A Tea Party Wants Mandatory Christmas Carols In Public Schools

[Coyote]

Bye, bye America. You have surrendered every value you ever had to special interest groups. So sad, so patetic, so politically correct, so 21st century American.

Allah Akbar !

Yukon as much as I dislike a lot of what you post I do agree with this assessment, especially if we pass cap and trade, healthcare, and sign off on an internationally binding agreement in copenhagen.

And I also agree that God, by whatever name the higher power is called, is great.

I'm going to gently disagree with this. It is true that we have handed over to big government many of our former freedoms and rights in favor of a nanny/big brother state and in the process have corrupted both government and ourselves. But I do not believe that we have surrendered all our values and I think more Americans are regaining their backbones and their virtues every day as testified by the Tea Parties, Tax Protest rallies, and the polls.

I hope that trend continues and we will have a fighting chance to restore our country to its former greatness.

What former greatness was that?

 

[NYcarbineer]

Bye, bye America. You have surrendered every value you ever had to special interest groups. So sad, so patetic, so politically correct, so 21st century American.

Allah Akbar !

Yukon as much as I dislike a lot of what you post I do agree with this assessment, especially if we pass cap and trade, healthcare, and sign off on an internationally binding agreement in copenhagen.

And I also agree that God, by whatever name the higher power is called, is great.

I'm going to gently disagree with this. It is true that we have handed over to big government many of our former freedoms and rights in favor of a nanny/big brother state and in the process have corrupted both government and ourselves. But I do not believe that we have surrendered all our values and I think more Americans are regaining their backbones and their virtues every day as testified by the Tea Parties, Tax Protest rallies, and the polls.

I hope that trend continues and we will have a fighting chance to restore our country to its former greatness.

What former greatness was that?

 

[NYcarbineer]

Yukon as much as I dislike a lot of what you post I do agree with this assessment, especially if we pass cap and trade, healthcare, and sign off on an internationally binding agreement in copenhagen.

And I also agree that God, by whatever name the higher power is called, is great.

I'm going to gently disagree with this. It is true that we have handed over to big government many of our former freedoms and rights in favor of a nanny/big brother state and in the process have corrupted both government and ourselves. But I do not believe that we have surrendered all our values and I think more Americans are regaining their backbones and their virtues every day as testified by the Tea Parties, Tax Protest rallies, and the polls.

I hope that trend continues and we will have a fighting chance to restore our country to its former greatness.

I hear that......AMEN Fox

How interesting to see so many conservatives now declare that America is no longer a great nation.

 

[Foxfyre]

Yukon as much as I dislike a lot of what you post I do agree with this assessment, especially if we pass cap and trade, healthcare, and sign off on an internationally binding agreement in copenhagen.

And I also agree that God, by whatever name the higher power is called, is great.

I'm going to gently disagree with this. It is true that we have handed over to big government many of our former freedoms and rights in favor of a nanny/big brother state and in the process have corrupted both government and ourselves. But I do not believe that we have surrendered all our values and I think more Americans are regaining their backbones and their virtues every day as testified by the Tea Parties, Tax Protest rallies, and the polls.

I hope that trend continues and we will have a fighting chance to restore our country to its former greatness.

What former greatness was that?

We were the envy of the world when we were not a nanny/big brother state; when those elected to high officer were ashamed of being caught being self serving or unethical and were expected to step down when guilty of that. We once were subservient to nobody and valued hard work, self reliance, private charity, flag, country, and deference to God by whatever name. Most Americans understood the concept of unalienable rights and did not consider it their right for anybody else to provide what they needed. The government pretty much enforced sensible laws and otherwise left people pretty much alone to live their lives. And because government had not yet learned to enhance its own power, authority, prestige, or personal wealth by manipulating the system, our manufacturing base, productivity, GDP, and standard of living was coveted by all. Fiscal restraint was the norm rather than a fast fading memory. It was a nation of patriots and almost all Americans loved their country, knew it to be good despite its flaws, and didn't apologize to anybody.

The Tea Partiers remember that country and/or are smart enough to know that it existed. And they want it back.

 

[ihopehefails]

Bye, bye America. You have surrendered every value you ever had to special interest groups. So sad, so patetic, so politically correct, so 21st century American.

Allah Akbar !

Yukon as much as I dislike a lot of what you post I do agree with this assessment, especially if we pass cap and trade, healthcare, and sign off on an internationally binding agreement in copenhagen.

