2013 sea ice thread!!!

[itfitzme]

Arctic News: The Growing Threat of Catastrophic Storm Surge in the Next 30 Years on a Fast, Global Warming Induced, Sea Level Rise and its Consequences for Coastal Cities and Humanity

For shits and grins, this is the data website

http://psc.apl.washington.edu/wordpress/research/projects/arctic-sea-ice-volume-anomaly/

http://psc.apl.washington.edu/wordpress/research/projects/arctic-sea-ice-volume-anomaly/data/

I am, unfortunately, not able to open and plot the actual data. But, just in case someone wants to bitch "where is the data" or "it's all a lie...."

 

[itfitzme]

So the denialists are _still_ refusing to acknowledge the 1991 climate science paper that specifically predicted the increase in Antarctic sea ice? Of course they are. It's what cultists do.

Do they consider themselves liars? Not really. I think Westwall honestly thinks he's an honest person, as a result of his cult programming. It's part of the cult indoctrination, the cult defining its own members as morally perfect and incapable of lying. Thus, cultists are emotionally unable to process the fact that their cult lied to them. Since, in their eyes, the cult can't lie, that means the bearer of bad news who showed the cult was lying has to be a liar himself. And that would be why poor Westwall goes so unhinged whenever someone shows him how his cult lied.

And the evidence of the cult's lies? Simple refuse to acknowledge such a thing exists. If the bearer of bad news insists on bringing it up again, switch to endless personal attacks to divert attention.

I have had a recent and rare opportunity to observe chronic liars in action. In one instance, I shared the exact same experience with one. On recanting the incident, at a later time, this habitual liar picked and chose from small events that occurred, rearranged and ignored parts, then completely fabricated made a couple of needed ones to fit the pieces into his own narrative. And, I can assure you, he fully believed the fantasy that he fabricated.

I have no difficulty believing that Westwall does, in fact, believe his own fabrications as if they really happened. It is the marvelous thing about the mind, that psychology has shown, that memories can be completely fabricated, reality entirely overwritten. I have no doubt that Westwall is psychotic.

 

[westwall]

So the denialists are _still_ refusing to acknowledge the 1991 climate science paper that specifically predicted the increase in Antarctic sea ice? Of course they are. It's what cultists do.

Do they consider themselves liars? Not really. I think Westwall honestly thinks he's an honest person, as a result of his cult programming. It's part of the cult indoctrination, the cult defining its own members as morally perfect and incapable of lying. Thus, cultists are emotionally unable to process the fact that their cult lied to them. Since, in their eyes, the cult can't lie, that means the bearer of bad news who showed the cult was lying has to be a liar himself. And that would be why poor Westwall goes so unhinged whenever someone shows him how his cult lied.

And the evidence of the cult's lies? Simple refuse to acknowledge such a thing exists. If the bearer of bad news insists on bringing it up again, switch to endless personal attacks to divert attention.

I have had a recent and rare opportunity to observe chronic liars in action. In one instance, I shared the exact same experience with one. On recanting the incident, at a later time, this habitual liar picked and chose from small events that occurred, rearranged and ignored parts, then completely fabricated made a couple of needed ones to fit the pieces into his own narrative. And, I can assure you, he fully believed the fantasy that he fabricated.

I have no difficulty believing that Westwall does, in fact, believe his own fabrications as if they really happened. It is the marvelous thing about the mind, that psychology has shown, that memories can be completely fabricated, reality entirely overwritten. I have no doubt that Westwall is psychotic.

Yes, you call me all sorts of names and yet can never point to a lie I've ever told....so what does that make you? More to the point here's what the current state of the ice is... Doesn't look ANYTHING like the propaganda you posted..

 

[itfitzme]

So the denialists are _still_ refusing to acknowledge the 1991 climate science paper that specifically predicted the increase in Antarctic sea ice? Of course they are. It's what cultists do.

