Fascism comes to America yet again

[justinacolmena]

And her crime?

Failure to "put out" in the military barracks.

 

[FA_Q2]

Far right movements spread around the world in the early 20th century. Americans have flirted with fascist ideology on and off, especially in the early 20th century--then in reaction to a strong progressive streak that dominated American culture. The opposition to democracy, nationalism, anti-immigrant demagoguery, the reliance on lies and propaganda, and authoritarianism are its most persistent features.

The conservative base in America has always had far right components to it, yet they were never able to dominate the US completely, not even in the 1930s before WW2. They were essentially fringe ideas for much of the period since WW2 to the point where they were basically ignored. For most of the past century, any far-right insurgency was almost always contained by the center-right element of the party. But not this time.

Once again we are witnesses to a rise of fascist far-right parties taking over in much of the world. Even though it was clearly the governing ideology of Trump himself, there were significant hurdles from the centrists that stopped his agenda. But those roadblocks were either systematically dismantled or eliminated through excommunication from the party. The near-absolute cover they gave him for his criminality, for his impeachable offenses, and for "the Big Lie" were signs that the party was weakening.

Now, the fascist wing has captured the Republican Party thoroughly. There is no accountability for the far-right members of the party, only those who might question their lies. The center-right Republican Party is now officially dead. It is just the fascists who are left.

God help us all.

It's been building since the Reagan Administration did away with the fairness doctrine which led to the rise of RW talk radio. For years, RW talk radio was like a group of underground fifth columnists which acted to subvert Democrats first and Republicans later on. The ginned up the anger in rural America to such an extent that even conservative leaders found themselves run out of office, even in a primary election.

For a few years, conservatives like Gingrich thought they could use talk radio, and they did just that. But they had unleashed a beast that they could no longer control by the time Obama was elected. I saw how badly conservatives reacted when Clinton was elected, but it paled in comparison to the reaction to the election of Obama,

Then a little over 10 years ago, three things happened in relatively quick succession. The Tea Party ascendancy in 2010, Trump's Birtherism charges in 2011, and Mitt Romney's defeat to Obama's reelection bid in 2012.

That's when the stage was set for what would come next even though nobody knew it at the time.

That's the ticket. Free speech, that is the problem.

And you can sit there with a straight face and claim it is the modern right that is authoritarian. It would be laughable if it was not so pathetic.

The left can be authoritarian and tribal: look at the legal system in Great Britain, for instance.

The 'woke' left is authoritarian in America but generally committed to Constitutional values, law, and order which the Trumpalists abhor.

... no.

The 'woke' left is certainly not committed to constitutional values. They openly hate free speech for starters. Woke ideology directly claims that the US is founded upon, steeped in and reliant upon deep evil. You really are going to claim that such a stance holds to constitutional values? That would necessitate doublethink. You cannot think something is both rooted in deep and unending evil yet hold to its values, they are mutually exclusive.

 

[StormAl]

Far right movements spread around the world in the early 20th century. Americans have flirted with fascist ideology on and off, especially in the early 20th century--then in reaction to a strong progressive streak that dominated American culture. The opposition to democracy, nationalism, anti-immigrant demagoguery, the reliance on lies and propaganda, and authoritarianism are its most persistent features.

The conservative base in America has always had far right components to it, yet they were never able to dominate the US completely, not even in the 1930s before WW2. They were essentially fringe ideas for much of the period since WW2 to the point where they were basically ignored. For most of the past century, any far-right insurgency was almost always contained by the center-right element of the party. But not this time.

Once again we are witnesses to a rise of fascist far-right parties taking over in much of the world. Even though it was clearly the governing ideology of Trump himself, there were significant hurdles from the centrists that stopped his agenda. But those roadblocks were either systematically dismantled or eliminated through excommunication from the party. The near-absolute cover they gave him for his criminality, for his impeachable offenses, and for "the Big Lie" were signs that the party was weakening.

Now, the fascist wing has captured the Republican Party thoroughly. There is no accountability for the far-right members of the party, only those who might question their lies. The center-right Republican Party is now officially dead. It is just the fascists who are left.

God help us all.

It's been building since the Reagan Administration did away with the fairness doctrine which led to the rise of RW talk radio. For years, RW talk radio was like a group of underground fifth columnists which acted to subvert Democrats first and Republicans later on. The ginned up the anger in rural America to such an extent that even conservative leaders found themselves run out of office, even in a primary election.

For a few years, conservatives like Gingrich thought they could use talk radio, and they did just that. But they had unleashed a beast that they could no longer control by the time Obama was elected. I saw how badly conservatives reacted when Clinton was elected, but it paled in comparison to the reaction to the election of Obama,

Then a little over 10 years ago, three things happened in relatively quick succession. The Tea Party ascendancy in 2010, Trump's Birtherism charges in 2011, and Mitt Romney's defeat to Obama's reelection bid in 2012.

