CBO: extending unemployment benefits creates 19,000 jobs per billion dollar stimulus

[Soggy in NOLA]

You idiot. You don't give Obama credit for ANYTHING. You are a hack and you know it.

Oh, the irony of this post

Priceless irony isn't it?

Hacks say hacky things..

 

[LordBrownTrout]

1) The benefits that the unemployed spend creates economic demand where there wouldn't be otherwise. For every tax dollar spent on these benefits, it creates $1.64 in economic stimulus (or 10 billion spent creates 16.7 billion in demand). Why? Because it creates a ripple effect in the market. Capitalism 101.

2) When the unemployed receive this insurance, they quickly spend ALL of it on basic essentials like food, clothing, and shelter. That is why it is so effective in creating jobs. Without this extra demand, more businesses are forced to lay their workers off.

3) Only 10,000 jobs are created every billion dollar TAX CUT. This is because the employed only spend HALF of their tax cuts. They have the luxury of saving some. All in all it does more harm than good: every dollar lost in revenue only creates .59 cents in growth.

4) This fiscal policy was a great success during the Great Depression.

This isn't Leftwing bull. We are talking basic economics. Demand side economic policies is the answer. Trickle down economics is a republican lie.

Why Extended Federal Unemployment Benefits Boost the Economy

That isn't capitalism 101. This goofy logic is known as dumbassism 101.

 

[Cecilie1200]

If they had repealed Obamacare after everyone found out what was in the law, they probably would have saved or created 19,000,000 jobs at least and it wouldn't have cost the tax payers a dime. Too bad that saving the middle class isn't on their agenda.

Working in the health insurance industry as I am right now (specifically, I work for a company that manages prescription benefits for the insurance providers, and also operates as a mail-order pharmacy), I can tell you what an incredible joy Obamacare has been to everyone. At least a quarter of the clients I talk to every day are calling because they've been put on "Healthcare Reform" plans and are seeking help to navigate the Byzantine mess their prescriptions have become. My employer had to provide my coworkers and I special training just so we could make these wonderful explanations, because those accounts don't work in our system the way normal insurance coverage accounts do. I have yet to talk to any of our members who is happy with their new Obamacare. The best reaction I have seen so far is blank incredulity when I get done explaining their benefits to them. The phrase "You've got to be kidding" shows up a lot.

 

[Antares]

If they had repealed Obamacare after everyone found out what was in the law, they probably would have saved or created 19,000,000 jobs at least and it wouldn't have cost the tax payers a dime. Too bad that saving the middle class isn't on their agenda.

Working in the health insurance industry as I am right now (specifically, I work for a company that manages prescription benefits for the insurance providers, and also operates as a mail-order pharmacy), I can tell you what an incredible joy Obamacare has been to everyone. At least a quarter of the clients I talk to every day are calling because they've been put on "Healthcare Reform" plans and are seeking help to navigate the Byzantine mess their prescriptions have become. My employer had to provide my coworkers and I special training just so we could make these wonderful explanations, because those accounts don't work in our system the way normal insurance coverage accounts do. I have yet to talk to any of our members who is happy with their new Obamacare. The best reaction I have seen so far is blank incredulity when I get done explaining their benefits to them. The phrase "You've got to be kidding" shows up a lot.

I am on the Insurance end of it, the ones who are happy are the ones who qualify for subsidies and most especially those who also qualify for cost sharing. That cost sharing turns out some astonishing numbers for them.

 

[The Rabbi]

If they had repealed Obamacare after everyone found out what was in the law, they probably would have saved or created 19,000,000 jobs at least and it wouldn't have cost the tax payers a dime. Too bad that saving the middle class isn't on their agenda.

