plants and drawing all of our energy form clean, safe nuclear.

The anti-nuclear green lobby is indeed full of shit, and they receive money from big oil, believe it or not. Do you know why? Because everyone knows that we can't rely 100% on freaking solar panels and batteries. Relying on windmills in 2023? Don Quixote? We need nuclear and the greenies have drunk the anti-nuclear Kool-Aid.

 

[Red Front]

The issue isn't whether we now have a cure for cancer in China or from another supposed communist government, but whether capitalism impedes the development of cures in the United States and I've already provided evidence of that.

No capitalistic impeding in the USSR or Red China. No cures either, obviously.

GILD is a case in point, where the success of its hepatitis C franchise has gradually exhausted the available pool of treatable patients,”

They cured most of the patients and made tens of billions. Just awful!
A company that did the same for cancer would make hundreds of billions for decades.
Not to mention the Nobel Prizes, magazine covers, supermodel girlfriends.

Where is your evidence they're sitting on cures?

In a socialist society, we will focus on a permanent, effective cure.

Where is your focus? Where is your cure?

Too busy trying not to starve in your worker's paradise?

Whether we've developed one in the past or have one now is irrelevant to the point that's being made.

Why is the socialist failure to do anything close to what capitalists have done ever irrelevant?

Capitalism makes finding a cure even less likely. It's actually the government that funds cures, not capitalism. So whether it's socialism here in the US or somewhere else, that hasn't found a cure yet, eventually, we will, and when we find it, it will be despite capitalism, not because of it.

The democratic party is "communist", or "socialist" because it's for the government "doing stuff" rather than the private sector and its "free market" doing everything. When we communists point out the government's crucial role in developing pharmaceuticals, then "government doing stuff", magically isn't really communism or socialism anymore. How convenient.

A couple of weeks ago Todd and I were discussing how Walmart pays so little that many of its employees have to rely on government assistance, like food stamps. The government is essentially subsidizing Walmart's workforce, despite it being one of the wealthiest companies in the world. Its CEO makes 1000+ times more than the lowest-paid employee in their stores. I proposed that the government can offer all Americans an employment guarantee. If you can't find a job in the private sector, you have a job in the public sector, in government. There's plenty to be done in this country, rebuilding and maintaining our infrastructure. The government's "public works department" can employ tens of millions of Americans.

This will stimulate the economy and actually increase the profits of both small, local businesses and big outlet stores like Walmart. More Americans, making good money, translates into more customers, buying your products, eating in your restaurant..etc. Do you know what Todd's response was?

"UUUUuuuuuUUUUuuuu that's the Soviet Union. That's Commie Shit."​

The government doing stuff = commie shit. Well if the US government's resources are crucial in the development of pharmaceuticals/cures for disease, then it's essentially socialism, "commie-shit", that will be responsible for the cure for cancer, not Todd's beloved, imaginary "free market". We don't need rich capitalists like Todd. Why is Todd so emotionally involved in this discussion? He's a pearl-clutching rich dude or a completely brainwashed working-class person, who drank the capitalist Kool-Aid. He votes against his own interests at the ballot box. He's one of capitalism's many working-class drones. I suspect he's a pearl clutcher and not of the working-class.

 

[Toddsterpatriot]

"The fossil fuel industry starting from the 1950s was engaging in campaigns against the nuclear industry which it perceived as a threat to their commercial interests.[33][34] Organizations such as the American Petroleum Institute, the Pennsylvania Independent Oil and Gas Association and Marcellus Shale Coalition were engaged in anti-nuclear lobbying in the late 2010s[35] and from 2019, large fossil fuel suppliers started advertising campaigns portraying fossil gas as a "perfect partner for renewables" (wording from Shell and Statoil advertisements).[36][37] Fossil fuel companies such as Atlantic Richfield were also donors to environmental organizations with clear anti-nuclear stances, such as Friends of the Earth.[36][38] Groups like the Sierra Club, Environmental Defense Fund and Natural Resources Defense Council are receiving grants from other fossil fuel companies.[39][36][40] As of 2011, a strategy paper released by Greenpeace titled "Battle of Grids" proposed gradual replacement of nuclear power by fossil gas plants which would provide "flexible backup for wind and solar power".[41]"

Anti-nuclear movement - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

Friends of the Earth :: Works to kill nuclear power around the world and refuses to disclose its donors.

"The American Petroleum Institute, the nation's biggest and most influential lobbying group for the oil and natural gas industry, is fighting nuclear power subsidies across the U.S., poised to oppose any efforts to expand renewable electricity, and telling the Trump administration that its study on the power grid better not hurt natural gas in an effort to help coal and nuclear energy.

