1896 Film of Palestine and Jerusalem.

[toastman]

[

Jews make up 75% of Israel. A Palestinian majority in Israel proper is a looooooong time away, IF it ever occurs. And Israelis aren't going back to Europe, as much as you would like them too.

Again, you are engaging in selective math.

There are 6 million Jews in Israel proper (pre-1967 borders) and 1 million Arabs within those borders.

There are 1.6 million people in Gaza and 2.5 million on the west bank.

There are another 2 million or so Palestinian refugees living in surrounding countries.

[
BTW, should Japanese living in America go back to Japan ?
Should Filipino's living in Canada go back to the Philippines ?
Should Germans living in Guatemala go back to Germany ?

if they started insisting that they were living in their own countries instead of the ones they were living in, um, yeah, I'd seriously consider it.

We are talking about Israel proper. Jews make up 75% of the population. What does the West Bank and Gaza have to do with it ?

 

[Roudy]

Hamas might be "Terrorists" to the Zionists who stole the land of the Palestinians, but they are "Freedom Fighters" to those Palestinians.

A person would have to be remarkably stupid to think the only thing that distinguishes freedom fighting from terrorism is point of view.

No, a person would really have to be stupid to think that guys who were fighting the Russians because they wanted to teach girls how to read were really all that concerned about "Freedom".

To the Palestinians, 'Freedom" would be defined as getting the Zionists to go back to Europe where they came from and reclaiming their land.

No actually you are an idiot. America never call Bin Laden a freedom fighter, however it did indirectly AND KNOWINGLY support jihadists to drive the Russians out of Afghanistan, which did occur. At no time was America under the delusion that they were freedom fighters. They were Jihadists from OTHER Arab or Muslim countries who came into Afghanistan to drive the infidels out.

At that time it was in America's NATIONAL SECURITY INTEREST to do that. You should look it up. Just like America is now contemplating cooperating with Iran or Assad INDIRECTLY in order to destroy ISIS.

 

[Coyote]

You gave yourself a loophole with "strategic". I just wonder how you are going to use it.

So answer the question? What groups do you consider "freedom fighters" and which ones "terrorists"

I did not give myself any loophole at all. The word strategic was used in conjunction with the recognized distinctions between guerilla war and terrorism, in this case strategic referring to the sorts of targets already listed.

If Palestinians targeted a military, governmental or intelligence gathering operation, that would be considered strategic. Targeting civilians and individuals isn't.

Ok. That I agree with.

Now answer the question.

 

[docmauser1]

... There are another 2 million or so Palestinian refugees living in surrounding countries. ...

Professional "refugees", indeed.

 

[MaryL]

Edmund Burke said:"All that is necessary for the triumph of evil is that good men do nothing." Where are all these so called "good" Muslims?

 

[Coyote]

[


I can see that bombing Dresden and Hiroshima would be considered "stratigic targets" in a war that imo was justifiable. The intent was not to kill civilians, but win the war and those were major centers of industry etc important to the war effort or important in claiming a decisive victory.

That's also an interesting point on Algiers - I hadn't thought of it in that way.

I would go so far to argue that Dresden and HIroshima were in fact acts of terrorism. The intent was to intimidate enemies already on the verge of surrender to give up.

Especially Hiroshima, which was spared conventional bombing just so we could see what kind of damage these new nuclear weapons could do.

I hesitate to go so far when it's easy to argue historical events in hindsight.

Dresden: Bombing of Dresden in World War II - Wikipedia the free encyclopedia

Dresden was Germany's seventh-largest city and, according to the RAF at the time, the largest remaining unbombed built-up area.[27] Taylor writes that an official 1942 guide to the city described it as "one of the foremost industrial locations of the Reich" and in 1944, the German Army High Command's Weapons Office listed 127 medium-to-large factories and workshops that were supplying the army with materiel.[28] The contribution to the German war effort may not have been as significant as the planners thought.[29]​

Hiroshima was even more complicated - we were at war and we needed an end quickly and decisively. Japan's emporor was not going to surrender otherwise. At least that was the thinking at the time.

I don't think I'd consider it terrorism. But it does show that maybe the line isn't always clear.

 

[Phoenall]

Hoss Hi,as you know I have much respect for you,you are nothing like those two Pathetic Bastards Roudy and Condor.....but even with evident facts presented still keep up this crappy Anti-Semitic shit.......as a pragmatic man,I support the two State solution.....unlike most of the Zionist Wannabee Baboons on here,who are just virilant sic Zionists.......Not Semitic Jews but "Outsider Jews" the only Semitic people are Shepardic Jews and Palestinians....and what appeplexic virilant ANTI-SEMITES they are,..........Of course there is Judaism without Zionism......this is not what Zionist want you to believe......But Judaism has been around over 3000 years+...Zionist are a Terrorist Organization started circa 1870.....
"Jonny come lately's".......but the Mentally Depraved Roudy and Condor and their ilk want you to believe there is NO Judaism without Zionism....what absolute Shit........ask the Ultra's they hate the Zionists so do the Secular Jews in Israel and outside.As they should because their whole Mantra is a pack of lies.


