Catastrophic Gap In Weather Satellite Data

[elektra]

Scheduled Hearings as well?

Hearing: Weather Satellite Delays, Data Gap to Harm U.S. Forecasting

Posted: Thursday, February 12, 2015, Washington, D.C. Today, the Subcommittees on Oversight and Environment held ajoint hearing to examine schedule delays to our nation's next generation weather forecasting satellites and the implications of the impending gap in weather data. Witnesses provided an update on operations and development of the National Oceanic and Atmospheric Administration's (NOAA) polar-orbiting (JPSS) and geostationary (GOES) weather satellite programs and discussed recent Government Accountability Office (GAO) reports on the two programs.

 

[flacaltenn]

There are currently 12 satellites in the constellation for just weather. Certainly not ALL of all were in your "diagram" and not all of them are going useless. Both RSS and UAH use at least 10 AMSU sounding units to gather the "global temperature".

So I'm sure you are right about the upcoming gaps,. But we should make sure exactly WHAT data is being "gapped".. It's a crowded sky up there. Lots of junk and treasure floating around in orbit..

 

[Old Rocks]

Hearing: Weather Satellite Delays, Data Gap to Harm U.S. Forecasting

Washington, D.C. Today, the Subcommittees on Oversight and Environment held ajoint hearing to examine schedule delays to our nation's next generation weather forecasting satellites and the implications of the impending gap in weather data. Witnesses provided an update on operations and development of the National Oceanic and Atmospheric Administration's (NOAA) polar-orbiting (JPSS) and geostationary (GOES) weather satellite programs and discussed recent Government Accountability Office (GAO) reports on the two programs.

Environment Subcommittee Chairman Jim Bridenstine (R-Okla.): "Given the criticality of JPSS and GOES to our forecasts, it is imperative we ensure these programs receive the adequate support and oversight to avoid further delays and costs overruns. Instead of continuing down the path of large government-owned satellites that are prone to cost overruns and delays, we must look outside the box for new methods of providing essential weather data. There is a burgeoning commercial industry that has incredible potential to assist us in providing accurate information to protect American lives and property, disaggregate risk, and save the taxpayers' dollars. We need to have the most resilient space-based architecture possible."

Looks to me like the GOP'ers on the panel are saying that the government should not do it and that we should wait for the private businesses to do it.

 

[elektra]

The diagram I added was for visual effect, I was not sure how much it actually applied to the OP, I kind of sometimes develop this as I go. I was looking for something that showed the sun/radiation/damage to give a visual idea of what is happening. In the second post I was surprised about the actual malfunctioning transponder.

 

[Dale Smith]

Hearing: Weather Satellite Delays, Data Gap to Harm U.S. Forecasting

Washington, D.C. Today, the Subcommittees on Oversight and Environment held ajoint hearing to examine schedule delays to our nation's next generation weather forecasting satellites and the implications of the impending gap in weather data. Witnesses provided an update on operations and development of the National Oceanic and Atmospheric Administration's (NOAA) polar-orbiting (JPSS) and geostationary (GOES) weather satellite programs and discussed recent Government Accountability Office (GAO) reports on the two programs.

Environment Subcommittee Chairman Jim Bridenstine (R-Okla.): "Given the criticality of JPSS and GOES to our forecasts, it is imperative we ensure these programs receive the adequate support and oversight to avoid further delays and costs overruns. Instead of continuing down the path of large government-owned satellites that are prone to cost overruns and delays, we must look outside the box for new methods of providing essential weather data. There is a burgeoning commercial industry that has incredible potential to assist us in providing accurate information to protect American lives and property, disaggregate risk, and save the taxpayers' dollars. We need to have the most resilient space-based architecture possible."

Looks to me like the GOP'ers on the panel are saying that the government should not do it and that we should wait for the private businesses to do it.

Your beloved "gubermint" is a corporation and a business. They will push this load of b.s because it has the potential to improve their bottom line.

 

[Old Rocks]

My goodness, Dale, you really believe it is a good thing for the government to run a deficit? I thought all good conservatives believed that the government should be ran more like a business. So what is your beef?

 

[mamooth]

The GOES-R satellite is scheduled for a October 2016 launch. GOES 12,13,14,15 are working now. Those are the geosynchronous weather satellites. They sit above the USA, with visible and IR cameras and microwave sounding units.

POES, the polar orbiting satellites, are a US/European joint project. Currently 5 satellites, with any spot on earth being overflown about 4 times a day. New JPSS satellite scheduled for 2017 launch.

The A-train consists of 6 satellites in a sun-synchronous near-polar orbit. Those are the specialized earth sciences satellites

SMAP, the soil moisture measuring unit, was mounted on the ISS in Jan 2015. And failed in July 2015. At least it was a cheaper failure, as things cost much less if they're not a stand-alone satellite.