Why it matters: The entry of API into the debate over power generation is a turning point in an industry long dominated by coal and nuclear energy. It's also a shift at an organization traditionally known for focusing on drilling and the transportation sector. API's members, including Exxon Mobil Corp., and Royal Dutch Shell, are increasingly producing natural gas, and now the group is fighting to make sure that fuel becomes America's dominant source of electricity.

A decade ago, coal powered almost 50% of U.S. electricity. By last year, that figure had dropped to 30%, and natural gas has made up most of the difference. Here's an Axios card deck primer on America's electricity sources.

Fueled by the oil and natural gas boom over the last decade, API began moving into the electricity business in late 2015, when it acquired another trade group, America's Natural Gas Alliance, whose sole mission was to pump up demand for natural gas. API's broader mission has come into clearer focus over the last few months in three ways."

Loading…

www.axios.com

​

Corporate & Energy Interest Funding for Anti-Nuclear Groups​

Sierra Club :: Has taken $136 million from nat gas/ renewables interests that stand to profit from the closure of nuclear plants.

Natural Resources Defense Council (NRDC) :: Has minimum of $70 million directly invested in oil and gas renewable energy interests that stand to profit from the closure of nuclear plants.

Environmental Defense Fund :: Has received minimum of $60 million from oil, gas, & renewables investors who would directly benefit from EDF's anti-nuclear advocacy.

WISE International :: Funded by renewable energy interests that stand to profit from the closure of nuclear plants.

Environmental Law and Policy Center (ELPC) Funded by natural gas and renewable energy interests that stand to profit from the closure of nuclear plants.

Just google "Fossil Fuel Industry against Nuclear Energy" or "Fossil Fuel Industry Lobby Against Nuclear", and you'll get a mountain of evidence. These fossil fuel companies even fund the "greenies" that you hate. They fund all of that shit.

Capitalists fund liberals as well. This is another issue but nonetheless, it shows how capitalists only care about profits and that's it. All of the gender dysphoria and lunacy, injecting children with puberty blockers. It's funded by very wealthy powerful capitalists. They see this as a lucrative business opportunity. Getting children hooked on expensive hormone treatments and surgeries FOREVER. They love that shit. They'll gladly keep us hooked on fossil fuels when we could be building nuclear plants and drawing all of our energy form clean, safe nuclear.

The anti-nuclear green lobby is indeed full of shit, and they receive money from big oil, believe it or not. Do you know why? Because everyone knows that we can't rely 100% on freaking solar panels and batteries. Relying on windmills in 2023? Don Quixote? We need nuclear and the greenies have drunk the anti-nuclear Kool-Aid.

Organizations such as the American Petroleum Institute, the Pennsylvania Independent Oil and Gas Association and Marcellus Shale Coalition were engaged in anti-nuclear lobbying in the late 2010s[35]
Finally! A real link.

They don't want handouts to current nuclear power plants to keep them open and compete
against current natural gas plants. If the greens weren't such stupid twats, they'd back nuclear.

But they are, so they won't.

 

[Toddsterpatriot]

Because everyone knows that we can't rely 100% on freaking solar panels and batteries.

Not everybody, eh Dagosa ?

 

[Red Front]

Organizations such as the American Petroleum Institute, the Pennsylvania Independent Oil and Gas Association and Marcellus Shale Coalition were engaged in anti-nuclear lobbying in the late 2010s[35]
Finally! A real link.

View attachment 809819

They don't want handouts to current nuclear power plants to keep them open and compete
against current natural gas plants. If the greens weren't such stupid twats, they'd back nuclear.

But they are, so they won't.

Whether nuclear is commercially viable or not is irrelevant. I already showed you how goods and services don't have to be profitable or deemed "commercially viable" by capitalists, to serve the public good, offering a valuable product or service. The fossil fuel industry gets a fortune in government subsidies:

RANK	PARENT	SUBSIDY VALUE.	NUMBER OF AWARDS
1	Boeing	$15,136,286,466	946
2	Intel	$8,371,896,017	133
3	Ford Motor	$7,761,916,195	815
4	General Motors	$7,594,509,872	990
5	Micron Technology	$6,785,681,915	18
6	Alcoa	$5,798,600,778	160
7	X-Energy LLC	$5,661,511,202	17
8	General Atomics	$5,465,529,295	438
9	Cheniere Energy	$5,431,565,870	41
10	Amazon.com	$5,191,773,349	333
11	Foxconn Technology Group (Hon Hai Precision Industry Company)	$4,827,036,483	76
12	Sempra Energy	$3,835,098,001	53
13	Southern Company	$3,783,360,569	130
14	NRG Energy	$3,586,516,301	268
15	Venture Global LNG	$3,285,883,566	6
16	NextEra Energy	$3,003,823,754	117
17	Tesla Inc.	$2,836,366,619	116
18	Sasol	$2,836,049,845	72
19	Stellantis	$2,800,442,867	230
20	Volkswagen	$2,740,983,143	222
21	General Electric	$2,529,193,561	1,668
22	Nucor	$2,514,358,340	158
23	Walt Disney	$2,421,304,588	248
24	Brookfield Asset Management	$2,339,430,278	304
25	Toyota	$2,303,826,689	199
26	Iberdrola	$2,285,768,043	112
27	Summit Power	$2,240,568,236	8
28	Shell PLC	$2,184,517,527	141
29	Oracle	$2,167,890,528	88
30	Mubadala Investment Company	$2,124,035,097	62
31	Nike	$2,104,917,829	138
32	Hyundai Motor	$2,072,957,848	27
33	SCS Energy	$1,927,236,683	10
34	Archer Daniels Midland	$1,920,305,787	1,099
35	Exxon Mobil	$1,891,153,489	207
36	NuScale Power	$1,880,780,589	34
37	Berkshire Hathaway	$1,859,775,471	1,158
38	Nissan	$1,842,814,165	87
39	Alphabet Inc.	$1,832,565,977	116
40	Paramount Global	$1,751,801,882	317
41	Apple Inc.	$1,750,043,420	36
42	Comcast	$1,722,467,426	376
43	JPMorgan Chase	$1,663,890,873	1,129
44	Cleveland-Cliffs	$1,654,401,303	137
45	Energy Transfer	$1,634,074,422	106
46	Samsung	$1,586,310,806	70
47	PG&E Corp.	$1,568,027,901	27
48	IBM Corp.	$1,562,738,626	387
49	SkyWest	$1,550,492,958	683
50	Rivian Automotive Inc.	$1,532,854,012	3
51	OGE Energy	$1,427,570,182	15
52	Panasonic	$1,385,969,341	61
53	Raytheon Technologies	$1,322,899,721	952
54	Duke Energy	$1,318,084,164	69
55	Lockheed Martin	$1,302,847,415	337
56	Corning Inc.	$1,272,628,059	395
57	Northrop Grumman	$1,266,804,354	266
58	Vingroup	$1,254,000,000	1
59	Continental AG	$1,244,875,478	111
60	Vornado Realty Trust	$1,243,857,336	32
61	Microsoft	$1,153,690,869	103
62	Jefferies Financial Group	$1,120,662,497	18
63	Meta Platforms Inc.	$1,105,098,844	53
64	Dow Inc.	$1,091,152,544	686
65	Abengoa	$1,082,660,583	63
66	SK Holdings	$1,081,550,283	9
67	LG	$1,055,690,737	103
68	Valero Energy	$1,054,520,860	199
69	Exelon	$1,040,601,369	98
70	AES Corp.	$1,010,194,632	132
71	CF Industries	$982,271,715	129
72	Pyramid Companies	$966,050,097	91
73	EDF-Electricite de France	$940,247,983	65
74	Texas Instruments	$940,071,436	60
75	Mazda Toyota Manufacturing, U.S.A., Inc.	$900,000,000	1
76	Air Products & Chemicals	$897,651,105	248
77	Delta Air Lines	$876,412,623	14
78	Centene	$875,064,432	54
79	Bayer	$849,175,809	202
80	Honda	$846,026,154	91
81	Enterprise Products Partners	$826,988,371	83
82	Shin-Etsu Chemical	$826,062,285	104
83	SunEdison	$812,753,318	119
84	Apollo Global Management	$804,565,970	471
85	Goldman Sachs	$801,573,386	255
86	E.ON	$782,609,880	38
87	Wolfspeed Inc.	$773,681,732	88
88	Triple Five Worldwide	$748,000,000	4
89	EDP-Energias de Portugal	$733,674,868	14
90	Warner Bros. Discovery Inc.	$725,632,525	206
91	Gotion	$715,000,000	1
92	American Electric Power	$699,673,821	92
93	Bank of America	$698,760,073	919
94	Johnson Controls	$691,180,720	144
95	Related Companies	$687,200,000	1
96	Caithness Energy	$670,379,738	28
97	Hyannis Air Service Inc.	$667,928,778	296
98	Koch Industries	$662,557,530	486
99	Sagamore Development	$660,000,000	1

They lobby for all of that government/communist money. It's government man = commie. Yeah! Commies! Capitalism can't survive without socialism. Privatizing the profits and making its losses public.