Working in the health insurance industry as I am right now (specifically, I work for a company that manages prescription benefits for the insurance providers, and also operates as a mail-order pharmacy), I can tell you what an incredible joy Obamacare has been to everyone. At least a quarter of the clients I talk to every day are calling because they've been put on "Healthcare Reform" plans and are seeking help to navigate the Byzantine mess their prescriptions have become. My employer had to provide my coworkers and I special training just so we could make these wonderful explanations, because those accounts don't work in our system the way normal insurance coverage accounts do. I have yet to talk to any of our members who is happy with their new Obamacare. The best reaction I have seen so far is blank incredulity when I get done explaining their benefits to them. The phrase "You've got to be kidding" shows up a lot.

I am on the Insurance end of it, the ones who are happy are the ones who qualify for subsidies and most especially those who also qualify for cost sharing. That cost sharing turns out some astonishing numbers for them.

And those people tend to be low income, high cost customers. Exactly what is going to make the system go bankrupt.

 

[Antares]

Working in the health insurance industry as I am right now (specifically, I work for a company that manages prescription benefits for the insurance providers, and also operates as a mail-order pharmacy), I can tell you what an incredible joy Obamacare has been to everyone. At least a quarter of the clients I talk to every day are calling because they've been put on "Healthcare Reform" plans and are seeking help to navigate the Byzantine mess their prescriptions have become. My employer had to provide my coworkers and I special training just so we could make these wonderful explanations, because those accounts don't work in our system the way normal insurance coverage accounts do. I have yet to talk to any of our members who is happy with their new Obamacare. The best reaction I have seen so far is blank incredulity when I get done explaining their benefits to them. The phrase "You've got to be kidding" shows up a lot.

I am on the Insurance end of it, the ones who are happy are the ones who qualify for subsidies and most especially those who also qualify for cost sharing. That cost sharing turns out some astonishing numbers for them.

And those people tend to be low income, high cost customers. Exactly what is going to make the system go bankrupt.

Yes they do.....the Country is going to find that the industry will be upside down very soon....adverse selection will sink the ACA.

 

[Meister]

I am on the Insurance end of it, the ones who are happy are the ones who qualify for subsidies and most especially those who also qualify for cost sharing. That cost sharing turns out some astonishing numbers for them.

And those people tend to be low income, high cost customers. Exactly what is going to make the system go bankrupt.

Yes they do.....the Country is going to find that the industry will be upside down very soon....adverse selection will sink the ACA.

Sadly, from the ashes of the ACA, the government will push for the single payer healthcare.
I think this was obama's plan all along and what was stated to Kucinich(sp?) on Air Force One to get his vote. The only flaw is that it was supposed to be a slow death, not a spiral death. So we'll just have to see what happens.

 

[Cecilie1200]

How many jobs does a dollar of taxes or government borrowing destroy?

We didn't get out of the Great Depression until government borrowed over 100% of GDP to ramp up war manufacturing. The resulting government jobs put nearly everyone to work. And guess what happened as a result? Answer: since everyone had money to spend on "Main Street, the Capitalist had an incentive to invest, produce and add jobs, which put even more consumers in the economy, which incentivized even greater investment and job growth, which jump started a cycle that saw multi-decades of economic growth, including the 50s and 60s, which had greater growth than the Supply Side boom in the 80s & 90s, which boom was artificial because it was over-reliant on the expansion of credit to consumers. Regarding our WWII-government-borrowing which stimulated massive economic growth, please note: we could have built the bombs and dumped them into the ocean AND the economic growth would have been the same: tons of people with jobs and as a direct result, the needed purchasing power to stimulate Main Street job growth. FYI: the resulting economic growth also lead to increased revenue and, as a result, allowed us to pay down the massive deficit.

*sigh* I would ask when idiot leftists are ever going to get over the myth they cling to of WWII ending the Great Depression, but I know the answer is, "Never".

Despite that, I am going to go over this yet again for the thinking-impaired among us: World War Two did NOT end the Great Depression. Let's review.

Herbert Hoover, contrary to leftist memes, was the exact opposite of a laissez-faire, unbridled-capitalism President. Smoot-Hawley, Davis-Bacon, and Norris-LaGuardia (just for a start) all prove this. Hoover's policies increased federal spending by 50%. What was the result of all this wonderful government spending that was supposed to stimulate the economy, which you leftist twits would have us believe is "basic economics"? The Depression. (No, Hoover wasn't singlehandedly responsible for the Depression, but his administration was a huge chunk of the perfect storm that caused it.)