That's when the stage was set for what would come next even though nobody knew it at the time.

That's the ticket. Free speech, that is the problem.

And you can sit there with a straight face and claim it is the modern right that is authoritarian. It would be laughable if it was not so pathetic.

The left can be authoritarian and tribal: look at the legal system in Great Britain, for instance.

The 'woke' left is authoritarian in America but generally committed to Constitutional values, law, and order which the Trumpalists abhor.

... no.

The 'woke' left is certainly not committed to constitutional values. They openly hate free speech for starters. Woke ideology directly claims that the US is founded upon, steeped in and reliant upon deep evil. You really are going to claim that such a stance holds to constitutional values? That would necessitate doublethink. You cannot think something is both rooted in deep and unending evil yet hold to its values, they are mutually exclusive.

... yes, the center and left are Constitution supporters, the Right is not.

... yes, the US was founded on systemic racism and sexism and ethnocentrism.

... the Democrats over the last fifty years have been trying to correct the idea is for US while male property holders only.

 

[K9Buck]

He is the Classic example of fascism: cult leader, melomaniac, amoral, and so forth.

You simply hate Trump and, therefore, Trump is a "fascist". You don't care about what fascism actually IS. For you, it's just a pejorative that you use to smear people that you despise. If you said Trump is an "asshole", many of us here might agree with you. But a fascist? No, he's not a fascist and is the OPPOSITE of what is a fascist. Clearly, you know nothing about fascism.

 

[K9Buck]

... yes, the center and left are Constitution supporters, the Right is not.

It's not the "right" that undermines the 2nd amendment. Yea, the left is real supportive of the constitution. LOL.

 

[StormAl]

K9Buck, please learn what all those terms mean.

You are so screwed up right now.

 

[FA_Q2]

Far right movements spread around the world in the early 20th century. Americans have flirted with fascist ideology on and off, especially in the early 20th century--then in reaction to a strong progressive streak that dominated American culture. The opposition to democracy, nationalism, anti-immigrant demagoguery, the reliance on lies and propaganda, and authoritarianism are its most persistent features.

The conservative base in America has always had far right components to it, yet they were never able to dominate the US completely, not even in the 1930s before WW2. They were essentially fringe ideas for much of the period since WW2 to the point where they were basically ignored. For most of the past century, any far-right insurgency was almost always contained by the center-right element of the party. But not this time.

Once again we are witnesses to a rise of fascist far-right parties taking over in much of the world. Even though it was clearly the governing ideology of Trump himself, there were significant hurdles from the centrists that stopped his agenda. But those roadblocks were either systematically dismantled or eliminated through excommunication from the party. The near-absolute cover they gave him for his criminality, for his impeachable offenses, and for "the Big Lie" were signs that the party was weakening.

Now, the fascist wing has captured the Republican Party thoroughly. There is no accountability for the far-right members of the party, only those who might question their lies. The center-right Republican Party is now officially dead. It is just the fascists who are left.

God help us all.

Three things:

1. Fascism is Left Wing,
2. You meant to pray to Beelzebub, and
3. Fuck off. Just fuck off

No, Fascism is always right wing.
Fascism was started in Ancient Rome, and it referred to the axe handles used as the badge of office by the lictors who were sort of like police. These axe handles are called fascia. Anyway, the oligarchs used the axe handle facia tied in bundles to represent strength in unity. And their unity was the military, aristocracy, and priesthood. Which is essentially the same as the right wing unity these days except the priesthood has been replaced by bankers and corporations.
Mussolini also was put into power by the right wing, wealthy elite.
Fascism has never referred to left wing, lower class, populists.

No, it's not. Right wing is NO government. ALL collectivist governments are LEFTIST.

Wrong.
Aristocracies are always right wing.
They are centralized.
The left wing has always been the decentralized populists.
The word "collectivist" has no meaning since it depend on who it being united collectively?
If it is the wealthy elite, then it is right wing.
If it is the poor majority of the workers, then it is left wing.

There can never be such as thing as "NO government", because if allowed to get their way, the wealthy elite always takes over and created a monarchy.
The only way to prevent a monarchy or any sort of dictatorship from taking over with a mercenary force, is a strong populist government that prevents it with collective force.

The Fabian socialists have been propagandizing this line of bullshit for over a 100 years.

The political spectrum isn't a circle, it's a straight line. Collectivism on one side, anarchy on the other.

That's it.

No, its not because something as complex as a political system cannot be boiled down to a left/right duopoly. There are right wing authoritarians and there are left wing authoritarians.