As for me better an Asshole than a Zionist COMPULSIVE LAIR...........Don't get sucked in by their Shit Rhetoric Hoss...You are better,a lot better than that.steve,I will never change my opinion of you because I know you to be a thoroughly decent Guy......yep we don't always agree but we can always face each other man to man.

For you to view.. Jews who helped Hitler and the Nazis


www.ihr.org/jhr/v13/v13n4p29_Weber.html

^^^^^^^^^^^
And here's Mark Weber's shiny resume. TALK ABOUT DEPRAVED, STEVO, YOU BEAT THE CAKE:



Southern Poverty Law Center
Mark Weber
Holocaust Denial Movement Rocked by Infighting (2009)
National Alliance Leader, William Pierce, Looks to Build Far-Right Alliances (1999)
Date of Birth:
1952
Groups:
Institute for Historical Review
Location:
Newport Beach, CA
Ideology:
Holocaust Denial
Since 1993, Mark Weber, who has probably done more than any other American to popularize denial of the World War II Holocaust of European Jews, has directed theInstitute for Historical Review (IHR), a once prominent denial group that has recently been in decline. He also served as the editor of IHR's now-defunct Journal of Historical Review from 1992 to 2000 and remains the organization's leading spokesperson, giving speeches and radio interviews to promote IHR's anti-Semitic propaganda. Weber shocked his denial colleagues in early 2009, when he published an essay suggesting that Holocaust denial had become counterproductive and that the real struggle should be directed against "Jewish-Zionist power."

In His Own Words
"Around the world awareness is growing that the ‘Holocaust' campaign is a major weapon in the Jewish-Zionist arsenal, that it is used to justify otherwise unjustifiable Israeli policies, and as a powerful tool for blackmailing enormous sums of money from Americans and Europeans."
— "An Open Letter to Fourteen Arab Intellectuals," 2001

"The most direct and obvious victims of Jewish-Zionist power are, of course, the Palestinians who live under Israel's harsh rule. But as the IHR has made clear for years, in truth we Americans are also victims — through the Jewish-Zionist grip on the media, and the organized Jewish-Zionist corruption of our political system."
— Speech at an Institute for Historical Review meeting in Arlington, Va., 2002

"[W]hat is happening is a worldwide conflict now, a global conflict that involves all of humanity. … [W]hether you are a conservative or a liberal, whether your primary loyalties are to your religion, to your ethnic group, to your country, to your heritage in whatever form, you will come up inevitably against this great Jewish Zionist power. … [W]hat we are involved in, is a global struggle … for the interests of us all and the interests of humanity."
— Speech at a Holocaust denial rally, April 24, 2004

"[D]espite a discouraging record of achievement, some revisionists insist that their work is vitally important because success in exposing the Holocaust as a hoax will deliver a shattering blow to Israel and Jewish-Zionist power. … In the real world struggle against Jewish-Zionist power, Holocaust revisionism has proved to be as much a hindrance as a help."
— "How Relevant is Holocaust Revisionism?", Jan. 7, 2009

Background
Born in Portland, Ore., and equipped with a master's degree in history from Indiana University, Mark Weber first appeared on the radical right in 1978, when he became news editor of National Vanguard, a publication of the National Alliance, which later evolved into one of the most important neo-Nazi groups in America. But while he remained connected to the Alliance for years, Weber was by 1979 already writing articles for The Spotlight, an anti-Semitic tabloid started by Willis Carto, and other Carto publications. In these articles, Weber referred to the Holocaust's Jewish "mythmakers," attacked the credibility of Anne Frank's diary, claimed the Allies used torture to extract false stories about extermination camps, and suggested that the testimony of victims of the Holocaust was unreliable at best.

"The Holocaust hoax is a religion," Weber wrote in 1989, according to the Anti-Defamation League. "[T]he rise of religions such as this generally coincides with the decline and fall of nations which tolerate them." The same year, he said he didn't believe that it was possible for black people to assimilate into American society.

