80 Years Ago We Built 2 Harbors in Normandy in 10 Days

[Moonglow]

Good for you

You are too gifted to be a mere shoeshine boy

Nobody is a shoeshine boy nowadays so you'll need another trade fer yer monkeys.

 

[Mac-7]

Nobody is a shoeshine boy nowadays so you'll need another trade fer yer monkeys.

As you were

Since so few men wear leather shoes its the perfect occupation for welfare bums

 

[Robert W]

What field combat duty did Eisenhower have during WWII?

Generals at the top don't have combat duty. They have boss duty.

 

[Moonglow]

Generals at the top don't have combat duty. They have boss duty.

Really, what field combat positions did his chief of staff generals have?

As you were

Since so few men wear leather shoes its the perfect occupation for welfare bums

For you uninitiated patent leather never needs polishing.

 

[Moonglow]

80 years ago the USA valued efficiency, expertise, competence, integrity, excellence.

Now it's 'woke.'

We all see D Day with a mixed bag of emotions. It was the beginning of the end of a Third Reich that no honorable person condones or sees as anything other than a vicious, genocidal regime and a stain on all that is good and honorable.

But it came at such a terrible cost in blood and treasure that the reasonable wonder if something different might have been better. But we can't change history. At least we cannot do so honestly or honorably. But we can learn from it.

I shudder to think that if those brave soldiers who stormed Normandy had been commanded by the current 'woke' administration how much less effective we would have been. And it is unlikely we would have brought Germany to unconditional surrender. And the world would be a much different place now.

Nope, things went wrong back then also.

 

[Robert W]

You evidently have no idea about WWII and American soldiers airmen, or sailors.

No, Even when I was a Democrat, I loved learning new things. I had got out of the Army and did not need to understand war but still my time in the Army made the time right to learn. I taught you that blacks did not get combat duty until the war in Europe was over and limited to pilots who were black officers.

 

[Foxfyre]

FDR banned blacks from combat duty. FDR soaked Americans to pay for his war. Really soaked them. Today we are not nearly as close to the FDR soaking. FDR due to war got saved from the Depression lasting longer. D Day was much better planned out. Also then the Chiefs of Staff had combat duty responsibility. This was taken from them at the end of WW2 so apparently somebody was not happy.

FDR did not ban blacks from combat duty but did keep black combat soldiers segregated. Harry Truman ended racial segregation in the military in 1948. Yes D Day was planned out but the best of the planners did not expect the carnage of that first day of the invasion--the longest day. So many mistakes were made that cost so many American lives but they were mistakes. Not intentional.

 

[Moonglow]

No, Even when I was a Democrat, I loved learning new things. I had got out of the Army and did not need to understand war but still my time in the Army made the time right to learn. I taught you that blacks did not get combat duty until the war in Europe was over and limited to pilots who were black officers.

92 and 93 Rd divisions fought in Italy, black marines saw combat on three major Japanese Islands invasions, black balloon unit was the first to step onto the beaches at Normandy.
Black tank battalion fought at battle of the Bulge.
This former dogface was a 27E and a 52D and I served in my nation's army and enjoyed seeing being alongside all those men and women who were not white along with white people because it's not about your color or nationality it's about doing your job.
If you hate FDR he did much for racial integration that was allowed by fellow white Americans.

 

[Robert W]

FDR did not ban blacks from combat duty but did keep black combat soldiers segregated. Harry Truman ended racial segregation in the military in 1948. Yes D Day was planned out but the best of the planners did not expect the carnage of that first day of the invasion--the longest day. So many mistakes were made that cost so many American lives but they were mistakes. Not intentional.

Where did blacks fight wars under FDR? Actually America did not lose as many troops on D day as the movies make you think.

FDRs own site works hard to whitewash FDR so let judge them by their writing.

FDR had blacks working as his personal staff. Goody.

In his rise to the presidency, FDR would be pressed to divulge where he stood on matters of race by the executive director of the NAACP Walter White. Republican Herbert Hoover’s dismal tenure in the White House gave FDR, candidate for the Democrat ticket, an opening to Black voters, who were suffering from four years of the Depression, but remained loyal to the Party of Lincoln. Roosevelt faced a major challenge right away. The New Deal era had its own versions of Black Lives Matter and debates over gun safety: chiefly, the scourge of lynching and the wariness of President Roosevelt to take it on directly for fear of alienating more powerful interests who held the keys to sweeping economic reforms he hoped to push through Congress. FDR tried to convey how, though he was horrified by the brutality of lynching, his hands were tied politically. Eventually, a gap would open between FDR and Eleanor over the gruesome and deadly practice.