The grid is a much more accurate picture of politics pitting authoritarians/anarchists as opposites and left/right as opposites but still massively over simplified. The right certainly does not represent something closer to anarchy than the left.

View attachment 489035

Correct. A total lack of government is the true definition of far-right ideology. A "sovereign citizen" is an example of a far-right person.

False.

What you state means there is no right at all in this country and that the left and right we do have occupy the SAME SPOT on the political spectrum. Just like that silly ass image oddball put up, it places the left and right on the same point.

What does that model tell you then? Nothing at all. That is what happens when you distill a host of complex ideologies into a one dimensional spectrum. Considering that such ideologies cover a massive swath of life, not just governance but things like economics, it makes the model useless.

It is not useful as there is a massive differences in ideologies that would simply be nonexistent on something as simple as a line.

 

[StormAl]

FA_Q3 went in to the deep end.

He does not understand the terms.

 

[Oddball]

Far right movements spread around the world in the early 20th century. Americans have flirted with fascist ideology on and off, especially in the early 20th century--then in reaction to a strong progressive streak that dominated American culture. The opposition to democracy, nationalism, anti-immigrant demagoguery, the reliance on lies and propaganda, and authoritarianism are its most persistent features.

The conservative base in America has always had far right components to it, yet they were never able to dominate the US completely, not even in the 1930s before WW2. They were essentially fringe ideas for much of the period since WW2 to the point where they were basically ignored. For most of the past century, any far-right insurgency was almost always contained by the center-right element of the party. But not this time.

Once again we are witnesses to a rise of fascist far-right parties taking over in much of the world. Even though it was clearly the governing ideology of Trump himself, there were significant hurdles from the centrists that stopped his agenda. But those roadblocks were either systematically dismantled or eliminated through excommunication from the party. The near-absolute cover they gave him for his criminality, for his impeachable offenses, and for "the Big Lie" were signs that the party was weakening.

Now, the fascist wing has captured the Republican Party thoroughly. There is no accountability for the far-right members of the party, only those who might question their lies. The center-right Republican Party is now officially dead. It is just the fascists who are left.

God help us all.

Three things:

1. Fascism is Left Wing,
2. You meant to pray to Beelzebub, and
3. Fuck off. Just fuck off

No, Fascism is always right wing.
Fascism was started in Ancient Rome, and it referred to the axe handles used as the badge of office by the lictors who were sort of like police. These axe handles are called fascia. Anyway, the oligarchs used the axe handle facia tied in bundles to represent strength in unity. And their unity was the military, aristocracy, and priesthood. Which is essentially the same as the right wing unity these days except the priesthood has been replaced by bankers and corporations.
Mussolini also was put into power by the right wing, wealthy elite.
Fascism has never referred to left wing, lower class, populists.

No, it's not. Right wing is NO government. ALL collectivist governments are LEFTIST.

Wrong.
Aristocracies are always right wing.
They are centralized.
The left wing has always been the decentralized populists.
The word "collectivist" has no meaning since it depend on who it being united collectively?
If it is the wealthy elite, then it is right wing.
If it is the poor majority of the workers, then it is left wing.

There can never be such as thing as "NO government", because if allowed to get their way, the wealthy elite always takes over and created a monarchy.
The only way to prevent a monarchy or any sort of dictatorship from taking over with a mercenary force, is a strong populist government that prevents it with collective force.

The Fabian socialists have been propagandizing this line of bullshit for over a 100 years.

The political spectrum isn't a circle, it's a straight line. Collectivism on one side, anarchy on the other.

That's it.

No, its not because something as complex as a political system cannot be boiled down to a left/right duopoly. There are right wing authoritarians and there are left wing authoritarians.

The grid is a much more accurate picture of politics pitting authoritarians/anarchists as opposites and left/right as opposites but still massively over simplified. The right certainly does not represent something closer to anarchy than the left.

View attachment 489035

Correct. A total lack of government is the true definition of far-right ideology. A "sovereign citizen" is an example of a far-right person.

False.

What you state means there is no right at all in this country and that the left and right we do have occupy the SAME SPOT on the political spectrum. Just like that silly ass image oddball put up, it places the left and right on the same point.

What does that model tell you then? Nothing at all. That is what happens when you distill a host of complex ideologies into a one dimensional spectrum. Considering that such ideologies cover a massive swath of life, not just governance but things like economics, it makes the model useless.

It is not useful as there is a massive differences in ideologies that would simply be nonexistent on something as simple as a line.

No, far right is anarchy - the peaceful anarchy that Rand and Rothbart wrote extensively about, not the "anarchy" being carried out today by murderous commie lunatics....The far left is authoritarianism of all brands....

Trying to parse out whether fascism, communism, et al. are of any significant difference, is no more a cerebral exercise than contemplating the "differences" between Coke and Pepsi.

