Algerian writer: “Take Islam back from the Islamists!”

[MHunterB]

I would say that 'don't like' is a very inaccurate - disingenuously so! - description of the emotions Sunni's filth have inspired in those of us who've been his perennial targets.

Guess you missed the one about shipping all the Jews - not 'Zionists', JEWS - to an island and having armed boats patrolling the waters around it?

 

[Coyote]

muslims hate him because he went to Israel.

http://www.nytimes.com/2012/07/05/w...ying-prize-money-to-algerian-writer.html?_r=0

It's actually a really interesting article and he makes some interesting points, particularly about the role of Islam in those countries and what, I'm thinking is a lack of a "civil society" that is needed for democracy, seperate from religion and government.

One must question the relationship of Islam to society, to democracy, to women and to the modern world. And to the state. Things that we take for granted, the conception of the state, is something that cannot be explained to a Muslim who has lived his whole life with Islam. It is a concept that does not exist in Islam. For Islam it is much more about God governing humanity.

I think this is also a key difference between Islam in western countries, such as the US and Islam in Africa or the ME.

Does that mean that Islam and democracy are incompatible?

Sansal: The fact that they are not compatible at the moment does not mean that they cannot become so. Christianity and democracy have not always been compatible. God was in charge and the Church ruled over people's souls. Then democracy came along and brought war between religion and democracy.

Another good point.

Sansal: That's difficult. I have often accused Western politicians of supporting our dictators and Islamists instead of our democrats. They tell me that there are no democrats here, that they can only give their support to either dictators or Islamists. And they are right! We cannot import European democracy into Algeria; we have to invent one of our own.

But the selling of weapons to dictators and the supporting of Islamists has to stop – as Germany has done and is still doing. I also criticise Muslim intellectuals. What are they doing in Europe? They sit in Paris and complain about the Algerian government not being democratic. They should be saying this in Algeria! Democrats need to fight for democracy in Muslim countries. And Muslims must fight for Islam. They must take it back from the Islamists. It is they who must fight Islamism because it is destroying their religion.

He really makes good points...

 

[toastman]

Sources matter. If you select an article from a source that's a recognizable hate site - it taints it and it's difficult to get around that.

Would you take seriously someone who posted an article from a site such as Jew Watch News

I wouldn't.

When people choose to use such sites for their sources, then it leads one to question their agendas as well.

Would you take someone who read the book "The Protocols of the Elders of Zion", claiming the book to be factual seriously?

Yes or no ?

 

[Coyote]

muslims hate him because he went to Israel.

http://www.nytimes.com/2012/07/05/w...ying-prize-money-to-algerian-writer.html?_r=0

It's actually a really interesting article and he makes some interesting points, particularly about the role of Islam in those countries and what, I'm thinking is a lack of a "civil society" that is needed for democracy, seperate from religion and government.



I think this is also a key difference between Islam in western countries, such as the US and Islam in Africa or the ME.




Another good point.

Sansal: That's difficult. I have often accused Western politicians of supporting our dictators and Islamists instead of our democrats. They tell me that there are no democrats here, that they can only give their support to either dictators or Islamists. And they are right! We cannot import European democracy into Algeria; we have to invent one of our own.

But the selling of weapons to dictators and the supporting of Islamists has to stop – as Germany has done and is still doing. I also criticise Muslim intellectuals. What are they doing in Europe? They sit in Paris and complain about the Algerian government not being democratic. They should be saying this in Algeria! Democrats need to fight for democracy in Muslim countries. And Muslims must fight for Islam. They must take it back from the Islamists. It is they who must fight Islamism because it is destroying their religion.

He really makes good points...

You really are speaking from both sides of your mouth. First you trash him, now you praise him. Rather than advising others to investigate the source perhaps you should take your own advice.

Nope. I trashed the source. I investigated it. Did you?

Nope.

You like the message you don't look at the source.

