Dunderheaded Leftist Myths about Capitalism

[K9Buck]

You have a fundamental misunderstanding of what is socialism.

Coming from you it doesn’t mean much.

A community pooling funds to hire people to fight fires, pick up garbage, arrest criminals, etc., does not make them "socialist". Socialism is a an idea that exists only on paper. There is no such thing as a socialist nation anywhere in the world, based on the textbook definition of socialism.

 

[Hellbilly]

You have a fundamental misunderstanding of what is socialism.

Coming from you it doesn’t mean much.

A community pooling funds to hire people to fight fires, pick up garbage, arrest criminals, etc., does not make them "socialist". Socialism is a an idea that exists only on paper. There is no such thing as a socialist nation anywhere in the world, based on the textbook definition of socialism.

Who said there was?

 

[K9Buck]

You have a fundamental misunderstanding of what is socialism.

Coming from you it doesn’t mean

You have a fundamental misunderstanding of what is socialism.

Coming from you it doesn’t mean much.

A community pooling funds to hire people to fight fires, pick up garbage, arrest criminals, etc., does not make them "socialist". Socialism is a an idea that exists only on paper. There is no such thing as a socialist nation anywhere in the world, based on the textbook definition of socialism.

Who said there was?

You're an atheist, right?

 

[Hellbilly]

You're an atheist, right?

Nope.

 

[Ringo]

Lenin, Stalin, Mussolini, Hitler, Mao, Castro, etc., etc., etc., also opposed capitalism. Lefttards never learn.

You have to be completely brainwashed to put Hitler or Mussolini on a par with the сommunists. In general, this is not surprising, given the giant system of lies in the аmerican media.

My statement is accurate. They all opposed free-market capitalism. If you can demonstrate that I am mistaken, I will retract my statement.

Then a cat and a crocodile are the same animal, because each has four legs. Right?
The belonging of society to capitalism-nazism (Nazism is a kind of capitalism, when monopolists and bankers, who are afraid of losing everything, give power to fascists/nazis, which establish an open dictatorship of the most reactionary part of the bourgeoisie) is determined by the attitude to private ownership of the means of production. Hitler and Mussolini were for private ownership of the means of production, the communists destroy it, if they are communists, of course, and not аmerican leftists.

 

[K9Buck]

Lenin, Stalin, Mussolini, Hitler, Mao, Castro, etc., etc., etc., also opposed capitalism. Lefttards never learn.

You have to be completely brainwashed to put Hitler or Mussolini on a par with the сommunists. In general, this is not surprising, given the giant system of lies in the аmerican media.

My statement is accurate. They all opposed free-market capitalism. If you can demonstrate that I am mistaken, I will retract my statement.

Then a cat and a crocodile are the same animal, because each has four legs. Right?
The belonging of society to capitalism-nazism (Nazism is a kind of capitalism, when monopolists and bankers, who are afraid of losing everything, give power to fascists/nazis, which establish an open dictatorship of the most reactionary part of the bourgeoisie) is determined by the attitude to private ownership of the means of production. Hitler and Mussolini were for private ownership of the means of production, the communists destroy it, if they are communists, of course, and not аmerican leftists.

You believe that private business owners put guys like Mussolini and Hitler into power?

 

[K9Buck]

You're an atheist, right?

Nope.

Do you believe in Jesus?

 

[Hellbilly]

Do you believe in Jesus?

I believe Jesus existed.

 

[Ringo]

You believe that private business owners put guys like Mussolini and Hitler into power?