 

[westwall]

Far right movements spread around the world in the early 20th century. Americans have flirted with fascist ideology on and off, especially in the early 20th century--then in reaction to a strong progressive streak that dominated American culture. The opposition to democracy, nationalism, anti-immigrant demagoguery, the reliance on lies and propaganda, and authoritarianism are its most persistent features.

The conservative base in America has always had far right components to it, yet they were never able to dominate the US completely, not even in the 1930s before WW2. They were essentially fringe ideas for much of the period since WW2 to the point where they were basically ignored. For most of the past century, any far-right insurgency was almost always contained by the center-right element of the party. But not this time.

Once again we are witnesses to a rise of fascist far-right parties taking over in much of the world. Even though it was clearly the governing ideology of Trump himself, there were significant hurdles from the centrists that stopped his agenda. But those roadblocks were either systematically dismantled or eliminated through excommunication from the party. The near-absolute cover they gave him for his criminality, for his impeachable offenses, and for "the Big Lie" were signs that the party was weakening.

Now, the fascist wing has captured the Republican Party thoroughly. There is no accountability for the far-right members of the party, only those who might question their lies. The center-right Republican Party is now officially dead. It is just the fascists who are left.

God help us all.

Three things:

1. Fascism is Left Wing,
2. You meant to pray to Beelzebub, and
3. Fuck off. Just fuck off

No, Fascism is always right wing.
Fascism was started in Ancient Rome, and it referred to the axe handles used as the badge of office by the lictors who were sort of like police. These axe handles are called fascia. Anyway, the oligarchs used the axe handle facia tied in bundles to represent strength in unity. And their unity was the military, aristocracy, and priesthood. Which is essentially the same as the right wing unity these days except the priesthood has been replaced by bankers and corporations.
Mussolini also was put into power by the right wing, wealthy elite.
Fascism has never referred to left wing, lower class, populists.

No, it's not. Right wing is NO government. ALL collectivist governments are LEFTIST.

Wrong.
Aristocracies are always right wing.
They are centralized.
The left wing has always been the decentralized populists.
The word "collectivist" has no meaning since it depend on who it being united collectively?
If it is the wealthy elite, then it is right wing.
If it is the poor majority of the workers, then it is left wing.

There can never be such as thing as "NO government", because if allowed to get their way, the wealthy elite always takes over and created a monarchy.
The only way to prevent a monarchy or any sort of dictatorship from taking over with a mercenary force, is a strong populist government that prevents it with collective force.

The Fabian socialists have been propagandizing this line of bullshit for over a 100 years.

The political spectrum isn't a circle, it's a straight line. Collectivism on one side, anarchy on the other.

That's it.

No, its not because something as complex as a political system cannot be boiled down to a left/right duopoly. There are right wing authoritarians and there are left wing authoritarians.

The grid is a much more accurate picture of politics pitting authoritarians/anarchists as opposites and left/right as opposites but still massively over simplified. The right certainly does not represent something closer to anarchy than the left.

View attachment 489035

Correct. A total lack of government is the true definition of far-right ideology. A "sovereign citizen" is an example of a far-right person.

False.

What you state means there is no right at all in this country and that the left and right we do have occupy the SAME SPOT on the political spectrum. Just like that silly ass image oddball put up, it places the left and right on the same point.

What does that model tell you then? Nothing at all. That is what happens when you distill a host of complex ideologies into a one dimensional spectrum. Considering that such ideologies cover a massive swath of life, not just governance but things like economics, it makes the model useless.

It is not useful as there is a massive differences in ideologies that would simply be nonexistent on something as simple as a line.

No, far right is anarchy - the peaceful anarchy that Rand and Rothbart wrote extensively about, not the "anarchy" being carried out today by murderous commie lunatics....The far left is authoritarianism of all brands....

Trying to parse out whether fascism, communism, et al. are of any significant difference, is no more a cerebral exercise than contemplating the "differences" between Coke and cultists.

Yup. Mental masturbation at its finest.

 

[K9Buck]

What you state means there is no right at all in this country

The more government control one wants, the more to the left they are. The less government control one wants, the more to the right they are.

The far left, which includes guys like Hitler, Stalin, Mao, etc., all OPPOSED free-market capitalism in favor of an economic system managed by GOVERNMENT. NOBODY on the right supports such a concept. The closest thing we have to people who favor a government-managed economy would be someone like Bernie Sanders or AOC.

 

[FA_Q2]

Far right movements spread around the world in the early 20th century. Americans have flirted with fascist ideology on and off, especially in the early 20th century--then in reaction to a strong progressive streak that dominated American culture. The opposition to democracy, nationalism, anti-immigrant demagoguery, the reliance on lies and propaganda, and authoritarianism are its most persistent features.

