DA Candidate: 'Holocaust' Exaggerated

[HopeandGlory]

Though I support israel as a agent of american power in the region, you have to admit they basically just took it based on rights from god.

No, I don't have to admit it at all, because it isn't true. In 1967, Israel was simultaneously attacked by 3 separate national forces. It struck back in self-defence and seriously embaressed its attackers. Simple.

 

[jillian]

No, I don't have to admit it at all, because it isn't true. In 1967, Israel was simultaneously attacked by 3 separate national forces. It struck back in self-defence and seriously embaressed its attackers. Simple.

Yeah...but he thinks it's a Vast Jewish Conspiracy.

 

[Said1]

No, I don't have to admit it at all, because it isn't true. In 1967, Israel was simultaneously attacked by 3 separate national forces. It struck back in self-defence and seriously embaressed its attackers. Simple.

You're talking about events, which of course did happen. However that doesn't negate their overall purpose for wanting the land, which does have biblical foundations.

 

[jillian]

You're talking about events, which of course did happen. However that doesn't negate their overall purpose for wanting the land, which does have biblical foundations.

Actually, that isn't quite right. Orthodox Jews actually don' believe in the establishment of a Jewish State until after the coming of the Messiah. The land was divvied up by the Brits and the U.N. After that, the Arabs swore to drive the Jews into the sea and the land was won in defensive battle. But Jews had always lived in Israel. The "overall purpose" for a Jewish State was so that no one could try to eradicate Jews as a race again. And that was pursued by Europe so they wouldn't have to take in the survivors.

I've always kind of wondered why many people who complain about the Jewish State have no such complaints about the fact that there are a whole slew of Arab countries.

 

[Said1]

Actually, that isn't quite right. Orthodox Jews actually don' believe in the establishment of a Jewish State until after the coming of the Messiah. The land was divvied up by the Brits and the U.N. After that, the Arabs swore to drive the Jews into the sea and the land was won in defensive battle. But Jews had always lived in Israel. The "overall purpose" for a Jewish State was so that no one could try to eradicate Jews as a race again. And that was pursued by Europe so they wouldn't have to take in the survivors.

Again. Events. Totally over looking the relevance of biblical foundations. Laterz.

 

[jillian]

Again. Events. Over looking the "point". Laterz.

I *got* your point. Wasn't that difficult to get.

And do we have a history? Just wondering....

 

[Said1]

Hahaaha. Back to work, yeah right. You're on hidden.

 

[jillian]

Hahaaha. Back to work, yeah right. You're on hidden.

And?

 

[Said1]

I *got* your point. Wasn't that difficult to get.

And do we have a history? Just wondering....

No you didn't "get" it.

 

[Said1]

And?

You funny. Get it?

 

[Said1]

Now, I actually have to go to work. Laterz.

 

[jillian]

You funny. Get it?

Whatever rocks ya.

 

[rtwngAvngr]

Actually, that isn't quite right. Orthodox Jews actually don' believe in the establishment of a Jewish State until after the coming of the Messiah. The land was divvied up by the Brits and the U.N. After that, the Arabs swore to drive the Jews into the sea and the land was won in defensive battle. But Jews had always lived in Israel. The "overall purpose" for a Jewish State was so that no one could try to eradicate Jews as a race again. And that was pursued by Europe so they wouldn't have to take in the survivors.

I've always kind of wondered why many people who complain about the Jewish State have no such complaints about the fact that there are a whole slew of Arab countries.

But their country was destroyed long ago.

Do we all get a raced based state or is that only for jews?

 

[dilloduck]

No, I don't have to admit it at all, because it isn't true. In 1967, Israel was simultaneously attacked by 3 separate national forces. It struck back in self-defence and seriously embaressed its attackers. Simple.

And after all these years the continue to seriously embarass thier neighbors. What the hell are they doing spying on the US btw?

 

[Deornwulf]

A few points I'd like to raise even though I've come to the table late.....