And I also agree that God, by whatever name the higher power is called, is great.

I'm going to gently disagree with this. It is true that we have handed over to big government many of our former freedoms and rights in favor of a nanny/big brother state and in the process have corrupted both government and ourselves. But I do not believe that we have surrendered all our values and I think more Americans are regaining their backbones and their virtues every day as testified by the Tea Parties, Tax Protest rallies, and the polls.

I hope that trend continues and we will have a fighting chance to restore our country to its former greatness.

The symptom of the disease is a government that has gotten so big that it not longer connects with the people. The size of DC is huge and total number of federal employees probably matches with any small city. This creates a kind of society of federal employees that feel more connected to that "society" than it does to the American people they think they rule.

We need to cut the government drastically and then you will see attitudes change.

 

[PLYMCO_PILGRIM]

I'm going to gently disagree with this. It is true that we have handed over to big government many of our former freedoms and rights in favor of a nanny/big brother state and in the process have corrupted both government and ourselves. But I do not believe that we have surrendered all our values and I think more Americans are regaining their backbones and their virtues every day as testified by the Tea Parties, Tax Protest rallies, and the polls.

I hope that trend continues and we will have a fighting chance to restore our country to its former greatness.

What former greatness was that?

We were the envy of the world when we were not a nanny/big brother state; when those elected to high officer were ashamed of being caught being self serving or unethical and were expected to step down when guilty of that. We once were subservient to nobody and valued hard work, self reliance, private charity, flag, country, and deference to God by whatever name. Most Americans understood the concept of unalienable rights and did not consider it their right for anybody else to provide what they needed. The government pretty much enforced sensible laws and otherwise left people pretty much alone to live their lives. And because government had not yet learned to enhance its own power, authority, prestige, or personal wealth by manipulating the system, our manufacturing base, productivity, GDP, and standard of living was coveted by all. Fiscal restraint was the norm rather than a fast fading memory. It was a nation of patriots and almost all Americans loved their country, knew it to be good despite its flaws, and didn't apologize to anybody.

The Tea Partiers remember that country and/or are smart enough to know that it existed. And they want it back.

I noticed your post scared everyone away .

The truth can do that sometimes you know

BTW I never claimed we aren't still a great nation, its just we have this cancer of "nanny-stateism" that needs to be cut out.

 

[nodoginnafight]

I'm going to gently disagree with this. It is true that we have handed over to big government many of our former freedoms and rights in favor of a nanny/big brother state and in the process have corrupted both government and ourselves. But I do not believe that we have surrendered all our values and I think more Americans are regaining their backbones and their virtues every day as testified by the Tea Parties, Tax Protest rallies, and the polls.

I hope that trend continues and we will have a fighting chance to restore our country to its former greatness.

What former greatness was that?

We were the envy of the world when we were not a nanny/big brother state; when those elected to high officer were ashamed of being caught being self serving or unethical and were expected to step down when guilty of that. We once were subservient to nobody and valued hard work, self reliance, private charity, flag, country, and deference to God by whatever name. Most Americans understood the concept of unalienable rights and did not consider it their right for anybody else to provide what they needed. The government pretty much enforced sensible laws and otherwise left people pretty much alone to live their lives. And because government had not yet learned to enhance its own power, authority, prestige, or personal wealth by manipulating the system, our manufacturing base, productivity, GDP, and standard of living was coveted by all. Fiscal restraint was the norm rather than a fast fading memory. It was a nation of patriots and almost all Americans loved their country, knew it to be good despite its flaws, and didn't apologize to anybody.

The Tea Partiers remember that country and/or are smart enough to know that it existed. And they want it back.

IF the tea partiers can cast off the theocractic jihadists, they stand a chance. If not, they will dwell in the house of minority forever, amen.

And that would be a tragedy imho. Fiscal conservatism (imho) should NOT be marginalized. IMHO the Blue Dog (paygo) Democrats are in a much better position to push the agenda without all the distractions of the far right nutters. It remains to be seen if the far left nutters of THEIR party will allow it.

 

[Foxfyre]

IF the tea partiers can cast off the theocractic jihadists, they stand a chance. If not, they will dwell in the house of minority forever, amen.

And that would be a tragedy imho. Fiscal conservatism (imho) should NOT be marginalized. IMHO the Blue Dog (paygo) Democrats are in a much better position to push the agenda without all the distractions of the far right nutters. It remains to be seen if the far left nutters of THEIR party will allow it.

