Boycott Israel

[José]

So why is no one upset about Jordan's sovereignty over the Arab Palestinian people?

ALLENBY BRIDGE - ISRAEL-JORDAN BORDER​

The site of hundreds of mass, giant protests between 1950 and 2019 involving hundreds of thousands of VERY UPSET palestinian refugees in Jordan demanding the end of their exile in Jordan and their right to return to their homeland only to be, sometimes, shot by israeli soldiers.

Refugees crossing the Allenby bridge
Civilian refugees crossing the bridge Allenby/King Hussein at the Jordan to reach refugee camps in the desert. The bridge was destroyed by the Israelis at the beginning of the Arab-Israeli Six-Day War. Jordan, 1967.

A Palestinian refugee girl carrying her sister as they prepare to cross the Allenby Bridge to Jordan, fleeing from the West Bank and Gaza Strip, as part of the Palestinian exodus in the aftermath of the Six Day War.

The girl seem very upset to me...

And 40 years later the descendants of these two little girls seem no less upset
​

Jordan

In Jordan, 200 Palestinian students attempted to march towards the Israeli border, but were restrained by Jordanian security forces resulting in the injury of six people. They were part of a larger group of 500 who were stopped at the Allenby Bridge.

2011 Israeli border demonstrations - Wikipedia

 

[rylah]

So why is no one upset about Jordan's sovereignty over the Arab Palestinian people?

ALLENBY BRIDGE - ISRAEL-JORDAN BORDER​

The site of hundreds of mass, giant protests between 1950 and 2019 involving hundreds of thousands of VERY UPSET palestinian refugees in Jordan demanding the end of their exile in Jordan and their right to return to their homeland only to be, sometimes, shot by israeli soldiers.

Refugees crossing the Allenby bridge
Civilian refugees crossing the bridge Allenby/King Hussein at the Jordan to reach refugee camps in the desert. The bridge was destroyed by the Israelis at the beginning of the Arab-Israeli Six-Day War. Jordan, 1967.

A Palestinian refugee girl carrying her sister as they prepare to cross the Allenby Bridge to Jordan, fleeing from the West Bank and Gaza Strip, as part of the Palestinian exodus in the aftermath of the Six Day War.

The girl seem very upset to me...

And 40 years later the descendants of these two little girls seem no less upset
​

Jordan

In Jordan, 200 Palestinian students attempted to march towards the Israeli border, but were restrained by Jordanian security forces resulting in the injury of six people. They were part of a larger group of 500 who were stopped at the Allenby Bridge.

2011 Israeli border demonstrations - Wikipedia

I'm sure they're also upset about the sea preventing them from reaching Spain to "return" to the Caliphate.
They'll take the middle finger from Spain like a tamed puppy, and blame the Jews for failing to realize their imperialist fantasies.

 

[Sixties Fan]

40,000 runners take part in Tel Aviv marathon

 

[Shusha]

hundreds of thousands of VERY UPSET palestinian refugees in Jordan demanding the end of their exile in Jordan and their right to return to their homeland

They are IN their homeland -- Palestine, part of which is occupied by Jordan. Why are they not upset at the Jordanian occupation of Palestinian land?

 

[Paul Motter]

Possibly because Jordan attacked Israel and lost the war they started. Israel won a great deal of land that was previously parts of other nations, and Israel gave much of it back. There are places for "Palestinians" to live other than Israel.

See - the truth is that almost all Jews in the Middle east have been banished to Israel, and some Palestinians have been made to leave Israeli soil. Many of those Palestinians (which was never a real country by the way) work in Israeli jobs and live in the area so they can make more money.

And to be clear, I have Christian relatives who were driven out of what is now Israel back in about 1948, and yes they are still angry, but I think one should just move on. Hating on Israel is not winning the Arabs any friends in the world.

Also, this thread was started 6 years ago - couldn't we start a new one?

 

[P F Tinmore]

Pro-Israel Lobby Groups Secretly Admits Cultural Boycott Is Effective, Leaked Report Shows

 

[José]

Originally posted by Shusha
They are IN their homeland -- Palestine, part of which is occupied by Jordan. Why are they not upset at the Jordanian occupation of Palestinian land?

Where is the Shusha who's always telling everybody:

Nobody but Jews has the right to determine who belongs or doesn't belong to the jewish people.

Follow your own advice and respect the fact that:

Neither you nor the british cartographers and politicians of WWI have the right to determine the homeland of the palestinian people.

Only Palestinians can determine their own homeland and it does not include any land east of the Jordan river.

 

[ForeverYoung436]

Originally posted by Shusha
They are IN their homeland -- Palestine, part of which is occupied by Jordan. Why are they not upset at the Jordanian occupation of Palestinian land?

Where is the Shusha who's always telling everybody:

Nobody but Jews has the right to determine who belongs or doesn't belong to the jewish people.

Follow your own advice and respect the fact that:

Neither you nor the british cartographers and politicians of WWI have the right to determine the homeland of the palestinian people.

Only Palestinians can determine their own homeland and it does not include any land east of the Jordan river.

