Dr. Hand Of The Invisible Free Market

[skews13]

 

[ChrisL]

As far as the healthcare debacle is concerned, I think there are some things that should be kept with Obamacare, but other things should not. Not to mention, health insurance is not the real root cause of the outrageously expensive costs of healthcare here in America. Tackling the health insurance industry is like putting a band aid on a carotid artery that is bleeding out.

 

[gipper]

As far as the healthcare debacle is concerned, I think there are some things that should be kept with Obamacare, but other things should not. Not to mention, health insurance is not the real root cause of the outrageously expensive costs of healthcare here in America. Tackling the health insurance industry is like putting a band aid on a carotid artery that is bleeding out.

Yes the elephant in the room is cost, yet the criminal politicians ignore it. They are bought and paid for.

 

[Norman]

Obamacare is a complete disaster.

Everything I have heard about the new bill is also disastrous, but I don't have the details down.


It's terrible idea in general to have few people decide how the health care of 300 million people should work - while being excluded of the mess(law) themselves (WTF?).

I hope Trump comes up with his health account plan, that's at least better than the alternatives.

 

[Boss]

Cartoons have always been a good way to disseminate propaganda.

Point of intellectual order here... Forcing insurance carriers to cover pre-existing conditions renders their product no longer insurance. You can call it welfare but it's no longer insurance.

 

[ChrisL]

I never liked or agreed with the preexisting conditions rule. I mean, aren't those really the people who need insurance the most? They are going to go to see a doctor when they get sick, and if they can't afford the outrageous costs for their treatment, then the rest of us end up picking up the tab one way or another anyways.

 

[ChrisL]

There used to be a time when doctor's did have the freedom to set their own prices and would even see some patients for free, if they knew these patients lacked insurance or means to pay them. Now, the healthcare industry is just another for-profit industry. Kind of sad.

 

[jwoodie]

There is a difference between health care and health insurance. The former has been available to everyone in the U.S. for a long time (although you might have to spend your own money on it). The latter was a "fringe benefit" invented to circumvent wage controls during WW2. It has since grown into an income tax subsidized monster that has inflated health care costs to astronomical levels in the U.S.

These costs would come down dramatically if:

1. Health insurance was a voluntary and taxable employment benefit;

2. Restrictions on competition between insurance companies were lifted; and

3. Reasonable limits on malpractice awards were implemented.

Unfortunately, these reforms are opposed by those who wish to use the existing system as an instrument of "social justice" policy.

 

[Boss]

I never liked or agreed with the preexisting conditions rule. I mean, aren't those really the people who need insurance the most? They are going to go to see a doctor when they get sick, and if they can't afford the outrageous costs for their treatment, then the rest of us end up picking up the tab one way or another anyways.

You could say the same thing for any type of insurance. The person who's car is upside down in a ditch certainly needs car insurance. The person who's house is smoldering in ashes certainly needs fire insurance. Some have the foresight to buy insurance for these things and some don't. Those who have that foresight and act responsibly shouldn't have to pay extra to cover those who neglected to obtain insurance. That defeats the entire purpose of insurance.

Insurance is a safeguard against an event that may or may not happen. Once the event has happened, it's impossible to insure against it happening. It's no longer INSURANCE!

 

[Missouri_Mike]

Is it just me or is that about the dumbest cartoon ever created?

 

[Missouri_Mike]

Ignore my previous question. I looked them up. Absolutely the dumbest thing I've ever seen.

 

[ChrisL]

I never liked or agreed with the preexisting conditions rule. I mean, aren't those really the people who need insurance the most? They are going to go to see a doctor when they get sick, and if they can't afford the outrageous costs for their treatment, then the rest of us end up picking up the tab one way or another anyways.

You could say the same thing for any type of insurance. The person who's car is upside down in a ditch certainly needs car insurance. The person who's house is smoldering in ashes certainly needs fire insurance. Some have the foresight to buy insurance for these things and some don't. Those who have that foresight and act responsibly shouldn't have to pay extra to cover those who neglected to obtain insurance. That defeats the entire purpose of insurance.

Insurance is a safeguard against an event that may or may not happen. Once the event has happened, it's impossible to insure against it happening. It's no longer INSURANCE!

Okay, so it's no longer insurance. So what? Medical care is just too expensive for any middle class person to afford, and if you have to see a doctor regularly, it would be impossible, and we would have our OWN citizens dying from conditions that are VERY treatable. Is that what you want, because it costs you 2 dollars more per month?