There are no 'theocratic jihadists' who are true Americans out there. There are those who recognize that religion, especially Christianity, is ingrained in American history, culture, values, and laws and who are becoming increasingly adament that the Atheistic or anti-religious jihadists should not be allowed to dismiss, exorcize, deny, or restrict acknowledgement and celebration of that. The Founders were quite careful to ensure that no religion would have power to control the U.S. government, but they were quite aware that Americans were religious and wrote into the Constitution that the government would not have the power to silence, reward, or punish anyone for expressing his/her religious beliefs. They fully expected that Americans would vote their values, including those arising from religious teachings or beliefs, into the laws, customs, and principles that guided government.

Up until the last several decades, there was no question about that. People were allowed to be patriots AND religious at the same time. Evenso it was the people themselves, while no less religious, who saw the wisdom of eliminating the theocracies that existed within individual states. Since then, no new theocracies have developed.. That tells me the Founders got it right about all that. A truly free people generally do eventually arrive at the best social contract acceptable to all.

In my opinion, there is far more danger to American values in attempting to squelch religious values than there is in allowing them to be expressed.

 

[007]

your thread title and the initiative's purpose, according to the OP, do not mesh...

The initiative would require schools to provide children the opportunity to listen to or perform Christmas carols, and would subject the schools to litigation if the rule isn't followed.

whats wrong with providing an opportunity? seems you are against freedom....

Well how about that... now you need an initiative to do what we USED to be able to do of our own free will.

What the fuck is happening to this country? Why is stupid shit like this even necessary?

 

[nodoginnafight]

IF the tea partiers can cast off the theocractic jihadists, they stand a chance. If not, they will dwell in the house of minority forever, amen.

And that would be a tragedy imho. Fiscal conservatism (imho) should NOT be marginalized. IMHO the Blue Dog (paygo) Democrats are in a much better position to push the agenda without all the distractions of the far right nutters. It remains to be seen if the far left nutters of THEIR party will allow it.

There are no 'theocratic jihadists' who are true Americans out there. There are those who recognize that religion, especially Christianity, is ingrained in American history, culture, values, and laws and who are becoming increasingly adament that the Atheistic or anti-religious jihadists should not be allowed to dismiss, exorcize, deny, or restrict acknowledgement and celebration of that. The Founders were quite careful to ensure that no religion would have power to control the U.S. government, but they were quite aware that Americans were religious and wrote into the Constitution that the government would not have the power to silence, reward, or punish anyone for expressing his/her religious beliefs. They fully expected that Americans would vote their values, including those arising from religious teachings or beliefs, into the laws, customs, and principles that guided government.

Up until the last several decades, there was no question about that. People were allowed to be patriots AND religious at the same time. Evenso it was the people themselves, while no less religious, who saw the wisdom of eliminating the theocracies that existed within individual states. Since then, no new theocracies have developed.. That tells me the Founders got it right about all that. A truly free people generally do eventually arrive at the best social contract acceptable to all.

In my opinion, there is far more danger to American values in attempting to squelch religious values than there is in allowing them to be expressed.

The founding fathers were also aware that that there would be constant pressure from the majority religion to write their doctrine into law. (Prohibition, etc ...) and that it would take constant vigilence to make sure no religion - even the majority religion - is able to write their doctrine into U.S. Law or to create a systemically prefered religion of the land.

If the Tea Partiers can't eject these right-wing jihadists (because a right-wing jihadist is a right-wing jihadist regardless of whether they are a muslim right-wing jihadist or a Christian right-wing jihadist) then they will fail.

But fiscal conservatism has a real chance - IF it can be divorced from these distateful social mandates.

 

[PLYMCO_PILGRIM]

IF the tea partiers can cast off the theocractic jihadists, they stand a chance. If not, they will dwell in the house of minority forever, amen.

And that would be a tragedy imho. Fiscal conservatism (imho) should NOT be marginalized. IMHO the Blue Dog (paygo) Democrats are in a much better position to push the agenda without all the distractions of the far right nutters. It remains to be seen if the far left nutters of THEIR party will allow it.

