Atheism takes courage

[RWNJ]

The debate that you can not see God therefore he doesn't exist can be explained by the senses of the brain, and how we know things even though we can not see them...

And that argument would be a brilliant response to my position, if my position had anything to do with "seeing" God. Empirical evidence has nothing to do with sight. It has to do with objective, quantifiable, verifiable evidence. But, you see, you want to make it about "seeing", because that makes it easier to argue against than my actual position.

Here's some objective, quantifiable, verifiable evidence for you. Bible prophecy. 100 percent track record. No one could do that but God.

 

[Eaglewings]

Show me where science has proven 100% that God does not exist?


.

You see, this is why theism always, always fails. It relies on faulty logic to maintain its position. What you have presented is a Negative Proof Fallacy. That same fallacy can be used to defend any irrational position: Prove that an invisible and undetectable Flying Spaghetti Monster doesn't exist. Yes, Pastafarianism is an actual thing.

This is why one uses the Null Hypothesis for questions of this nature. God does not exist. This is not dogmatic. I am not married to this position. It is merely the default starting position. From here, I await objective, quantifiable, verifiable empirical evidence contrary to that position.

Now, angry, militant theists, like Meriweather, get angry, and aggressive, insisting that I am being unfair, because all of these mythical creatures for which I am asking evidence exist on some fantastic plane of existence that is not connected to the physical plane, thus there is no "proof" to be found, physically.

Here's the problem with that. This mythical God/Creator is said to have created this physical plane. (S)He is said to engage with this physical plane on a regular basis performing miracles. At least one religion insists that he physically walked among us, as a man.

So, clearly, if this extra-physical plane exists, there must be points of connection. As such, there should be empirical evidence that this plane exists. There isn't. See, it all comes down to a lack of evidence.

Oh brother... You didn't answer my question but blabbed a bunch of bullshit..

Prove to me God doesn't exist Scientifically ...

I showed you facts on the human brain and emotions that we cannot see .. you return with jabber jabber.. Bullshit..

..

You just asked to prove a negative. Common fallacy. If I'd say to you. " Halfway between Jupiter and Uranus floats a little block of hot fudge." Would your inability to prove otherwise confirm the truth of that statement?

He is trying to go on and on about freaken Empirical Evidence of the senses..I explained to him in a scientific approach to the 5 senses of the brain..4 of these senses are not visible to the human eye...Yet after years of Scientific Study it is proven how the brain responds ... Every single one of the 5 senses release Dopamine Calming, or a Stress Hormone..
It is integrated into our Subconscious going back to the beginning of time..

.

You are making my point for me. Your own words: "Yet after years of Scientific Study it is proven how the brain responds ... Every single one of the 5 senses release Dopamine Calming, or a Stress Hormone.." In other words there is empirical evidence that these senses exist, and produce signals interpreted by the brain" By all means, demonstrate for me the empirical evidence of the existence of God. Hell, I'll make it easy. Produce verifiable, quantifiable empirical evidence of anything "Supernatural". With all the resources that have been dedicated to this study, it should be easy for you.

Well... this will be an on going back and forth of prove me wrong thread...

This is interesting and fits right in..

if I see a beautiful sand castle on the beach with intricate design, but no one there along with it, I can not “prove” someone made it, just as someone else can not “prove” the sand castle made itself from the wind, waves and sand randomly interacting with one another, so we have to determine what logic and reason tell us is the most plausible explanation, based on scientific evidence and examination.

You simply can not prove there is not a master designer..

 

[Czernobog]

The debate that you can not see God therefore he doesn't exist can be explained by the senses of the brain, and how we know things even though we can not see them...

And that argument would be a brilliant response to my position, if my position had anything to do with "seeing" God. Empirical evidence has nothing to do with sight. It has to do with objective, quantifiable, verifiable evidence. But, you see, you want to make it about "seeing", because that makes it easier to argue against than my actual position.