 

[Toddsterpatriot]

Capitalism makes finding a cure even less likely. It's actually the government that funds cures, not capitalism. So whether it's socialism here in the US or somewhere else, that hasn't found a cure yet, eventually, we will, and when we find it, it will be despite capitalism, not because of it.

The democratic party is "communist", or "socialist" because it's for the government "doing stuff" rather than the private sector and its "free market" doing everything. When we communists point out the government's crucial role in developing pharmaceuticals, then "government doing stuff", magically isn't really communism or socialism anymore. How convenient.

View attachment 809812​

A couple of weeks ago Todd and I were discussing how Walmart pays so little that many of its employees have to rely on government assistance, like food stamps. The government is essentially subsidizing Walmart's workforce, despite it being one of the wealthiest companies in the world. Its CEO makes 1000+ times more than the lowest-paid employee in their stores. I proposed that the government can offer all Americans an employment guarantee. If you can't find a job in the private sector, you have a job in the public sector, in government. There's plenty to be done in this country, rebuilding and maintaining our infrastructure. The government's "public works department" can employ tens of millions of Americans.

This will stimulate the economy and actually increase the profits of both small, local businesses and big outlet stores like Walmart. More Americans, making good money, translates into more customers, buying your products, eating in your restaurant..etc. Do you know what Todd's response was?

"UUUUuuuuuUUUUuuuu that's the Soviet Union. That's Commie Shit."​

The government doing stuff = commie shit. Well if the US government's resources are crucial in the development of pharmaceuticals/cures for disease, then it's essentially socialism, "commie-shit", that will be responsible for the cure for cancer, not Todd's beloved, imaginary "free market". We don't need rich capitalists like Todd. Why is Todd so emotionally involved in this discussion? He's a pearl-clutching rich dude or a completely brainwashed working-class person, who drank the capitalist Kool-Aid. He votes against his own interests at the ballot box. He's one of capitalism's many working-class drones. I suspect he's a pearl clutcher.

Capitalism makes finding a cure even less likely.

Capitalism made a cure for hepatitis C possible. I haven't seen a hepatitis C cure from communism.

It's actually the government that funds cures, not capitalism.

So why haven't the commie governments funded a cancer cure yet?

A couple of weeks ago Todd and I were discussing how Walmart pays so little that many of its employees have to rely on government assistance, like food stamps.

Are you telling me that Walmart, besides providing quality goods at reasonable prices, also reduces the amount of government assistance its employees need?

The government is essentially subsidizing Walmart's workforce, despite it being one of the wealthiest companies in the world.

How wealthy are they?

Its CEO makes 1000+ times more than the lowest-paid employee in their stores.

What does the lowest-paid employee do? How much is he paid? What is the proper ratio?

I proposed that the government can offer all Americans an employment guarantee. If you can't find a job in the private sector, you have a job in the public sector, in government.

That's a proposal alright. A pretty stupid one.
How much will these new government employees make?

Well if the US government's resources are crucial in the development of pharmaceuticals/cures for disease

What government resources cured Hep C?

We don't need rich capitalists like Todd. Why is Todd so emotionally involved in this discussion?

We don't need commie failure here; we saw what it did in eastern Europe.

 

[Toddsterpatriot]

Whether nuclear is commercially viable or not is irrelevant. I already showed you how goods and services don't have to be profitable or deemed "commercially viable" by capitalists, to serve the public good, offering a valuable product or service. The fossil fuel industry gets a fortune in government subsidies:

RANK	PARENT	SUBSIDY VALUE.	NUMBER OF AWARDS
1	Boeing	$15,136,286,466	946
2	Intel	$8,371,896,017	133
3	Ford Motor	$7,761,916,195	815
4	General Motors	$7,594,509,872	990
5	Micron Technology	$6,785,681,915	18
6	Alcoa	$5,798,600,778	160
7	X-Energy LLC	$5,661,511,202	17
8	General Atomics	$5,465,529,295	438
9	Cheniere Energy	$5,431,565,870	41
10	Amazon.com	$5,191,773,349	333
11	Foxconn Technology Group (Hon Hai Precision Industry Company)	$4,827,036,483	76
12	Sempra Energy	$3,835,098,001	53
13	Southern Company	$3,783,360,569	130
14	NRG Energy	$3,586,516,301	268
15	Venture Global LNG	$3,285,883,566	6
16	NextEra Energy	$3,003,823,754	117
17	Tesla Inc.	$2,836,366,619	116
18	Sasol	$2,836,049,845	72
19	Stellantis	$2,800,442,867	230
20	Volkswagen	$2,740,983,143	222
21	General Electric	$2,529,193,561	1,668
22	Nucor	$2,514,358,340	158
23	Walt Disney	$2,421,304,588	248
24	Brookfield Asset Management	$2,339,430,278	304
25	Toyota	$2,303,826,689	199
26	Iberdrola	$2,285,768,043	112
27	Summit Power	$2,240,568,236	8
28	Shell PLC	$2,184,517,527	141
29	Oracle	$2,167,890,528	88
30	Mubadala Investment Company	$2,124,035,097	62
31	Nike	$2,104,917,829	138
32	Hyundai Motor	$2,072,957,848	27
33	SCS Energy	$1,927,236,683	10
34	Archer Daniels Midland	$1,920,305,787	1,099
35	Exxon Mobil	$1,891,153,489	207
36	NuScale Power	$1,880,780,589	34
37	Berkshire Hathaway	$1,859,775,471	1,158
38	Nissan	$1,842,814,165	87
39	Alphabet Inc.	$1,832,565,977	116
40	Paramount Global	$1,751,801,882	317
41	Apple Inc.	$1,750,043,420	36
42	Comcast	$1,722,467,426	376
43	JPMorgan Chase	$1,663,890,873	1,129
44	Cleveland-Cliffs	$1,654,401,303	137
45	Energy Transfer	$1,634,074,422	106
46	Samsung	$1,586,310,806	70
47	PG&E Corp.	$1,568,027,901	27
48	IBM Corp.	$1,562,738,626	387
49	SkyWest	$1,550,492,958	683
50	Rivian Automotive Inc.	$1,532,854,012	3
51	OGE Energy	$1,427,570,182	15
52	Panasonic	$1,385,969,341	61
53	Raytheon Technologies	$1,322,899,721	952
54	Duke Energy	$1,318,084,164	69
55	Lockheed Martin	$1,302,847,415	337
56	Corning Inc.	$1,272,628,059	395
57	Northrop Grumman	$1,266,804,354	266
58	Vingroup	$1,254,000,000	1
59	Continental AG	$1,244,875,478	111
60	Vornado Realty Trust	$1,243,857,336	32
61	Microsoft	$1,153,690,869	103
62	Jefferies Financial Group	$1,120,662,497	18
63	Meta Platforms Inc.	$1,105,098,844	53
64	Dow Inc.	$1,091,152,544	686
65	Abengoa	$1,082,660,583	63
66	SK Holdings	$1,081,550,283	9
67	LG	$1,055,690,737	103
68	Valero Energy	$1,054,520,860	199
69	Exelon	$1,040,601,369	98
70	AES Corp.	$1,010,194,632	132
71	CF Industries	$982,271,715	129
72	Pyramid Companies	$966,050,097	91
73	EDF-Electricite de France	$940,247,983	65
74	Texas Instruments	$940,071,436	60
75	Mazda Toyota Manufacturing, U.S.A., Inc.	$900,000,000	1
76	Air Products & Chemicals	$897,651,105	248
77	Delta Air Lines	$876,412,623	14
78	Centene	$875,064,432	54
79	Bayer	$849,175,809	202
80	Honda	$846,026,154	91
81	Enterprise Products Partners	$826,988,371	83
82	Shin-Etsu Chemical	$826,062,285	104
83	SunEdison	$812,753,318	119
84	Apollo Global Management	$804,565,970	471
85	Goldman Sachs	$801,573,386	255
86	E.ON	$782,609,880	38
87	Wolfspeed Inc.	$773,681,732	88
88	Triple Five Worldwide	$748,000,000	4
89	EDP-Energias de Portugal	$733,674,868	14
90	Warner Bros. Discovery Inc.	$725,632,525	206
91	Gotion	$715,000,000	1
92	American Electric Power	$699,673,821	92
93	Bank of America	$698,760,073	919
94	Johnson Controls	$691,180,720	144
95	Related Companies	$687,200,000	1
96	Caithness Energy	$670,379,738	28
97	Hyannis Air Service Inc.	$667,928,778	296
98	Koch Industries	$662,557,530	486
99	Sagamore Development	$660,000,000	1

They lobby for all of that government/communist money. It's government man = commie. Yeah! Commies! Capitalism can't survive without socialism. Privatizing the profits and making its losses public.

The fossil fuel industry gets a fortune in government subsidies:

That's awful! Can you break those subsidies down for me? Post a list?