Do you have a problem with Tennessee's "curbs [for] trans treatment and drag for children"?

[Robz]

: Funding: JLT received a pilot research award for general psychiatry residents from The American Academy of Child & Adolescent Psychiatry, supported by Industry Sponsors (Arbor and Pfizer), an award from the National Institute of Mental Health (MH094612), and a fellowship from The Sorensen Foundation. ASK received a grant from Health Resources and Services Administration Bureau of Primary Health Care (U30CS22742). The sponsors of this research did not play any role in the study design, data collection and analysis, decision to publish, or preparation of the manuscript.)

More issues with the usts than that. It was an online, anonymous survey that offered cash prizes (raffle) for completion and asked nicely that people only complete it once.

Jack keeps going back to it for different claims.

I.e. He tried to use it to show low detransition rate... though to be included in the survey results the participant had to "currently identify as transgender". Detransitioners don't identify as transgender and would have been excluded from the results.

 

[Robz]

So all this is supposed to be "about the kids" right?

And yet the biggest cause of deaths for children is GUNS...about which you not only want to do nothing...you want MORE availability of guns

I don't know about the opinions of everyone here, but i suspect theyd all be in favor of laws against shooting kids or allowing kids to own a gun. Shrug.

 

[Lesh]

I don't know about the opinions of everyone here, but i suspect theyd all be in favor of laws against shooting kids or allowing kids to own a gun. Shrug.

We have an epidemic of guns...they re literally everywhere. More guns than people. And the biggest killer of children is GUNS

Other first world countries have far fewer guns and far fewer kids killed by guns. The same people who are flippin out over drag queens "because of the children" don't give a shit about the leading cause of death for those children

 

[Missouri_Mike]

Are you saying youth with gender dysphoria should be denied treatment?

Yes you fucking ghoul. If your idea of “treatment” is wheeling a teen girl into an operating room, chopping her tits off, cutting part of her arm out to make a fake cock and pumping her full of hormone drugs. Then your god damn right I’m denying that butchery and any of you sick fucks that promoted it need to be convicted of child mutilation and sent to prison.

 

[Missouri_Mike]

We have an epidemic of guns...they re literally everywhere. More guns than people. And the biggest killer of children is GUNS

Other first world countries have far fewer guns and far fewer kids killed by guns. The same people who are flippin out over drag queens "because of the children" don't give a shit about the leading cause of death for those children

So you’ll stop butchering children’s sex organs if we outlaw guns? You’re a fucking retard.

 

[Lesh]

Yes you fucking ghoul. If your idea of “treatment” is wheeling a teen girl into an operating room, chopping her tits off, cutting part of her arm out to make a fake cock and pumping her full of hormone drugs. Then your god damn right I’m denying that butchery and any of you sick fucks that promoted it need to be convicted of child mutilation and sent to prison.

But you don’t give a shit if that same girl is blown apart in a mask shooting event.

Oh wait… I forgot “thoughts and prayers”

 

[Missouri_Mike]

But you don’t give a shit if that same girl is blown apart in a mask shooting event.

Oh wait… I forgot “thoughts and prayers”

False equivalency you moron. It’s easy to not want either to happen but let’s face facts. You’re all for child mutilation and are searching for anything else to excuse your behavior. Chop those kids up because there’s shootings anyway is not a validation of your stance.

 

[HeyNorm]

Not all trans people opt for surgery because gender dysphoria exists on a scale. I'm not at all concerned about what that young lady does with her genitals, you are. I'm only concerned with whether or not she's happy with herself.

What part of the scale are you?

 

[Robz]

Because you're a bitch but the study showed significant improvement.

Pubertal Suppression for Transgender Youth and Risk of Suicidal Ideation

Retreat retreat retreat. Teens who are denied gender affirming care are being put at risk. That's what the science says. You can either be on the side of science or you can be on the side of ignorant morons. Straddling the fence just makes you an assclown.

And, as further evidence, here is a leading expert out of finland's largest gender clinic speaking on the "suicide myth":


"Mentally healthy young people who experience their gender in a way that differs from their biological body are not automatically suicidal."


Suicide was a very rare event in the material of young people who applied for gender identity studies over a ten-year period.


On the other hand, in a large Swedish registry study, suicide mortality was clearly increased among adults who received gender reassignment treatments.

 

[Seymour Flops]

Because you're a bitch but the study showed significant improvement.