The conservative base in America has always had far right components to it, yet they were never able to dominate the US completely, not even in the 1930s before WW2. They were essentially fringe ideas for much of the period since WW2 to the point where they were basically ignored. For most of the past century, any far-right insurgency was almost always contained by the center-right element of the party. But not this time.

Once again we are witnesses to a rise of fascist far-right parties taking over in much of the world. Even though it was clearly the governing ideology of Trump himself, there were significant hurdles from the centrists that stopped his agenda. But those roadblocks were either systematically dismantled or eliminated through excommunication from the party. The near-absolute cover they gave him for his criminality, for his impeachable offenses, and for "the Big Lie" were signs that the party was weakening.

Now, the fascist wing has captured the Republican Party thoroughly. There is no accountability for the far-right members of the party, only those who might question their lies. The center-right Republican Party is now officially dead. It is just the fascists who are left.

God help us all.

It's been building since the Reagan Administration did away with the fairness doctrine which led to the rise of RW talk radio. For years, RW talk radio was like a group of underground fifth columnists which acted to subvert Democrats first and Republicans later on. The ginned up the anger in rural America to such an extent that even conservative leaders found themselves run out of office, even in a primary election.

For a few years, conservatives like Gingrich thought they could use talk radio, and they did just that. But they had unleashed a beast that they could no longer control by the time Obama was elected. I saw how badly conservatives reacted when Clinton was elected, but it paled in comparison to the reaction to the election of Obama,

Then a little over 10 years ago, three things happened in relatively quick succession. The Tea Party ascendancy in 2010, Trump's Birtherism charges in 2011, and Mitt Romney's defeat to Obama's reelection bid in 2012.

That's when the stage was set for what would come next even though nobody knew it at the time.

That's the ticket. Free speech, that is the problem.

And you can sit there with a straight face and claim it is the modern right that is authoritarian. It would be laughable if it was not so pathetic.

The left can be authoritarian and tribal: look at the legal system in Great Britain, for instance.

The 'woke' left is authoritarian in America but generally committed to Constitutional values, law, and order which the Trumpalists abhor.

... no.

The 'woke' left is certainly not committed to constitutional values. They openly hate free speech for starters. Woke ideology directly claims that the US is founded upon, steeped in and reliant upon deep evil. You really are going to claim that such a stance holds to constitutional values? That would necessitate doublethink. You cannot think something is both rooted in deep and unending evil yet hold to its values, they are mutually exclusive.

... yes, the center and left are Constitution supporters, the Right is not.

Bullshit.

Stating it does not make it fact. I already pointed out that it is fundamentally impossible to both hold to the far left ideology AND the constitution. Again, freedom of speech is literally antithetical to woke ideology. 100 percent antithetical as is a host of other realities in our constitution.

... yes, the US was founded on systemic racism and sexism and ethnocentrism.

Uh huh.

... the Democrats over the last fifty years have been trying to correct the idea is for US while male property holders only.

Aside from the fact that I contend this is flatly not true, it is irrelevant to what we were discussing, the woke left.

 

[FA_Q2]

What you state means there is no right at all in this country

The more government control one wants, the more to the left they are. The less government control one wants, the more to the right they are.

The far left, which includes guys like Hitler, Stalin, Mao, etc., all OPPOSED free-market capitalism in favor of an economic system managed by GOVERNMENT. NOBODY on the right supports such a concept. The closest thing we have to people who favor a government-managed economy would be someone like Bernie Sanders or AOC.

So there is no right wing in this nation. Trump was thoroughly left wing.

 

[FA_Q2]

Far right movements spread around the world in the early 20th century. Americans have flirted with fascist ideology on and off, especially in the early 20th century--then in reaction to a strong progressive streak that dominated American culture. The opposition to democracy, nationalism, anti-immigrant demagoguery, the reliance on lies and propaganda, and authoritarianism are its most persistent features.

The conservative base in America has always had far right components to it, yet they were never able to dominate the US completely, not even in the 1930s before WW2. They were essentially fringe ideas for much of the period since WW2 to the point where they were basically ignored. For most of the past century, any far-right insurgency was almost always contained by the center-right element of the party. But not this time.

Once again we are witnesses to a rise of fascist far-right parties taking over in much of the world. Even though it was clearly the governing ideology of Trump himself, there were significant hurdles from the centrists that stopped his agenda. But those roadblocks were either systematically dismantled or eliminated through excommunication from the party. The near-absolute cover they gave him for his criminality, for his impeachable offenses, and for "the Big Lie" were signs that the party was weakening.

Now, the fascist wing has captured the Republican Party thoroughly. There is no accountability for the far-right members of the party, only those who might question their lies. The center-right Republican Party is now officially dead. It is just the fascists who are left.