Political opponents of the National Socialists, including those from the bourgeois camp, noted from the very beginning that the NSDAP coped with financial difficulties much easier than many other parties. Former German Chancellor Breuning, for example, repeatedly complained that, despite the huge material costs associated with frequent elections in the last years of the Weimar Republic, the Hitler movement constantly had the necessary funds.
This was all the more striking because the expenditures made by the Nazis were, on the whole, more significant than those carried out by other bourgeois parties. The Nazis were the first to create a private SA party army. This army was numerous, and the expenses for its maintenance were especially large, since it was largely supported by material handouts (free uniforms, compensation for missed working days, payment of travel cards, free beer, and sometimes lunches). According to some estimates, the expenses of the NSDAP for uniforms, weapons and other related payments amounted to from 70 to 90 million marks.
at the beginning of the 20s, the volume of financial receipts to the NSDAP cash register was such that it could not be explained only by Reichswehr and foreign handouts. In the business reports of the party for 1922, its property without current financial expenses was officially estimated at 22 million marks (22 thousand marks in gold). For a relatively small party, which was only a group of drinking buddies three years ago, this was a significant amount, especially considering that the party's business reports were usually adjusted to underestimate the actual value of the property. But this indicated that, in addition to the Reichswehr, the NSDAP had new rich patrons inside the country.

And indeed, by this time a stable group of industrialists had formed in Bavaria, who relied on the Hitler Party. The decisive role among them was played by the large Munich industrialist von Maffey, the owner of the "Electrochemische Werke AG" (Munich) Albert Pietsch and the rich Munich publisher Hugo Bruckmann. The most influential figure in this group was the chairman of the Bavarian Union of Industrialists, X. Aust. All of them regularly allocated funds for the NSDAP, and, as Aust admitted in 1924 in his testimony to the prosecutor in connection with the trial against Hitler, it was about large sums. The money of the Bavarian industrialists played an important role in the Nazi election campaign in 1924.
Even if the circle of financial patrons at that time was limited only to the mentioned group, there was every reason to assert that already at the first stage of its existence the NSDAP was closely connected with the industrialists of Bavaria, in which it then operated. However, the NSDAP's ties with industry were much broader.

Since 1922, the leadership of the Hitlerite Party has established contact with a number of influential representatives of the monopolistic elite throughout Germany. Around this time, the beginning of a close relationship between Hitler and the owner of the world-famous Berlin piano factory, Karl Bechstein, who became a kind of NSDAP emissary in Berlin business circles, dates back to this time. In the summer of 1922, the list of patrons of the National Socialist Party was replenished by the chairman of the Association of German Employers, a major Berlin industrialist von Borsig. Contacts between Hitler and von Borsig, established shortly after the speech of the NSDAP Fuhrer at the National Club in Berlin, develop into close cooperation. Von Borsig undertakes to raise funds among industrialists for the creation of NSDAP organizations in Northern Germany and Berlin. The large sum received as a result of this collection was transferred to Hitler's authorized Pener through the director of the Borzig factories, Litz.

At this time, one of the most influential magnates of the steel industry, Fritz Thyssen, began to show increasing interest in the NSDAP. In 1923, he sent 100 thousand gold marks through General Ludendorff, who was in close contact with the Hitler Party, to organize subversive activities against the Weimar Republic[19].

At the same time, the NSDAP and its allies are handed a large amount of money allocated by Stinnes through the banker Mina. It was this money that made it possible to organize the beer hall putsch of 1923, which was aimed at replacing the parliamentary regime with a fascist one .the Ludendorff dictatorship.

In 1926, the Nazis established contact with an influential group of Ruhr industrialists, and at the end of 1928-with the entrepreneurs of Nuremberg.

The sums that she received from industrialists were quite impressive. But that's not even the main thing. The main thing was that the capitalist circles immediately correctly assessed the class character of the program of the National Socialists. Neither the Bavarian manufacturers, nor Thyssen, nor Stinnes, nor Borsig were afraid of the "anti-capitalist" orientation of the National Socialist propaganda, nor the name "workers' party", nor the threats of the so-called radical National Socialists. The class instinct told the representatives of the bourgeoisie who they were really dealing with. And, as you know, they were not mistaken.