Here's some objective, quantifiable, verifiable evidence for you. Bible prophecy. 100 percent track record. No one could do that but God.

LOL! So, your "objective" evidence is a book of fairy tales written over 2,000 years ago? LOL

 

[Czernobog]

You see, this is why theism always, always fails. It relies on faulty logic to maintain its position. What you have presented is a Negative Proof Fallacy. That same fallacy can be used to defend any irrational position: Prove that an invisible and undetectable Flying Spaghetti Monster doesn't exist. Yes, Pastafarianism is an actual thing.

This is why one uses the Null Hypothesis for questions of this nature. God does not exist. This is not dogmatic. I am not married to this position. It is merely the default starting position. From here, I await objective, quantifiable, verifiable empirical evidence contrary to that position.

Now, angry, militant theists, like Meriweather, get angry, and aggressive, insisting that I am being unfair, because all of these mythical creatures for which I am asking evidence exist on some fantastic plane of existence that is not connected to the physical plane, thus there is no "proof" to be found, physically.

Here's the problem with that. This mythical God/Creator is said to have created this physical plane. (S)He is said to engage with this physical plane on a regular basis performing miracles. At least one religion insists that he physically walked among us, as a man.

So, clearly, if this extra-physical plane exists, there must be points of connection. As such, there should be empirical evidence that this plane exists. There isn't. See, it all comes down to a lack of evidence.

Oh brother... You didn't answer my question but blabbed a bunch of bullshit..

Prove to me God doesn't exist Scientifically ...

I showed you facts on the human brain and emotions that we cannot see .. you return with jabber jabber.. Bullshit..

..

You just asked to prove a negative. Common fallacy. If I'd say to you. " Halfway between Jupiter and Uranus floats a little block of hot fudge." Would your inability to prove otherwise confirm the truth of that statement?

He is trying to go on and on about freaken Empirical Evidence of the senses..I explained to him in a scientific approach to the 5 senses of the brain..4 of these senses are not visible to the human eye...Yet after years of Scientific Study it is proven how the brain responds ... Every single one of the 5 senses release Dopamine Calming, or a Stress Hormone..
It is integrated into our Subconscious going back to the beginning of time..

.

You are making my point for me. Your own words: "Yet after years of Scientific Study it is proven how the brain responds ... Every single one of the 5 senses release Dopamine Calming, or a Stress Hormone.." In other words there is empirical evidence that these senses exist, and produce signals interpreted by the brain" By all means, demonstrate for me the empirical evidence of the existence of God. Hell, I'll make it easy. Produce verifiable, quantifiable empirical evidence of anything "Supernatural". With all the resources that have been dedicated to this study, it should be easy for you.

Well... this will be an on going back and forth of prove me wrong thread...

This is interesting and fits right in..

if I see a beautiful sand castle on the beach with intricate design, but no one there along with it, I can not “prove” someone made it, just as someone else can not “prove” the sand castle made itself from the wind, waves and sand randomly interacting with one another, so we have to determine what logic and reason tell us is the most plausible explanation, based on scientific evidence and examination.

You simply can not prove there is not a master designer..

You're right. I also cannot prove the universe was not created by a giant, rainbow shitting unicorn. And neither can you. Your point?

 

[Eaglewings]

Oh brother... You didn't answer my question but blabbed a bunch of bullshit..

Prove to me God doesn't exist Scientifically ...

I showed you facts on the human brain and emotions that we cannot see .. you return with jabber jabber.. Bullshit..

..

You just asked to prove a negative. Common fallacy. If I'd say to you. " Halfway between Jupiter and Uranus floats a little block of hot fudge." Would your inability to prove otherwise confirm the truth of that statement?

He is trying to go on and on about freaken Empirical Evidence of the senses..I explained to him in a scientific approach to the 5 senses of the brain..4 of these senses are not visible to the human eye...Yet after years of Scientific Study it is proven how the brain responds ... Every single one of the 5 senses release Dopamine Calming, or a Stress Hormone..
It is integrated into our Subconscious going back to the beginning of time..