God help us all.

Three things:

1. Fascism is Left Wing,
2. You meant to pray to Beelzebub, and
3. Fuck off. Just fuck off

No, Fascism is always right wing.
Fascism was started in Ancient Rome, and it referred to the axe handles used as the badge of office by the lictors who were sort of like police. These axe handles are called fascia. Anyway, the oligarchs used the axe handle facia tied in bundles to represent strength in unity. And their unity was the military, aristocracy, and priesthood. Which is essentially the same as the right wing unity these days except the priesthood has been replaced by bankers and corporations.
Mussolini also was put into power by the right wing, wealthy elite.
Fascism has never referred to left wing, lower class, populists.

No, it's not. Right wing is NO government. ALL collectivist governments are LEFTIST.

Wrong.
Aristocracies are always right wing.
They are centralized.
The left wing has always been the decentralized populists.
The word "collectivist" has no meaning since it depend on who it being united collectively?
If it is the wealthy elite, then it is right wing.
If it is the poor majority of the workers, then it is left wing.

There can never be such as thing as "NO government", because if allowed to get their way, the wealthy elite always takes over and created a monarchy.
The only way to prevent a monarchy or any sort of dictatorship from taking over with a mercenary force, is a strong populist government that prevents it with collective force.

The Fabian socialists have been propagandizing this line of bullshit for over a 100 years.

The political spectrum isn't a circle, it's a straight line. Collectivism on one side, anarchy on the other.

That's it.

No, its not because something as complex as a political system cannot be boiled down to a left/right duopoly. There are right wing authoritarians and there are left wing authoritarians.

The grid is a much more accurate picture of politics pitting authoritarians/anarchists as opposites and left/right as opposites but still massively over simplified. The right certainly does not represent something closer to anarchy than the left.

View attachment 489035

Correct. A total lack of government is the true definition of far-right ideology. A "sovereign citizen" is an example of a far-right person.

False.

What you state means there is no right at all in this country and that the left and right we do have occupy the SAME SPOT on the political spectrum. Just like that silly ass image oddball put up, it places the left and right on the same point.

What does that model tell you then? Nothing at all. That is what happens when you distill a host of complex ideologies into a one dimensional spectrum. Considering that such ideologies cover a massive swath of life, not just governance but things like economics, it makes the model useless.

It is not useful as there is a massive differences in ideologies that would simply be nonexistent on something as simple as a line.

No, far right is anarchy - the peaceful anarchy that Rand and Rothbart wrote extensively about, not the "anarchy" being carried out today by murderous commie lunatics....The far left is authoritarianism of all brands....

Trying to parse out whether fascism, communism, et al. are of any significant difference, is no more a cerebral exercise than contemplating the "differences" between Coke and cultists.

Yup. Mental masturbation at its finest.

That is what your silly line graph is, mental masterbation since it has been pointed out that it does not actually bring any meaning whatsoever to the table. It actually removes it.

I repeat, the image that was given, the one you liked

DIRECTLY SHOWED NAZISM AS MATCHING THE RIGHT. Its right there, in the picture.

Do you now disagree with that image?

 

[Oddball]

Far right movements spread around the world in the early 20th century. Americans have flirted with fascist ideology on and off, especially in the early 20th century--then in reaction to a strong progressive streak that dominated American culture. The opposition to democracy, nationalism, anti-immigrant demagoguery, the reliance on lies and propaganda, and authoritarianism are its most persistent features.

The conservative base in America has always had far right components to it, yet they were never able to dominate the US completely, not even in the 1930s before WW2. They were essentially fringe ideas for much of the period since WW2 to the point where they were basically ignored. For most of the past century, any far-right insurgency was almost always contained by the center-right element of the party. But not this time.

Once again we are witnesses to a rise of fascist far-right parties taking over in much of the world. Even though it was clearly the governing ideology of Trump himself, there were significant hurdles from the centrists that stopped his agenda. But those roadblocks were either systematically dismantled or eliminated through excommunication from the party. The near-absolute cover they gave him for his criminality, for his impeachable offenses, and for "the Big Lie" were signs that the party was weakening.

Now, the fascist wing has captured the Republican Party thoroughly. There is no accountability for the far-right members of the party, only those who might question their lies. The center-right Republican Party is now officially dead. It is just the fascists who are left.

God help us all.

It's been building since the Reagan Administration did away with the fairness doctrine which led to the rise of RW talk radio. For years, RW talk radio was like a group of underground fifth columnists which acted to subvert Democrats first and Republicans later on. The ginned up the anger in rural America to such an extent that even conservative leaders found themselves run out of office, even in a primary election.