There are no 'theocratic jihadists' who are true Americans out there. There are those who recognize that religion, especially Christianity, is ingrained in American history, culture, values, and laws and who are becoming increasingly adament that the Atheistic or anti-religious jihadists should not be allowed to dismiss, exorcize, deny, or restrict acknowledgement and celebration of that. The Founders were quite careful to ensure that no religion would have power to control the U.S. government, but they were quite aware that Americans were religious and wrote into the Constitution that the government would not have the power to silence, reward, or punish anyone for expressing his/her religious beliefs. They fully expected that Americans would vote their values, including those arising from religious teachings or beliefs, into the laws, customs, and principles that guided government.

Up until the last several decades, there was no question about that. People were allowed to be patriots AND religious at the same time. Evenso it was the people themselves, while no less religious, who saw the wisdom of eliminating the theocracies that existed within individual states. Since then, no new theocracies have developed.. That tells me the Founders got it right about all that. A truly free people generally do eventually arrive at the best social contract acceptable to all.

In my opinion, there is far more danger to American values in attempting to squelch religious values than there is in allowing them to be expressed.

He is talking about some of the people who show up with their anti-abortion signs and stuff like that.

I dont think he realizes that the "tea parties" consist of ALL types of americans....more from the right but we go all the way from far right to almost far left in our membership. That being said you will ALWAYS find a few crazies out there with signs....knowing how our media works those are the ones who will get propped up as representative of the movement. The media doesn't like us because their fat-cat politician friends are scared of us.

Thats what happens with movements like this....we get ignored, then marginalized....then if we dont go away they start to fight back but if they go that far guess what......yup its in my sig line .

 

[nodoginnafight]

They also get tooled - by those who could care less about the integrity or the real purpose of the movement. They just want to use the movement as a tool against their political opponents.

Got to cast out those demons.

 

[PLYMCO_PILGRIM]

They also get tooled - by those who could care less about the integrity or the real purpose of the movement. They just want to use the movement as a tool against their political opponents.

Got to cast out those demons.

indeed

 

[Foxfyre]

IF the tea partiers can cast off the theocractic jihadists, they stand a chance. If not, they will dwell in the house of minority forever, amen.

And that would be a tragedy imho. Fiscal conservatism (imho) should NOT be marginalized. IMHO the Blue Dog (paygo) Democrats are in a much better position to push the agenda without all the distractions of the far right nutters. It remains to be seen if the far left nutters of THEIR party will allow it.

There are no 'theocratic jihadists' who are true Americans out there. There are those who recognize that religion, especially Christianity, is ingrained in American history, culture, values, and laws and who are becoming increasingly adament that the Atheistic or anti-religious jihadists should not be allowed to dismiss, exorcize, deny, or restrict acknowledgement and celebration of that. The Founders were quite careful to ensure that no religion would have power to control the U.S. government, but they were quite aware that Americans were religious and wrote into the Constitution that the government would not have the power to silence, reward, or punish anyone for expressing his/her religious beliefs. They fully expected that Americans would vote their values, including those arising from religious teachings or beliefs, into the laws, customs, and principles that guided government.

Up until the last several decades, there was no question about that. People were allowed to be patriots AND religious at the same time. Evenso it was the people themselves, while no less religious, who saw the wisdom of eliminating the theocracies that existed within individual states. Since then, no new theocracies have developed.. That tells me the Founders got it right about all that. A truly free people generally do eventually arrive at the best social contract acceptable to all.

In my opinion, there is far more danger to American values in attempting to squelch religious values than there is in allowing them to be expressed.

The founding fathers were also aware that that there would be constant pressure from the majority religion to write their doctrine into law. (Prohibition, etc ...) and that it would take constant vigilence to make sure no religion - even the majority religion - is able to write their doctrine into U.S. Law or to create a systemically prefered religion of the land.

If the Tea Partiers can't eject these right-wing jihadists (because a right-wing jihadist is a right-wing jihadist regardless of whether they are a muslim right-wing jihadist or a Christian right-wing jihadist) then they will fail.

But fiscal conservatism has a real chance - IF it can be divorced from these distateful social mandates.

Well you know what, as an enthusiastic, committed, and dedicated Tea Partier myself, I haven't seen a 'jihadist' of any sort in their midst at any time. I have seen a very few people who showed up with racist or hateful or otherwise inappropriate signs asked to please put those away and in every case they did. The leftist media has to really scour most of the crowds to find any sign they could photograph and show as representative of how radical these people are. A blatant lie of course, but with the modern media these days, honestly and integrity do not seem to be high on its list of priorities.

Now, assuming you are not just arguing ad hominem or in an insulting manner, it is my opinion that jihad is one of the more poorly understood and most misused terms in the modern vernacular. I wonder if you are using it appropriately?