While FDR felt constrained, ER would go public in an increasingly vocal way. The racial fallout over ER’s Arthurdale, West Virginia, homestead experiment was a perfect example of New Deal racial injustice that altered ER’s thinking. It also would spark her evolution from an employer of Black domestic employees to an advocate of equal rights and a partner of Black activists. Though the Black press called out FDR for his failure to act on racial injustice and inequality, it also zeroed in on the fact that twenty-three out of the Roosevelts’ twenty-five White House household staff members were Black. Among them were the couple Irvin (“Mac”) and Elizabeth (“Lizzie”) McDuffie, FDR’s personal valet and a maid, respectively. Several profiles of the staff ran in the Black press, and Mac was interviewed on the record for at least one of them. He attested that FDR thought only in terms of “Americans,” not with the labels Black and white.

Black Civil Rights Leaders and the Roosevelts - Home Of Franklin D Roosevelt National Historic Site (U.S. National Park Service)

www.nps.gov

The passage of the Selective Service Act in September 1940, the first peacetime draft in the nation’s history, signaled FDR’s desire to prepare the nation for war. Soon, thousands of African American men aged twenty-one to thirty-six registered for the lottery. Black people had historically fought in every American conflict, but the numbers were much higher than the military and Roosevelt’s War Department had anticipated. One in six of all enlistments in 1940-1941 were African American, even though African Americans made up only one-tenth of the US population. One historian wrote that leading Army officials, who were white without exception, believed that too many Black soldiers would “demoralize the white majority,” and, as a result, many would-be Black GIs were turned away from enlistment centers.

Black Americans were excluded from the Air Corps, the Signal Corps, the Coast Guard, and the Marines. The Navy, the branch of the service that FDR knew best, had no officers of color. African Americans could serve only as messmen, in menial positions. As the NAACP’s magazine, the Crisis, highlighted with a cover showing an airplane factory marked “For Whites Only,” only 0.2 percent of aircraft industry employees were African American in 1940. Randolph, along with the NAACP’s Walter White, Mary McLeod Bethune, and others in the Black Cabinet, lobbied the Roosevelt White House to change the situation.
And the capper:
The meeting was recorded, as Roosevelt was the first president to install audiotape equipment. The recording suggests a disconnect between the three Black leaders and Roosevelt, who touted his proposed military draft as an improvement on World War I. FDR was noncommittal on the specifics of the memorandum they brought to the meeting which demanded the wholesale desegregation of the US armed forces. Randolph insisted that “the Negro people . . . feel they are not wanted in the armed forces of the country, and they feel they have earned the right to participate in every phase of the government by virtue of their records in past wars since the time of the Revolution.” FDR suggested minor adjustments of Jim Crow policy to appease the civil rights leaders. Racial change, in the president’s view, should be limited and gradual: “A little opportunity here, a little opportunity there.” When White handed over petitions from eighty-five veterans’ posts condemning segregation, FDR cut him off, and the meeting ended abruptly.

FDR had promised to get back to Randolph and his colleagues about their memorandum, but he never did.

 

[Oddball]

Mulberry Harbors, Churchill’s idea.
Compare that in contrast to Biden’s $320M pier for terrorists that took months to build and fell apart on its own before it even went into service.
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Back then, you didn't have armies of pantywaisted faggot bureaucrats, making you create telephone book sized environmental impact statements.

 

[Robert W]

92 and 93 Rd divisions fought in Italy, black marines saw combat on three major Japanese Islands invasions, black balloon unit was the first to step onto the beaches at Normandy.
Black tank battalion fought at battle of the Bulge.
This former dogface was a 27E and a 52D and I served in my nation's army and enjoyed seeing being alongside all those men and women who were not white along with white people because it's not about your color or nationality it's about doing your job.
If you hate FDR he did much for racial integration that was allowed by fellow white Americans.

I don't hate FDR. I want America to know the truth. Not the Democrats version of Truth, but the honest to god factual Truth about FDR.

You were not involved in WW2, nor was I. I did not say when I was in under JFK and then Johnson blacks were not in my unit. But now that we discuss this, not a hell of a lot of blacks were even in my unit in Germany. My unit had around 360 officers and EM and I recall perhaps under a dozen were blacks. That was in the Draft era in the 1960s. I was the platoon sgt in my unit in Basic and I think I had, my assistant, and maybe 3 men who were black out of 60 troops.

 

[Robert W]

But like all presidents, F.D.R. courted criticism—both for what he did and what he failed to do. Even his signature New Deal initiative, which helped jump-start the U.S. economy and provide vulnerable Americans with a safety net, drew fire. While supporters hailed it as a visionary new approach to governing, critics contended that it set a dangerous precedent for expanding the federal government’s role in the economy and society.

Scholars and analysts continue to bicker over his legacy, with the most persistent criticism concentrated in a few key areas.