As the political and economic situation worsened, the circle of monopolies that came into direct contact with the Nazis was constantly expanding. Since 1927, the NSDAP has attracted the special attention of one of the leaders of the German monopoly capital, the general director and owner of the largest coal mining company "Gelsenkirchener Bergwerks A. G.", the creator of the German coal syndicate Emil Kirdorf. Kirdorf's support gives the National Socialist Party access to the highest spheres of German heavy industry. On his recommendation, Fritz Thyssen restores his ties with the Nazis. A series of reports for industrialists on the economic and socio-political views of the NSDAP, which Hitler began to speak with in 1926, is gathering an increasingly representative audience.

In the second half of 1930, Hitler repeatedly met with industrialists of the Ruhr region. The result of these meetings was significant new monetary contributions to the Nazi Party's cash register. As follows from the report of the local authorities related to this time, it was about two subsidies in the amount of 700 thousand and 400 thousand marks.

At the initiative of Kirdorf, at the end of 1930, the Rhenish-Westphalian Coal Syndicate decided to deduct 5 pf from each ton of coal sold by its member firms from January 1, 1931 in favor of the NSDAP. Some bourgeois researchers deny that this decision was made. At the same time, they refer to the assurances of Stinnes and the general director of the syndicate, Albert Janus, that there was no such decision, as well as to the statement of the production council of the North German Coal Industry Administration, fabricated by the British military administration, to which the functions of the coal syndicate were transferred after the defeat of Nazi Germany[28]. These statements are refuted by about 200 notarized statements of former members of the production councils of the enterprises of the Siemens concern.

It is characteristic, however, that even the most ardent defenders of German industrialists do not dare to assert that the Ruhr coal mining industry did not allocate subsidies to the National Socialists at all. Therefore, the dispute that they are trying to impose on this issue is ultimately reduced to the amount of the amount paid. If the enterprises of the Rhenish-Westphalian Coal Syndicate deducted 5 pf. from each ton of coal sold to the NSDAP, this amounted to about 6 million marks annually. Those who claim that there was no such decision, call a smaller amount.

In addition, from the funds of the Union of Entrepreneurs of North-West Germany, on the initiative of its general secretary Ludwig Grauert, the NSDAP several times issued subsidies in the amount of 200-300 thousand marks for the expansion of the newspaper "Nationalzeitung" and for the election campaign in 1932. [30] The example of the Union of Entrepreneurs of the North-West was soon followed by the Association of the Steel Industry of North-West Germany and the Union for the Protection of Joint Economic Interests in the Rhineland and Westphalia.

According to many researchers (including Hallgarten), the data cited by Heinrichsbauer is significantly understated, which is not surprising, given the role that he personally played in feeding the Nazi Party. Most likely, all the amounts he writes about were allocated not instead of deductions of 5 pf. from each ton sold, but along with them.....

I could continue for long time, but you probably still see capitalism as it was in the 18th century... But for much more than 100 years, capitalism has been primarily banks that make money from anything and own everything. The war was the most profitable, Judge for yourself, the German monopolists came out of the war with huge profits. And this is in a defeated, unconditionally capitulated country! Forget about John Adams and even Henry Ford, capitalism today is a soulless, greedy squid leading humanity to a dead end.

 

[Oddball]

Lenin, Stalin, Mussolini, Hitler, Mao, Castro, etc., etc., etc., also opposed capitalism. Lefttards never learn.

You have to be completely brainwashed to put Hitler or Mussolini on a par with the сommunists. In general, this is not surprising, given the giant system of lies in the аmerican media.

My statement is accurate. They all opposed free-market capitalism. If you can demonstrate that I am mistaken, I will retract my statement.

Then a cat and a crocodile are the same animal, because each has four legs. Right?
The belonging of society to capitalism-nazism (Nazism is a kind of capitalism, when monopolists and bankers, who are afraid of losing everything, give power to fascists/nazis, which establish an open dictatorship of the most reactionary part of the bourgeoisie) is determined by the attitude to private ownership of the means of production. Hitler and Mussolini were for private ownership of the means of production, the communists destroy it, if they are communists, of course, and not аmerican leftists.