Pubertal Suppression for Transgender Youth and Risk of Suicidal Ideation

Retreat retreat retreat. Teens who are denied gender affirming care are being put at risk. That's what the science says. You can either be on the side of science or you can be on the side of ignorant morons. Straddling the fence just makes you an assclown.

You really should learn to read all of what you post. From your own link:

RE: Pubertal Suppression for Transgender Youth and Risk of Suicidal Ideation​

January 2 2021
Patrick H Clarke
UNIVERSITY OF ADELAIDE
I am writing to express my concern that Pediatrics has named “Pubertal Suppression and Risk of Suicidal Ideation in Transgender Youth” by Turban et al. its Paper of the Year for 2020. The study’s conclusion that puberty blockers are beneficial is severely compromised by methodologic flaws. 1 To the best of my knowledge, Turban et al. failed to respond to the posted comments of their paper.
Turban et al.’s conclusions also contradict the recent extensive review of evidence by the UK High Court, which found puberty blockers to be an experimental treatment with significant risks.2 Contrary to Turban et al.’s recommendations to provide puberty blockers to any child or adolescent who wants it, the UK High Court ruled that young people can rarely consent to these treatments, requiring a case-by-case judicial review for any patients 16 and younger.
The following is a brief summary of the flaws in the Turban et al.’s study, which render their conclusions misleading:
1. The source study, the United States Transgender Survey 2015 (USTS), employed a non representative, biased convenience sample. The results from this survey are unreliable.3
2. Over 70% of the USTS respondents demonstrably did not know what puberty blockers were, claiming to have commenced treatment after age 18. Although Turban et al. attempted to control for this, a proper adjustment was not possible.
3. There was no control for underlying mental health. Since more stable individuals are more likely to be eligible for puberty suppression, one cannot discern mental health benefits or harms of puberty suppression without controlling for pre-treatment mental health.
4. Turban et al. ignored their own finding that a history of puberty suppression was associated with an increase in recent serious suicide attempts.

. . .

RE: Pubertal Suppression for Transgender Youth and Risk of Suicidal Ideation​

May 4 2020
I Cheng
TAITUNG CHRISTIAN HOSPITAL, TAIWAN
Dear editors and authors,
In response to the article “Pubertal Suppression for Transgender Youth and Risk of Suicidal Ideation”, I would like to thank the authors for exploring this topic. But I still have two questions about this article.
First, I have great concerns about the method of self reports which was used in this questionnaire. The answers might reflect the desire of the transgender social group rather than true psychological or physiological benefits. In this article, they asked “Have you ever wanted any of the health care listed below (including puberty blockers) for your gender identity or gender transition? Participants might be led to think “I would be happier and would not have the suicide ideation if I ever had the puberty blockers in my adolescence.” Therefore, the socially desirable option could be overreported (1). In addition, none of similar studies listed in this article has used the method of self reports, either.
We also noticed “Suicidality (past 12 mo): Attempt resulting in inpatient care” in Table 3 indicated 45.5% in the participants who had puberty blockers, while 22.8% in those who didn’t have such therapy. A higher odds ratio is noted; however, without significant difference (table 2). This might be attributed to the small sample size of the puberty blocker users (2, 3). Nevertheless, suicide attempts resulting in inpatient care would be an important indicator to know the true outcomes of puberty blockers. We would suggest a further investigation on this issue to clarify the outcome of puberty blockers rather than concluding based on “no significance”.

. . .