FDR, for all that he campaigned for the presidency on criticisms of Hoover's economic intervention, merely accelerated, exacerbated, and built upon the exact same policies, and thereby worsened and prolonged the depression into The Great Depression. FDR increased government spending 83% in his first three years. The resulting "economic stimulation" that you lefties want to believe is the inevitable result of government spending was an unemployment rate that never went below 14%.

Now, to the question of WW2's wonderful economic benefits.

On the surface, which is as far as you leftists ever look, wartime spending moved America out of the Depression. War production went from 2% of the GDP to 40% and unemployment fell below 2%. However, there are a couple of points below the surface that the left never even sees, let alone considers.

Unless you intend for your nation to remain perpetually at war, wartime spending and employment are an economic anomaly, not an actual economic improvement. Saying that unemployment has dropped to 2% because all those previously-non-working men are now employed as soldiers ignores the fact that soldiering is almost entirely a short-term, temporary occupation, not a real, long-term career. To put it more simply, the war is going to end, and all those soldiers are going to be discharged, and then you're right back where you started from with them being unemployed.

The same applies to your Rosie the Riveter types. What happened to the women who were employed during the war to build war machines and supplies to support the military when the war ends and those products are no longer needed? Answer: they don't have jobs any more. Worse, they end up competing for what jobs are available with the returning unemployed ex-soldiers, because WWII actually exacerbated the economic problems by putting a segment of the population to work that never had been before, and once the war was over, those ladies weren't willing to go back to their previous status of unpaid homemakers.

And this brings us to the next point: war spending does very little to stimulate the private sector in any long-term way. Oh, sure, the temporarily-employed-by-the-war people had incomes, but since private consumption was curbed both by government-imposed rationing and by the fact that most of the manufacturing had moved from private consumption items to war supplies, they weren't really buying much.

So if it wasn't war spending that boosted America out of the Great Depression, what did it? That would be the demise of FDR's New Deal policies. Tax rates had been slashed, price controls and regulations retreated, and as one of the few industrial nations that still had its manufacturing capacity intact after the war, America was able to reap the benefits of a private sector unfettered by the government policies that had shackled it during the Depression. Federal spending fell from $93 billion in 1945 to under $30 billion by 1948, but unemployment stabilized at 4% as the private sector kicked into gear.

I have worked for both the government and the private sector in my long career history. I have seen the public sector rush at the end of the fiscal year to spend all the rest of the money in their annual budget - didn't matter on what or whether it was efficient or effective - in order to justify being given more money the next year. That's not how it works in the private sector. If your department wants a budget increase the next year, it has to do more than just show that it spent all the money; it has to show that it improved the company, made more profit, and/or satisfied more customers. Feature the government EVER asking those questions when preparing a budget. Doesn't happen. They merely assume that OF COURSE their activities and increased spending on those activities makes the world a better place, and why in the Hell would you ever expect them to PROVE it?

Businesses thrive by producing, being efficient, and pleasing customers. Bureaucracies thrive by being inefficient and focusing only on their self-perpetuation. Therefore, spending by bureaucracies does not produce economic stimulation or recovery. It produces only waste and burden.

And that, brothers and sisters, is REAL "basic economics".

 

[Cecilie1200]

You idiot. You don't give Obama credit for ANYTHING. You are a hack and you know it.

I give him credit for completely fucking things up... happy? Obama sucks.. his policies have given us functional unemployment of nearly 37%... 1/6 of Americans on public assistance, $7,000,000,000,000 new debt in 5 years....

Functional employment of 37%? How's this and then what was the functional employment of the previous administration. 37% unemployment and freeways clogged during work hours in southern california and I haven't seen traffic any lighter or heavier since Obama took over.