Hitler and Mussolini were for private ownership of the means of production...

Hugo Junkers was unavailable for comment.

 

[Ringo]

Lenin, Stalin, Mussolini, Hitler, Mao, Castro, etc., etc., etc., also opposed capitalism. Lefttards never learn.

You have to be completely brainwashed to put Hitler or Mussolini on a par with the сommunists. In general, this is not surprising, given the giant system of lies in the аmerican media.

My statement is accurate. They all opposed free-market capitalism. If you can demonstrate that I am mistaken, I will retract my statement.

Then a cat and a crocodile are the same animal, because each has four legs. Right?
The belonging of society to capitalism-nazism (Nazism is a kind of capitalism, when monopolists and bankers, who are afraid of losing everything, give power to fascists/nazis, which establish an open dictatorship of the most reactionary part of the bourgeoisie) is determined by the attitude to private ownership of the means of production. Hitler and Mussolini were for private ownership of the means of production, the communists destroy it, if they are communists, of course, and not аmerican leftists.

Hitler and Mussolini were for private ownership of the means of production...

Hugo Junkers was unavailable for comment.

Until his last days, Hitler remembered, who brought him to power and whose pockets he filled with military orders. And Hugo Junkers was a little farmer. The German monopolists, the masters of the German economy, could have thrown many other capitalist owners under the bus for the sake of their profits. "You need planes, Adolf, to wage the wars we need and keep our workers in order - take the Junkers!"

 

[Oddball]

Lenin, Stalin, Mussolini, Hitler, Mao, Castro, etc., etc., etc., also opposed capitalism. Lefttards never learn.

You have to be completely brainwashed to put Hitler or Mussolini on a par with the сommunists. In general, this is not surprising, given the giant system of lies in the аmerican media.

My statement is accurate. They all opposed free-market capitalism. If you can demonstrate that I am mistaken, I will retract my statement.

Then a cat and a crocodile are the same animal, because each has four legs. Right?
The belonging of society to capitalism-nazism (Nazism is a kind of capitalism, when monopolists and bankers, who are afraid of losing everything, give power to fascists/nazis, which establish an open dictatorship of the most reactionary part of the bourgeoisie) is determined by the attitude to private ownership of the means of production. Hitler and Mussolini were for private ownership of the means of production, the communists destroy it, if they are communists, of course, and not аmerican leftists.

Hitler and Mussolini were for private ownership of the means of production...

Hugo Junkers was unavailable for comment.

Until his last days, Hitler remembered, who brought him to power and whose pockets he filled with military orders. And Hugo Junkers was a little farmer. The German monopolists, the masters of the German economy, could have thrown many other capitalist owners under the bus for the sake of their profits. "You need planes, Adolf, to wage the wars we need and keep our workers in order - take the Junkers!"

Doesn't matter, the result is the same...Nazi Germany was only "free market" under the threat of nationalization...Monopolies don't exist without onerous gubmint regulation, which prices competitors out of the market.

Economically speaking, the only real difference between Nazi Germany and Stalinist Russia is that Willy Messerschmitt got to hang a shingle with his name on outside his airplane factories, while Mikoyan and Gurevich didn't.

 

[Ringo]

Doesn't matter, the result is the same...only real difference between Nazi Germany and Stalinist Russia is that Willy Messerschmitt got to hang a shingle with his name on outside his airplane factories, while Mikoyan and Gurevich didn't.

This is what happens when people don't want to read and learn the facts....
After all, I wrote that the German monopolies EARNED in the war, even when the State was defeated. So in addition to the name on the planes, the German monopolists had billions in banks. Even those monopolists who produced Cyclone-B and other means of destruction.
So, even the jewish american monopolists, who could personally hate german manufacturers, still had business with them after the war, as if nothing had happened. Communists are scarier for them...
It's just a business.