.

You are making my point for me. Your own words: "Yet after years of Scientific Study it is proven how the brain responds ... Every single one of the 5 senses release Dopamine Calming, or a Stress Hormone.." In other words there is empirical evidence that these senses exist, and produce signals interpreted by the brain" By all means, demonstrate for me the empirical evidence of the existence of God. Hell, I'll make it easy. Produce verifiable, quantifiable empirical evidence of anything "Supernatural". With all the resources that have been dedicated to this study, it should be easy for you.

Well... this will be an on going back and forth of prove me wrong thread...

This is interesting and fits right in..

if I see a beautiful sand castle on the beach with intricate design, but no one there along with it, I can not “prove” someone made it, just as someone else can not “prove” the sand castle made itself from the wind, waves and sand randomly interacting with one another, so we have to determine what logic and reason tell us is the most plausible explanation, based on scientific evidence and examination.

You simply can not prove there is not a master designer..

You're right. I also cannot prove the universe was not created by a giant, rainbow shitting unicorn. And neither can you. Your point?

Curious as to how you come to your conclusion since there is not Empirical Evidence to back up that there is not a Master Designer?

.

 

[Czernobog]

You just asked to prove a negative. Common fallacy. If I'd say to you. " Halfway between Jupiter and Uranus floats a little block of hot fudge." Would your inability to prove otherwise confirm the truth of that statement?

He is trying to go on and on about freaken Empirical Evidence of the senses..I explained to him in a scientific approach to the 5 senses of the brain..4 of these senses are not visible to the human eye...Yet after years of Scientific Study it is proven how the brain responds ... Every single one of the 5 senses release Dopamine Calming, or a Stress Hormone..
It is integrated into our Subconscious going back to the beginning of time..

.

You are making my point for me. Your own words: "Yet after years of Scientific Study it is proven how the brain responds ... Every single one of the 5 senses release Dopamine Calming, or a Stress Hormone.." In other words there is empirical evidence that these senses exist, and produce signals interpreted by the brain" By all means, demonstrate for me the empirical evidence of the existence of God. Hell, I'll make it easy. Produce verifiable, quantifiable empirical evidence of anything "Supernatural". With all the resources that have been dedicated to this study, it should be easy for you.

Well... this will be an on going back and forth of prove me wrong thread...

This is interesting and fits right in..

if I see a beautiful sand castle on the beach with intricate design, but no one there along with it, I can not “prove” someone made it, just as someone else can not “prove” the sand castle made itself from the wind, waves and sand randomly interacting with one another, so we have to determine what logic and reason tell us is the most plausible explanation, based on scientific evidence and examination.

You simply can not prove there is not a master designer..

You're right. I also cannot prove the universe was not created by a giant, rainbow shitting unicorn. And neither can you. Your point?

Curious as to how you come to your conclusion since there is not Empirical Evidence to back up that there is not a Master Designer?

.

You get I agreed with you, right? Let's try that again: YOU ARE CORRECT. I CANNOT PROVE THAT THE UNIVERSE WAS NOT CREATED BY A MASTER DESIGNER.

YOU ALSO CANNOT PROVE THAT THE UNIVERSE WAS NOT CREATED BY THE ALMIGHTY RAINBOW SHITTING UNICORN.

So. Now that we have established that a negative assertion cannot be proactively proven, what's your point?

 

[Eaglewings]

He is trying to go on and on about freaken Empirical Evidence of the senses..I explained to him in a scientific approach to the 5 senses of the brain..4 of these senses are not visible to the human eye...Yet after years of Scientific Study it is proven how the brain responds ... Every single one of the 5 senses release Dopamine Calming, or a Stress Hormone..
It is integrated into our Subconscious going back to the beginning of time..

.