Yes, because people in California NEVER drive anywhere but to and from work.

Dear GOD, you're a moron.

 

[Cecilie1200]

If they had repealed Obamacare after everyone found out what was in the law, they probably would have saved or created 19,000,000 jobs at least and it wouldn't have cost the tax payers a dime. Too bad that saving the middle class isn't on their agenda.

Working in the health insurance industry as I am right now (specifically, I work for a company that manages prescription benefits for the insurance providers, and also operates as a mail-order pharmacy), I can tell you what an incredible joy Obamacare has been to everyone. At least a quarter of the clients I talk to every day are calling because they've been put on "Healthcare Reform" plans and are seeking help to navigate the Byzantine mess their prescriptions have become. My employer had to provide my coworkers and I special training just so we could make these wonderful explanations, because those accounts don't work in our system the way normal insurance coverage accounts do. I have yet to talk to any of our members who is happy with their new Obamacare. The best reaction I have seen so far is blank incredulity when I get done explaining their benefits to them. The phrase "You've got to be kidding" shows up a lot.

I am on the Insurance end of it, the ones who are happy are the ones who qualify for subsidies and most especially those who also qualify for cost sharing. That cost sharing turns out some astonishing numbers for them.

Even the ones I encounter who qualify for subsidies are not dancing for joy, possibly because by the time I encounter them, they're experiencing the bitter that inevitably goes with the sweet, ie. being driven batshit insane in exchange for getting those subsidies.

 

[Antares]

And those people tend to be low income, high cost customers. Exactly what is going to make the system go bankrupt.

Yes they do.....the Country is going to find that the industry will be upside down very soon....adverse selection will sink the ACA.

Sadly, from the ashes of the ACA, the government will push for the single payer healthcare.
I think this was obama's plan all along and what was stated to Kucinich(sp?) on Air Force One to get his vote. The only flaw is that it was supposed to be a slow death, not a spiral death. So we'll just have to see what happens.

I completely agree.

 

[bluecoller-eddy]

Post #8
Rozman's Sez
What about working?
Does that do anything for the economy?
Libs don't seem to think it does.

How about that?
More and more the left wants us to think that there
is nothing wrong with people being out of work.

Our really cool PRESIDENT Obama's Jobs Expansion has already exceeded the
Bush job Expansion in private sector job creation.

Top Picks (Most Requested Statistics) : U.S. Bureau of Labor Statistics
Total Private Employment - CES0500000001

Bush Jobs Expansion

Jul --2003 --108,330

Jan --2008 --115,668

53 Months ----+7,338

Our really cool PRESIDENT Obama's Jobs Expansion

Feb --2010 --106,850

Dec --2013 --115,028

46 Months ----+8,178

Republican governors on the other hand don't think that teachers
and police deserve jobs.
Thus holding the economy back.

Top Picks (Most Requested Statistics) : U.S. Bureau of Labor Statistics
Government CES9000000001

Bush

Jan --2001 --20,835

Jan --2009 --22,583 +1,748

Obama

Jan --2009 --22,583

Dec --2013 --21;849 Minus 734

For Republicans, Lying is a way of life.

-------Bluecoller--the grumpy old kraut -----

 

[Meister]

Post #8
Rozman's Sez
What about working?
Does that do anything for the economy?
Libs don't seem to think it does.

How about that?
More and more the left wants us to think that there
is nothing wrong with people being out of work.

Our really cool PRESIDENT Obama's Jobs Expansion has already exceeded the
Bush job Expansion in private sector job creation.

Top Picks (Most Requested Statistics) : U.S. Bureau of Labor Statistics
Total Private Employment - CES0500000001

Bush Jobs Expansion

Jul --2003 --108,330

Jan --2008 --115,668

53 Months ----+7,338

Our really cool PRESIDENT Obama's Jobs Expansion

Feb --2010 --106,850

Dec --2013 --115,028

46 Months ----+8,178

Republican governors on the other hand don't think that teachers
and police deserve jobs.
Thus holding the economy back.