Jordan is an artificial country named after a river, for Gd's sake. It was part of the Palestine Mandate. Historically and ethnically, there is absolutely no difference between a "Jordanian" and a Palestinian.

 

[Sixties Fan]

What a natural-sounding conversation!

In reality, Gholami didn't have a choice, and was miserable at having to forfeit his match in early January.


In 2017, Borna Derakhshani, a 14-year old chess player, was banned by Iran Federation forever for playing against an Israeli player.


This Swedish chess site says:
Aryan Gholami tells schack.se that he has no personal antipathy against the Israeli Ariel Erenberg.
"But if I were to play against an Israeli, it would have serious consequences for me." An Iranian human rights group released a caricatureshowing how Khamenei forced Gholami to withdraw.

(full article online)

Iran's Supreme Leader honors chess player who was forced to forfeit match against Israeli ~ Elder Of Ziyon - Israel News

 

[Shusha]

Originally posted by Shusha
They are IN their homeland -- Palestine, part of which is occupied by Jordan. Why are they not upset at the Jordanian occupation of Palestinian land?

Where is the Shusha who's always telling everybody:

Nobody but Jews has the right to determine who belongs or doesn't belong to the jewish people.

Follow your own advice and respect the fact that:

Neither you nor the british cartographers and politicians of WWI have the right to determine the homeland of the palestinian people.

Only Palestinians can determine their own homeland and it does not include any land east of the Jordan river.

You are quite extravagantly missing my point. The Palestinians (as a whole) absolutely have the right to decide who is and who is not a Palestinian. They absolutely have the right to give away parts of their territory to form independent nations. When have I said otherwise?

The hypocrisy is in permitting the Jordanian Palestinians to take part of the territory to create a State, while warring against the Jewish Palestinians for doing the same. The hypocrisy is in declaring that THIS piece of land is "occupied" because Jewish Palestinians formed a nation on it, while this piece of land is "not occupied" because Arab Palestinians formed a nation on it.

The common denominator here is NOT "Palestinian" -- its ARAB. The Arab Palestinians are absolutely fine with Palestine being divided and portioned out to different States -- as long as those States are fundamentally Arab Muslim and the Jewish Palestinians are excluded from those rights.

 

[José]

Originally posted by ForeverYoung436
Jordan is an artificial country named after a river, for Gd's sake. It was part of the Palestine Mandate. Historically and ethnically, there is absolutely no difference between a "Jordanian" and a Palestinian.

I see...

Gentiles like José, Coyote and Tinmore have no business deciding who is and who isn't a Jew.

But FY, Shusha and rylah, jews from America, Canada and Israel have the final say about the territory comprised by the palestinian homeland and even get to decide whether or not Palestinians exist as a separate national identity.

 

[José]

Originally posted by Shusha
while warring against the Jewish Palestinians for doing the same.

And rightly so...

The only place in the universe where europeans of jewish faith have any right to populate the region and create states in the Middle East is inside the obscure mind of imperialists like RoccoR.

 

[Sixties Fan]

Originally posted by ForeverYoung436
Jordan is an artificial country named after a river, for Gd's sake. It was part of the Palestine Mandate. Historically and ethnically, there is absolutely no difference between a "Jordanian" and a Palestinian.

I see...

Gentiles like José, Coyote and Tinmore have no business deciding who is and who isn't a Jew.

But FY, Shusha and rylah, jews from America, Canada and Israel have the final say about the territory comprised by the palestinian homeland and even get to decide whether or not Palestinians exist as a separate national identity.

It never was Palestinian land, and Arabs ARE a separate National identity.

They refer to themselves as Muslims first. Arabs second.

That is the way it is. We did not make it up, they say so themselves.

"Ancient Palestine" never existed.

Ancient Canaan and Ancient Israel did.

And you seem to forget that the Hashemite Arabs decided that TranJordan would be a territory only for the Hashemites, with all other Arabs living there. Before and after all of those other clans of Arabs decided, or did not decide to identify themselves as Palestinians.

As a matter of fact, it was Arafat, in 1964, who decided what the identity of all of those Arabs was going to be. And it came as a shock to most of those Arabs, as they thought of themselves as Syrians, and part of greater Syria.

 

[Shusha]

I see...

Gentiles like José, Coyote and Tinmore have no business deciding who is and who isn't a Jew.

But FY, Shusha and rylah, jews from America, Canada and Israel have the final say about the territory comprised by the palestinian homeland and even get to decide whether or not Palestinians exist as a separate national identity.

No, not at all. The territory is the territory. The territory of Palestine encapsulates all of what is now Jordan, Israel, Areas A and B and C and Gaza. The Palestinians (all of them) absolutely do get to decide between themselves if they should exist as separate national identities. The problem is when SOME Palestinians are prevented from doing so -- the Jewish Palestinians.

Why can't the Jewish Palestinians form a nation?

(also, I'm not Jewish).

 

[Sixties Fan]

Originally posted by Shusha
while warring against the Jewish Palestinians for doing the same.

And rightly so...

The only place in the universe where europeans of jewish faith have any right to populate the region and create states in the Middle East is inside the obscure mind of imperialists like RoccoR.