You are making my point for me. Your own words: "Yet after years of Scientific Study it is proven how the brain responds ... Every single one of the 5 senses release Dopamine Calming, or a Stress Hormone.." In other words there is empirical evidence that these senses exist, and produce signals interpreted by the brain" By all means, demonstrate for me the empirical evidence of the existence of God. Hell, I'll make it easy. Produce verifiable, quantifiable empirical evidence of anything "Supernatural". With all the resources that have been dedicated to this study, it should be easy for you.

Well... this will be an on going back and forth of prove me wrong thread...

This is interesting and fits right in..

if I see a beautiful sand castle on the beach with intricate design, but no one there along with it, I can not “prove” someone made it, just as someone else can not “prove” the sand castle made itself from the wind, waves and sand randomly interacting with one another, so we have to determine what logic and reason tell us is the most plausible explanation, based on scientific evidence and examination.

You simply can not prove there is not a master designer..

You're right. I also cannot prove the universe was not created by a giant, rainbow shitting unicorn. And neither can you. Your point?

Curious as to how you come to your conclusion since there is not Empirical Evidence to back up that there is not a Master Designer?

.

You get i agreed with you, right. let's try that again: YOU ARE CORRECT. I CANNOT PROVE THAT THE UNIVERSE WAS NOT CREATED BY A MASTER DESIGNER.

YOU ALSO CANNOT PROVE THAT THE UNIVERSE WAS NOT CREATED BY THE ALMIGHTY RAINBOW SHITTING UNICORN.

So. Now that we have established that a negative assertion cannot be proactively proven, what's your point?

Well being that we are both in the boat of not being able to give Empirical Evidence... why wouldn't you just ask God if He is real reveal himself to you..It is not going to cause an explosion, but you may just find that the unicorn was actually something.

 

[RWNJ]

The debate that you can not see God therefore he doesn't exist can be explained by the senses of the brain, and how we know things even though we can not see them...

And that argument would be a brilliant response to my position, if my position had anything to do with "seeing" God. Empirical evidence has nothing to do with sight. It has to do with objective, quantifiable, verifiable evidence. But, you see, you want to make it about "seeing", because that makes it easier to argue against than my actual position.

Here's some objective, quantifiable, verifiable evidence for you. Bible prophecy. 100 percent track record. No one could do that but God.

LOL! So, your "objective" evidence is a book of fairy tales written over 2,000 years ago? LOL

OK, genius. Show me one Bible prophecy that got it wrong. Just one.

 

[RWNJ]

Let's get back on topic. What is so courageous about being an atheist? No one is persecuting atheists. But Christians are being killed for believing in God. Millions of Christians have died rather than deny Christ. THAT takes courage. So, tell me. What would an atheist die for?

 

[Czernobog]

The debate that you can not see God therefore he doesn't exist can be explained by the senses of the brain, and how we know things even though we can not see them...

And that argument would be a brilliant response to my position, if my position had anything to do with "seeing" God. Empirical evidence has nothing to do with sight. It has to do with objective, quantifiable, verifiable evidence. But, you see, you want to make it about "seeing", because that makes it easier to argue against than my actual position.

Here's some objective, quantifiable, verifiable evidence for you. Bible prophecy. 100 percent track record. No one could do that but God.

LOL! So, your "objective" evidence is a book of fairy tales written over 2,000 years ago? LOL

OK, genius. Show me one Bible prophecy that got it wrong. Just one.

So, a bunch of people got together, studied the "prophesies" that were written, several centuries ago, and proceeded to write a story, incorporating those "prophesies" into their fiction, and that, somehow, proves anything? Riiiiight....

 

[sealybobo]

Just a bit of insight on what it means to be an atheist. It's actually easier to allow one's self to believe in God than it is to be an atheist. Being an atheist means there is no Devil to blame, no afterlife to reunite with loved ones, no personal cosmic bodyguard, only one life to live, personal responsibility for one's thoughts, actions, and prosperity, or lack thereof, lack of acceptance from a religion infused society, and no easy explanation for our existence.

Atheism is not for the weak.

I'd love nothing more than to believe I just can't and can't say I didn't want to cause I just said I'd like nothing more.