 

[Oddball]

Doesn't matter, the result is the same...only real difference between Nazi Germany and Stalinist Russia is that Willy Messerschmitt got to hang a shingle with his name on outside his airplane factories, while Mikoyan and Gurevich didn't.

This is what happens when people don't want to read and learn the facts....
After all, I wrote that the German monopolies EARNED in the war, even when the State was defeated. So in addition to the name on the planes, the German monopolists had billions in banks. Even those monopolists who produced Cyclone-B and other means of destruction.
So, even the jewish american monopolists, who could personally hate german manufacturers, still had business with them after the war, as if nothing had happened.
It's just a business.

That's how fascism and communism have always worked, boobie....The corporatists make as much going down as they did on the way up....You're stating this as though it's some sort of big news flash.

 

[hadit]

We should raise their taxes. What could go wrong?

We would have more revenue for infrastructure, education, healthcare

Not nearly enough to make much difference. It's a pipe dream given the way Congress works because every new dollar in revenue would be met by at least $2.50 in new spending. But, hey, it'll make you feel good that you're sticking it to the rich guy. Then, of course, they'd have to extend it down into the middle class, which is where the wealth really is.

 

[Oddball]

We should raise their taxes. What could go wrong?

We would have more revenue for infrastructure, education, healthcare

Not nearly enough to make much difference. It's a pipe dream given the way Congress works because every new dollar in revenue would be met by at least $2.50 in new spending. But, hey, it'll make you feel good that you're sticking it to the rich guy. Then, of course, they'd have to extend it down into the middle class, which is where the wealth really is.

Those asswipes spend the loot faster than it comes in....All the unexpected windfall of tax revenue generated under both Reagan and Clinton got used as an excuse to expand State spending, in lieu of retiring debt.

 

[Dragonlady]

Tell us more about Trickle Down Uncle John….

the person that pays you has more money than you ...its a little more complicated than that but hopefully i simplified it enough for you .

Bzzzzzzzz!!! Wrong!!!!! Try again.

Tax breaks for millionaires gives them more money to invest and create more jobs. Eventually there will be so many jobs that companies won’t be able to fill them all and they will give be forced to give raises to workers to get them to work for them.

So the tax breaks to billionaires will “trickle down” to the workers. Wages for workers haven’t gone up since Reagan cut taxes for billionaires.

Every time Republicans cut taxes the economy crashes. When the economy crashes there is massive unemployment and low wage workers take whatever they can get. With three economic crashes in the past 40 years workers were just starting to see some modest wage increases when the pandemic and trumps tax cuts crash the economy yet again.

 

[Ringo]

That's how fascism and communism have always worked, boobie....

What the Hell you are talking about... Well, don't answer.

 

[Toddsterpatriot]

Wages for workers haven’t gone up since Reagan cut taxes for billionaires.

Link?

 

[Dragonlady]

We should raise their taxes. What could go wrong?

We would have more revenue for infrastructure, education, healthcare

Not nearly enough to make much difference. It's a pipe dream given the way Congress works because every new dollar in revenue would be met by at least $2.50 in new spending. But, hey, it'll make you feel good that you're sticking it to the rich guy. Then, of course, they'd have to extend it down into the middle class, which is where the wealth really is.

Nothing in your post is true.

Well the rest of the first world has been investing our tax revenues into education, infrastructure, and programs which benefit new businesses, low income families, and depressed economic areas, the United States of America has been investing all of their revenues into wars in foreign countries and tax cuts for billionaires.

One cannot help but notice that the moment you pulled out of Afghanistan, Republicans start started screaming about the dangers of China and how China must be militarily restrained immediately for the good of the world.

Republicans don’t want the government spending money on their people or on their country. They want billionaires to continue to receive 80% of the wealth of the nation until the middle class is completely strangled and subservient.