Top Picks (Most Requested Statistics) : U.S. Bureau of Labor Statistics
Government CES9000000001

Bush

Jan --2001 --20,835

Jan --2009 --22,583 +1,748

Obama

Jan --2009 --22,583

Dec --2013 --21;849 Minus 734

For Republicans, Lying is a way of life.

-------Bluecoller--the grumpy old kraut -----

Bush had unemployment in the 4-5% for most of his term, you libs don't seem to be able to grasp that bit of reality. There just weren't a lot of people to fill the job growth you're talking about. Now go sit down.

 

[Billy000]

I find it shocking none of you understand how capitalism works.

 

[Listening]

I find it shocking none of you understand how capitalism works.

What we find shocking is that you know how to use the bathroom (assuming you do).

 

[Billy000]

I find it shocking none of you understand how capitalism works.

What we find shocking is that you know how to use the bathroom (assuming you do).

 

[bluecoller-eddy]

Post #16
Antares
We have tried spending money,” said Morgenthau. “We are spending more
than we have ever spent before and it does not work. … I say after eight
years of this administration we have just as much unemployment as when
we started. … And an enormous debt to boot!”

Henry Morgenthau-FDR's Treasury Secretary

So much for your "It worked for FDR" bullshit.

6-10-2010
Independent Research

http://www.siena.edu/uploadedfiles/...nity_page/sri/independent_research/Presidents 2010 Rank by Category.pdf


A 2010 Siena poll of 238 Presidential scholars

---------------Overall---6. Handling ---13. Domestic ------18
---------------Rank------of U.S. -------Accomplishments ---Intelligence
-------------------------Economy -------------------------------------

F. Roosevelt ---1 ---------1 --------------3 ---------------10
Clinton -------13 ---------3 -------------10 ----------------9
Truman ---------9 ---------6 --------------7 ---------------17
Reagan --------18 --------21 -------------23 ---------------36
G.W. Bush -----39 --------42 -------------38 ---------------42
Harding -------41 --------39 -------------40 ---------------43

The red-state knuckle dragger's worship Harding.

238 Presidential scholars rate Harding as the third worst president,
and F. Roosevelt as the very best of 43 presidents.

238 Presidential scholars rate F.Roosevelt as the very best at Handling the
Economy,Harding as the fifth worst.

238 Presidential scholars rate Harding as the only president dumber than G.W. Bush.
But then the red-state knuckle dragger's worship stupidity.

Seems to be a difference of opinion?
Lets examine the evidence.
What is recorded in the United States of America's official budget records is-

Historical Tables | The White House

Table 1.1—Summary of Receipts, Outlays, and Surpluses or Deficits (-): 1789–2016

In 1916, the last peacetime year before WW 1
federal receipts were 761 million dollars and
federal spending was 713 million dollars.
We then had a rather expensive war and our spending went to 18,493
Million dollars in 1919. Wilson cut this to 6,358 Million in 1920.

In the next five years Harding and Coolidge reduced the war time spending to
2,942 million dollars. Four hundred and thirteen percent more than in pre-war 1916.
A 413% spending INCREASE in 9 years. --This is a republican cut!!

By 1925 revenues were reduced from there war time highs to 3,641 million dollars
A four hundred and seventy eight percent more than in pre-war 1916.
A 478% revenue INCREASE in 9 years. --This is a republican cut!!

Republicans are shameless liars.

What do presidential scholars see when they look at the F.D.R.s economy.

GDP 1958 prices ---page 224 ----F 1-5 --F 31
http://www2.census.gov/prod2/statcomp/documents/CT1970p1-07.pdf

GDP --1958 Dollars
1921 ---127.8
1929 ---203.6
8 years + 59.3%

1933 ---141.5
1941 ---263.7
8 years ----+86.3%


Brain-dead Reagan
2005 Dollars
1980 ___5,839.0 __
1988 ___7,613.9 __+30.4%

GDP grew very well in the 1920s. Probably due to a four fold increase in
government spending after 1916.