 

[Czernobog]

You are making my point for me. Your own words: "Yet after years of Scientific Study it is proven how the brain responds ... Every single one of the 5 senses release Dopamine Calming, or a Stress Hormone.." In other words there is empirical evidence that these senses exist, and produce signals interpreted by the brain" By all means, demonstrate for me the empirical evidence of the existence of God. Hell, I'll make it easy. Produce verifiable, quantifiable empirical evidence of anything "Supernatural". With all the resources that have been dedicated to this study, it should be easy for you.

Well... this will be an on going back and forth of prove me wrong thread...

This is interesting and fits right in..

if I see a beautiful sand castle on the beach with intricate design, but no one there along with it, I can not “prove” someone made it, just as someone else can not “prove” the sand castle made itself from the wind, waves and sand randomly interacting with one another, so we have to determine what logic and reason tell us is the most plausible explanation, based on scientific evidence and examination.

You simply can not prove there is not a master designer..

You're right. I also cannot prove the universe was not created by a giant, rainbow shitting unicorn. And neither can you. Your point?

Curious as to how you come to your conclusion since there is not Empirical Evidence to back up that there is not a Master Designer?

.

You get i agreed with you, right. let's try that again: YOU ARE CORRECT. I CANNOT PROVE THAT THE UNIVERSE WAS NOT CREATED BY A MASTER DESIGNER.

YOU ALSO CANNOT PROVE THAT THE UNIVERSE WAS NOT CREATED BY THE ALMIGHTY RAINBOW SHITTING UNICORN.

So. Now that we have established that a negative assertion cannot be proactively proven, what's your point?

Well being that we are both in the boat of not being able to give Empirical Evidence... why wouldn't you just ask God if He is real reveal himself to you..It is not going to cause an explosion, but you may just find that the unicorn was actually something.

You really do not understand how logic works do you? So, what happens when I ask God for "the answer", and I get silence? Do I get to say God doesn't exist, then? Or did God just choose to ignore me?

 

[Czernobog]

Let's get back on topic. What is so courageous about being an atheist? No one is persecuting atheists. But Christians are being killed for believing in God. Millions of Christians have died rather than deny Christ. THAT takes courage. So, tell me. What would an atheist die for?

Actually atheists are put to death all the time. What else you got?

 

[ChrisL]

In my own experience, I've found that a lot of supposedly "religious people" are real ASSHOLES. That has been my experience with some online religious fanatics. They are defensive, insulting and really quite jerky just because you disagree with their belief system. Just because you ask them some questions since they seem to know it all!

 

[RWNJ]

The debate that you can not see God therefore he doesn't exist can be explained by the senses of the brain, and how we know things even though we can not see them...

And that argument would be a brilliant response to my position, if my position had anything to do with "seeing" God. Empirical evidence has nothing to do with sight. It has to do with objective, quantifiable, verifiable evidence. But, you see, you want to make it about "seeing", because that makes it easier to argue against than my actual position.

Here's some objective, quantifiable, verifiable evidence for you. Bible prophecy. 100 percent track record. No one could do that but God.

LOL! So, your "objective" evidence is a book of fairy tales written over 2,000 years ago? LOL

OK, genius. Show me one Bible prophecy that got it wrong. Just one.

So, a bunch of people got together, studied the "prophesies" that were written, several centuries ago, and proceeded to write a story, incorporating those "prophesies" into their fiction, and that, somehow, proves anything? Riiiiight....

Quit deflecting. Show me one Bible prophecy that got it wrong. You can make all the lame excuses you like. It won't change anything. There are many prophecies that have a confirmed date for when they were written, and they accurately describe historical events that happened hundreds of years later. So, show me one prophecy that got it wrong. You can't, and you know it.

 

[RWNJ]

Let's get back on topic. What is so courageous about being an atheist? No one is persecuting atheists. But Christians are being killed for believing in God. Millions of Christians have died rather than deny Christ. THAT takes courage. So, tell me. What would an atheist die for?