Do they consider themselves liars? Not really. I think Westwall honestly thinks he's an honest person, as a result of his cult programming. It's part of the cult indoctrination, the cult defining its own members as morally perfect and incapable of lying. Thus, cultists are emotionally unable to process the fact that their cult lied to them. Since, in their eyes, the cult can't lie, that means the bearer of bad news who showed the cult was lying has to be a liar himself. And that would be why poor Westwall goes so unhinged whenever someone shows him how his cult lied.

And the evidence of the cult's lies? Simple refuse to acknowledge such a thing exists. If the bearer of bad news insists on bringing it up again, switch to endless personal attacks to divert attention.

I have had a recent and rare opportunity to observe chronic liars in action. In one instance, I shared the exact same experience with one. On recanting the incident, at a later time, this habitual liar picked and chose from small events that occurred, rearranged and ignored parts, then completely fabricated made a couple of needed ones to fit the pieces into his own narrative. And, I can assure you, he fully believed the fantasy that he fabricated.

I have no difficulty believing that Westwall does, in fact, believe his own fabrications as if they really happened. It is the marvelous thing about the mind, that psychology has shown, that memories can be completely fabricated, reality entirely overwritten. I have no doubt that Westwall is psychotic.

Yes, you call me all sorts of names and yet can never point to a lie I've ever told....so what does that make you? More to the point here's what the current state of the ice is... Doesn't look ANYTHING like the propaganda you posted..

Like he said, "Westwall honestly thinks he's an honest person,".

You have just proven his point, that you honestly think you are an honest person.

 

[Old Rocks]

So the denialists are _still_ refusing to acknowledge the 1991 climate science paper that specifically predicted the increase in Antarctic sea ice? Of course they are. It's what cultists do.

Do they consider themselves liars? Not really. I think Westwall honestly thinks he's an honest person, as a result of his cult programming. It's part of the cult indoctrination, the cult defining its own members as morally perfect and incapable of lying. Thus, cultists are emotionally unable to process the fact that their cult lied to them. Since, in their eyes, the cult can't lie, that means the bearer of bad news who showed the cult was lying has to be a liar himself. And that would be why poor Westwall goes so unhinged whenever someone shows him how his cult lied.

And the evidence of the cult's lies? Simple refuse to acknowledge such a thing exists. If the bearer of bad news insists on bringing it up again, switch to endless personal attacks to divert attention.

I have had a recent and rare opportunity to observe chronic liars in action. In one instance, I shared the exact same experience with one. On recanting the incident, at a later time, this habitual liar picked and chose from small events that occurred, rearranged and ignored parts, then completely fabricated made a couple of needed ones to fit the pieces into his own narrative. And, I can assure you, he fully believed the fantasy that he fabricated.

I have no difficulty believing that Westwall does, in fact, believe his own fabrications as if they really happened. It is the marvelous thing about the mind, that psychology has shown, that memories can be completely fabricated, reality entirely overwritten. I have no doubt that Westwall is psychotic.

Yes, you call me all sorts of names and yet can never point to a lie I've ever told....so what does that make you? More to the point here's what the current state of the ice is... Doesn't look ANYTHING like the propaganda you posted..

That Walleyes can post this as proof that nothing important is happening in the cryosphere is proof of the extent of his seperation from reality. Just look at the differance in the anamolys between the Arctic and Anarctic, yet he regards them as equal.

 

[westwall]

I have had a recent and rare opportunity to observe chronic liars in action. In one instance, I shared the exact same experience with one. On recanting the incident, at a later time, this habitual liar picked and chose from small events that occurred, rearranged and ignored parts, then completely fabricated made a couple of needed ones to fit the pieces into his own narrative. And, I can assure you, he fully believed the fantasy that he fabricated.

I have no difficulty believing that Westwall does, in fact, believe his own fabrications as if they really happened. It is the marvelous thing about the mind, that psychology has shown, that memories can be completely fabricated, reality entirely overwritten. I have no doubt that Westwall is psychotic.

Yes, you call me all sorts of names and yet can never point to a lie I've ever told....so what does that make you? More to the point here's what the current state of the ice is... Doesn't look ANYTHING like the propaganda you posted..

