Equal Rights vs Social Equity

[iamwhatiseem]

Who decides who gets the ‘equity?’

 

[iamwhatiseem]

Equity:
No matter how well you do, you will never reach a potential higher than you are allowed.
No matter how poorly you do, we will take from those that do, and give it to you as a reward for not doing it.

 

[22lcidw]

Parent’s are a variable that can’t really be adjusted for, but other things can be helped to create more equality at the start line. For example economic situations, the effects of poor schools, lack of opportunities and safe places to learn and recreate in, etc. Free community college.

The Asians are laughing, especially the Chinese.

 

[Bootney Lee Farnsworth]

Government should only work to protect equal rights. Period.

 

[Coyote]

We will never have equal starting points. If your parents are smart and educated, you automatically have an advantage. How do you propose to make that equal?

You are right, you can’t completely equalize everything, but you can do some things.

 

[Leo123]

You are right, you can’t completely equalize everything, but you can do some things.

Name one.

 

[Coyote]

Free community college is hardly the equivalent of an ivy league education.

That wasn’t exactly where I was going. Community colleges are a good way to make up deficiencies, improve gpa and if your school doesn’t offer advanced placement courses, you could make up for that. That would be one way of equalizing part of the playing field.

Do you see a role for government in preventing parents from giving their children a "head start"? Should we outlaw inheritance, or gifting, from wealthy parents to their children?

Of course not.

 

[Coyote]

Name one.

Just did in another post.

Equal rights...hands down.
Social equity is just another term for socialism

It’s something to strive for though. The greater the gap between the wealthy and the poor, and the less people are able to see a way up, the more unstable we would be imo.

 

[Leo123]

Just did in another post.

It’s something to strive for though. The greater the gap between the wealthy and the poor, and the less people are able to see a way up, the more unstable we would be imo.

OK so, you wrote:

"Parent’s are a variable that can’t really be adjusted for, but other things can be helped to create more equality at the start line. For example economic situations, the effects of poor schools, lack of opportunities and safe places to learn and recreate in, etc. Free community college"

First of all 'equality at the starting line' will and can never exist. We are guaranteed only equality in the pursuit, not the outcome or the 'starting line.' It is not government's job to make everyone equal. If you want to personally help folks, have at it, just don't use my money for your schemes.

 

[Coyote]

OK so, you wrote:

"Parent’s are a variable that can’t really be adjusted for, but other things can be helped to create more equality at the start line. For example economic situations, the effects of poor schools, lack of opportunities and safe places to learn and recreate in, etc. Free community college"

First of all 'equality at the starting line' will and can never exist. We are guaranteed only equality in the pursuit, not the outcome or the 'starting line.' It is not government's job to make everyone equal. If you want to personally help folks, have at it, just don't use my money for your schemes.

It’s the government’s job to do what it can to equalize the start. Doesn’t mean it will happen, but the gaps can be reduced.

Hey, I don’t like having my money used to pay for peoples private religious schools either but I don’t have any choice.

 

[Couchpotato]

Free community college is hardly the equivalent of an ivy league education. Do you see a role for government in preventing parents from giving their children a "head start"? Should we outlaw inheritance, or gifting, from wealthy parents to their children?

In what world is that "fair"? Also why as an adult ever work harder than they had to, to make just what they needed to live if all I that would happen to everything they'd built up and earned over their lifetime gets stolen from their family and given to all the people who didnt work and sacrifice the way they did to do so? This is the key component all you socialist can never seem to grasp.

 

[Couchpotato]

It’s the government’s job to do what it can to equalize the start. Doesn’t mean it will happen, but the gaps can be reduced.

Hey, I don’t like having my money used to pay for peoples private religious schools either but I don’t have any choice.

No it isnt. The only way to do so is through tyranny.

 

[Coyote]

No it isnt. The only way to do so is through tyranny.

Not at all. It doesn’t take tyranny to improve schools, offer free community college, provide affordable health care and child care, create safer neighborhoods.

