American criminals shoot to kill, British criminals shoot to wound, they all have guns....

[bgrouse]

Sorry...as more Americans own and carry guns our injury rates have gone down, not up....

Guy, 33,000 gun deaths a year... they haven't gone down. They've gone up.

Why would you even count suicides? Those are weapons being used for their intended purpose, presumably to end a person's suffering. How is that a bad thing?

 

[JoeB131]

Why would you even count suicides? Those are weapons being used for their intended purpose, presumably to end a person's suffering. How is that a bad thing?

Suicide is a permanent solution to temporary problem.

The thing is, most people who survive suicide attempts don't try again.

But a gun makes it very difficult to survive a suicide attempt.

 

[2aguy]

Why would you even count suicides? Those are weapons being used for their intended purpose, presumably to end a person's suffering. How is that a bad thing?

Suicide is a permanent solution to temporary problem.

The thing is, most people who survive suicide attempts don't try again.

But a gun makes it very difficult to survive a suicide attempt.

And you ignore the truth...that countries with extreme gun control like Japan, China, Korea...have higher suicide rates than we do...and many of the countries in Europe, also with all the gun control you want, have higher suicide rates than we do.....

But you need to add suicide rates to your gun death total..since there were only 11,004 gun murders in 2016.....out of a population of over 320 million people...and of those, 70-80% of the victims were criminals murdered by other criminals....

While Americans use their guns, on average, 1,500,000 times a year to stop rape, robberies and murder.....

So you need to lie to make your numbers bigger.

 

[2aguy]

Sorry...as more Americans own and carry guns our injury rates have gone down, not up....

Guy, 33,000 gun deaths a year... they haven't gone down. They've gone up.

You have to add suicides in.....to get your number higher...since cars kill more people every single year than guns do.....and gun murder isn't even in the top 10 ways people die in this country.

 

[JoeB131]

And you ignore the truth...that countries with extreme gun control like Japan, China, Korea...have higher suicide rates than we do...

Because they don't consider suicide to be a sin. Yes, the country where seppuku and kamikazes are part of their culture are more likely to commit suicide because they think the next life will be better than this one. Amazing!

But you need to add suicide rates to your gun death total..since there were only 11,004 gun murders in 2016.....

Wow, so you aren't hawking the bullshit 8K numbers anymore? that's nice.

While Americans use their guns, on average

DGU's are a myth... you'd have to believe that you guys pull out your pecker-compensators 1,500,000 times and only kill 200 bad guys. (usually the spouse who got to the gun first, not an actual criminal)

 

[HenryBHough]

Suicide is a permanent solution to temporary problem.

The thing is, most people who survive suicide attempts don't try again.

But a gun makes it very difficult to survive a suicide attempt.

Obviously and apparently sadly you've never had to watch a person die slowly from cancer eating them away from inside.

Pity you haven't.

Then you might be able to distinguish between "temporary" and "permanent" problems.

But, then, I guess some people - particularly liberals - get their rocks off watching people in torment.

 

[2aguy]

And you ignore the truth...that countries with extreme gun control like Japan, China, Korea...have higher suicide rates than we do...

Because they don't consider suicide to be a sin. Yes, the country where seppuku and kamikazes are part of their culture are more likely to commit suicide because they think the next life will be better than this one. Amazing!

But you need to add suicide rates to your gun death total..since there were only 11,004 gun murders in 2016.....

Wow, so you aren't hawking the bullshit 8K numbers anymore? that's nice.

While Americans use their guns, on average

DGU's are a myth... you'd have to believe that you guys pull out your pecker-compensators 1,500,000 times and only kill 200 bad guys. (usually the spouse who got to the gun first, not an actual criminal)

Moron.....you state that guns are the reason that suicide is deadly, then, when faced with Japan, China and Korea...all of a sudden it's culture....even as you deny culture when it comes to criminals in Europe not committing murder as often as American criminals...

And, oh yeah.....suicide rates in European countries....without Seppuku....