And the DoD has their own weather satellites. Because they can.

 

[jc456]

My, my, doesn't this make you anti-science assholes happy?

But then, we will put up more satellites that will provide us with more data.

actually it is quite sad that the technology is failing.

 

[RollingThunder]

They can make all the claims they want today, but the fact is the current satellites are degraded, sensors are failing, and it is a huge cover-up. The problem is radiation, which is so high in space that it literally burns the sensors up, degrading their ability to provide us data within their design specifications.

Panel Warns of ‘Catastrophic’ Gap in Weather Satellite Data

• Published: November 14th, 2013 , Last Updated: November 14th, 2013

Unless it acts quickly, the U.S. faces the likelihood of a "catastrophic" reduction in weather and climate data starting in 2016, resulting in less reliable weather and climate forecasts, a federally-commissioned review panel said on Thursday. The review team, which was comprised of veterans of the weather, space, and aerospace industries, found that the

National Oceanic and Atmospheric Administration (NOAA) has made progress fixing major problems in its satellite programs since the last outside review was completed in 2012, but that the agency has not done enough to mitigate the impacts of a satellite data gap.

NOAA has warned that, starting in about 2016, there will be at least a year-long gap between the newest polar orbiting satellite’s design lifetime and the scheduled launch date of its replacement.

The usual insane, lie-filled rant from ol' Ejakulatra. The imbecile first claims that the satellite data showing the rapid decline in Arctic ice must be faulty because of supposed problems with the satellites.....then, as evidence, the fool posts an article published in 2013 that doesn't support his fraudulent points about the satellites being unreliable at all but instead talks about a not-yet-happening potential problem that might happen later this year.....even the part of the article he quoted says: "Unless it acts quickly, the U.S. faces the likelihood of a "catastrophic" reduction in weather and climate data starting in 2016, resulting in less reliable weather and climate forecasts,"

The article also says....
"NOAA has warned that, starting in about 2016, there will be at least a year-long gap between the newest polar orbiting satellite’s design lifetime and the scheduled launch date of its replacement.

That would mean the U.S. would be reliant on just one polar-orbiting satellite, rather than the two that have long been in service. A lack of funding from Congress has put that program, known as the Joint Polar Satellite System (JPSS), years behind schedule.

NOAA and international forecasting agencies have warned that such a data gap could significantly erode the agency’s ability to provide advanced notice of significant weather events."

Now, who do you think are the ones in Congress who have blocked the funding for NASA.....well, of course, it was the anti-science Republicans' stooging for their corporate puppetmasters in the fossil fuel industry...and the Koch brothers who have said they will spend nearly a billion dollars on the current Presidential election, and who don't want anyone collecting more data showing the shocking reality, speed and already disastrous effects of the global warming-climate change crisis the world is facing.

 

[Wyatt earp]

As for a gap during the period before we launch new satellites, the ESA, Russians, and Japanese all have satellites that record the data we need. I am sure that they would sell us that data.

NASA doesn't understand the metric system

 

[RollingThunder]

As for a gap during the period before we launch new satellites, the ESA, Russians, and Japanese all have satellites that record the data we need. I am sure that they would sell us that data.

NASA doesn't understand the metric system

LOLOLOL....so says the clueless retard about real scientists.

 

[Wyatt earp]

As for a gap during the period before we launch new satellites, the ESA, Russians, and Japanese all have satellites that record the data we need. I am sure that they would sell us that data.

NASA doesn't understand the metric system

LOLOLOL....so says the clueless retard about real scientists.

Don't tell me you don't even know the story I am referring to???????


How clueless are you about science, history and the rest of the world with out talking points???????

 

[RollingThunder]

As for a gap during the period before we launch new satellites, the ESA, Russians, and Japanese all have satellites that record the data we need. I am sure that they would sell us that data.

NASA doesn't understand the metric system

LOLOLOL....so says the clueless retard about real scientists.

Don't tell me you don't even know the story I am referring to???????

I do know that if you imagine that the scientists at NASA, who have ten times your intelligence, and about a hundred times your education, don't "understand the metric system", then you are a very crazy and very delusional retard!

 

[Wyatt earp]

As for a gap during the period before we launch new satellites, the ESA, Russians, and Japanese all have satellites that record the data we need. I am sure that they would sell us that data.

NASA doesn't understand the metric system

LOLOLOL....so says the clueless retard about real scientists.

Don't tell me you don't even know the story I am referring to???????

I do know that if you imagine that the scientists at NASA, who have ten times your intelligence, and about a hundred times your education, don't "understand the metric system", then you are a very crazy and very delusional retard!

