Zone1 Christendom's Trinity - Where Did It Come From?

[Cougarbear]

Cougarbear:

I'm glad you asked.

When scripture at John 1:1, Clause #1 says: "In the beginning was the Word," it's talking about the beginning of creation. Scripture says Jesus (the Son) was the very first of Jehovah (the Father's) creations.

Since Jesus is a created being, he could not possibly be part of a trinity with Jehovah the Father? Why not? Because in the official definition of Christendom's Trinity, it says the Father, Son, and holy spirit are co-eternal.


Christendom's Trinity is defined as follows:
"There is but one living and true God, everlasting, without body, parts, or passions; of infinite power, wisdom, and goodness; the maker and preserver of all things both visible and indivisible. And in unity of this Godhead there be three persons, of ONE substance, power, and ETERNITY; the Father, the Son, and the Holy Ghost."

Article I: Of faith in the Holy Trinitymb-soft.com is registered with Pair Domains


Definition of eternal:
"without beginning or end; lasting forever; always existing ( temporal ):"

Dictionary.com | Meanings & Definitions of English Words

The world's leading online dictionary: English definitions, synonyms, word origins, example sentences, word games, and more. A trusted authority for 25+ years!

www.dictionary.com

An eternal person cannot have a beginning. John 1:1 at Clause #1 says Jesus had a beginning.


Alter2Ego

Let's read the verse again. "In the beginning of creation of the universe and earth was the Word. The Word was WITH GOD."
Stop there. Unless the Word and this God are the same personage, these are two separate beings, The Word and The God. So, is The Word or the God, Jehovah? Word or God, which one is Jehovah? Surely you can see this viewpoint? The last part of the sentence is stating the Word is also God. But, not the one the Word is with. So again, which of the two Gods is Jehovah? The one he is with or the one he is?

 

[Street Juice]

Although Trinity is the most important doctrine within most of Christendom's 41,000 denominations, Trinitarians ignore the following facts:



1. There are no scriptures in the Judeo-Christian Bible in support of the dogma of a 3-in-1 god, in which there are three persons (Father, Son, and Holy Ghost) that are co-equal and co-eternal.

2. Neither Jesus Christ nor his disciples of the 1st century AD promoted the teaching that there are three persons within a "godhead," all of whom are co-equal and co-eternal.

3. Trinity did not become official Christian teaching until the 4th century AD, some 300 years after Jesus Christ left the earthly scene and returned to heavenly life, and some 300 years after the last book of the Bible was written.


It would surprise some that there were trinity gods throughout the pagan world for centuries before the idea of a 3-in-1 god was adopted by Christendom. Below are four such examples:


A. In the 2nd century BCE (two centuries before Jesus Christ came to the earth), Egypt had a triad of gods consisting of (1) Horus, (2) Osiris, and (3) Isis.


B. In the 2nd century B.C.E., Babylon had a triad of gods consisting of (1) Ishtar, (2) Sin, and (3) Shamash.


C. In the 1st century C.E., Palmyra, which was an ancient city in Syria, had a triune god which consisted of (1) moon god, (2) Lord of Heavens, and (3) sun god.


D. Even the Hindus in India have their own trinity of gods, as follows: (1) Brahma, (2) Vishnu, and (3) Shiva.



QUESTIONS FOR DISCUSSION:

1. If the teaching of a Trinity god is essential to Christianity, how is it that the doctrine is nowhere to be found in scriptures within Jehovah's inspired word, the Judeo-Christian Bible?



2. If Jesus Christ is part of a trinity in which he has the same power (co-equal) and the same eternity (co-eternal) as Jehovah the Father, how is it that the scriptures repeatedly inform us that Jesus Christ is subservient to Almighty God Jehovah (indicating inequality) and why is it that scripture tells us over and over again that Jesus Christ is "begotten" (indicating he had a beginning)?



3. Why did it take two Roman Emperors/politicians, neither of whom were Christians, to enforce the official Trinity dogma some 300 years after Jesus Christ left the earthly scene?

I took some really good LDS one time and saw several dozen Gods.

 

[kjw47]

Let's read the verse again. "In the beginning of creation of the universe and earth was the Word. The Word was WITH GOD."
Stop there. Unless the Word and this God are the same personage, these are two separate beings, The Word and The God. So, is The Word or the God, Jehovah? Word or God, which one is Jehovah? Surely you can see this viewpoint? The last part of the sentence is stating the Word is also God. But, not the one the Word is with. So again, which of the two Gods is Jehovah? The one he is with or the one he is?

There is only one God= the one the Word was with=the Father=Jehovah. Small g god belongs in the last line at John 1:1-proven fact.

 

[Cougarbear]

There is only one God= the one the Word was with=the Father=Jehovah. Small g god belongs in the last line at John 1:1-proven fact.

You are proven wrong over and over by everyone.

 

[kjw47]

You are proven wrong over and over by everyone.

Its 100% fact--you best recheck. Only trinitarians say its a capitol G. They can't say otherwise it proves their religions false.

 

[Cougarbear]

Its 100% fact--you best recheck. Only trinitarians say its a capitol G. They can't say otherwise it proves their religions false.

LOL!!! You don't know God nor what he wants to be named as. Jesus said his name was also "I Am" in the New Testament and referring to when he told Moses his name is "I Am." You are unable to use cognitive reasoning. I'm dealing with either a 10 years old or a mentally challenged IQ of 70.