For a few years, conservatives like Gingrich thought they could use talk radio, and they did just that. But they had unleashed a beast that they could no longer control by the time Obama was elected. I saw how badly conservatives reacted when Clinton was elected, but it paled in comparison to the reaction to the election of Obama,

Then a little over 10 years ago, three things happened in relatively quick succession. The Tea Party ascendancy in 2010, Trump's Birtherism charges in 2011, and Mitt Romney's defeat to Obama's reelection bid in 2012.

That's when the stage was set for what would come next even though nobody knew it at the time.

That's the ticket. Free speech, that is the problem.

And you can sit there with a straight face and claim it is the modern right that is authoritarian. It would be laughable if it was not so pathetic.

The left can be authoritarian and tribal: look at the legal system in Great Britain, for instance.

The 'woke' left is authoritarian in America but generally committed to Constitutional values, law, and order which the Trumpalists abhor.

... no.

The 'woke' left is certainly not committed to constitutional values. They openly hate free speech for starters. Woke ideology directly claims that the US is founded upon, steeped in and reliant upon deep evil. You really are going to claim that such a stance holds to constitutional values? That would necessitate doublethink. You cannot think something is both rooted in deep and unending evil yet hold to its values, they are mutually exclusive.

... yes, the center and left are Constitution supporters, the Right is not.

... yes, the US was founded on systemic racism and sexism and ethnocentrism.

... the Democrats over the last fifty years have been trying to correct the idea is for US while male property holders only.

You're a cafeteria constitutionalist fascist pig, and a poor sock puppet, Jake.

 

[K9Buck]

So there is no right wing in this nation.

Of course there is a "right" in the U.S. They support government but a LIMITED government. They also support free-market capitalism that is free of government interference. They support freedom of speech and religion and freedom to assemble and the freedom to own and bear arms.

 

[K9Buck]

DIRECTLY SHOWED NAZISM AS MATCHING THE RIGHT. Its right there, in the picture.

What tenet of Nazism is a tenet of the modern, American, right?

 

[Oddball]

Far right movements spread around the world in the early 20th century. Americans have flirted with fascist ideology on and off, especially in the early 20th century--then in reaction to a strong progressive streak that dominated American culture. The opposition to democracy, nationalism, anti-immigrant demagoguery, the reliance on lies and propaganda, and authoritarianism are its most persistent features.

The conservative base in America has always had far right components to it, yet they were never able to dominate the US completely, not even in the 1930s before WW2. They were essentially fringe ideas for much of the period since WW2 to the point where they were basically ignored. For most of the past century, any far-right insurgency was almost always contained by the center-right element of the party. But not this time.

Once again we are witnesses to a rise of fascist far-right parties taking over in much of the world. Even though it was clearly the governing ideology of Trump himself, there were significant hurdles from the centrists that stopped his agenda. But those roadblocks were either systematically dismantled or eliminated through excommunication from the party. The near-absolute cover they gave him for his criminality, for his impeachable offenses, and for "the Big Lie" were signs that the party was weakening.

Now, the fascist wing has captured the Republican Party thoroughly. There is no accountability for the far-right members of the party, only those who might question their lies. The center-right Republican Party is now officially dead. It is just the fascists who are left.

God help us all.

Three things:

1. Fascism is Left Wing,
2. You meant to pray to Beelzebub, and
3. Fuck off. Just fuck off

No, Fascism is always right wing.
Fascism was started in Ancient Rome, and it referred to the axe handles used as the badge of office by the lictors who were sort of like police. These axe handles are called fascia. Anyway, the oligarchs used the axe handle facia tied in bundles to represent strength in unity. And their unity was the military, aristocracy, and priesthood. Which is essentially the same as the right wing unity these days except the priesthood has been replaced by bankers and corporations.
Mussolini also was put into power by the right wing, wealthy elite.
Fascism has never referred to left wing, lower class, populists.

No, it's not. Right wing is NO government. ALL collectivist governments are LEFTIST.

Wrong.
Aristocracies are always right wing.
They are centralized.
The left wing has always been the decentralized populists.
The word "collectivist" has no meaning since it depend on who it being united collectively?
If it is the wealthy elite, then it is right wing.
If it is the poor majority of the workers, then it is left wing.

There can never be such as thing as "NO government", because if allowed to get their way, the wealthy elite always takes over and created a monarchy.
The only way to prevent a monarchy or any sort of dictatorship from taking over with a mercenary force, is a strong populist government that prevents it with collective force.

The Fabian socialists have been propagandizing this line of bullshit for over a 100 years.

The political spectrum isn't a circle, it's a straight line. Collectivism on one side, anarchy on the other.

That's it.

No, its not because something as complex as a political system cannot be boiled down to a left/right duopoly. There are right wing authoritarians and there are left wing authoritarians.