Main tables - Eurostat

May, 2014

France....14.13

Finland...14.55

Poland....15.51

Belgium....17.28

Austria....15.26


U.S.....13.00 (Products - Data Briefs - Number 241 - April 2016)

 

[2aguy]

And you ignore the truth...that countries with extreme gun control like Japan, China, Korea...have higher suicide rates than we do...

Because they don't consider suicide to be a sin. Yes, the country where seppuku and kamikazes are part of their culture are more likely to commit suicide because they think the next life will be better than this one. Amazing!

But you need to add suicide rates to your gun death total..since there were only 11,004 gun murders in 2016.....

Wow, so you aren't hawking the bullshit 8K numbers anymore? that's nice.

While Americans use their guns, on average

DGU's are a myth... you'd have to believe that you guys pull out your pecker-compensators 1,500,000 times and only kill 200 bad guys. (usually the spouse who got to the gun first, not an actual criminal)

And no...defensive gun use is not a myth....41 years of actual research show this..

A quick guide to the studies and the numbers.....the full lay out of what was studied by each study is in the links....

The name of the group doing the study, the year of the study, the number of defensive gun uses and if police and military defensive gun uses are included.....notice the bill clinton and obama defensive gun use research is highlighted.....

GunCite-Gun Control-How Often Are Guns Used in Self-Defense

GunCite Frequency of Defensive Gun Use in Previous Surveys

Field...1976....3,052,717 ( no cops, military)

DMIa 1978...2,141,512 ( no cops, military)

L.A. TIMES...1994...3,609,68 ( no cops, military)

Kleck......1994...2.5 million ( no cops, military)

Obama's CDC....2013....500,000--3million

--------------------


Bordua...1977...1,414,544

DMIb...1978...1,098,409 ( no cops, military)

Hart...1981...1.797,461 ( no cops, military)

Mauser...1990...1,487,342 ( no cops, military)

Gallup...1993...1,621,377 ( no cops, military)

DEPT. OF JUSTICE...1994...1.5 million ( the bill clinton study)

Journal of Quantitative Criminology--- 989,883 times per year."

(Based on survey data from a 2000 study published in the Journal of Quantitative Criminology,[17] U.S. civilians use guns to defend themselves and others from crime at least 989,883 times per year.[18])

Paper: "Measuring Civilian Defensive Firearm Use: A Methodological Experiment." By David McDowall and others. Journal of Quantitative Criminology, March 2000. Measuring Civilian Defensive Firearm Use: A Methodological Experiment - Springer


-------------------------------------------

Ohio...1982...771,043

Gallup...1991...777,152

Tarrance... 1994... 764,036 (no cops, military)

Lawerence Southwich Jr. 400,000 fewer violent crimes and at least 800,000 violent crimes deterred..

*****************************************
If you take the studies from that Kleck cites in his paper, 16 of them....and you only average the ones that exclude military and police shootings..the average becomes 2 million...I use those studies because I have the details on them...and they are still 10 studies (including Kleck's)....

 

[bgrouse]

Why would you even count suicides? Those are weapons being used for their intended purpose, presumably to end a person's suffering. How is that a bad thing?

Suicide is a permanent solution to temporary problem.

No shit, the terminally ill will die of their problems one day (and so their temporary problem will end), but some people don't give a shit about your delicate liberal sensibilities when they're staring at a few months of mind-numbing pain and choose to end it quickly.

The thing is, most people who survive suicide attempts don't try again.

But a gun makes it very difficult to survive a suicide attempt.

Still easier than surviving a fall from a skyscraper. And a whole hell of a lot safer to pedestrians. But if you want people to hopelessly suffer to appease your delicate liberal emotions, then I suppose there's no arguing with you.

And you ignore the truth...that countries with extreme gun control like Japan, China, Korea...have higher suicide rates than we do...

Because they don't consider suicide to be a sin. Yes, the country where seppuku and kamikazes are part of their culture are more likely to commit suicide because they think the next life will be better than this one. Amazing!

Seppuku and kamikazes? Do they still have samurai walking around with Katanas, too?

But you need to add suicide rates to your gun death total..since there were only 11,004 gun murders in 2016.....

Wow, so you aren't hawking the bullshit 8K numbers anymore? that's nice.