30 minutes latter and still can not figure out what I was referring to?

 

[RollingThunder]

NASA doesn't understand the metric system

LOLOLOL....so says the clueless retard about real scientists.

Don't tell me you don't even know the story I am referring to???????

I do know that if you imagine that the scientists at NASA, who have ten times your intelligence, and about a hundred times your education, don't "understand the metric system", then you are a very crazy and very delusional retard!

30 minutes latter and still can not figure out what I was referring to?

30 minutes or ten years....I still wouldn't care what bullshit hokum you've gullibly swallowed, you poor delusional moron.

 

[ScienceRocks]

NASA doesn't understand the metric system

LOLOLOL....so says the clueless retard about real scientists.

Don't tell me you don't even know the story I am referring to???????

I do know that if you imagine that the scientists at NASA, who have ten times your intelligence, and about a hundred times your education, don't "understand the metric system", then you are a very crazy and very delusional retard!

30 minutes latter and still can not figure out what I was referring to?

30 minutes or ten years....I still wouldn't care what bullshit hokum you've gullibly swallowed, you poor delusional moron.

it's sad

 

[Wyatt earp]

NASA doesn't understand the metric system

LOLOLOL....so says the clueless retard about real scientists.

Don't tell me you don't even know the story I am referring to???????

I do know that if you imagine that the scientists at NASA, who have ten times your intelligence, and about a hundred times your education, don't "understand the metric system", then you are a very crazy and very delusional retard!

30 minutes latter and still can not figure out what I was referring to?

30 minutes or ten years....I still wouldn't care what bullshit hokum you've gullibly swallowed, you poor delusional moron.

You quoted me three times to say you didn't care? Damn, dumber then a bunch of rocks.

 

[Wyatt earp]

NASA doesn't understand the metric system

LOLOLOL....so says the clueless retard about real scientists.

Don't tell me you don't even know the story I am referring to???????

I do know that if you imagine that the scientists at NASA, who have ten times your intelligence, and about a hundred times your education, don't "understand the metric system", then you are a very crazy and very delusional retard!

30 minutes latter and still can not figure out what I was referring to?

30 minutes or ten years....I still wouldn't care what bullshit hokum you've gullibly swallowed, you poor delusional moron.

it's sad

Its more sadder when you don't even know.

 

[Crick]

Both I and Thunder know what you're referring to and it does not change the answer. The people at NASA "understand the metric system". The people who fucked up didn't work for NASA. The people who fucked up worked for Lockheed Martin who were under contract to provide SI data but failed to do so. You know, Lockheed Martin, the FOR-PROFIT CORPORATION.

Cause of failure
On November 10, 1999, the Mars Climate Orbiter Mishap Investigation Board released a Phase I report, detailing the suspected issues encountered with the loss of the spacecraft. Previously, on September 8, 1999, Trajectory Correction Maneuver-4 was computed and then executed on September 15, 1999. It was intended to place the spacecraft at an optimal position for an orbital insertion maneuver that would bring the spacecraft around Mars at an altitude of 226 kilometers on September 23, 1999. However, during the week between TCM-4 and the orbital insertion maneuver, the navigation team indicated the altitude may be much lower than intended at 150 to 170 kilometers. Twenty-four hours prior to orbital insertion, calculations placed the orbiter at an altitude of 110 kilometers; 80 kilometers is the minimum altitude that Mars Climate Orbiter was thought to be capable of surviving during this maneuver. Post-failure calculations showed that the spacecraft was on a trajectory that would have taken the orbiter within 57 kilometers of the surface, where the spacecraft likely disintegrated because of atmospheric stresses.

The primary cause of this discrepancy was that one piece of ground software supplied by Lockheed Martin produced results in a United States customary unit, contrary to its Software Interface Specification (SIS), while a second system, supplied by NASA, expected those results to be in metric units, in accordance with the SIS. Specifically, software that calculated the total impulse produced by thruster firings calculated results in pound-seconds. The trajectory calculation software then used these results -- expected to be in newton-seconds -- to update the predicted position of the spacecraft.[16]

The discrepancy between calculated and measured position, resulting in the discrepancy between desired and actual orbit insertion altitude, had been noticed earlier by at least two navigators, whose concerns were dismissed. A meeting of trajectory software engineers, trajectory software operators (navigators), propulsion engineers, and managers, was convened to consider the possibility of executing Trajectory Correction Maneuver-5, which was in the schedule. Attendees of the meeting recall an agreement to conduct TCM-5, but it was ultimately not done.