 

[ChrisL]

I wonder where are all the people who are middle of the road in such matters? We have the dems taking it to one extreme and the reps taking it to the other extreme. I'm SICK of it. Let's use our common sense and logic and work together to solve problems and have a healthy and productive society of people! That just helps everyone and OUR country be a better place.

 

[occupied]

Is it just me or is that about the dumbest cartoon ever created?

Look at the liberal scum being ridiculed, that's one the 3 legs of the conservative humor triad along with racism and videos of people getting hurt. Anything can be conservative funny if there is some misery in there somewhere.

 

[Missouri_Mike]

Is it just me or is that about the dumbest cartoon ever created?

Look at the liberal scum being ridiculed, that's one the 3 legs of the conservative humor triad along with racism and videos of people getting hurt. Anything can be conservative funny if there is some misery in there somewhere.

WTF are you getting on about? That's the most left leaning shit I've seen and you're claiming its conservative? Are you what we used to call "special?"

 

[peach174]

Is it just me or is that about the dumbest cartoon ever created?

Look at the liberal scum being ridiculed, that's one the 3 legs of the conservative humor triad along with racism and videos of people getting hurt. Anything can be conservative funny if there is some misery in there somewhere.

WTF are you getting on about? That's the most left leaning shit I've seen and you're claiming its conservative? Are you what we used to call "special?"

Ah ha a light bulb moment!
You are finding out that the right is just as diversified as the left.

 

[Boss]

I never liked or agreed with the preexisting conditions rule. I mean, aren't those really the people who need insurance the most? They are going to go to see a doctor when they get sick, and if they can't afford the outrageous costs for their treatment, then the rest of us end up picking up the tab one way or another anyways.

You could say the same thing for any type of insurance. The person who's car is upside down in a ditch certainly needs car insurance. The person who's house is smoldering in ashes certainly needs fire insurance. Some have the foresight to buy insurance for these things and some don't. Those who have that foresight and act responsibly shouldn't have to pay extra to cover those who neglected to obtain insurance. That defeats the entire purpose of insurance.

Insurance is a safeguard against an event that may or may not happen. Once the event has happened, it's impossible to insure against it happening. It's no longer INSURANCE!

Okay, so it's no longer insurance. So what? Medical care is just too expensive for any middle class person to afford, and if you have to see a doctor regularly, it would be impossible, and we would have our OWN citizens dying from conditions that are VERY treatable. Is that what you want, because it costs you 2 dollars more per month?

Well it's more than $2 a month. You don't just nationalize shit because it's expensive! Let me tell you something, when you turn all your healthcare over to the government... people are going to die due to lack of care! Government providing it doesn't mean doctors are going to work for free! By removing it from the free market you will force rationing... there isn't another alternative. You're heading down a road where the government will decide if your life is worth living, if your illness is worth treating. When you get old, fuck you... you're not worth saving!

 

[ChrisL]

I never liked or agreed with the preexisting conditions rule. I mean, aren't those really the people who need insurance the most? They are going to go to see a doctor when they get sick, and if they can't afford the outrageous costs for their treatment, then the rest of us end up picking up the tab one way or another anyways.

You could say the same thing for any type of insurance. The person who's car is upside down in a ditch certainly needs car insurance. The person who's house is smoldering in ashes certainly needs fire insurance. Some have the foresight to buy insurance for these things and some don't. Those who have that foresight and act responsibly shouldn't have to pay extra to cover those who neglected to obtain insurance. That defeats the entire purpose of insurance.

Insurance is a safeguard against an event that may or may not happen. Once the event has happened, it's impossible to insure against it happening. It's no longer INSURANCE!

Okay, so it's no longer insurance. So what? Medical care is just too expensive for any middle class person to afford, and if you have to see a doctor regularly, it would be impossible, and we would have our OWN citizens dying from conditions that are VERY treatable. Is that what you want, because it costs you 2 dollars more per month?

Well it's more than $2 a month. You don't just nationalize shit because it's expensive! Let me tell you something, when you turn all your healthcare over to the government... people are going to die due to lack of care! Government providing it doesn't mean doctors are going to work for free! By removing it from the free market you will force rationing... there isn't another alternative. You're heading down a road where the government will decide if your life is worth living, if your illness is worth treating. When you get old, fuck you... you're not worth saving!

