Climate Change Science Poised to Enter Nation's Classrooms

[JoeNormal]

Yeah, right.

Sorry, I didn't say it to rub your nose in it. I said it to rub thereisnospoon's nose in it. That's just what design engineers with 20+ years experience like me earn. If that's where you want to be, why don't you man up like a good conservative and do what it takes to get there.

If you were who you claim to be you wouldn't have the time or the inclination to waste time posting here. I hang out here because I am retired. Most of the educated types here are likewise retired. Thta's why we have the time to screw around here. When I was working...and making more than you claim BTW, I would never have spent a minute on this site. I simply never had the time to burn.

I use this as creative distraction. It helps me to put my mind on something else for a short while so when I come back to a problem, I see it in a new light.

 

[bripat9643]

New national science standards that make the teaching of global warming part of the public school curriculum are slated to be released this month, potentially ending an era in which climate skepticism has been allowed to seep into the nation's classrooms.

The Next Generation Science Standards were developed by the National Research Council, the National Science Teachers Association, the American Association for the Advancement of Science, the nonprofit Achieve and more than two dozen states. The latest draft recommends that educators teach the evidence for man-made climate change starting as early as elementary school and incorporate it into all science classes, ranging from earth science to chemistry. By eighth grade, students should understand that "human activities, such as the release of greenhouse gases from burning fossil fuels, are major factors in the current rise in Earth’s mean surface temperature (global warming)," the standards say.

Climate Change Science Poised to Enter Nation's Classrooms | InsideClimate News

Yes...yes...We know. Science Bad.

No, only chicanery posing as science is bad.

 

[S.J.]

Sorry, I didn't say it to rub your nose in it. I said it to rub thereisnospoon's nose in it. That's just what design engineers with 20+ years experience like me earn. If that's where you want to be, why don't you man up like a good conservative and do what it takes to get there.

Prove it.

Would it give me credibility in your eyes? Probably not. You'd probably prefer to ignore or deny the information because it doesn't match your preconceived notions.

In other words, you're lying.

 

[JoeNormal]

Prove it.

Would it give me credibility in your eyes? Probably not. You'd probably prefer to ignore or deny the information because it doesn't match your preconceived notions.

In other words, you're lying.

My specialty is audio signal processing. Why don't you ask me something that only someone like me would know?

 

[S.J.]

Would it give me credibility in your eyes? Probably not. You'd probably prefer to ignore or deny the information because it doesn't match your preconceived notions.

In other words, you're lying.

My specialty is audio signal processing. Why don't you ask me something that only someone like me would know?

So you can google it? Let's see a pay stub.

 

[JoeNormal]

In other words, you're lying.

My specialty is audio signal processing. Why don't you ask me something that only someone like me would know?

So you can google it? Let's see a pay stub.

Yeah, I'll get right on that.

 

[S.J.]

My specialty is audio signal processing. Why don't you ask me something that only someone like me would know?

So you can google it? Let's see a pay stub.

Yeah, I'll get right on that.

Then I guess you'll just have to shut up, huh?

 

[JoeNormal]

So you can google it? Let's see a pay stub.

Yeah, I'll get right on that.

Then I guess you'll just have to shut up, huh?

Does that witty banter usually work at the school yard where you hang out?

 

[Mustang]

Most scientists believe that man effects climate change. The naysayers say no. These are usually the same individuals who believe that not only is Sarah Palin not as dumb as a box of hammers, but that she's a highly intelligent, articulate woman. I think I'll defer to the scientists.

Report: 97 percent of scientists say man-made climate change is real

You can engineer the results of a survey if you are selective in who you survey. If I wanted a study to conclude that 75% of citizens think Obama is the anti-christ, I would ask 3 Christians and 1 atheist the question.

Is what you just wrote an example of your knowledge of statistical analysis?

 

[S.J.]

Yeah, I'll get right on that.

Then I guess you'll just have to shut up, huh?

Does that witty banter usually work at the school yard where you hang out?

Put up or shut up.

 

[thereisnospoon]

S.J. -

I don't see the point in comparing the US with Zimbabwe, Fiji or Guam - hence I generally use other western countries as a basis for comparison.