In the mid-1980s, even though he was working closely with Carto, Weber remained a part of the Alliance and was listed as the treasurer of its Cosmotheist Church, which was an attempt by the basically atheistic group to win tax-exempt status. This is surprising because Carto and Alliance leader William Pierce had been bitter enemies since 1970, when they split as they worked to reconfigure the old Youth for Wallace group as the National Youth Alliance (which Pierce would officially rename the National Alliance four years later). Nevertheless, it was in this same period in the mid-1980s that Weber began taking a leading role at Carto's Institute for Historical Review (IHR). In 1984, Weber began leading the group's annual conferences. (These gatherings typically were highlighted by a "mystery guest," who in 1987 was Maj. Gen. Otto Ernst Remer, the unrepentant Nazi who helped crush a 1944 bomb plot against Hitler.) In 1985, Weber joined the IHR's editorial advisory committee and, in 1992, he took over as editor of IHR's Journal of Historical Review, work he did until 2000.

In 1993, with Weber's support, the IHR board ousted Carto as its leader, accusing him of interfering in editorial decisions. The next May, Carto and his wife tried to retake IHR by occupying its California offices, a situation that led to fistfights and, ultimately, Carto being forcibly removed from the building. At around the same time, another dispute between IHR and Carto broke out, with IHR leaders accusing Carto of diverting some $10 million that was allegedly left to IHR's parent company, the Legion for the Survival of Freedom.

During the decade of complex litigation that followed, Carto's Spotlight characterized Weber as a "rat," a "cockroach" and a "devil," but in the end Weber's side basically won. The Spotlight was shut down as a result of the litigation, although it was rapidly replaced with the look-alike American Free Press. Carto also created The Barnes Review, a Holocaust denial journal that now competes directly with IHR.

While Weber and IHR won their lawsuits, the fight with Carto proved to be a great distraction for the organization. It failed to maintain regular publication of its bimonthly Journal of Historical Review (no issues were published between April 1996 and May 1997) and it was unable to hold any conferences between 1994 and 2000. IHR did manage to put on a major conference in 2000, with David Irving, Ernst Zündel, and other notable Holocaust deniers in attendance, but a planned conference on "Revisionism and Zionism" in Beirut, Lebanon, in 2001, was cancelled after authorities banned it. The Lebanese decision followed international criticism of the planned conference.

Since then, Weber's IHR has continued to decline. By 2003, it stopped publishing the Journal of Historical Review and limited its conferences to mostly small, one-day affairs with speeches by Weber or other IHR staffers. In 2004, Weber did plan on attending a two-day Holocaust denial conference in Sacramento, Calif., but at the last minute, the venue refused to host the event, forcing Weber to join with representatives of the neo-Nazi National Alliance in a makeshift gathering at another location. In his keynote address, Weber went on an anti-Semitic rant, warning that all of humanity is involved in "a global struggle" against "Jewish-Zionist power."

More recently, Weber has sought publicity on James Edwards' extremist radio talk show, "The Political Cesspool," whose other guests have included Gordon Baum, head of the white supremacistCouncil of Conservative Citizens and former Klan leader and neo-Nazi David Duke. IHR also runs ads on the Cesspool.

In January 2009, Weber threw the world of Holocaust denial into turmoil with the publication of an essay asking "How Relevant Is Holocaust Revisionism?" Weber's conclusion, shocking to his colleagues on the radical right, was not very — that those on the radical right would do better to struggle against the real enemy, "Jewish-Zionist power," than on a historical debate about the Holocaust that they were largely losing. The essay set off acrimonious attacks on Weber by many of his former friends and colleagues, but hardly reflected a move by Weber to the political center. Within months of publishing the essay, he was recirculating ancient anti-Semitic conspiracy theories, complaining about those "who control political and cultural life, including the education system and the mass media." From the looks of his audience, Weber had replaced his old suit-and-tie denialist friends with hard-core anti-Semites, including open neo-Nazis and heavily tattooed racist skinheads. What this means for Holocaust denial remains an open question.

Mark Weber:
The Professional Denier
More than any other propagandist, Mark Weber, 45, embodies the Holocaust-denial movement. An articulate, media-savvy spokesperson with a master's degree in History from Indiana University, Weber got his start in the radical right in 1978, when he took the position of news editor for National Vanguard, a publication of the neo-Nazi National Alliance. In 1979, Weber also began to contribute regularly to The Spotlight, a weekly

Weber has warned against America's becoming "a sort of Mexicanized, Puerto Ricanized country. . . . I don't believe it's possible for Black Americans to be assimilated into white society."

[TBODY] [/TBODY]

tabloid produced by Willis Carto's Liberty Lobby organization. His involvement with the IHR also intensified steadily over the years; initially working as a contributor to the now-defunct IHR Newsletter, Weber began serving as emcee for the group's annual conventions in 1984. In 1985 he became a member of IHR's Editorial Advisory Committee and in 1992 he became editor of the Journal of Historical Review. Following IHR's break with Carto and the subsequent departure of most professional staff members in 1993, Weber became director of the organization with one professional staff person serving under him.