While Americans use their guns, on average

DGU's are a myth... you'd have to believe that you guys pull out your pecker-compensators 1,500,000 times and only kill 200 bad guys. (usually the spouse who got to the gun first, not an actual criminal)

 

[JoeB131]

Obviously and apparently sadly you've never had to watch a person die slowly from cancer eating them away from inside.

You mean other than both of my parents?

Are you a fucking retard?

Then you might be able to distinguish between "temporary" and "permanent" problems.

Most people who commit suicide are not dealing with terminal illnesses, you stupid fuck.

But, then, I guess some people - particularly liberals - get their rocks off watching people in torment.

I'd have no problem if more conservatives put themselves out of our misery

 

[JoeB131]

Moron.....you state that guns are the reason that suicide is deadly, then, when faced with Japan, China and Korea...all of a sudden it's culture....even as you deny culture when it comes to criminals in Europe not committing murder as often as American criminals...

Um, yeah, guy... here's the thing.

Guns make suicide and crime easier. No,we can't abolish these things and yes, there are differences in culture.

But we can make them more difficult.

Again, buddy, I know you are in a panic now because big corporations are turning on the gun companies and the National Rampage Association.

Citigroup Sets Restrictions on Gun Sales by Business Partners

Citigroup is setting restrictions on the sale of firearms by its business customers, making it the first Wall Street bank to take a stance in the divisive nationwide gun control debate.

The new policy, announced Thursday, prohibits the sale of firearms to customers who have not passed a background check or who are younger than 21. It also bars the sale of bump stocks and high-capacity magazines. It would apply to clients who offer credit cards backed by Citigroup or borrow money, use banking services or raise capital through the company.

The rules, which the company described as “common-sense measures,” echo similar restrictions established by some major retailers, like Walmart. But they also represent the boldest such move to emerge from the banking sector.

2AGuy's bleachable Moment!

 

[2aguy]

Moron.....you state that guns are the reason that suicide is deadly, then, when faced with Japan, China and Korea...all of a sudden it's culture....even as you deny culture when it comes to criminals in Europe not committing murder as often as American criminals...

Um, yeah, guy... here's the thing.

Guns make suicide and crime easier. No,we can't abolish these things and yes, there are differences in culture.

But we can make them more difficult.

Again, buddy, I know you are in a panic now because big corporations are turning on the gun companies and the National Rampage Association.

Citigroup Sets Restrictions on Gun Sales by Business Partners

Citigroup is setting restrictions on the sale of firearms by its business customers, making it the first Wall Street bank to take a stance in the divisive nationwide gun control debate.

The new policy, announced Thursday, prohibits the sale of firearms to customers who have not passed a background check or who are younger than 21. It also bars the sale of bump stocks and high-capacity magazines. It would apply to clients who offer credit cards backed by Citigroup or borrow money, use banking services or raise capital through the company.

The rules, which the company described as “common-sense measures,” echo similar restrictions established by some major retailers, like Walmart. But they also represent the boldest such move to emerge from the banking sector.

2AGuy's bleachable Moment!

And again.....Japan, Korea and China have higher suicide rates and extreme gun control...making your argument stupid.

And criminals around the world get guns easily even on island nations with extreme gun control, like Britain, Australia and Puerto Rico.......the only people that gun control works against is law abiding citizens...who are made into victims much easier in countries with extreme gun control.

 

[JoeB131]

And again.....Japan, Korea and China have higher suicide rates and extreme gun control...making your argument stupid.

Yes, a country with a different view on sucide will have more of them.

Don't think any society thinks crime is okay, but man, we have a lot more homicides...

 

[JoeB131]

And criminals around the world get guns easily even on island nations with extreme gun control, like Britain, Australia and Puerto Rico.......the only people that gun control works against is law abiding citizens...who are made into victims much easier in countries with extreme gun control.

Again- the UK and Australia have gun murders in Double Digits, we have it in FIVE DIGITS.

They got this right.

 

[2aguy]

And again.....Japan, Korea and China have higher suicide rates and extreme gun control...making your argument stupid.

Yes, a country with a different view on sucide will have more of them.

Don't think any society thinks crime is okay, but man, we have a lot more homicides...