Except that those are not "European Jews", anymore than Germans living in Australia, America, England or Japan can be said to identify mainly by those countries.

They do know that they came from Germany, the same way any Jew who lived in Europe, Americas, Japan, China, etc, knows that they came from the land of their ancestors, the Land of Israel and are indigenous to that land.

Repeating something as false as the European nonsense about Jews, is never going to turn the indigenous Jews of Asian, Land of Israel roots, into Europeans.

 

[Shusha]

Originally posted by Shusha
while warring against the Jewish Palestinians for doing the same.

And rightly so...

The only place in the universe where europeans of jewish faith have any right to populate the region and create states in the Middle East is inside the obscure mind of imperialists like RoccoR.

Because only Muslim Arabs are Palestinians (TM). Thank you. I see you have got my point after all.

See, there is no conflict if you can manage to erase an entire culture and the identity of an entire group of people; their entire history and ancestry; their ethnicity; their connection to their land; entire ethnic backgrounds going back thousands of years. But you know what that is, right?

 

[José]

Originally posted by Shusha
The territory of Palestine encapsulates all of what is now Jordan, Israel, Areas A and B and C and Gaza.

Depends on who you ask.

If you asked a british politician in 1918 to envision the region of Palestine he would visualise in his mind all the regions you mentioned.

But if you asked an arab inhabitant to visualise Palestine, the territory of his national homeland in 1950, 60, 90 or 2000 he would envision all the regions you cited minus Jordan despite all the efforts made by King Hussein to erase the palestinian national identity and replace it with Jordan's and despite the irresistible wave of pan-arabist nasserism that swept the Middle East in the 50's and 60's.

There was only one way to include Jordan in the territorial identity of the palestinian people:

If Britain had earmarked Jordan for european colonization back in the 20's.

 

[Sixties Fan]

Originally posted by Shusha
The territory of Palestine encapsulates all of what is now Jordan, Israel, Areas A and B and C and Gaza.

Depends on who you ask.

If you asked a british politician in 1918 to envision the region of Palestine he would visualise in his mind all the regions you mentioned.

But if you asked an arab inhabitant to visualise Palestine, the territory of his national homeland in 1950, 60, 90 or 2000 he would envision all the regions you cited minus Jordan despite all the efforts made by King Hussein to erase the palestinian national identity and replace it with Jordan's and despite the irresistible wave of pan-arabist nasserism that swept the Middle East in the 50's and 60's.

There was only one way to include Jordan in the territorial identity of the palestinian people:

If Britain had earmarked Jordan for european colonization back in the 20's.

Do not play games of WHEN one asked this person or that person.

It is absurd.

You do not know or care about the history of the Mandate, why all the Mandate was earmarked for the Jewish Homeland, anymore than you know why Syria is Syria, Lebanon is Lebanon and Iraq became Iraq, out of the other three mandates post WWI.

 

[José]

Originally posted by Shusha
See, there is no conflict if you can manage to erase an entire culture and the identity of an entire group of people

Originally posted by Sixties Fan
Except that those are not "European Jews", anymore than Germans living in Australia, America, England or Japan can be said to identify mainly by those countries.

I'm not erasing anyone and they are europeans.

Askhenazis are the descendants of European converts to Judaism...

Together with Judaism they received the notion of "people" that's embedded in the jewish religion.

Genetically, they are 100% europeans who began thinking about themselves as part of the jewish people the moment they converted.

I respect their religious faith, I respect the sense of peoplehood they received together with their new religion but their DNA is 100% european.

I can call Agatha and Jolie, my sister's siamese cats a horse and a guinea pig for the rest of my life but the little beasts will continue to be felines.

You can call europeans of jewish faith Jewish Palestinians all you want but at the end of the day they'll still be europeans of jewish faith, ie, their DNA will still be as semitic as Mao Tse Tung's.

 

[Sixties Fan]

Originally posted by Shusha
The territory of Palestine encapsulates all of what is now Jordan, Israel, Areas A and B and C and Gaza.

Depends on who you ask.

If you asked a british politician in 1918 to envision the region of Palestine he would visualise in his mind all the regions you mentioned.

But if you asked an arab inhabitant to visualise Palestine, the territory of his national homeland in 1950, 60, 90 or 2000 he would envision all the regions you cited minus Jordan despite all the efforts made by King Hussein to erase the palestinian national identity and replace it with Jordan's and despite the irresistible wave of pan-arabist nasserism that swept the Middle East in the 50's and 60's.

There was only one way to include Jordan in the territorial identity of the palestinian people:

If Britain had earmarked Jordan for european colonization back in the 20's.

The only European colonization would have been that of the British or the French, had they decided to keep the territory of any one of the Mandates to themselves.

The British tried to do it with the Mandate for Palestine after giving 78% of the Jewish ancient homeland to the foreign Hashemites who had just moved to the area post WWI.

After they gave that part away to only one clan of Arabs, they tried to keep the rest to themselves because the British government did not care about the Balfour Declaration and honoring their part in that Mandate, to secure and help rebuild the Jewish Nation for the Jewish People.

Accept it or not, that is the history of the area, and the Mandates.