Weber's more openly extremist commitment to white supremacy has not abated during his pyrrhic ascendancy through the IHR ranks. Throughout the 1980s, he maintained his contact with the National Alliance, serving, according to official documents, as treasurer of that organization's "Cosmotheist Church."

Similarly, in 1987, graduating seniors at four private high schools in Atlanta received copies of a 584-page racist and anti-Semitic book, The Dispossessed Majority, with a letter signed by Weber which stated, "... You and your classmates may expect to face grave political, economic and social problems. There will be outright discrimination against you as you compete for admission to the better colleges. Less-qualified nonwhites with lower academic standing will be pushed ahead of you by means of racial quotas and four-year scholarships."

In 1989, several ROTC cadets at Auburn University received an identical mailing from Weber. In the same year, Weber was interviewed by The Sower, a student newspaper at the University of Nebraska. In the interview, Weber stated, " l'm concerned about the future of (the white) race and I'm concerned about the future of our country." He also warned against America's becoming "a sort of Mexicanized, Puerto Ricanized country.... I don't believe it's possible for Black Americans to be assimilated into white society."

Nonetheless, it is as a Holocaust-denier that Weber has found his niche on the radical right, and it is through the IHR that he has found the platform to pursue his increasingly solitary, yet persistently hateful propaganda mission.

Well I certainly are not a denier of the Holocaust Roudy.....in fact very much the reverse as is Well Noted on this Forum....but the facts remain that Jews did collaborate with the Nazis......mind you the West never really helped the Jews during the Nazi period although they knew full well what was happening.....you once said to me to "Hang my Head in Shame".....but I have nothing to hang my head for any reason because I believe in a Free Palestine and Israel....

Why don't you and your possee Ever complain about the Germans of whom at the time were complicit with the Nazis....Why don't you complain about the other Western Countries that assisted the Nazis ??????? because plenty did..........Why always the Sufferers like the Palestinians......You posted about the Boycott...Did I disagree with you....NO, I supported You......Look the Jews worldwide are on the Nose,with Anti-Semitic threats and violence on the rise.....Why....well the awful treatment of the Palestinians has not helped your cause....there has been no fairness although you will differ....But back to this Rampant Anti-Seminism world wide........Jewish friends are becoming very nervous because the type of people creating this problem are nasty hardliners.....friends in Europe and the UK feel so uncomfortable that they feel unsafe...the level of threat has become alarming to them,Australia as an Island is not a problem,the Muslims here commune well with Jews and Christians and visa-versa......We have a few ISIS wannabees but the threat is so small....all ISIS want and do is Murder anyone in their way.......but minorities and other Muslims are their main target.......this does not affect Israel,well at ISIS current evolution.

Really we can keep harping to the past....but it is todays situation that really needs our attention and motivation....other wise we just keep cat-calling each other and going round and round in ever decreasing circles......Yep I like to stir you up,but in the end it is mentally wasteful......there really are more important things to resolve......I have as you know desired a peaceful solution for the cousins,for that essensially is what they are.....for Palestine and Israel.......I understand your point of view,of course I do.....But reality is often so different.....The Palestinians are not Jews real enemy as History proves......there are darker elements afoot that harbour Real Hatred for Jews.......and these should be eliminated.and it is this danger we should really be discussing Regards.steven...ps Thanks for setting me straight about Webber....I was wrong to post that,st

The Palestinians have brought the treatment on themselves by being violent, terrorist child murderers who plant bombs in schools and youth disco's. When that was thwarted they made complaints to the UN about having their right to mass murder being taken away from them. Now they fire rockets at child facilities in Israel and have been found to hqave dug tunnels under Israel towards child facilities and packed them with high explosives. Those acts should not go unpunished and the people behind them should be arrested and charged in the ICJ. Not just the hamas leaders but the "civilians" that protect the terrorists from harm. We can start with team Palestine on this board and have them arrested and tried for war crimes and crimes against humanity because of their many posts inciting violence against the Jews

The Palestinians, Christians and Muslims, have only resisted the settlement and subsequent theft of land and their removal on the part of Europeans. They have done no less or no more than the IRA has done to establish the Republic of Ireland.

What theft of land they did not own any, they lost it all in 1099 when the crusaders beat them to a pulp. The last muslims to own the land of Palestine were the Ottomans who transferred it to the LoN as reparations for WW1. The Lon transferred the land to make Iraq, Syria, Transjordan and the RESURECTED NATIONAL HOME OF THE JEWS. No mention in any treaty or agreement of the Palestinian arab muslims other than to say they could stay as peaceful citizens of Eretz Ysrael or they could move to Jordan, Syria or Iraq.
You show your complete lack of understanding as to why the IRA mass murdered many people including children, they had nothing to do with the Republic of Ireland that was formed before the IRA was invented. The IRA killed for the simple reason they are racist scum who did not want anyone else to live in N.I. but themselves, they killed atheists, catholics and protestants in equal numbers because they could. They are still killing innocents today because they want to be dictators of Ireland and have failed to unite the republic of Ireland with the five counties. It was the catholics that called in the British because of sectarianism and they turned against them when they would not wipe out the protestants for them, that is how the IRA was formed.