 

[kjw47]

LOL!!! You don't know God nor what he wants to be named as. Jesus said his name was also "I Am" in the New Testament and referring to when he told Moses his name is "I Am." You are unable to use cognitive reasoning. I'm dealing with either a 10 years old or a mentally challenged IQ of 70.

There is no i am that i am from Hebrew to English in Gods OT--I will be what i will be is correct.

 

[Cougarbear]

There is no i am that i am from Hebrew to English in Gods OT--I will be what i will be is correct.

There most certainly is.

 

[kjw47]

There most certainly is.

Only in error filled translations that mislead=100% fact--you better relook.

 

[Cougarbear]

Only in error filled translations that mislead=100% fact--you better relook.

No errors. I have the second witness of Jesus Christ. You don’t. I even have more! I’m arguing with idiot bible bashers who no matter what they do or know on earth will get them into their bizarre 144,000 glorified in heaven. They will be stuck in second place on earth no matter how good and what they do. Sad.

 

[kjw47]

No errors. I have the second witness of Jesus Christ. You don’t. I even have more! I’m arguing with idiot bible bashers who no matter what they do or know on earth will get them into their bizarre 144,000 glorified in heaven. They will be stuck in second place on earth no matter how good and what they do. Sad.

I want to stay on Earth. It will be a paradise, perfect health, not aging like now, peace always, etc. Smith is a phony.

 

[Alter2Ego]

LOL. The "Judeo-Christian Bible?" What the Holy Jehovan fuck is that?

NT God: Love your neighbors.
OT God: Genocide your neighbors.

Christian: Duh...Dem is the same God...cauz, you know...uh...that man on TV said so and that's why I'm stupid as a doorknob and easily manipulated and am literally helping Jews commit genocide. Because godsaid and stuff like that....duh....drool...

Jew: Teeheehee

Street Juice:

For your disgusting foul language, you are now being sent to my "Ignore" list where you will remain forever.

Now, get lost!


Alter2Ego

 

[Alter2Ego]

Let's read the verse again. "In the beginning of creation of the universe and earth was the Word. The Word was WITH GOD."
Stop there. Unless the Word and this God are the same personage, these are two separate beings, The Word and The God. So, is The Word or the God, Jehovah? Word or God, which one is Jehovah? Surely you can see this viewpoint? The last part of the sentence is stating the Word is also God. But, not the one the Word is with. So again, which of the two Gods is Jehovah? The one he is with or the one he is?

Cougarbear:

Nowhere in the Judeo-Christian Bible does it say "the beginning of creation of the universe."

Not only does John 1:1 (at Clause #1) state that the Word (Jesus, the Son) had a beginning, Clause #1 of John 1:1 says in no uncertain terms that creation began with Jesus aka the Word. In other words, Jesus was the beginning of creation. He was the first thing that Jehovah created.

"In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God."



Alter2Ego

 

[kjw47]

I took some really good LDS one time and saw several dozen Gods.

Satan showed you that. He rules you.

 

[Cougarbear]

I want to stay on Earth. It will be a paradise, perfect health, not aging like now, peace always, etc. Smith is a phony.

The phony is you. The 144,000 will have it 1,000 times better, won't they! See, you have already convinced yourself you aren't good enough for the 144,000. You are right that you will have those things and most likely a terrestrial glory as Paul wrote. But, you could have the Celestial and you shun it because your faith teaches you not to love yourself. Instead, to think of yourself not worthy of being in God's presence. Fortunately, the Father and Son came to restore true gospel knowledge, doctrines and ordinances through the mode always chosen, a prophet of God. That which you have stated your founders were not. You are the phony.

 

[Cougarbear]

Cougarbear:

Nowhere in the Judeo-Christian Bible does it say "the beginning of creation of the universe."

Not only does John 1:1 (at Clause #1) state that the Word (Jesus, the Son) had a beginning, Clause #1 of John 1:1 says in no uncertain terms that creation began with Jesus aka the Word. In other words, Jesus was the beginning of creation. He was the first thing that Jehovah created.

"In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God."



Alter2Ego

Jehovah is not the Father. Jehovah is the Son. God is the Father. You know that. the Word was with the Father. Hast to be. And, the Word was also God, the Son or the Son of God. Again, in the beginning of the universe from Genesis 1:1. "In the beginning, God (Father) created the heavens (universe) and the earth. We believe he had Jehovah and Michael do this with help from the rest of us spirit children. So yes, Jehovah organized the universe and thus was here before the universe was organized. But, Jehovah is not God the Father.

 

[kjw47]

The phony is you. The 144,000 will have it 1,000 times better, won't they! See, you have already convinced yourself you aren't good enough for the 144,000. You are right that you will have those things and most likely a terrestrial glory as Paul wrote. But, you could have the Celestial and you shun it because your faith teaches you not to love yourself. Instead, to think of yourself not worthy of being in God's presence. Fortunately, the Father and Son came to restore true gospel knowledge, doctrines and ordinances through the mode always chosen, a prophet of God. That which you have stated your founders were not. You are the phony.

Not 1 mortal knows what heaven is like.

 

[Cougarbear]

Not 1 mortal knows what heaven is like.

Paul did. It’s in the Bible too. That thing your church destroyed in 1960.

 

[Street Juice]

Paul did. It’s in the Bible too. That thing your church destroyed in 1960.

There are no magic books, dumdum

 

[Cougarbear]

There are no magic books, dumdum

So, you are God?