So do you consider people who want Merry Christmas to be the normal greeting at Christmastime to be jihadists? Or, appropriately for this thread, are they jihadists who want their children to have opportunity to learn and sing the great traditional and classical music composed for Christmas celebrations. How about those who deeply believe that a human life starts at conception and that babies should be born and not killed? How about those who understand the First Amendment as the Founders did and resist those who want all religious symbolism, expression, imagery, music etc. banned from the public sector? Does somebody petitioning their government for any reason, including religious reasons, constitute jihad to you?

If so, what is your basic argument for opposing any of these things? Should all people professing such conviction or belief be expelled by reasonable people? Do you feel the same way about all the animal rights, environmentalist crusaders, political correctness police, and civil/gay rights advocates who protest this or that or who petition their government re various concerns?

Or where do you draw the line between what is our constitutional and proper right to free speech, conviction, opinion, etc. and that which should cause reasonable people to expel us from their midst?

 

[Yurt]

I see Carb posting evidence, Yurt calling people liars.

lmao...what evidence? be specific

obviously dogbert has failed to provide evidence, thus dogbert (using his logic) is a liar

 

[MajikMyst]

Just to chime in here.. I think there are a few dynamics at play..

First, anytime something is mandantory and violation will result in a form of punishment, is by definition not freedom.. So?? To say that it is mandatory to offer an opportunity, is in itself dsingenuous and not enforcable.. All a school has to say is that it offered and the students refused.. Case closed..

What is implied here is the mandantory perfromring and singing of Christmas carols.. They use the word 'offer' to enable the freedom arguement.. If you want freedom? Then don't make a law about it at all.. Let the schools and students make the call.. They don't need you mandating the oportunity to do anything..

Just be honest here! You want a law demanding that kids sing christian christmas carols.. That is cool!! I can live with that.. As long as there is a law telling them that Christmas was a Pagan holiday and Christ wasn't really born on Christmas.. He was actually born in March by all accounts according to the bible and other documents.. So is that fair?? You mandate christmas carols, if I can tell them christmas is a pagen holiday?? I mean?? I think telling the truth should be mandantory!! Every school should be required to offer the truth about chrsitmas and christianity in general?? I think that is fair!!

You neotards are quibbling over a word.. But remember.. Freedom also means to have the freedom to have no religion on schools.. The freedom of no religion should not be broken!!

 

[California Girl]

Just to chime in here.. I think there are a few dynamics at play..

First, anytime something is mandantory and violation will result in a form of punishment, is by definition not freedom.. So?? To say that it is mandatory to offer an opportunity, is in itself dsingenuous and not enforcable.. All a school has to say is that it offered and the students refused.. Case closed..

What is implied here is the mandantory perfromring and singing of Christmas carols.. They use the word 'offer' to enable the freedom arguement.. If you want freedom? Then don't make a law about it at all.. Let the schools and students make the call.. They don't need you mandating the oportunity to do anything..

Just be honest here! You want a law demanding that kids sing christian christmas carols.. That is cool!! I can live with that.. As long as there is a law telling them that Christmas was a Pagan holiday and Christ wasn't really born on Christmas.. He was actually born in March by all accounts according to the bible and other documents.. So is that fair?? You mandate christmas carols, if I can tell them christmas is a pagen holiday?? I mean?? I think telling the truth should be mandantory!! Every school should be required to offer the truth about chrsitmas and christianity in general?? I think that is fair!!

You neotards are quibbling over a word.. But remember.. Freedom also means to have the freedom to have no religion on schools.. The freedom of no religion should not be broken!!

No one is demanding that kids sing christian christmas carols. Someone is requesting that children have the OPPORTUNITY to sing them. Huge difference.

 

[Gatekeeper]

Just to chime in here.. I think there are a few dynamics at play..

First, anytime something is mandantory and violation will result in a form of punishment, is by definition not freedom.. So?? To say that it is mandatory to offer an opportunity, is in itself dsingenuous and not enforcable.. All a school has to say is that it offered and the students refused.. Case closed..

What is implied here is the mandantory perfromring and singing of Christmas carols.. They use the word 'offer' to enable the freedom arguement.. If you want freedom? Then don't make a law about it at all.. Let the schools and students make the call.. They don't need you mandating the oportunity to do anything..

