For those that may prefer a Socialist country

[surada]

And Venezuela and Nicaragua ...

Venezuela's middle class has all but disappeared under a pernicious, elitist capitalism. That's why they finally elected Hugo Chavez.

 

[surada]

T

They did Socialism better ( Right ) than the Street Communists they murdered

Who did socialism better?

 

[mudwhistle]

Russia after the revolution was never cooperative.
If nothing else, you can tell immediately because anything cooperative had to be locally controlled, and not centralized.

But communism had nothing at all to do with the 40 million Russians killed by Germany in WWII.
The deaths by starvation due to Stalin not knowing anything about food production, were at least a decade earlier.

Communists use starvation as a means of control.
The Soviets and the Chicoms murdered their own people using WWII as a cover.
In closed societies nothing is as it seems.

 

[mudwhistle]

Not at all.
Democratic socialism means you can use pooled tax dollars to create some means of production, OR you can use your own private funds.
That is very different from the theory of communism, which is where all means of production have to be jointly owned.
I say "theory of communism", because no one ever tried communism beyond the tribal level.
It would have been interesting to see what the communists in Russia could have done if Stalin had not killed them all off and implemented capitalism instead.

Apologists for commies are worse than communists themselves.
They are what makes the takeover possible.
They are taught how to talk their way out of the truth....but they're really just living in denial.
It's been done in so many other countries.....and there's always folks like you that help make it happen.

 

[fncceo]

Das Boot's handbook.

What does a submarine manual have to do with anything?

 

[Vrenn]

What does a submarine manual have to do with anything?

If you Fascists did take over, you would sink the United States like a leaky submarine.

 

[Kruska]

Hitler did break with the Socialists in 1926.

Hitler never broke with socialists, since he was never aligned with a socialist party - actually propagating and standing for real socialist dogmas.
Hitler hated socialists and communists - due to the latter in his opinion being Jewish Bolsheviks. Bolsheviks being members of the majority faction of the Russian Social Democratic Party - before they called themselves Communists.

Hitler upon studying fascism, took samples/parts out of fascist-socialism e.g. Italy - in order to unify and uniform the masses that he needed to turn Germany into a Nazi-controlled state.
E.g. the SA was a clear fascist-socialist construct - a peoples army in opposition to a governments army and police force - aka Reichswehr and Polizei - since the latter were a threat towards the Nazi's. It was e.g. the Bavarian Police force that opened fire and thus stopped Hitlers Munich putsch in 1923.

Once he had the support and control of the Reichswehr, later termed Wehrmacht - he completely annihilated the SA leadership - and re-functioned the SA towards merely assisting towards Nazi doctrines - e.g. smearing Jewish business, hunting down members of any political opposition, spying onto and indoctrinating the German population - till Goering had turned the Police into a Nazi robot and formed the Gestapo.

The political and racial Nazi doctrine carried forward in public via the SA, and was then taken over by Himmler in view of his SS organization. Since it was obvious that many SA members were not adhering fully to Nazi dogmas. (not fanatic enough and partially even questioning Nazi doctrines).

The HJ and BDM were Fascist-socialist inspired organizations - propagating that all Germans are equal in Nazi institutions - regardless of their social background or classes. Just as in the SS.
(The German language and culture beholds two very different ways of addressing a person) Those in the same social class, close friends and family members addressing each other with Du (you) and other social classes or superiors with Sie (you - sometimes the term Sir is also applied in the English language) - until today.
In the SS, SA, HJ and BDM everyone, even the common soldier addressed his superior and other SS members with Du. - but not so in the Wehrmacht or in any other German institution or public life.

So Hitler simply transferred Fascist-socialism ideals and functions into his NSDAP organization. The term Nazi itself is a derogatory term used and invented by Germans (not the Allies) who opposed the construct of the Hitler party - trying to sell itself as being a Nationalist Socialist German Workers Party. Anyone caught using the term Nazi was therefore facing reprisals by the NSDAP right down to being sent to e.g. Dachau.

 

[Red Front]

Wrong.
Communism does not allow capitalist means of production like private banks, socialism does.

Socialism does not preclude private means of production, but just ensures they can not become abusive, by providing fair alternatives.

You obviously don't know much about Marxist socialism. The major centers of economic power or what Marx called the "commanding heights of the economy" are in public hands. Completely nationalized. This includes finance or "banks". What can remain in the beginning, as socialism transitions into communism, is a consumer goods market. Even then, with a market for consumer goods, the publicly owned banks, unlike here in the US under capitalism, would give loans to workers who want to start a labor cooperative, freeing themselves from private employers. The state would encourage the creation of worker-owned enterprises, that are run democratically and in collaboration with the proletariat-state.

So you're correct about socialism allowing markets, in the beginning of the process of transitioning to communism, but those markets would only exist for consumer goods, not for the industries that are vital to the nation's infrastructure, like banks, energy production, mines, utilities, and other important industries. That is immediately nationalized (owned by the public).

 

[mudwhistle]

 

[Soupnazi630]

Not true.
Obviously for a society to be communist, it has to be democratic, cooperative, communal, and collective.
When none of those are true, it can't at all be socialist.
And clearly Stalin was completely profit motivated.
He was such an ultra capitalist, he prevented any competition.
That is what all capitalist dictators have always done, going back thousands of years.

WRONG

Communism is NEVEER democratic it is tyrannnical by design and in practice. It is never communal or cooperative. It is collective only in that it is collectice slavery.

That is why Stalin was a true communist to the core. He enslaved an entire nation.

 

[Soupnazi630]

Russia after the revolution was never cooperative.
If nothing else, you can tell immediately because anything cooperative had to be locally controlled, and not centralized.