That Walleyes can post this as proof that nothing important is happening in the cryosphere is proof of the extent of his seperation from reality. Just look at the differance in the anamolys between the Arctic and Anarctic, yet he regards them as equal.

Poor dumb olfraud....where oh where did I say that. YOUR claims were that the Arctic was in a "death spiral" and that there would be no ice by....well I think you guys' original prediction was this year would be ice free ..was it not?

I am merely pointing out that the "canary in the coal mine", you guys' other favorite bit of tripe, is not panning out like you claimed it would.

Care to address those failed predictions?

 

[Abraham3]

This is a death spiral

 

[IanC]

hahaha. does anyone else notice that the warmers' predictions for both the arctic and the antarctic are both wrong? they are obviously putting the wrong inputs into their models, or are just ignoring ones that should be included. either way they are....wrong.

 

[Old Rocks]

Ian, you know better. Yes, the predictions for the Arctic and Anarctic were wrong. For the Arctic, no one predicted the extent of the loss of ice we have seen in the last decade. For the Antarctic, both sea ice and continental ice was predicted to increase. However, do to the wasting of ice shelves and glacial outflow and erosion, the continental ice is decreasing, and the sea ice increase is very small compared to the loss of the ice in the Arctic.

 

[Old Rocks]

Yes, you call me all sorts of names and yet can never point to a lie I've ever told....so what does that make you? More to the point here's what the current state of the ice is... Doesn't look ANYTHING like the propaganda you posted..

That Walleyes can post this as proof that nothing important is happening in the cryosphere is proof of the extent of his seperation from reality. Just look at the differance in the anamolys between the Arctic and Anarctic, yet he regards them as equal.

Poor dumb olfraud....where oh where did I say that. YOUR claims were that the Arctic was in a "death spiral" and that there would be no ice by....well I think you guys' original prediction was this year would be ice free ..was it not?

I am merely pointing out that the "canary in the coal mine", you guys' other favorite bit of tripe, is not panning out like you claimed it would.

Care to address those failed predictions?

Since I never said that the ice would be gone by 2013, that is just another lie from you. I have posted some that said that was a possibility after the 2007 surprise, but the most pessimistic that I have posted is that it possibly could be gone by 2015, and allmost certainly will have an ice free period by 2030. And the ice is in a death spiral. Every graph from every scientific source shows that. We have a very strong positive feedback loop going on there.

 

[Katzndogz]

The only thing wrong with the shrinking sea ice, is that sea ice is actually growing.

And now it's global COOLING! Return of Arctic ice cap as it grows by 29% in a year | Mail Online

 

[itfitzme]

The only thing wrong with the shrinking sea ice, is that sea ice is actually growing.

And now it's global COOLING! Return of Arctic ice cap as it grows by 29% in a year | Mail Online

It rains every winter. It snows in higher elevations. And every winter, the ice grows.

What part of this don't you understand?

Please check one or more of the statement that applies

I am dumb ______.
I am ignorant _____.
I am crazy ______.

 

[itfitzme]

That Walleyes can post this as proof that nothing important is happening in the cryosphere is proof of the extent of his seperation from reality. Just look at the differance in the anamolys between the Arctic and Anarctic, yet he regards them as equal.

Poor dumb olfraud....where oh where did I say that. YOUR claims were that the Arctic was in a "death spiral" and that there would be no ice by....well I think you guys' original prediction was this year would be ice free ..was it not?

I am merely pointing out that the "canary in the coal mine", you guys' other favorite bit of tripe, is not panning out like you claimed it would.

Care to address those failed predictions?

Since I never said that the ice would be gone by 2013, that is just another lie from you. I have posted some that said that was a possibility after the 2007 surprise, but the most pessimistic that I have posted is that it possibly could be gone by 2015, and allmost certainly will have an ice free period by 2030. And the ice is in a death spiral. Every graph from every scientific source shows that. We have a very strong positive feedback loop going on there.

Curiously, this seems to be a common thing this week, the wacknuts making claims to things that never happened.