However the 86% increase in the gdp during F.D.R.s first 2 terms was the
fastest 8 year economic growth in American history.
--The fastest growth in 8 years.----------PERIOD ---END OF STORY. --

Almost Three times faster than brain-dead Reagans recovery!

Employment ---- page 126 D ---1--110
http://www2.census.gov/prod2/statcomp/documents/CT1970p1-05.pdf

Employment
1921 --26,618
1929 --35,666
8 years –+9,048 ------+34.0%

1933 --27,962
1941 --41,250
8 years --+13,288-----+47.5%

Brain-dead Reagan
Top Picks (Most Requested Statistics) : U.S. Bureau of Labor Statistics

Total Nonfarm Employment - CES0000000001

Jan 1981 ---91,031
Jan 1989 --107,133
8 years ----16,102 ---+17.7%

During F.D.R.s first 2 terms the economy grew by 13 million new jobs.
Four million MORE than during the roaring twenty's.
The 47.5% increase is the fastest 8 year job increase in American history.
The F.D.R.economy holds the record for fastest job growth. -END OF STORY.

Almost three times faster than Brain-dead Reagan's 17% increase.

This is why 238 presidential scholars say that F.D.R. was the BEST
president in the handling of the American economy.

F.D.R. Absolutely stomped the sh*t out of the all of the supply side economic records.
That's irrefutable HISTORY.

Of course Mr Morgenthau lied. As Treasury Secretary its hard to overlook
a record breaking 13 million jobs in 8 years. Thats why republicans love
him. republicans worship liars almost as much as they worship the maggot-
infested asses of their corporate masters.


For Republicans, Lying is a way of life.

-------Bluecoller--the grumpy old kraut -----

 

[Toddsterpatriot]

1) The benefits that the unemployed spend creates economic demand where there wouldn't be otherwise. For every tax dollar spent on these benefits, it creates $1.64 in economic stimulus (or 10 billion spent creates 16.7 billion in demand). Why? Because it creates a ripple effect in the market. Capitalism 101.

2) When the unemployed receive this insurance, they quickly spend ALL of it on basic essentials like food, clothing, and shelter. That is why it is so effective in creating jobs. Without this extra demand, more businesses are forced to lay their workers off.

3) Only 10,000 jobs are created every billion dollar TAX CUT. This is because the employed only spend HALF of their tax cuts. They have the luxury of saving some. All in all it does more harm than good: every dollar lost in revenue only creates .59 cents in growth.

4) This fiscal policy was a great success during the Great Depression.

This isn't Leftwing bull. We are talking basic economics. Demand side economic policies is the answer. Trickle down economics is a republican lie.

Why Extended Federal Unemployment Benefits Boost the Economy

CBO: extending unemployment benefits creates 19,000 jobs per billion dollar stimulus

When you look at how many jobs Obamacare has cost, how many billions more will we have to spend on unemployment benefits, just to recover them?

 

[Cecilie1200]

I find it shocking none of you understand how capitalism works.

What we find shocking is that you know how to use the bathroom (assuming you do).

I don't know that urination takes all that much know-how, but I do wonder how many times someone had to explain why the little handle doohickey makes the water disappear.

 

[bluecoller-eddy]

Post 193
Meister's Sez
Bush had unemployment in the 4-5% for most of his term, you libs don't seem
to be able to grasp that bit of reality. There just weren't a lot of people
to fill the job growth you're talking about. Now go sit down.

Top Picks (Most Requested Statistics) : U.S. Bureau of Labor Statistics
Total Private Employment - CES0500000001

Jan --2001 --111,634
Jan --2009 --110,981 --Minus 653

If you take away the government jobs, Ex-president murdering war-criminal lost
653,000 private sector jobs during his 8 years in office.The only president in
history to lose jobs over two full terms.

But according to your lie, he lost those jobs is because he put too
many people too work. That's a fun lie.


For Republicans, Lying is a way of life.

-------Bluecoller--the grumpy old kraut -----