 

[Leo123]

It’s the government’s job to do what it can to equalize the start. Doesn’t mean it will happen, but the gaps can be reduced.

Hey, I don’t like having my money used to pay for peoples private religious schools either but I don’t have any choice.

'Equalize the start' and 'reducing gaps' seems pretty vague. I think the Devil's in the details there.

Federal funding is allocated per child. Private schools can equitably participate in these funds. Your money is taken either way. Would you not want a child going to a private school to receive the same Federal funding as a child going to a public school? Seems your notion of equality is somewhat skewed.

 

[Leo123]

Not at all. It doesn’t take tyranny to improve schools, offer free community college, provide affordable health care and child care, create safer neighborhoods.

All good notions however, Federal government will only cause chaos and prices to rise. We've been doing that already and it doesn't work. But, if you want to go that way, how about giving vouchers to parents to pay for the school of their choice? Schools will improve when parents start pulling money from them and they will become competitive.

 

[Couchpotato]

Not at all. It doesn’t take tyranny to improve schools, offer free community college, provide affordable health care and child care, create safer neighborhoods.

We spend over on average 12k a year on every grade school child in the US. That's number is likely higher as it doesnt account for children who go to private school and thus arent having public money spent on them (depending on your state). That equates to 652 billion dollars a year. That means every person in the US has to come up with 2k to put in the kitty to educated students just though highschool each year every year of their life. I used to live near Baltimore. That city spent 17k a year on each student, and the students were still terrible. Education starts and stops at home. It's cultural. You have to want to learn and do well in school. It has to be important to you, your family, and those around you. This isnt a spending issue it's a family and cultural one.

The same can be said of the other issues you list. Neighborhoods who have people who live in them who embrace and idolize criminal behavior will never be "safe". Certainly not if we continue to not put criminals in jail. But even if we reverse that course it wont solve the problem as this again isnt an issue where there's a lack of spending or lack of governmental influence. It's cultural. If you get respect or "cred" because you did something stupid and went to jail in the circles you run in...

And yes the things you are talking about like making sure everyone has the same "starting line" are only achieved through tyranny.

 

[Leo123]

We spend over on average 12k a year on every grade school child in the US. That's number is likely higher as it doesnt account for children who go to private school and thus arent having public money spent on them (depending on your state). That equates to 652 billion dollars a year. That means every person in the US has to come up with 2k to put in the kitty to educated students just though highschool each year every year of their life. I used to live near Baltimore. That city spent 17k a year on each student, and the students were still terrible. Education starts and stops at home. It's cultural. You have to want to learn and do well in school. It has to be important to you, your family, and those around you. This isnt a spending issue it's a family and cultural one.

The same can be said of the other issues you list. Neighborhoods who have people who live in them who embrace and idolize criminal behavior will never be "safe". Certainly not if we continue to not put criminals in jail. But even if we reverse that course it wont solve the problem as this again isnt an issue where there's a lack of spending or lack of governmental influence. It's cultural. If you get respect or "cred" because you did something stupid and went to jail in the circles you run in...

And yes the things you are talking about like making sure everyone has the same "starting line" are only achieved through tyranny.

If you have a child going to a private school, you are still paying a public school tax.

 

[Couchpotato]

If you have a child going to a private school, you are still paying a public school tax.

Trust me Im well aware. LOL. The school taxes that I have pay where I live are higher than the private school tuition I pay for my kid. Boggles the mind how the private school, can give a better education, have nicer facilities, pay the teachers better and do it at a lower cost....

 

[dblack]

We will never have equal starting points. If your parents are smart and educated, you automatically have an advantage. How do you propose to make that equal?

The only way to make things fair is to take kids from their parents at *birth and raise them in government schools.

* or before birth if Republicans have anything to say about it.

 

[dblack]

It’s the government’s job to do what it can to equalize the start.

Who says? I mean really. You're kinda just making that up.

Hey, I don’t like having my money used to pay for peoples private religious schools either but I don’t have any choice.

I don't actually mind my money going to help out people in need. I just don't like government making the call. It has unreliable motives and untrustworthy agents.