This doesn't exempt other countries from responsibility - it just means that I think they belong in a different category. China and India pollute terribly, obviously, but their situation is quite different to the EU and US. That isn't 'deception', it's just common sense.

No, it is you on mission to punish the US with this climate change crap that if those in support get their way, will crush our economy.
Not one single shred of scientific data has been produced that, for example, carbon taxes, the Kyoto Protocol and other schemes have reduced pollution.

A favorite axe for conservatives to grind says that the more you tax something, the less of it you'll get. Not so?

Taxation for punishment is unacceptable. And this whole climate thing is taxation for punishment.

 

[thereisnospoon]

Find a more trustworthy source that refutes it then. Oh wait, that would be an appeal to authority wouldn't it. Come to think of it, any information that you might want to use to prove pretty much anything would come down to an appeal to authority. I guess you're pretty much condemned to be an ignorant twit then, aren't you.

We do not prove negatives around here. Clearly you libs look to this tactic so that you may for your own convenience post at will things that are opinion presented as fact. Your next response is "prove me wrong"....Uh uh....That's not how it's done.

Proving negatives? No, stating something different than the Wiki link stated in a more authoritative way... Gawd, do you conservatives properly understand anything?

Wiki? Who the fuck mentioned wiki?
Look, on this forum, if you make a claim, you back it up with facts. Period.
In a court of law, the prosecution, the party making the accusation, has the burden of prof the defendant committed the offense.
You don't get to come on here, make a drive by statement then demand others prove you wrong.
Now, if that's unacceptable to you, you'll just have to be upset.

 

[thereisnospoon]

Global Warming! HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA!!!!

Lefties will buy ANYHTING!!!!

People also used to laugh at the notion of the existence of microorganisms and the belief that those very same seemingly invisible microscopic life forms could be the cause of diseases. They also scoffed at the concept that washing hands could cut down on the transmission of diseases both within a hospital setting (like an operating room) and in everyday life.

Today, we can't even imagine a world in which those ideas aren't anything other than universally accepted fact.

Deflection...

 

[thereisnospoon]

Wow, way to incorectly site a logical falacy. Maybe this is why you're so consistently misinformed. You think it's against the rules to listen to the authorities on any subject.

Here's a little guide to 'argument from authority'.

Argument from authority - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

You're an even bigger moron. There is no such thing as a "valid authority" in terms of logic. If you insist that something is true because some expert says it's true, all you've done is prove you are immune to logic. What you and Saigon refuse to acknowledge is that authorities are often wrong. They aren't infallible. Until you can find an omniscient being to answer your questions, the appeal to authority will always be a fallacy.

It's clear that one reason liberal turds have fallen for the AGW scam is that they are incapable of rational thought.

I find it hilarious that you quote an authority to prove that the appeal to authority is a valid argument. Your wiki article is wrong and the guy who wrote it is a moron. There is no such thing as a valid appeal to authority.

Find a more trustworthy source that refutes it then. Oh wait, that would be an appeal to authority wouldn't it. Come to think of it, any information that you might want to use to prove pretty much anything would come down to an appeal to authority. I guess you're pretty much condemned to be an ignorant twit then, aren't you.

We don't prove negatives here.

 

[thereisnospoon]

Not one single shred of scientific data has been produced that, for example, carbon taxes, the Kyoto Protocol and other schemes have reduced pollution.

Oh, on the contrary - there is no doubt at all that every country who has put their mind to it has reduced emissions significantly - and people have benefitted hugely from this.

Better insulation, lights on automatic timers, dimmer switches, better lightbulbs...companies and people have saved millions bu using new technologies.

It is just that not every country that signed up to Kyoto has made the effort to stick to it.

Then show the data. Until such time, your statement is merely conjecture on your part.
I will point out to you one very obvious fail in your argument.
If you are citing CFL's, these things cost 5 times as much and do not last any longer than an incandescent light bulb. Not only that, they contain mercury. They must be disposed of in a specific manner according to EPA regulations. If a CFL breaks, by law the homeowner must contact local authorities to dispatch a HAZMAT team to effect the clean up.
The manufacturing process of CFL's uses much more energy than that of Incandescent.
The bottom line is CFL's were forced upon us by government because a certain company was paid huge sums of taxpayer dollars to engineer and design the bulbs. Lots of people with ties to powerful politicians stand to make a whole bunch of money off new federal regulations.
Once one peels back the layers of the political onion, there are dollars in the core.