 

[Dogmaphobe]

Ok. That I agree with.

Now answer the question.

Well, let's see here. One of the two groups in question here rewards mass murdering terrorists with streets being named after them, posters glorifying their actions and much celebration.

One of the group doesn't.

You figure it out.

 

[Phoenall]

Mark Weber:
The Professional Denier
More than any other propagandist, Mark Weber, 45, embodies the Holocaust-denial movement. An articulate, media-savvy spokesperson with a master's degree in History from Indiana University, Weber got his start in the radical right in 1978, when he took the position of news editor for National Vanguard, a publication of the neo-Nazi National Alliance. In 1979, Weber also began to contribute regularly to The Spotlight, a weekly

Weber has warned against America's becoming "a sort of Mexicanized, Puerto Ricanized country. . . . I don't believe it's possible for Black Americans to be assimilated into white society."

[TBODY] [/TBODY]

tabloid produced by Willis Carto's Liberty Lobby organization. His involvement with the IHR also intensified steadily over the years; initially working as a contributor to the now-defunct IHR Newsletter, Weber began serving as emcee for the group's annual conventions in 1984. In 1985 he became a member of IHR's Editorial Advisory Committee and in 1992 he became editor of the Journal of Historical Review. Following IHR's break with Carto and the subsequent departure of most professional staff members in 1993, Weber became director of the organization with one professional staff person serving under him.

Weber's more openly extremist commitment to white supremacy has not abated during his pyrrhic ascendancy through the IHR ranks. Throughout the 1980s, he maintained his contact with the National Alliance, serving, according to official documents, as treasurer of that organization's "Cosmotheist Church."

Similarly, in 1987, graduating seniors at four private high schools in Atlanta received copies of a 584-page racist and anti-Semitic book, The Dispossessed Majority, with a letter signed by Weber which stated, "... You and your classmates may expect to face grave political, economic and social problems. There will be outright discrimination against you as you compete for admission to the better colleges. Less-qualified nonwhites with lower academic standing will be pushed ahead of you by means of racial quotas and four-year scholarships."

In 1989, several ROTC cadets at Auburn University received an identical mailing from Weber. In the same year, Weber was interviewed by The Sower, a student newspaper at the University of Nebraska. In the interview, Weber stated, " l'm concerned about the future of (the white) race and I'm concerned about the future of our country." He also warned against America's becoming "a sort of Mexicanized, Puerto Ricanized country.... I don't believe it's possible for Black Americans to be assimilated into white society."

Nonetheless, it is as a Holocaust-denier that Weber has found his niche on the radical right, and it is through the IHR that he has found the platform to pursue his increasingly solitary, yet persistently hateful propaganda mission.

Well I certainly are not a denier of the Holocaust Roudy.....in fact very much the reverse as is Well Noted on this Forum....but the facts remain that Jews did collaborate with the Nazis......mind you the West never really helped the Jews during the Nazi period although they knew full well what was happening.....you once said to me to "Hang my Head in Shame".....but I have nothing to hang my head for any reason because I believe in a Free Palestine and Israel....

Why don't you and your possee Ever complain about the Germans of whom at the time were complicit with the Nazis....Why don't you complain about the other Western Countries that assisted the Nazis ??????? because plenty did..........Why always the Sufferers like the Palestinians......You posted about the Boycott...Did I disagree with you....NO, I supported You......Look the Jews worldwide are on the Nose,with Anti-Semitic threats and violence on the rise.....Why....well the awful treatment of the Palestinians has not helped your cause....there has been no fairness although you will differ....But back to this Rampant Anti-Seminism world wide........Jewish friends are becoming very nervous because the type of people creating this problem are nasty hardliners.....friends in Europe and the UK feel so uncomfortable that they feel unsafe...the level of threat has become alarming to them,Australia as an Island is not a problem,the Muslims here commune well with Jews and Christians and visa-versa......We have a few ISIS wannabees but the threat is so small....all ISIS want and do is Murder anyone in their way.......but minorities and other Muslims are their main target.......this does not affect Israel,well at ISIS current evolution.