RE: Pubertal Suppression for Transgender Youth and Risk of Suicidal Ideation​

March 3 2020
Scott S. Field, MD
UAB SCHOOL OF MEDICINE, ADJUNCT FACULTY, DEPARTMENT OF PEDIATRICS
Given the controversy surrounding the practice of puberty suppression for gender dysphoric adolescents, the article by Turban et al.1 creates more confusion than clarity. The authors imply causal evidence for a reduction in suicidal ideation with transgender adolescents who received puberty suppression (PS), yet they fail to acknowledge the exceedingly high rates in both groups of suicide ideation (75% and 90%) and suicide attempts (42% and 51%). The cross-sectional design using online survey data is insufficient to validate the efficacy of such a life-altering therapy. Because the data was collected by survey, there is no way of knowing how many would-be participants in either group actually succumbed to suicide. The so-called “lifetime suicidal ideation” is misleading, since at the time of the survey, the PS treatment group was significantly (p=001) younger (mean age 21.7 years) than the “ever wanted” PS control group (mean age 23.4 years), and the total age range of survey participants was 18 to 36 years. With mean age of hormone treatment initiation being 15.7 years in the PS group and 22.5 in the control group (p<0.001), it is obvious that the follow-up time for both groups was far too brief to assess “lifetime suicidal ideation.” The control group was not appropriately matched to the treatment group by age at time of survey or by age when hormone therapy was begun. Since there were over 30 controls for each PS case, they could have been selectively trimmed to be better matched.
What is more disturbing is that the PS treated group actually had double (45.5% versus 22.8%) the rates of the control group for serious (resulting in inpatient care) suicide attempts in the year preceding the data collection (Table 3).1 Adolescents who identify as transgender along with other “sexual minorities” (including lesbian, gay, and bisexual youth) are increasing at extraordinary rates (doubled between 2009 and 2017), and these adolescents are almost four times more likely than their heterosexual peers to commit suicide.2 The same study found that over 35% of adolescent suicide attempts in 2017 came from sexual minorities, who comprised only 14% of the adolescent population. Gender dysphoric youth and their families need to know the truth about therapies offered – that real long-term safety and efficacy studies do not exist. Research surrounding PS, cross-sex hormones, and “gender-confirming surgery” that potentially render recipients sterile, physically altered, and sexually dysfunctional must adhere to the same high standards applied to less controversial conditions, and these therapies should be considered experimental until such studies have been done. The prevailing narrative that these interventions are necessary to prevent suicide is without reasonable evidence.

 

[Seymour Flops]

I guess our friend Curried Goats has decided to take the coward’s way out by running away from the thread. That after telling others that if they are tired of his childishness, they have lost the argument. I wanted to quote the post where he called a poster on here a little bitch, but when I searched on the word ”bitch” in his posts, I got too many hits to sort through.

That bitch sure projects a lot.

 

[Coyote]

Yes you fucking ghoul. If your idea of “treatment” is wheeling a teen girl into an operating room, chopping her tits off, cutting part of her arm out to make a fake cock and pumping her full of hormone drugs. Then your god damn right I’m denying that butchery and any of you sick fucks that promoted it need to be convicted of child mutilation and sent to prison.

I’ll reiterate what I said to another poster.


Surgery on minors is extremely rare and I don’t have an issue with opposing it under 18.

However…that surgery argument is a strawman. You are using it to deflect.

The real issue is banning the use of puberty blockers, hormones or counseling that affirms gender identity.

This is a group with high rates of suicide and attempted suicide. The recommended therapies (not including surgery) have been shown to significantly reduce rates of suicide ideation and attempts.

Now that you have succeeded in banning these therapies in many states, what do you propose replacing them with? Has anything else showed a similar rate of improvement?

 

[Seymour Flops]

I’ll reiterate what I said to another poster.


Surgery on minors is extremely rare and I don’t have an issue with opposing it under 18.

However…that surgery argument is a strawman. You are using it to deflect.

The real issue is banning the use of puberty blockers, hormones or counseling that affirms gender identity.

This is a group with high rates of suicide and attempted suicide. The recommended therapies (not including surgery) have been shown to significantly reduce rates of suicide ideation and attempts.

Now that you have succeeded in banning these therapies in many states, what do you propose replacing them with? Has anything else showed a similar rate of improvement?

If I may . . . we don't have to come up with a replacement for something so outlandish as providing artificial hormones to children in an attempt to cause them to resemble the gender that they supposedly want to be or believe that they are, or are told by adults that they must or might be. For us to even consider doing something like that to a child, we would need extremely strong, if not irrefutable evidence of a great benefit to compensate for the harm and potential harm.

We have no credible evidence at all. Those "rates of improvement" are a chimera, based on methodologically flawed studies funded by big pharma and pushed by the transgender treatment industry, and the woke media. We don't need a replacement to say we need to stop following that kind of pseudo-science.

There is a "replacement," if that's the right word which is this: Allow people do dress as they please and call people whatever they wish to be called. My least favorite thing to call someone would probably be "Comrade" given the mass murders committed by people who used that term, but if someone truly wanted to be called "Comrade Smith," I'd call them that.

Keep the needles, pills, and blades away from the kids. Let the parents choose whatever counselors, if any, they want for their children, but left on their own the kids would they will figure things out as they have these many millenia.

 

[Coyote]

And, as further evidence, here is a leading expert out of finland's largest gender clinic speaking on the "suicide myth":


"Mentally healthy young people who experience their gender in a way that differs from their biological body are not automatically suicidal."


Suicide was a very rare event in the material of young people who applied for gender identity studies over a ten-year period.