 

[thereisnospoon]

I've taken college level philosophy courses that have touched on epistemology. Here's a book that puts it in a convenient format.

Knowing How to Know: A Practical Philosophy in the Sufi Tradition - Idries Shah - Google Books

College level philosophy? I hope you paid for that out of your own pocket.
I cannot think of any business who's hiring manager would say "Oh look, this guy studied college level philosophy. By God we MUST hire this guy!!!!!"....

Yes, it was out of my own pocket. I'm sure it must come as a surprise to you but employers often seek people who aren't uneducated dumb shits. As evidence, I make six figures.

"I make six figures."...No you don't. People of such incomes do not waste their time communicating with the great unwashed masses.
For a moment, let us stipulate you did indeed take these courses.
Now, here is a typical liberal. Your elitism is evident. You just made a blanket statement, a generalization, that all who do not seek higher education are "dumb shits"..
Well, you may be book smart, but you aren't intelligent.
Only a dumb shit would make such an arrogant and pompous claim.
In my travels I have met college grads who are terrific book smart people who are so lacking in common sense that they could not think there way out of a wet paper bag if you spotted them the open end.
So please, spare me the " I make six figures" nonsense. Because anyone on an an internet forum can be anything they wish.
Now, you want to come back at me with more insults. Because I will stop at nothing. I don't give a shot about the forum rules.
You want a discussion? Fine. If you want to take this to the gutter, let's dance. Your call.
This is a test of your self proclaimed level of education. Be careful.

 

[JoeNormal]

College level philosophy? I hope you paid for that out of your own pocket.
I cannot think of any business who's hiring manager would say "Oh look, this guy studied college level philosophy. By God we MUST hire this guy!!!!!"....

Yes, it was out of my own pocket. I'm sure it must come as a surprise to you but employers often seek people who aren't uneducated dumb shits. As evidence, I make six figures.

"I make six figures."...No you don't. People of such incomes do not waste their time communicating with the great unwashed masses.
For a moment, let us stipulate you did indeed take these courses.
Now, here is a typical liberal. Your elitism is evident. You just made a blanket statement, a generalization, that all who do not seek higher education are "dumb shits"..
Well, you may be book smart, but you aren't intelligent.
Only a dumb shit would make such an arrogant and pompous claim.
In my travels I have met college grads who are terrific book smart people who are so lacking in common sense that they could not think there way out of a wet paper bag if you spotted them the open end.
So please, spare me the " I make six figures" nonsense. Because anyone on an an internet forum can be anything they wish.
Now, you want to come back at me with more insults. Because I will stop at nothing. I don't give a shot about the forum rules.
You want a discussion? Fine. If you want to take this to the gutter, let's dance. Your call.
This is a test of your self proclaimed level of education. Be careful.

I'm here for two reasons. The first is that this forum provides something to get my mind off the design problem that I'm trying to solve and lets it percolate in the back of my mind for a while. I find that breaks like this help me see a fresh perspective when I return to the issue at hand and that gets me over the hump. Second, having been involved with other sites of this type, I just can't seem to resist the temptation to rattle the cages of the farthest right of the right wingers. I've found a childish level of obstinance - especially when it involves issues like global warming - and although it probably does nothing but elevate a few people's blood pressure, it's a good release for me.

P.S. I do realize that not everyone without a formal education is a dumb shit.

 

[ShaklesOfBigGov]

It sounds like you're saying that Mother Teresa and the guy down at the local used car lot are on the same ethical plane because they're both people.

Credentials exist for a reason. Once somebody goes through the considerable hell it takes to earn a PhD, the argument should be over that they'll make stupid mistakes in logic or fail to take into account the issues that average people consider themselves clever enough to consider. From that basis, the minutiae can be dismissed and a real discussion of the merits of particular research can begin. Cons generally don't want to do that though. They want to take every argument from ground zero and discuss stupid shit over and over until any deeper meaning is thoroughly lost.

You're an idiot. Your argument is called "the appeal to authority." It's a logical fallacy. Credentials don't constitute proof of anything, dipstick.