16) "Mars Climate Orbiter Mishap Investigation Board Phase I Report" (PDF) (Press release). NASA. November 10, 1999. Retrieved February 22, 2013.

Mars Climate Orbiter - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

You actually hope to imply that you are smarter or less prone to making errors than the scientists in the US space program. The idea is insanely laughable. Why don't you go to that Wikipedia link, read its layman's description about the Mars Climate Orbiter and then explain to us what it was to do and how it was to do it. Explain to us what its sensors measured and how they did so, tell us how its computers worked, how it powered itself, how it navigated and maneuvered and how it transmitted its data to Earth. And I'd like to hear that all done at the level of someone who could actually design and build the hardware and software required, you ignorant ass.

 

[Dale Smith]

Both I and Thunder know what you're referring to and it does not change the answer. The people at NASA "understand the metric system". The people who fucked up didn't work for NASA. The people who fucked up worked for Lockheed Martin who were under contract to provide SI data but failed to do so. You know, Lockheed Martin, the FOR-PROFIT CORPORATION.

Cause of failure
On November 10, 1999, the Mars Climate Orbiter Mishap Investigation Board released a Phase I report, detailing the suspected issues encountered with the loss of the spacecraft. Previously, on September 8, 1999, Trajectory Correction Maneuver-4 was computed and then executed on September 15, 1999. It was intended to place the spacecraft at an optimal position for an orbital insertion maneuver that would bring the spacecraft around Mars at an altitude of 226 kilometers on September 23, 1999. However, during the week between TCM-4 and the orbital insertion maneuver, the navigation team indicated the altitude may be much lower than intended at 150 to 170 kilometers. Twenty-four hours prior to orbital insertion, calculations placed the orbiter at an altitude of 110 kilometers; 80 kilometers is the minimum altitude that Mars Climate Orbiter was thought to be capable of surviving during this maneuver. Post-failure calculations showed that the spacecraft was on a trajectory that would have taken the orbiter within 57 kilometers of the surface, where the spacecraft likely disintegrated because of atmospheric stresses.

The primary cause of this discrepancy was that one piece of ground software supplied by Lockheed Martin produced results in a United States customary unit, contrary to its Software Interface Specification (SIS), while a second system, supplied by NASA, expected those results to be in metric units, in accordance with the SIS. Specifically, software that calculated the total impulse produced by thruster firings calculated results in pound-seconds. The trajectory calculation software then used these results -- expected to be in newton-seconds -- to update the predicted position of the spacecraft.[16]

The discrepancy between calculated and measured position, resulting in the discrepancy between desired and actual orbit insertion altitude, had been noticed earlier by at least two navigators, whose concerns were dismissed. A meeting of trajectory software engineers, trajectory software operators (navigators), propulsion engineers, and managers, was convened to consider the possibility of executing Trajectory Correction Maneuver-5, which was in the schedule. Attendees of the meeting recall an agreement to conduct TCM-5, but it was ultimately not done.

16) "Mars Climate Orbiter Mishap Investigation Board Phase I Report" (PDF) (Press release). NASA. November 10, 1999. Retrieved February 22, 2013.

Mars Climate Orbiter - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

You actually hope to imply that you are smarter or less prone to making errors than the scientists in the US space program. The idea is insanely laughable. Why don't you go to that Wikipedia link, read its layman's description about the Mars Climate Orbiter and then explain to us what it was to do and how it was to do it. Explain to us what its sensors measured and how they did so, tell us how its computers worked, how it powered itself, how it navigated and maneuvered and how it transmitted its data to Earth. And I'd like to hear that all done at the level of someone who could actually design and build the hardware and software required, you ignorant ass.[/QUOTE


Holy shit, he was just making a joke!!! You and Thunder take this global warming bullshit waaaaay too seriously It's like a friggin' religious cause and anyone that you can't convert becomes your mortal enemy. I KNOW the the groups of elites that are pushing this crap and as to why they are doing it. You are carrying water for a bunch of low-lives that created this mess. This is extortion and on a global level. "Give into our demands, give up your sovereignty and we will stop spraying you like bugs". This shit they are spraying is landing on our farms, the cows eat the grass this crap lands on and it ends up in our water supply. There is as much as 30 percent less sunlight reaching the earth now in some places and I'll be damn if they are not blaming THAT on climate change.....it's incredible....is there anything it can't do? We had a bunch of hurricanes in 2004, massive ones...libs screamed "GLOBAL WARMING" and now we have gone 11 years and only one hurricane of note and THAT proves climate change (because they had to change it from "warming"). If you want to consider yourself an expert or a proponent of changing our way of life for something that I believe is being caused by a group of greedy globalists? Do some homework on what geo-engineering is because you will never get the truth if you simply attack it from one angle.