Like France, Finland and Austria....who have higher suicide rates than we do.....you moron.


Main tables - Eurostat

May, 2014

France....14.13

Finland...14.55

Poland....15.51

Belgium....17.28

Austria....15.26


U.S.....13.00 (Products - Data Briefs - Number 241 - April 2016)

 

[2aguy]

And criminals around the world get guns easily even on island nations with extreme gun control, like Britain, Australia and Puerto Rico.......the only people that gun control works against is law abiding citizens...who are made into victims much easier in countries with extreme gun control.

Again- the UK and Australia have gun murders in Double Digits, we have it in FIVE DIGITS.

They got this right.

They have increasing gun crime, moron, which means their criminals have guns, they just aren't intent on murdering people as our inner city democrats are. And that too is changing as their welfare states can't civilize their young males anymore.....and their importing of 3rd world criminals is increasing the violence of their drug gangs...

 

[JoeB131]

Like France, Finland and Austria....who have higher suicide rates than we do.....you moron.

dude, you can data mine all day, but here's your problem.

Big corporations are turning on you gun fetishists..

Game over, man, game over.

 

[LoneLaugher]

There were 4000 defensive uses of firearms in the US yesterday. There will be 4000 today. And 4000 tomorrow. And every day after that.

If that doesn't sound insane to you, you might be a retard.

 

[2aguy]

Like France, Finland and Austria....who have higher suicide rates than we do.....you moron.

dude, you can data mine all day, but here's your problem.

Big corporations are turning on you gun fetishists..

Game over, man, game over.

It doesn't matter, moron.....gun owners aren't relying on these corporations for funding.....and 5 million or more people turning on these corporations is a lot larger than the few uninformed people emailing them.....but keep playing this game and see what happens to their profit margin.....

 

[2aguy]

There were 4000 defensive uses of firearms in the US yesterday. There will be 4000 today. And 4000 tomorrow. And every day after that.

If that doesn't sound insane to you, you might be a retard.

No....you are a moron.....actual research by trained researchers from both government and private research groups have found that defensive gun use is done in large numbers in this country.....41 years of research...

A quick guide to the studies and the numbers.....the full lay out of what was studied by each study is in the links....

The name of the group doing the study, the year of the study, the number of defensive gun uses and if police and military defensive gun uses are included.....notice the bill clinton and obama defensive gun use research is highlighted.....

GunCite-Gun Control-How Often Are Guns Used in Self-Defense

GunCite Frequency of Defensive Gun Use in Previous Surveys

Field...1976....3,052,717 ( no cops, military)

DMIa 1978...2,141,512 ( no cops, military)

L.A. TIMES...1994...3,609,68 ( no cops, military)

Kleck......1994...2.5 million ( no cops, military)

Obama's CDC....2013....500,000--3million

--------------------


Bordua...1977...1,414,544

DMIb...1978...1,098,409 ( no cops, military)

Hart...1981...1.797,461 ( no cops, military)

Mauser...1990...1,487,342 ( no cops, military)

Gallup...1993...1,621,377 ( no cops, military)

DEPT. OF JUSTICE...1994...1.5 million ( the bill clinton study)

Journal of Quantitative Criminology--- 989,883 times per year."

(Based on survey data from a 2000 study published in the Journal of Quantitative Criminology,[17] U.S. civilians use guns to defend themselves and others from crime at least 989,883 times per year.[18])

Paper: "Measuring Civilian Defensive Firearm Use: A Methodological Experiment." By David McDowall and others. Journal of Quantitative Criminology, March 2000. Measuring Civilian Defensive Firearm Use: A Methodological Experiment - Springer


-------------------------------------------

Ohio...1982...771,043

Gallup...1991...777,152

Tarrance... 1994... 764,036 (no cops, military)

Lawerence Southwich Jr. 400,000 fewer violent crimes and at least 800,000 violent crimes deterred..

*****************************************
If you take the studies from that Kleck cites in his paper, 16 of them....and you only average the ones that exclude military and police shootings..the average becomes 2 million...I use those studies because I have the details on them...and they are still 10 studies (including Kleck's)....