It is true, I have seen it up close and personal, that people do actually make up things that never occurred and believe them. It seems to be a behavior that they picked up in childhood. They get so good at it that they are entirely unaware that they are making things up.

 

[itfitzme]

hahaha. does anyone else notice that the warmers' predictions for both the arctic and the antarctic are both wrong? they are obviously putting the wrong inputs into their models, or are just ignoring ones that should be included. either way they are....wrong.

What prediction? Quote and link because I've found plenty and it is not what the deniers claim. Curiously, I presented the 2007 predictions and it seems you are wrong.

 

[itfitzme]

Nice way to post a lie. Here is the whole graph;

http://psc.apl.washington.edu/wordp...olumeAnomalyCurrentV2.png?<?php echo time() ?

Idiot. Try posting a graph that describes the same thing. Do you understand the difference between a graph describing ice thickness and a graph describing a volume anomoly? Guess not.

So, 2013 is thinner than 1980. That could be part of the reason that volume is less. Hmm... Area times thickness equal volume, so it is an indicator, not an exact one, but it would be the first suggestion.

http://seaice.apl.washington.edu/

Check this out.. http://seaice.apl.washington.edu/IceAge&Extent/Rigor&Wallace2004_AgeOfIce1979to2007.mpg

What is your point?

 

[westwall]

The only thing wrong with the shrinking sea ice, is that sea ice is actually growing.

And now it's global COOLING! Return of Arctic ice cap as it grows by 29% in a year | Mail Online

It rains every winter. It snows in higher elevations. And every winter, the ice grows.

What part of this don't you understand?

Please check one or more of the statement that applies

I am dumb ______.
I am ignorant _____.
I am crazy ______.

And the poles are considered DESERT because they are so dry. So you qualify for points 1 AND 2.

 

[itfitzme]

So the denialists are _still_ refusing to acknowledge the 1991 climate science paper that specifically predicted the increase in Antarctic sea ice? Of course they are. It's what cultists do.

Do they consider themselves liars? Not really. I think Westwall honestly thinks he's an honest person, as a result of his cult programming. It's part of the cult indoctrination, the cult defining its own members as morally perfect and incapable of lying. Thus, cultists are emotionally unable to process the fact that their cult lied to them. Since, in their eyes, the cult can't lie, that means the bearer of bad news who showed the cult was lying has to be a liar himself. And that would be why poor Westwall goes so unhinged whenever someone shows him how his cult lied.

And the evidence of the cult's lies? Simple refuse to acknowledge such a thing exists. If the bearer of bad news insists on bringing it up again, switch to endless personal attacks to divert attention.

I have had a recent and rare opportunity to observe chronic liars in action. In one instance, I shared the exact same experience with one. On recanting the incident, at a later time, this habitual liar picked and chose from small events that occurred, rearranged and ignored parts, then completely fabricated made a couple of needed ones to fit the pieces into his own narrative. And, I can assure you, he fully believed the fantasy that he fabricated.

I have no difficulty believing that Westwall does, in fact, believe his own fabrications as if they really happened. It is the marvelous thing about the mind, that psychology has shown, that memories can be completely fabricated, reality entirely overwritten. I have no doubt that Westwall is psychotic.

Yes, you call me all sorts of names and yet can never point to a lie I've ever told....so what does that make you? More to the point here's what the current state of the ice is... Doesn't look ANYTHING like the propaganda you posted..

Nothing you posted appears inconsistent with the 2007 predictions. Indeed, what you post seems to be in complete contradiction to what you say. Do you need someone to interpret the data for you? Or can you read a graph?

I'm really not getting it. The more and more you present, the strong is the case against what you claim. You are actually proving yourself wrong.

 

[itfitzme]

This one shows a decrease in sea ice.

 

[itfitzme]

This one shows a decrease in the total, a decrease in the arctic, and an increase in the antarctic. That is exactly what is reported elsewhere and what was predicted.

 

[itfitzme]

This one shows that the later years, 2008-2011 are lower than the earlier years. 2002 and 2003 are at the high end. 2011 and 2012 are at the low end. 2013 is in the middle, so it bumped up but it is still lower than 2003.