FDR’s Presidency: 6 Controversies | HISTORY

One of America's most revered presidents, Roosevelt also had his share of missteps—from trying to pack the Supreme Court to incarcerating Japanese Americans.

www.history.com

Accusations of Being a Socialist (and a Fascist)​

Roosevelt, who embraced the label of “progressive” while in practice remaining fiercely pragmatic, attracted fierce criticism from both ends of the political spectrum. Those on the right denounced him as a socialist for the ways in which he expanded both presidential powers, grew the role of the federal government and levied new, higher taxes on individuals and businesses. Those on the left argue that his policies didn’t go nearly far enough—and that Congress had granted Roosevelt powers that made him the equivalent of a totalitarian leader.
FDR also promised African Americans access to aviation training and greater opportunities to serve as officers in the military. FDR’s last-minute appointments may have helped him win the 1940 election, but they did not satisfy Randolph. These changes, while important symbolically, had sidestepped the issue of desegregating the military, the core reform that Randolph and the other Black leaders had demanded in their White House meeting. On a trip south to meet Brotherhood officials in December 1940, Randolph told his travel companion Milton Webster, “I think we ought to get 10,000 Negroes to march on Washington in protest, march down Pennsylvania Avenue” to demand jobs in defense industries and to integrate the military.

 

[Robert W]

Back to FDR against black soldiers proof:

When World War II began, the Army held a deep distrust in the quality of black soldiers. The critical need for manpower forced the Army to field several African American combat units during the war, but the overwhelming majority of the 900,000 African Americans that served in the Army during the war were limited to logistical jobs.

Fighting for the Right to Fight: African American Experiences in World War II: Exhibit at The National WWII Museum in New Orleans

The National WWII Museum presents a Special Exhibit about African American Experiences in World War II. July 4, 2015 - May 30, 2016

righttofightexhibit.org

The prewar Army Air Corps was more vehement than most of the services regarding the inferiority of African Americans. The Air Corps was adamant that blacks could not serve as combat pilots. However, bowing to a presidential decree in 1941, the Air Corps began training a limited number of pilots at Tuskegee, Alabama—the legendary Tuskegee Airmen.

The tradition-bound Navy initially resisted accepting black servicemembers . . . then enlisted African Americans but denied them proper combat training and limited them to the roles of stevedore, steward, or cook. Nevertheless, recruitment surged: more than 160,000 African Americans would serve in the Navy during World War II.

Initially, the Marine Corps strongly resisted the inclusion of African Americans, and limited black troops to supply and logistical roles. In reality, black Marines found themselves in some of the fiercest fighting of the Pacific War, including Peleliu and Iwo Jima. ???? HOW MANY YOU ASK? How about 2000 max????
Okinawa, Japan, and China

The fight for Okinawa, which proved to be the last battle of World War II, involved some 2,000 black Marines, a larger concentration than for any previous operation. On 1 April 1945, the 6th and 1st Marine Divisions stormed ashore alongside two Army divisions, while the 2d Marine Division engaged in a feint to pin down the island's Japanese defenders. The three ammunition and four depot companies assigned to the 7th Field Depot, supporting the III Marine Amphibious Corps on that day, were divided between the demonstration and assault forces. The 1st and 3d Ammunition Companies and the 5th, 38th, and part of the 37th Marine Depot Companies accompanied the 2d Marine Division, while the 12th Ammunition and 18th Depot Companies, along with the rest of the 37th, participated in the landings by the 1st and 6th Marine Divisions. Within three days, almost all of the amphibious force's black Marines were in action ashore, and reinforcements soon arrived. By the end of April, the 20th Marine Depot Company reached Okinawa from Saipan, and in May the 9th and 10th Depot Companies from Guadalcanal, together with the 19th from Saipan, joined the 7th Field Depot.​

 

[Foxfyre]

Where did blacks fight wars under FDR? Actually America did not lose as many troops on D day as the movies make you think.

FDRs own site works hard to whitewash FDR so let judge them by their writing.

FDR had blacks working as his personal staff. Goody.

In his rise to the presidency, FDR would be pressed to divulge where he stood on matters of race by the executive director of the NAACP Walter White. Republican Herbert Hoover’s dismal tenure in the White House gave FDR, candidate for the Democrat ticket, an opening to Black voters, who were suffering from four years of the Depression, but remained loyal to the Party of Lincoln. Roosevelt faced a major challenge right away. The New Deal era had its own versions of Black Lives Matter and debates over gun safety: chiefly, the scourge of lynching and the wariness of President Roosevelt to take it on directly for fear of alienating more powerful interests who held the keys to sweeping economic reforms he hoped to push through Congress. FDR tried to convey how, though he was horrified by the brutality of lynching, his hands were tied politically. Eventually, a gap would open between FDR and Eleanor over the gruesome and deadly practice.