Credentials do not prove anything, but the opinions of people who have been well educated and have worked their entire lives in a field are much more likely to be accurate than the opinions of those who know next to nothing about the subject - like yourself for example.

The truth is there are scientists on BOTH sides of the argument that hold "credentials". The problem is when you have a controversial theory that's making long strides and efforts to try and become some form of scientific fact. Some of these Global Warming enthusiasts will size the O-Zone as one cause to the increase in temperatures, then present a small "window" of a timeline to skew results that benefit their case. One report boasted a "hole" the size of North America over Antarctica as proof of this increase in the earth's temperature. Yet there was never to be reported a decrease in the size of this southern ice mass, rather there was to be found an INCREASE in the formation of ice as the continent GREW in size.


Credited scientists even accused their colleagues of disregarding or simply ignoring, findings that were to go against their "predetermined" and formulated opinions that man-made Global Warming exists as the main culprit to any increases in the earth's temperatures.

Scientists who said climate change sceptics had been proved wrong accused of hiding truth by colleague | Mail Online

Yet when you take into account that public schools ARE funded by the government, an administration with an agenda towards spending BILLIONS in funding large "green" projects (many of which had later failed financially) behind a Global Warming conceptual theory, politicians like Al Gore who stands to profit BIG by spreading his beliefs through national presentations, one only has to ask themselves - Should we really be the least bit surprised?

It stands to reason, with a public school system that presently holds a statistical literacy record of 68% of students nationally testing at BELOW grade level, that we would have more important and "practical" things that we could be spending on...... for the sakes of those who will be graduating and needing to apply for a job.

High School State Cards (updated March 2012) | Alliance for Excellent Education

 

[Obamanation]

Global Warming! HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA!!!!

Lefties will buy ANYHTING!!!!

People also used to laugh at the notion of the existence of microorganisms and the belief that those very same seemingly invisible microscopic life forms could be the cause of diseases. They also scoffed at the concept that washing hands could cut down on the transmission of diseases both within a hospital setting (like an operating room) and in everyday life.

Today, we can't even imagine a world in which those ideas aren't anything other than universally accepted fact.

Yeah --- Scientists also thought the earth was flat... the earth was the center of the Universe, the Atom was the smallest particle in existence, even that rain followed the plow, Phlogiston was the stuff in stuff that makes it flamable, and that heavier objects fall faster than light ones....

basically science changes their "FACTS" every time they are proven to be wrong...

Science is always getting closer to being right --- but almost never really right...

Man controlled global warming is a HOAX!!!

 

[Obamanation]

Yes, it was out of my own pocket. I'm sure it must come as a surprise to you but employers often seek people who aren't uneducated dumb shits. As evidence, I make six figures.

"I make six figures."...No you don't. People of such incomes do not waste their time communicating with the great unwashed masses.
For a moment, let us stipulate you did indeed take these courses.
Now, here is a typical liberal. Your elitism is evident. You just made a blanket statement, a generalization, that all who do not seek higher education are "dumb shits"..
Well, you may be book smart, but you aren't intelligent.
Only a dumb shit would make such an arrogant and pompous claim.
In my travels I have met college grads who are terrific book smart people who are so lacking in common sense that they could not think there way out of a wet paper bag if you spotted them the open end.
So please, spare me the " I make six figures" nonsense. Because anyone on an an internet forum can be anything they wish.
Now, you want to come back at me with more insults. Because I will stop at nothing. I don't give a shot about the forum rules.
You want a discussion? Fine. If you want to take this to the gutter, let's dance. Your call.
This is a test of your self proclaimed level of education. Be careful.

I'm here for two reasons. The first is that this forum provides something to get my mind off the design problem that I'm trying to solve and lets it percolate in the back of my mind for a while. I find that breaks like this help me see a fresh perspective when I return to the issue at hand and that gets me over the hump. Second, having been involved with other sites of this type, I just can't seem to resist the temptation to rattle the cages of the farthest right of the right wingers. I've found a childish level of obstinance - especially when it involves issues like global warming - and although it probably does nothing but elevate a few people's blood pressure, it's a good release for me.

P.S. I do realize that not everyone without a formal education is a dumb shit.

So, you are claiming to be a logical (right-minded) liberal??? LMAO!!!!!

I think that's called an oxymoron...