Hitler exterminated 12 million assorted individuals, 6 million of which were Jewish. The other half have almost always been forgotten by history.

Stalin beat out Hitler by more than 100%, being attributed with causing the deaths of more than 27 million by some scholars in his purges. The information is hard to document due to the secret nature of Communist governments.

The "countries" around Israel have little historical claim to the territory taken by Israel in the Arab-Israeli war since those countries only exist as drawn by the European powers after the fall of the Ottoman Empire. Some experts credit the actions taken by the European powers as the major cause of unrest in the Middle East.

 

[dilloduck]

A few points I'd like to raise even though I've come to the table late.....

Hitler exterminated 12 million assorted individuals, 6 million of which were Jewish. The other half have almost always been forgotten by history.

Stalin beat out Hitler by more than 100%, being attributed with causing the deaths of more than 27 million by some scholars in his purges. The information is hard to document due to the secret nature of Communist governments.

The "countries" around Israel have little historical claim to the territory taken by Israel in the Arab-Israeli war since those countries only exist as drawn by the European powers after the fall of the Ottoman Empire. Some experts credit the actions taken by the European powers as the major cause of unrest in the Middle East.

You cannot invalidate an individuals claim to land simply because European powers decided to change the name and boundries of the area. The entire area was made up---Including the borders on Israel.

 

[Gunny]

You cannot invalidate an individuals claim to land simply because European powers decided to change the name and boundries of the area. The entire area was made up---Including the borders on Israel.

Which individuals specifically would that be? The so-called Palestinians? They're in actuality Transjordan Arabs, and yes, back in the day, you could quite easily redefine borders by winning the war. The Ottoman Empire lost. The arbitrary states they drew on the map went out the window with the loss.

By your reasoning, just how far do you go back? The Euro-invasion of America? The Huns? The Franks? The Celts? Just curious as to where we draw the line at redefining the map based on the winner.

 

[dilloduck]

Which individuals specifically would that be? The so-called Palestinians? They're in actuality Transjordan Arabs, and yes, back in the day, you could quite easily redefine borders by winning the war. The Ottoman Empire lost. The arbitrary states they drew on the map went out the window with the loss.

By your reasoning, just how far do you go back? The Euro-invasion of America? The Huns? The Franks? The Celts? Just curious as to where we draw the line at redefining the map based on the winner.

With a stroke of a pen, the land that arabs lived on was given to Israel.
Israel did nothing do get it except lobby.

http://www.palestinefacts.org/pf_ww1_british_promises_arabs.php

 

[Gunny]

With a stroke of a pen, the land that arabs lived on was given to Israel.
Israel did nothing do get it except lobby.

http://www.palestinefacts.org/pf_ww1_british_promises_arabs.php

Ah, but the Jews DID do something simply by being Jews. Antisemitism in the West created Israel as much as anything else. No Western nation wanted an influx of Jewish Holocaust survivors/refugees on their doorsteps.

From what I have read, Roosevelt was aware of the death camps fully a year before even the first was liberated but kept it on the QT because he was afraid of the reaction by Americans if they thought they were fighting a war to save Jews.

While they may have been given the land, nobody defended it or them but them.

 

[dilloduck]

Ah, but the Jews DID do something simply by being Jews. Antisemitism in the West created Israel as much as anything else. No Western nation wanted an influx of Jewish Holocaust survivors/refugees on their doorsteps.

From what I have read, Roosevelt was aware of the death camps fully a year before even the first was liberated but kept it on the QT because he was afraid of the reaction by Americans if they thought they were fighting a war to save Jews.

While they may have been given the land, nobody defended it or them but them.

The Allies split up the "conquered territory" (some argue that it was promised to the Arabs for thier help against the Turks) and the United States has been footing the bill for decades. I don't think the Arabs really like the idea that the Jews got Palestine because no place else would take em. I can see why they are pissed but it's time they all got over it and we stopped funding anyone over there. It's a waste.