Really we can keep harping to the past....but it is todays situation that really needs our attention and motivation....other wise we just keep cat-calling each other and going round and round in ever decreasing circles......Yep I like to stir you up,but in the end it is mentally wasteful......there really are more important things to resolve......I have as you know desired a peaceful solution for the cousins,for that essensially is what they are.....for Palestine and Israel.......I understand your point of view,of course I do.....But reality is often so different.....The Palestinians are not Jews real enemy as History proves......there are darker elements afoot that harbour Real Hatred for Jews.......and these should be eliminated.and it is this danger we should really be discussing Regards.steven...ps Thanks for setting me straight about Webber....I was wrong to post that,st

The Palestinians have brought the treatment on themselves by being violent, terrorist child murderers who plant bombs in schools and youth disco's. When that was thwarted they made complaints to the UN about having their right to mass murder being taken away from them. Now they fire rockets at child facilities in Israel and have been found to hqave dug tunnels under Israel towards child facilities and packed them with high explosives. Those acts should not go unpunished and the people behind them should be arrested and charged in the ICJ. Not just the hamas leaders but the "civilians" that protect the terrorists from harm. We can start with team Palestine on this board and have them arrested and tried for war crimes and crimes against humanity because of their many posts inciting violence against the Jews

The Palestinians, Christians and Muslims, have only resisted the settlement and subsequent theft of land and their removal on the part of Europeans. They have done no less or no more than the IRA has done to establish the Republic of Ireland.

Notice Mohomod Latici always refers to "Palestinians" as Muslims and Christians. As if the Jews had nothing to do with the land, and were non existent at the time. While the truth is that the label "Palestinian" ONLY referred to Jews of the region before 1948. If you walked up to an Arab before that and called him a Palestinian he'd punch you in the face for insulting him by calling him a Jew. These propagandists are so full of it you truly don't know where to start.

You surely are the king of the propagandists: Do you really think that ridiculous assertions like "While the truth is that the label "Palestinian" ONLY referred to Jews of the region before 1948" are believed by even your Jewish brethren?

I understand that the facts can only confirm that there were hardly any Jews in Palestine before 1850 and Europeans of the Jewish faith settled in great numbers in the area and expelled the people that were living there. And, I know this fact disturbs you, but that is the fact. But, making outrageous claims doesn't change the facts available from Government Archives, which I have linked very often.

Mandate For Palestine - The Legal Aspects of Jewish Rights


It is important to point out that political rights to self-determination as a polity for Arabs were guaranteed by the same League of Nations in four other mandates – in Lebanon and Syria (The French Mandate), Iraq, and later Trans-Jordan [The British Mandate].
Any attempt to negate the Jewish people’s right to Palestine - Eretz-Israel, and to deny them access and control in the area designated for the Jewish people by the League of Nations is a serious infringement of international law.


PALESTINE
INTRODUCTORY.
POSITION, ETC.
Palestine lies on the western edge of the continent of Asia between Latitude 30º N. and 33º N., Longitude 34º 30’ E. and 35º 30’ E.
On the North it is bounded by the French Mandated Territories of Syria and Lebanon, on the East by Syria and Trans-Jordan, on the South-west by the Egyptian province of Sinai, on the South-east by the Gulf of Aqaba and on the West by the Mediterranean. The frontier with Syria was laid down by the Anglo-French Convention of the 23rd December, 1920, and its delimitation was ratified in 1923. Briefly stated, the boundaries are as follows: -
North. – From Ras en Naqura on the Mediterranean eastwards to a point west of Qadas, thence in a northerly direction to Metulla, thence east to a point west of Banias.
East. – From Banias in a southerly direction east of Lake Hula to Jisr Banat Ya’pub, thence along a line east of the Jordan and the Lake of Tiberias and on to El Hamme station on the Samakh-Deraa railway line, thence along the centre of the river Yarmuq to its confluence with the Jordan, thence along the centres of the Jordan, the Dead Sea and the Wadi Araba to a point on the Gulf of Aqaba two miles west of the town of Aqaba, thence along the shore of the Gulf of Aqaba to Ras Jaba.
South. – From Ras Jaba in a generally north-westerly direction to the junction of the Neki-Aqaba and Gaza-Aqaba Roads, thence to a point west-north-west of Ain Maghara and thence to a point on the Mediterranean coast north-west of Rafa.
West. – The Mediterranean Sea.