Then I read the article

Doesn't change the fact that the source is crap. But hey, I'll remember that next time you whine about something posted from Ma'an news or one of those sites you constantly trash

 

[Coyote]

Sources matter. If you select an article from a source that's a recognizable hate site - it taints it and it's difficult to get around that.

Would you take seriously someone who posted an article from a site such as Jew Watch News

I wouldn't.

When people choose to use such sites for their sources, then it leads one to question their agendas as well.

Would you take someone who read the book "The Protocols of the Elders of Zion", claiming the book to be factual seriously?

Yes or no ?

I wouldn't take them seriously - I'd either bunk off to Conspiracy Theoryland or I might think they were pulling my leg.

 

[aris2chat]

muslims hate him because he went to Israel.

http://www.nytimes.com/2012/07/05/w...ying-prize-money-to-algerian-writer.html?_r=0

It's actually a really interesting article and he makes some interesting points, particularly about the role of Islam in those countries and what, I'm thinking is a lack of a "civil society" that is needed for democracy, seperate from religion and government.

One must question the relationship of Islam to society, to democracy, to women and to the modern world. And to the state. Things that we take for granted, the conception of the state, is something that cannot be explained to a Muslim who has lived his whole life with Islam. It is a concept that does not exist in Islam. For Islam it is much more about God governing humanity.

I think this is also a key difference between Islam in western countries, such as the US and Islam in Africa or the ME.

Does that mean that Islam and democracy are incompatible?

Sansal: The fact that they are not compatible at the moment does not mean that they cannot become so. Christianity and democracy have not always been compatible. God was in charge and the Church ruled over people's souls. Then democracy came along and brought war between religion and democracy.

Another good point.

Sansal: That's difficult. I have often accused Western politicians of supporting our dictators and Islamists instead of our democrats. They tell me that there are no democrats here, that they can only give their support to either dictators or Islamists. And they are right! We cannot import European democracy into Algeria; we have to invent one of our own.

But the selling of weapons to dictators and the supporting of Islamists has to stop – as Germany has done and is still doing. I also criticise Muslim intellectuals. What are they doing in Europe? They sit in Paris and complain about the Algerian government not being democratic. They should be saying this in Algeria! Democrats need to fight for democracy in Muslim countries. And Muslims must fight for Islam. They must take it back from the Islamists. It is they who must fight Islamism because it is destroying their religion.

He really makes good points...

I figured his voice was worth being heard.
His books can be found on amazon or probably ordered through your local library
this way you don't have to be jaded by "hate" sites.

 

[Coyote]

Sources matter. If you select an article from a source that's a recognizable hate site - it taints it and it's difficult to get around that.

Would you take seriously someone who posted an article from a site such as Jew Watch News

I wouldn't.

When people choose to use such sites for their sources, then it leads one to question their agendas as well.

Would you take someone who read the book "The Protocols of the Elders of Zion", claiming the book to be factual seriously?

Yes or no ?

Would YOU take an article seriously that was posted from a site that promotes mass deportation of all Muslims?

 

[Coyote]

muslims hate him because he went to Israel.

http://www.nytimes.com/2012/07/05/w...ying-prize-money-to-algerian-writer.html?_r=0

It's actually a really interesting article and he makes some interesting points, particularly about the role of Islam in those countries and what, I'm thinking is a lack of a "civil society" that is needed for democracy, seperate from religion and government.



I think this is also a key difference between Islam in western countries, such as the US and Islam in Africa or the ME.




Another good point.

Sansal: That's difficult. I have often accused Western politicians of supporting our dictators and Islamists instead of our democrats. They tell me that there are no democrats here, that they can only give their support to either dictators or Islamists. And they are right! We cannot import European democracy into Algeria; we have to invent one of our own.

But the selling of weapons to dictators and the supporting of Islamists has to stop – as Germany has done and is still doing. I also criticise Muslim intellectuals. What are they doing in Europe? They sit in Paris and complain about the Algerian government not being democratic. They should be saying this in Algeria! Democrats need to fight for democracy in Muslim countries. And Muslims must fight for Islam. They must take it back from the Islamists. It is they who must fight Islamism because it is destroying their religion.