Actually atheists are put to death all the time. What else you got?

Every country you listed is Muslim. And those same Muslims kill Christians too. Try again.

 

[Fort Fun Indiana]

I was once asked if I believed in God. My response was “it’s sometimes good for people to believe there’s a power greater than themselves”.

I am an addiction counselor .... and those who think a door knob will be their higher power usually do relapse.

The art of turning things over that we have no control over free's the spirit

The only thing that we have control over is how we respond to life... that is it..

.

But that is just trickery, as you then replace the "controller" with a god, when those things are actually still beyond control. And the things which ARE controllable are actually still controlled by them, despite them being tricked into believing otherwise. And if it takes trickery to treat the disease of addiction, then keep at it. But it is, indeed, trickery.

He exchanges one addiction for another

"He exchanges one addiction for another"

Maybe, but some addictions can be better than others.

 

[Czernobog]

Let's get back on topic. What is so courageous about being an atheist? No one is persecuting atheists. But Christians are being killed for believing in God. Millions of Christians have died rather than deny Christ. THAT takes courage. So, tell me. What would an atheist die for?

Actually atheists are put to death all the time. What else you got?

Every country you listed is Muslim. And those same Muslims kill Christians too. Try again.

So what? This isn't about Christians. This is about theists actions towards atheists. You're the one trying to make it all about Christians.

 

[RWNJ]

Well... this will be an on going back and forth of prove me wrong thread...

This is interesting and fits right in..

if I see a beautiful sand castle on the beach with intricate design, but no one there along with it, I can not “prove” someone made it, just as someone else can not “prove” the sand castle made itself from the wind, waves and sand randomly interacting with one another, so we have to determine what logic and reason tell us is the most plausible explanation, based on scientific evidence and examination.

You simply can not prove there is not a master designer..

You're right. I also cannot prove the universe was not created by a giant, rainbow shitting unicorn. And neither can you. Your point?

Curious as to how you come to your conclusion since there is not Empirical Evidence to back up that there is not a Master Designer?

.

You get i agreed with you, right. let's try that again: YOU ARE CORRECT. I CANNOT PROVE THAT THE UNIVERSE WAS NOT CREATED BY A MASTER DESIGNER.

YOU ALSO CANNOT PROVE THAT THE UNIVERSE WAS NOT CREATED BY THE ALMIGHTY RAINBOW SHITTING UNICORN.

So. Now that we have established that a negative assertion cannot be proactively proven, what's your point?

Well being that we are both in the boat of not being able to give Empirical Evidence... why wouldn't you just ask God if He is real reveal himself to you..It is not going to cause an explosion, but you may just find that the unicorn was actually something.

You really do not understand how logic works do you? So, what happens when I ask God for "the answer", and I get silence? Do I get to say God doesn't exist, then? Or did God just choose to ignore me?

Not at all. YOU chose to ignore God.

 

[Fort Fun Indiana]

I am an animal and all animals die eventually. Why is that so hard to accept?

But if you send me $50 every week, I will make sure you can live forever

All animals die ? Are you sure about that, I thought all dogs went to heaven. On a more serious note however - You don't know that for a fact, you can't prove it beyond the shadow of a doubt. You can't prove there is no such thing as a soul, but some researchers, [and not all of them are quacks], have demonstrated the possibility of a hereafter, reincarnation, yada yada yada

A theory from Dr. Robert Lanza states that death as we presently define it is an illusion ... The body itself does not generate consciousness, it lives on after the body dies. They have identified " microtubules " within brain cells ... theory goes on to postulate that the experience of consciousness as we know it is the product of quantum gravity effects in these microtubules.

Now 'rightwinger' I do realize that you only have a few brain cells to work with but perhaps you might be able to grasp some of the basics of biocentrism - Biocentrism

"You can't prove there is no such thing as a soul"

And you can't prove leprechauns don't collect stamps. So what?