In a report by His Majesty’s Government in the United Kingdom of Great Britain and Northern Ireland to the Council of the League of Nations on the administration of Palestine and Trans-Jordan for the year 1938, the British made it clear: Palestine is not a State, it is the name of a geographical area.13
Palestine is a name coined by the Romans around 135 CE from the name of a seagoing Aegean people who settled on the coast of Canaan in antiquity – the Philistines. The name was chosen to replace Judea, as a sign that Jewish sovereignty had been eradicated following the Jewish Revolts against Rome.
In the course of time, the Latin name Philistia was further bastardized into Palistina or Palestine.14 During the next 2,000 years Palestine was never an independent state belonging to any people, nor did a Palestinian people distinct from other Arabs appear during 1,300 years of Muslim hegemony in Palestine under Arab and Ottoman rule. During that rule, local Arabs were actually considered part of, and subject to, the authority of Greater Syria ( Suriyya al-Kubra).15
Historically, before the Arabs fabricated the concept of Palestinian peoplehood as an exclusively Arab phenomenon, no such group existed. This is substantiated in countless official British Mandate-vintage documents that speak of the Jews and the Arabs of Palestine – not Jews and Palestinians.16
In fact, before local Jews began calling themselves Israelis in 1948 (when the name “Israel” was chosen for the newly-established Jewish State), the term “Palestine” applied almost exclusively to Jews and the institutions founded by new Jewish immigrants in the first half of the 20th century, before the state’s independence.
Some examples include:
The Jerusalem Post, founded in 1932, was called The Palestine Post until 1948.
Bank Leumi L’Israel, incorporated in 1902, was called the “Anglo-Palestine Company” until 1948.
The Jewish Agency – an arm of the Zionist movement engaged in Jewish settlement since 1929 – was initially called the Jewish Agency for Palestine.
Today’s Israel Philharmonic Orchestra, founded in 1936 by German Jewish refugees who fled Nazi Germany, was originally called the “Palestine Symphony Orchestra,” composed of some 70 Palestinian Jews.17
The United Jewish Appeal (UJA) was established in 1939 as a merger of the United Palestine Appeal and the fund-raising arm of the Joint Distribution Committee.

 

[docmauser1]

The amazing thing about South Africa is they had Nelson Mandela.

If that keeps them happy and stuff, of course.

Neither the Palestinians nor the Israelis have a Mandela. And they need one.

No thanks, jews don't need that comrade, and palistanians have their own one, Abu Mazen, with a doctorate from the Moscow Oriental Studies, of course.

 

[Friends]

1896 film showing the people in Palestine and Jerusalem in particular. Notice how Christians and Muslims are the clear majority walking the streets of Jerusalem. Will a film convince the Israel Firsters?

So you'd support dissolving the US and returning it the Indians?

Too late for that. The Indians (as you call them) were put on reservations, at least the ones we didn't kill. There is hope for the Christians and Muslims of Palestine.

The Moslems should have been expelled right after Israel's thrilling victory in the Six Day War. Few Americans would have cared. We were too busy celebrating the Israeli victory.

 

[Phoenall]

It seems to me that you are projecting. The supremacist movement I see is the Zionist one. The Muslims are fighting mostly among themselves. The Zionists are the latter day Nazis. They are holding millions of non-Jews in virtual concentration camps killing thousands of them every year or so.

The arab muslims have no legal or moral claim to the land of Palestine, they did not even want to go there until the Jews from Europe had made the desert fertile again.


There Has Never Been a Sovereign Arab State in Palestine
The artificiality of a Palestinian identity is reflected in the attitudes and actions of neighboring Arab nations who never established a Palestinian state themselves.
The rhetoric by Arab leaders on behalf of the Palestinians rings hollow. Arabs in neighboring states, who control 99.9 percent of the Middle East land, have never recognized a Palestinian entity. They have always considered Palestine and its inhabitants part of the great “Arab nation,” historically and politically as an integral part of Greater Syria – Suriyya al-Kubra – a designation that extended to both sides of the Jordan River.20 In the 1950s, Jordan simply annexed the West Bank since the population there was viewed as the brethren of the Jordanians. Jordan’s official narrative of “Jordanian state-building” attests to this fact:

 

[Coyote]

Ok. That I agree with.

Now answer the question.

Well, let's see here. One of the two groups in question here rewards mass murdering terrorists with streets being named after them, posters glorifying their actions and much celebration.

One of the group doesn't.

You figure it out.

You are still ducking and dodging.

What groups do you consider "freedom fighters"?
What groups do you consider "terrorists"?

 

[Phoenall]

It seems to me that you are projecting. The supremacist movement I see is the Zionist one. The Muslims are fighting mostly among themselves. The Zionists are the latter day Nazis. They are holding millions of non-Jews in virtual concentration camps killing thousands of them every year or so.

The supremacist movement is the Zionist one, that is home to 2 billion Muslim and Christian Arabs living with the same rights as the rest of the Israelis?

It's not Islamists like Hamas, ISIS, Al Queda, Islamic Jihad, Muslim Brotherhood, Hezbollah, Al Shabab, Taliban, etc. who want to establish an ISLAMIC KALIFATE under SHARIAH LAW, where non-Muslims get to either SUBMIT TO ISLAM OR DIE? And in the process committing massacres, mass bombings, killing hundreds of thousands. Yup, dem Zionist Jooos are da problem in the world today.