Well isn't that basically what you are telling people to do now? Do you realize how expensive it is to treat cancer and other diseases?

 

[ChrisL]

Healthcare is way more expensive here in the US than anywhere else in the world, and yet our healthcare system isn't even rated #1. Why is THAT, do you think?

Now, I know some of you are going to be angry and get mad and a throw a fit, but this is why. I don't know if single payer is the answer, although some argue that it is. I know there MUST be some other ways to fix it.

6 Reasons Healthcare Is So Expensive in the U.S.

1. Administrative Costs
The number one reason our healthcare costs are so high, says Harvard economist David Cutler, is that “the administrative costs of running our healthcare system are astronomical. About one quarter of healthcare cost is associated with administration, which is far higher than in any other country.”

One example Cutler brought up in a discussion on this topic with National Public Radio was the 1,300 billing clerks at Duke University Hospital, which has only 900 beds. Those billing specialists are needed to determine how to bill to meet the varying requirements of multiple insurers. Canada and other countries that have a single-payer system don’t require this level of staffing to administer healthcare.

2. Drug Costs
Another major difference in health costs between the U.S. and every other developed nation is the cost of drugs. The public definitely believes drug costs are unreasonable; now politicians are starting to believe that too. In most countries the government negotiates drug prices with the drug makers, but when Congress created Medicare Part D, it specifically denied Medicare the right to use its power to negotiate drug prices. The Veteran's Administration and Medicaid, which can negotiate drug prices, pay the lowest drug prices. The Congressional Budget Office has found that just by giving the low-income beneficiaries of Medicare Part D the same discount Medicaid recipients get, the federal government would save $116 billion over 10 years. Think of what the savings might be if all Medicare recipients could benefit from Medicaid-negotiated drug prices!

3. Defensive Medicine
Yet another big driver of the higher U.S. health insurance bill is the practice of defensive medicine. Doctors are afraid that they will get sued, so they order multiple tests even when they are certain they know what the diagnosis is. A Gallup survey estimated that $650 billion annually could be attributed to defensive medicine. Everyone pays the bill on this with higher insurance premiums, co-pays and out-of-pocket costs, as well as taxes that go toward paying for governmental healthcare programs.

4. Expensive Mix of Treatments
U.S. medical practitioners also tend to use a more expensive mix of treatments. When compared with other developed countries, for example, the U.S. uses three times as many mammograms, two-and-a-half times the number of MRIs and 31% more Caesarean sections. This results in more being spent on technology in more locations. Another key part of the mix is that more people in the U.S. are treated by specialists, whose fees are higher than primary-care doctors, when the same types of treatments are done at the primary-care level in other countries. Specialists command higher pay, which drives the costs up in the U.S. for everyone.

5. Wages and Work Rules
Wages and staffing drive costs up in healthcare. Specialists are commanding high reimbursements and the overutilization of specialists through the current process of referral decision-making drives health costs even higher. The National Commission on Physician Payment Reform was the first step in fixing the problem; based on its 2013 report, the commission adopted 12 recommendations for changes to get control over physician pay. Now it is working with Congress to find a way to implement some of these recommendations.

6. Branding
“There is no such thing as a legitimate price for anything in healthcare,” says George Halvorson, the former chairman of health maintenance organization Kaiser Permanente. “Prices are made up depending on who the payer is.”

Providers who can demand the highest prices are the ones that create a brand everyone wants. “In some markets the prestigious medical institutions can name their price,” says Andrea Cabarello, program director at Catalyst for Payment Reform, a nonprofit that works with large employers to get some control on health costs.



Read more: 6 Reasons Healthcare Is So Expensive in the U.S. | Investopedia 6 Reasons Healthcare Is So Expensive in the U.S.
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[occupied]

Is it just me or is that about the dumbest cartoon ever created?

Look at the liberal scum being ridiculed, that's one the 3 legs of the conservative humor triad along with racism and videos of people getting hurt. Anything can be conservative funny if there is some misery in there somewhere.

WTF are you getting on about? That's the most left leaning shit I've seen and you're claiming its conservative? Are you what we used to call "special?"

Conservatives tend to like comedy based on putting people down and laughing at pain. Why did you even take the time to comment on political satire? The memes you people crank out and spam on my facebook makes it clear that conservatives cannot correctly use satire. Many of you cannot even identify it.