Just be honest here! You want a law demanding that kids sing christian christmas carols.. That is cool!! I can live with that.. As long as there is a law telling them that Christmas was a Pagan holiday and Christ wasn't really born on Christmas.. He was actually born in March by all accounts according to the bible and other documents.. So is that fair?? You mandate christmas carols, if I can tell them christmas is a pagen holiday?? I mean?? I think telling the truth should be mandantory!! Every school should be required to offer the truth about chrsitmas and christianity in general?? I think that is fair!!

You neotards are quibbling over a word.. But remember.. Freedom also means to have the freedom to have no religion on schools.. The freedom of no religion should not be broken!!

No one is demanding that kids sing christian christmas carols. Someone is requesting that children have the OPPORTUNITY to sing them. Huge difference.

Amazing how interpretations vary, even to a 'no brainer' article. Let's put the quote up and the article again.

Quote from: The Huffington Post Rachel Weiner

The initiative would require schools to provide children the opportunity to listen to or perform Christmas carols, and would subject the schools to litigation if the rule isn't followed.

A Re-Read is indicated for some.

Merry Hyatt, Tea Party Patriot, Wants Mandatory Christmas Carols In Public Schools

 

[California Girl]

Just to chime in here.. I think there are a few dynamics at play..

First, anytime something is mandantory and violation will result in a form of punishment, is by definition not freedom.. So?? To say that it is mandatory to offer an opportunity, is in itself dsingenuous and not enforcable.. All a school has to say is that it offered and the students refused.. Case closed..

What is implied here is the mandantory perfromring and singing of Christmas carols.. They use the word 'offer' to enable the freedom arguement.. If you want freedom? Then don't make a law about it at all.. Let the schools and students make the call.. They don't need you mandating the oportunity to do anything..

Just be honest here! You want a law demanding that kids sing christian christmas carols.. That is cool!! I can live with that.. As long as there is a law telling them that Christmas was a Pagan holiday and Christ wasn't really born on Christmas.. He was actually born in March by all accounts according to the bible and other documents.. So is that fair?? You mandate christmas carols, if I can tell them christmas is a pagen holiday?? I mean?? I think telling the truth should be mandantory!! Every school should be required to offer the truth about chrsitmas and christianity in general?? I think that is fair!!

You neotards are quibbling over a word.. But remember.. Freedom also means to have the freedom to have no religion on schools.. The freedom of no religion should not be broken!!

No one is demanding that kids sing christian christmas carols. Someone is requesting that children have the OPPORTUNITY to sing them. Huge difference.

Amazing how interpretations vary, even to a 'no brainer' article. Let's put the quote up and the article again.

Quote from: The Huffington Post Rachel Weiner

The initiative would require schools to provide children the opportunity to listen to or perform Christmas carols, and would subject the schools to litigation if the rule isn't followed.

A Re-Read is indicated for some.

Merry Hyatt, Tea Party Patriot, Wants Mandatory Christmas Carols In Public Schools

Yep, between that and the misunderstand of 'freedom OF religion' to become 'freedom FROM religion', it does seem that a few people struggle with words.

 

[rightwinger]

Just to chime in here.. I think there are a few dynamics at play..

First, anytime something is mandantory and violation will result in a form of punishment, is by definition not freedom.. So?? To say that it is mandatory to offer an opportunity, is in itself dsingenuous and not enforcable.. All a school has to say is that it offered and the students refused.. Case closed..

What is implied here is the mandantory perfromring and singing of Christmas carols.. They use the word 'offer' to enable the freedom arguement.. If you want freedom? Then don't make a law about it at all.. Let the schools and students make the call.. They don't need you mandating the oportunity to do anything..

Just be honest here! You want a law demanding that kids sing christian christmas carols.. That is cool!! I can live with that.. As long as there is a law telling them that Christmas was a Pagan holiday and Christ wasn't really born on Christmas.. He was actually born in March by all accounts according to the bible and other documents.. So is that fair?? You mandate christmas carols, if I can tell them christmas is a pagen holiday?? I mean?? I think telling the truth should be mandantory!! Every school should be required to offer the truth about chrsitmas and christianity in general?? I think that is fair!!

You neotards are quibbling over a word.. But remember.. Freedom also means to have the freedom to have no religion on schools.. The freedom of no religion should not be broken!!

No one is demanding that kids sing christian christmas carols. Someone is requesting that children have the OPPORTUNITY to sing them. Huge difference.

Just don't let me catch those kids singing songs about Obama!

Indoctrination damn it!