On the other hand, in a large Swedish registry study, suicide mortality was clearly increased among adults who received gender reassignment treatments.

Link?

 

[Coyote]

If I may . . . we don't have to come up with a replacement for something so outlandish as providing artificial hormones to children in an attempt to cause them to resemble the gender that they supposedly want to be or believe that they are, or are told by adults that they must or might be. For us to even consider doing something like that to a child, we would need extremely strong, if not irrefutable evidence of a great benefit to compensate for the harm and potential harm.

If you are going to claim “harm”, then you need actual data showing that, not personal testimonials.

If the harm is minimal then any benefit is that much more important.

We have no credible evidence at all. Those "rates of improvement" are a chimera, based on methodologically flawed studies funded by big pharma and pushed by the transgender treatment industry, and the woke media. We don't need a replacement to say we need to stop following that kind of pseudo-science.

Really now? You’ve examined those studies? Here are some.

Better mental health found among transgender people who started hormones as teens

Transgender adults who started gender-affirming hormone therapy as teens had better mental health than those who waited until adulthood or wanted the treatment but never received it, a Stanford-led study found.

med.stanford.edu

This one analyzes numerous studies looking at risks of hormone treatment:

The effects of gender-affirming hormone therapy on cardiovascular and skeletal health: A literature review

Approximately 1.5 million people in the United States currently identify as transgender. The use of gender affirming hormone therapy is integral to routine clinical care of transgender individuals, yet our understanding of the effects of this therapy ...

www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov

This one looks at 56 studies and analyzes the results:

• Of 56 peer-reviewed studies, 52 (93 percent) found that gender transition improves the overall well-being of transgender people. The other 7 percent reported mixed or null findings. None of the reviewed studies showed that gender transition harms well-being.

There is a "replacement," if that's the right word which is this: Allow people do dress as they please and call people whatever they wish to be called. My least favorite thing to call someone would probably be "Comrade" given the mass murders committed by people who used that term, but if someone truly wanted to be called "Comrade Smith," I'd call them that.

That is usually the first option, along with counseling…”social transitioning”, and I agree with it. If this is just a fad, it won’t last. Unfortunately, doing so is illegal in certain states.

Keep the needles, pills, and blades away from the kids. Let the parents choose whatever counselors, if any, they want for their children, but left on their own the kids would they will figure things out as they have these many millenia.

Let the parents, in consultation with their doctor and child figure out the best of action. That is how it should be.

Left too long figure “figure things out” might mean those who can’t end up suicides.

 

[Jessica-stormlover]

We have an epidemic of guns...they re literally everywhere. More guns than people. And the biggest killer of children is GUNS

Other first world countries have far fewer guns and far fewer kids killed by guns. The same people who are flippin out over drag queens "because of the children" don't give a shit about the leading cause of death for those children

And this isn't even getting into the reality that trans kids and people that don't do the hormones or tranistion is far deadier then not by far. But yet, again these people don't give a shit! They love it when kids are shot up and don't get the treatment they need. They believe that these kids need to die.

 

[Jessica-stormlover]

And this isn't even getting into the reality that trans kids and people that don't do the hormones or tranistion is far deadier then not by far. But yet, again these people don't give a shit! They love it when kids are shot up and don't get the treatment they need. They believe that these kids need to die.

These people that are so concern have zero evidence for anything they say or do. It is the same impulse that drives the islamic state or the taliban....Somehow, we need to live in the stone age and to hell with the suffering as we don't want to piss off the sky god.

 

[HeyNorm]

And this isn't even getting into the reality that trans kids and people that don't do the hormones or tranistion is far deadier then not by far. But yet, again these people don't give a shit! They love it when kids are shot up and don't get the treatment they need. They believe that these kids need to die.

There is no such thing as a trans kid. It’s a fairy tale.

But you like them fairy tales. Ammi right?

 

[HeyNorm]

These people that are so concern have zero evidence for anything they say or do. It is the same impulse that drives the islamic state or the taliban....Somehow, we need to live in the stone age and to hell with the suffering as we don't want to piss off the sky god.

Do you have any physical evidence that someone born with a penis is not male?

Didn’t think so. But claiming such make you think you are the “sky god”.

I’m right again, ain’t I?

 

[lennypartiv]

So all this is supposed to be "about the kids" right?
And yet the biggest cause of deaths for children is GUNS...about which you not only want to do nothing...you want MORE availability of guns

Those shootings are the price we pay for living in a free country.