He really makes good points...

I figured his voice was worth being heard.
His books can be found on amazon or probably ordered through your local library
this way you don't have to be jaded by "hate" sites.

I will look them up - it is a very interesting article and, I actually agree with some of his points.

But not what that "The Muslim Issue" site supports.

 

[toastman]

BTW, the title of the article should be considered flattering to REAL Muslims.

It suggests that Islam is a good religion that has been hijacked by murderous terrorists, and needs to go back to the way it used to be.

Did I over interpretate the title bit ?

 

[toastman]

Sources matter. If you select an article from a source that's a recognizable hate site - it taints it and it's difficult to get around that.

Would you take seriously someone who posted an article from a site such as Jew Watch News

I wouldn't.

When people choose to use such sites for their sources, then it leads one to question their agendas as well.

Would you take someone who read the book "The Protocols of the Elders of Zion", claiming the book to be factual seriously?

Yes or no ?

Would YOU take an article seriously that was posted from a site that promotes mass deportation of all Muslims?

You didn't even answer my question , wtf ?!?!

 

[SAYIT]

It's actually a really interesting article and he makes some interesting points, particularly about the role of Islam in those countries and what, I'm thinking is a lack of a "civil society" that is needed for democracy, seperate from religion and government.

I think this is also a key difference between Islam in western countries, such as the US and Islam in Africa or the ME.

Another good point.

He really makes good points...

You really are speaking from both sides of your mouth. First you trash him, now you praise him. Rather than advising others to investigate the source perhaps you should take your own advice.

Nope. I trashed the source. I investigated it. Did you?

Nope.

You like the message you don't look at the source.

Then I read the article

Doesn't change the fact that the source is crap. But hey, I'll remember that next time you whine about something posted from Ma'an news or one of those sites you constantly trash

The source is the author, former Algerian Minister of Trade Boualem Sansal, who courageously said what many have said for years ... that Islam has been hijacked by radical Islamists and his co-religionist's failure to stand up to them is a threat to all peace-seeking peeps. Sunni Man dumped on the "pro-western infidel" and you piled-on like a good little lap dog before even reading the article. Now you have egg all over you ... again.

 

[toastman]

You really are speaking from both sides of your mouth. First you trash him, now you praise him. Rather than advising others to investigate the source perhaps you should take your own advice.

Nope. I trashed the source. I investigated it. Did you?

Nope.

You like the message you don't look at the source.

Then I read the article

Doesn't change the fact that the source is crap. But hey, I'll remember that next time you whine about something posted from Ma'an news or one of those sites you constantly trash

The source is the author, former Algerian Minister of Trade Boualem Sansal, who courageously said what many have said for years ... that Islam has been hijacked by radical Islamists and his co-religionist's failure to stand up to them is a threat to all peace-seeking peeps. Sunni Man dumped on the "pro-western infidel" and you piled-on like a good little lap dog before even reading the article. Now you have egg all over you ... again.

Coyote's face right now -------->

 

[Coyote]

BTW, the title of the article should be considered flattering to REAL Muslims.

It suggests that Islam is a good religion that has been hijacked by murderous terrorists, and needs to go back to the way it used to be.

Did I over interpretate the title bit ?

I don't think so - he's telling people to fight for their religion, and to fight for their own form of democracy. And he's offering a promise for the future by specifically stating that while democracy and Islam in that part of the world aren't compatible at the moment - that doesn't mean it never will be. That's an important statement.

Actually, what's happening in that part of the world is just such a fight I suppose, and foreign powers need to keep their distance and let them work it out.

 

[SAYIT]

BTW, the title of the article should be considered flattering to REAL Muslims.

It suggests that Islam is a good religion that has been hijacked by murderous terrorists, and needs to go back to the way it used to be.

Did I over interpretate the title bit ?