While FDR felt constrained, ER would go public in an increasingly vocal way. The racial fallout over ER’s Arthurdale, West Virginia, homestead experiment was a perfect example of New Deal racial injustice that altered ER’s thinking. It also would spark her evolution from an employer of Black domestic employees to an advocate of equal rights and a partner of Black activists. Though the Black press called out FDR for his failure to act on racial injustice and inequality, it also zeroed in on the fact that twenty-three out of the Roosevelts’ twenty-five White House household staff members were Black. Among them were the couple Irvin (“Mac”) and Elizabeth (“Lizzie”) McDuffie, FDR’s personal valet and a maid, respectively. Several profiles of the staff ran in the Black press, and Mac was interviewed on the record for at least one of them. He attested that FDR thought only in terms of “Americans,” not with the labels Black and white.

Black Civil Rights Leaders and the Roosevelts - Home Of Franklin D Roosevelt National Historic Site (U.S. National Park Service)

www.nps.gov

The passage of the Selective Service Act in September 1940, the first peacetime draft in the nation’s history, signaled FDR’s desire to prepare the nation for war. Soon, thousands of African American men aged twenty-one to thirty-six registered for the lottery. Black people had historically fought in every American conflict, but the numbers were much higher than the military and Roosevelt’s War Department had anticipated. One in six of all enlistments in 1940-1941 were African American, even though African Americans made up only one-tenth of the US population. One historian wrote that leading Army officials, who were white without exception, believed that too many Black soldiers would “demoralize the white majority,” and, as a result, many would-be Black GIs were turned away from enlistment centers.

Black Americans were excluded from the Air Corps, the Signal Corps, the Coast Guard, and the Marines. The Navy, the branch of the service that FDR knew best, had no officers of color. African Americans could serve only as messmen, in menial positions. As the NAACP’s magazine, the Crisis, highlighted with a cover showing an airplane factory marked “For Whites Only,” only 0.2 percent of aircraft industry employees were African American in 1940. Randolph, along with the NAACP’s Walter White, Mary McLeod Bethune, and others in the Black Cabinet, lobbied the Roosevelt White House to change the situation.
And the capper:
The meeting was recorded, as Roosevelt was the first president to install audiotape equipment. The recording suggests a disconnect between the three Black leaders and Roosevelt, who touted his proposed military draft as an improvement on World War I. FDR was noncommittal on the specifics of the memorandum they brought to the meeting which demanded the wholesale desegregation of the US armed forces. Randolph insisted that “the Negro people . . . feel they are not wanted in the armed forces of the country, and they feel they have earned the right to participate in every phase of the government by virtue of their records in past wars since the time of the Revolution.” FDR suggested minor adjustments of Jim Crow policy to appease the civil rights leaders. Racial change, in the president’s view, should be limited and gradual: “A little opportunity here, a little opportunity there.” When White handed over petitions from eighty-five veterans’ posts condemning segregation, FDR cut him off, and the meeting ended abruptly.

FDR had promised to get back to Randolph and his colleagues about their memorandum, but he never did.

Some 1.2 million black Americans served in WWII

Black Americans Who Served in WWII Faced Segregation Abroad and at Home | HISTORY

Some 1.2 million Black men served in the U.S. military during the war, but they were often treated as second-class citizens.

www.history.com

 

[CrusaderFrank]

We planned and prepared for that for a couple of years and spent what would be billions in today's money to do it.

Not really apples to apples here.

How many environmental impact statements were filed at Normandy?

 

[Crepitus]

We didnt have diversity, equity, and inclusion in those days

America just used the best people rather than selecting them by color

Sure, ignore reality in favor of todays chosen fauxrage.

 

[Mac-7]

Sure, ignore reality in favor of todays chosen fauxrage.

How can you argue that white supremacy existed throughout our history and now turn on a dime and deny it?

 

[Crepitus]

How can you argue that white supremacy existed throughout our history and now turn on a dime and deny it?

Why don't you start a thread on that? It has nothing to do with what happened with the pier.

 

[alang1216]

Mulberry Harbors, Churchill’s idea.
Compare that in contrast to Biden’s $320M pier for terrorists that took months to build and fell apart on its own before it even went into service.

Your history is very weak. The Harbors were built over a period of months in England and towed to France. They were huge, the material requirements for any part of either Mulberry A or B were huge – 144,000 tons of concrete, 85,000 tons of ballast and 105,000 tons of steel, but one was quickly destroyed by a storm and the other severely damaged.

 

[Mac-7]

Why don't you start a thread on that? It has nothing to do with what happened with the pier.

Sez you

But we used to build better piers before DEI