Gee, coulda fooled me, PROPOGANDACITI! Ha ha ha.

The Jews are the problem in Palestine. This forum is about Palestine and Israel.

Not since you started to bring South Africa, Rhodesia and other far flung nations into the equation. So this means that we can throw in the many ISLAMONAZI and ISLAMOFACIST TERRORIST groups into the pot as examples.

YOU LOSE AGAIN Mohamed.

 

[montelatici]

"What theft of land they did not own any"

Owned over 90% of the land per the deeds and land registries as audited by the Mandatory in 1943 and reported to the UN in 1946 in the Survey of Palestine prior to partition.

 

[montelatici]

It seems to me that you are projecting. The supremacist movement I see is the Zionist one. The Muslims are fighting mostly among themselves. The Zionists are the latter day Nazis. They are holding millions of non-Jews in virtual concentration camps killing thousands of them every year or so.

The supremacist movement is the Zionist one, that is home to 2 billion Muslim and Christian Arabs living with the same rights as the rest of the Israelis?

It's not Islamists like Hamas, ISIS, Al Queda, Islamic Jihad, Muslim Brotherhood, Hezbollah, Al Shabab, Taliban, etc. who want to establish an ISLAMIC KALIFATE under SHARIAH LAW, where non-Muslims get to either SUBMIT TO ISLAM OR DIE? And in the process committing massacres, mass bombings, killing hundreds of thousands. Yup, dem Zionist Jooos are da problem in the world today.

Gee, coulda fooled me, PROPOGANDACITI! Ha ha ha.

The Jews are the problem in Palestine. This forum is about Palestine and Israel.

Not since you started to bring South Africa, Rhodesia and other far flung nations into the equation. So this means that we can throw in the many ISLAMONAZI and ISLAMOFACIST TERRORIST groups into the pot as examples.

YOU LOSE AGAIN Mohamed.

We are concerned with ZIONAZIs like you.

 

[Phoenall]

Palestine is a fiction, just like Israel. Muslims and jews coexisted for a millennium in this area....The British mandate of Palestine that divided Lebanon from Ottoman Syria was created in 1922, and nobody was the wiser. Really, who in the hell is going to care if Jews flee to that almost genetic homeland and WHO is going to object if they flee extermination? Americans wouldn't even let these people in, I don't blame the jews for going back to square one and creating a homeland from their past as a form of self protection....what else could they do? Palestinians? They could (hint hint) accept their brothers and live in harmony, not be hateful reactionaries. Muslims are like that. suicide bombers, crash planes into buildings. But that is a different story...is it? Muslims are always poor little victims, all the time always forever.

Another ill educated STOOGE that has not heard of the Pact of Umar or the laws of dhimmi that were in evidence from 627 C.E. till the founding of Israel in 1948

 

[Coyote]

It seems to me that you are projecting. The supremacist movement I see is the Zionist one. The Muslims are fighting mostly among themselves. The Zionists are the latter day Nazis. They are holding millions of non-Jews in virtual concentration camps killing thousands of them every year or so.

The arab muslims have no legal or moral claim to the land of Palestine, they did not even want to go there until the Jews from Europe had made the desert fertile again.

As indiginous peoples they have the same claim as the Jews.

 

[montelatici]

Palestine is a fiction, just like Israel. Muslims and jews coexisted for a millennium in this area....The British mandate of Palestine that divided Lebanon from Ottoman Syria was created in 1922, and nobody was the wiser. Really, who in the hell is going to care if Jews flee to that almost genetic homeland and WHO is going to object if they flee extermination? Americans wouldn't even let these people in, I don't blame the jews for going back to square one and creating a homeland from their past as a form of self protection....what else could they do? Palestinians? They could (hint hint) accept their brothers and live in harmony, not be hateful reactionaries. Muslims are like that. suicide bombers, crash planes into buildings. But that is a different story...is it? Muslims are always poor little victims, all the time always forever.

Another ill educated STOOGE that has not heard of the Pact of Umar or the laws of dhimmi that were in evidence from 627 C.E. till the founding of Israel in 1948

Better "ill educated" than uneducated like you ZIONAZI psychopath.

 

[Phoenall]

Ok. That I agree with.

Now answer the question.

Well, let's see here. One of the two groups in question here rewards mass murdering terrorists with streets being named after them, posters glorifying their actions and much celebration.

One of the group doesn't.

You figure it out.

You are still ducking and dodging.

What groups do you consider "freedom fighters"?
What groups do you consider "terrorists"?

Freedom fighters are those fighting against terrorists who are trying to wipe out one group and destroy their land

Terrorists are the group that have it as their charter that they will wipe out the other group and destroy their country.

Freedom fighters do not target children with high explosives or surround their fighters with civilians so threy wont be the target of return fire. terrorists do all this and more.