The grid is a much more accurate picture of politics pitting authoritarians/anarchists as opposites and left/right as opposites but still massively over simplified. The right certainly does not represent something closer to anarchy than the left.

View attachment 489035

Correct. A total lack of government is the true definition of far-right ideology. A "sovereign citizen" is an example of a far-right person.

False.

What you state means there is no right at all in this country and that the left and right we do have occupy the SAME SPOT on the political spectrum. Just like that silly ass image oddball put up, it places the left and right on the same point.

What does that model tell you then? Nothing at all. That is what happens when you distill a host of complex ideologies into a one dimensional spectrum. Considering that such ideologies cover a massive swath of life, not just governance but things like economics, it makes the model useless.

It is not useful as there is a massive differences in ideologies that would simply be nonexistent on something as simple as a line.

No, far right is anarchy - the peaceful anarchy that Rand and Rothbart wrote extensively about, not the "anarchy" being carried out today by murderous commie lunatics....The far left is authoritarianism of all brands....

Trying to parse out whether fascism, communism, et al. are of any significant difference, is no more a cerebral exercise than contemplating the "differences" between Coke and cultists.

Yup. Mental masturbation at its finest.

That is what your silly line graph is, mental masterbation since it has been pointed out that it does not actually bring any meaning whatsoever to the table. It actually removes it.

I repeat, the image that was given, the one you liked

DIRECTLY SHOWED NAZISM AS MATCHING THE RIGHT. Its right there, in the picture.

Do you now disagree with that image?

Nazism in my graph is on the left.

 

[progressive hunter]

Far right movements spread around the world in the early 20th century. Americans have flirted with fascist ideology on and off, especially in the early 20th century--then in reaction to a strong progressive streak that dominated American culture. The opposition to democracy, nationalism, anti-immigrant demagoguery, the reliance on lies and propaganda, and authoritarianism are its most persistent features.

The conservative base in America has always had far right components to it, yet they were never able to dominate the US completely, not even in the 1930s before WW2. They were essentially fringe ideas for much of the period since WW2 to the point where they were basically ignored. For most of the past century, any far-right insurgency was almost always contained by the center-right element of the party. But not this time.

Once again we are witnesses to a rise of fascist far-right parties taking over in much of the world. Even though it was clearly the governing ideology of Trump himself, there were significant hurdles from the centrists that stopped his agenda. But those roadblocks were either systematically dismantled or eliminated through excommunication from the party. The near-absolute cover they gave him for his criminality, for his impeachable offenses, and for "the Big Lie" were signs that the party was weakening.

Now, the fascist wing has captured the Republican Party thoroughly. There is no accountability for the far-right members of the party, only those who might question their lies. The center-right Republican Party is now officially dead. It is just the fascists who are left.

God help us all.

and yet its the democrat left currently trying to control everything that people do,,,

your outrage is misdirected,,,

O. P. Is a lying sack of anti American shit. Its not misdirected, its a flat out lie. And the O. P. Is a OP.

The OP is accurate, and the naysayers know it is accurate.

you forgot to add "WITHOUT EVIDENCE" in the op,,

 

[StormAl]

Far right movements spread around the world in the early 20th century. Americans have flirted with fascist ideology on and off, especially in the early 20th century--then in reaction to a strong progressive streak that dominated American culture. The opposition to democracy, nationalism, anti-immigrant demagoguery, the reliance on lies and propaganda, and authoritarianism are its most persistent features.

The conservative base in America has always had far right components to it, yet they were never able to dominate the US completely, not even in the 1930s before WW2. They were essentially fringe ideas for much of the period since WW2 to the point where they were basically ignored. For most of the past century, any far-right insurgency was almost always contained by the center-right element of the party. But not this time.

Once again we are witnesses to a rise of fascist far-right parties taking over in much of the world. Even though it was clearly the governing ideology of Trump himself, there were significant hurdles from the centrists that stopped his agenda. But those roadblocks were either systematically dismantled or eliminated through excommunication from the party. The near-absolute cover they gave him for his criminality, for his impeachable offenses, and for "the Big Lie" were signs that the party was weakening.

Now, the fascist wing has captured the Republican Party thoroughly. There is no accountability for the far-right members of the party, only those who might question their lies. The center-right Republican Party is now officially dead. It is just the fascists who are left.

God help us all.

and yet its the democrat left currently trying to control everything that people do,,,

your outrage is misdirected,,,

O. P. Is a lying sack of anti American shit. Its not misdirected, its a flat out lie. And the O. P. Is a OP.

The OP is accurate, and the naysayers know it is accurate.

you forgot to add "WITHOUT EVIDENCE" in the op,,

You saying 'no' is meaningless, my friend.