Nope and the hope is that Muslims of good will are ready to stand up to the radical Islamists among them. The author, former Algerian Minister of Trade Boualem Sansal, had the temerity to suggest that Islam should return to its peaceful ways and Sunni and Coyote had a hissy fit. I guess that explains where they are coming from. Go figure.

 

[Coyote]

You really are speaking from both sides of your mouth. First you trash him, now you praise him. Rather than advising others to investigate the source perhaps you should take your own advice.

Nope. I trashed the source. I investigated it. Did you?

Nope.

You like the message you don't look at the source.

Then I read the article

Doesn't change the fact that the source is crap. But hey, I'll remember that next time you whine about something posted from Ma'an news or one of those sites you constantly trash

The source is the author, former Algerian Minister of Trade Boualem Sansal, who courageously said what many have said for years ... that Islam has been hijacked by radical Islamists and his co-religionist's failure to stand up to them is a threat to all peace-seeking peeps. Sunni Man dumped on the "pro-western infidel" and you piled-on like a good little lap dog before even reading the article. Now you have egg all over you ... again.

The source used to link was "The Muslim Issue" - a well known hate site. I usually won't read articles from hate sites because it's a way of supporting them and their message - and I won't.

You can. You probably agree with the message of those sites. I don't.

 

[Coyote]

BTW, the title of the article should be considered flattering to REAL Muslims.

It suggests that Islam is a good religion that has been hijacked by murderous terrorists, and needs to go back to the way it used to be.

Did I over interpretate the title bit ?

Nope and the hope is that Muslims of good will are ready to stand up to the radical Islamists among them. The author, former Algerian Minister of Trade Boualem Sansal, had the temerity to suggest that Islam should return to its peaceful ways and Sunni and Coyote had a hissy fit. I guess that explains where they are coming from. Go figure.

Nice way of misrepresenting what was said (and you talk about integrity?).

 

[toastman]

BTW, the title of the article should be considered flattering to REAL Muslims.

It suggests that Islam is a good religion that has been hijacked by murderous terrorists, and needs to go back to the way it used to be.

Did I over interpretate the title bit ?

Nope and the hope is that Muslims of good will are ready to stand up to the radical Islamists among them. The author, former Algerian Minister of Trade Boualem Sansal, had the temerity to suggest that Islam should return to its peaceful ways and Sunni and Coyote had a hissy fit. I guess that explains where they are coming from. Go figure.

We all know that the Radical Islamists use fear to make sure those who disagree with their ideology and teachings won't open their mouth. And if they do...

 

[Coyote]

Would you take someone who read the book "The Protocols of the Elders of Zion", claiming the book to be factual seriously?

Yes or no ?

Would YOU take an article seriously that was posted from a site that promotes mass deportation of all Muslims?

You didn't even answer my question , wtf ?!?!

Post #27 dude.

 

[toastman]

Sources matter. If you select an article from a source that's a recognizable hate site - it taints it and it's difficult to get around that.

Would you take seriously someone who posted an article from a site such as Jew Watch News

I wouldn't.

When people choose to use such sites for their sources, then it leads one to question their agendas as well.

Would you take someone who read the book "The Protocols of the Elders of Zion", claiming the book to be factual seriously?

Yes or no ?

I wouldn't take them seriously - I'd either bunk off to Conspiracy Theoryland or I might think they were pulling my leg.

Guess what, Sunni Man believes the book to be factual.

Looks like you won't be taking him seriously any more , eh?

 

[Coyote]

Would you take someone who read the book "The Protocols of the Elders of Zion", claiming the book to be factual seriously?

Yes or no ?

I wouldn't take them seriously - I'd either bunk off to Conspiracy Theoryland or I might think they were pulling my leg.

Guess what, Sunni Man believes the book to be factual.

Looks like you won't be taking him seriously any more , eh?

Not on that subject (or is he pulling my leg?)

But - he's spot on about "The Muslim Mission" site isn't he?