But communism had nothing at all to do with the 40 million Russians killed by Germany in WWII.
The deaths by starvation due to Stalin not knowing anything about food production, were at least a decade earlier.

Communism had everytrrhing to do witht he 10 million people slughtered by Lenin and Staling all of whom were not killed by the nazis.

The USSR was a slave state making it a true communist nation. Communism is NEVER cooperative.

The deaths by starvation were engineered by Stalin and Lenin they were not caused by natural famine that is proven historic FACT

 

[Nuthin' Fancy]

Commies are the Enemy

That's true.

March 3 2018
U.S. President Donald Trump praised Chinese President Xi Jinping Saturday after the ruling Communist party announced it was eliminating the two-term limit for the presidency, paving the way for Xi to serve indefinitely.

“He’s now president for life, president for life. And he’s great,” Trump said, according to audio of excerpts of Trump’s remarks at a closed-door fundraiser in Florida.

“And look, he was able to do that. I think it’s great. Maybe we’ll have to give that a shot someday,” Trump said to cheers and applause from supporters.

Then they did.

 

[struth]

Capitalists love socialism, just ask Red China and Viet Nam.

well certainly, they will find a way to use it to their advantage, but it would be much easier not dealing with leftist tyrantical govts.

 

[DudleySmith]

well certainly, they will find a way to use it to their advantage, but it would be much easier not dealing with leftist tyrantical govts.

Leftist and rightist tyrannical govts. are exactly the same as far as most people are concerned. they produce the same results, and they both rely on mass murders to solve their social and economic problems, and they both rely on slave labor to keep their elites fat and happy.

 

[struth]

Leftist and rightist tyrannical govts. are exactly the same as far as most people are concerned. they produce the same results, and they both rely on mass murders to solve their social and economic problems, and they both rely on slave labor to keep their elites fat and happy.

That's why it's best to build a govt, around capitalism. Capitalism is freedom.

 

[DBA]

These right-wingers think socialism and communism are over and done with lol. What they fail to grasp is that it takes time for an economic system to replace another, it doesn't happen overnight. The material conditions have to be in place for it to happen. The European mercantile class didn't become the powerful, capitalist industrialists until the technology was available and conditions were ripe for capitalism to replace feudalism and the royal aristocracy.

The 20th century saw the final birth pains of socialism, and the 21st century, thanks to advanced automation and AI will give birth to the actual socialist age, that will replace capitalism. The 21st century is going to give birth to socialism. These right-wingers are completely clueless to this fact, thinking "socialism is dead" lol.

Not sure about others, but I don’t think Socialism is dead, just wish that it was. I actually agree with you that we are headed in that direction as people become more and more dependent and feel more entitled. Not far down the road from that is Communism. This is exactly why I am a Conservative and not a Liberal. I can see the writing on the wall.

 

[Nuthin' Fancy]

Not sure about others, but I don’t think Socialism is dead, just wish that it was. I actually agree with you that we are headed in that direction as people become more and more dependent and feel more entitled.

Trump and his cult.

Not far down the road from that is Communism.

Trump and his cult want to be just like them.

March 3 2018
U.S. President Donald Trump praised Chinese President Xi Jinping Saturday after the ruling Communist party announced it was eliminating the two-term limit for the presidency, paving the way for Xi to serve indefinitely.

“He’s now president for life, president for life. And he’s great,” Trump said, according to audio of excerpts of Trump’s remarks at a closed-door fundraiser in Florida.

“And look, he was able to do that. I think it’s great. Maybe we’ll have to give that a shot someday,” Trump said to cheers and applause from supporters.


"Putin, fierce—they're smart. You know a lot of times I'll say somebody's smart and the fake news will go 'He called President Xi smart.' He rules with an iron fist 1.5 billion people, yeah I'd say he's smart," Trump then added.

This is exactly why I am a Conservative and not a Liberal. I can see the writing on the wall.

Self proclaimed "conservatives" love authoritarianism.

Hungary's Viktor Orban tells Tucker Carlson​

Fox News
https://www.foxnews.com › media › hungary-viktor-o...
Aug 5, 2021 — In an interview on "Tucker Carlson Tonight," Hungarian President Viktor Orban fired back at U.S. President Joe Biden for linking Orban with ...

Tucker Carlson Interviews Brazil Far-Right Leader After ...​

Business Insider
https://www.businessinsider.com › Politics › Media
Jun 30, 2022 — Fox News host Tucker Carlson previewed an interview with Brazilian President Jair Bolsonaro, saying the far-right leader is completely different ...

Tucker Carlson Defends Putin, Says Italy Is Bigger Threat ...​

Business Insider
https://www.businessinsider.com › Politics › News
Jul 14, 2022 — Tucker Carlson defended Vladimir Putin again, suggesting Italy poses a bigger threat than Russia because of its slightly larger economy.




These are some of the first scenes of Tucker Carlson’s new “documentary,” boldly titled “Hungary vs. Soros: Fight for Civilization.” Why the quotation marks? Documentaries are supposed to show the truth, but Tucker Carlson’s portrayal of Hungary is quite far from it. And I’m not just talking about the trailer in which the Fox News host refers to Hungary’s southern neighbor as Slovakia. (It is, in fact, Serbia.)


Carlson’s documentary depicts Hungary as a conservative paradise with strong pro-family policies that has vanquished illegal immigration through its border fence. And the Hungarian-born Soros — shown only in black and white — is a villain who has spent billions trying to eliminate national borders and more generally fighting an ideological war against the West.

As a native Hungarian and resident of Budapest, I’ve watched since 2010 as Orbán, an ally of Donald Trump and Fox News favorite, has modified election laws to favor his party, curbed freedom of the press (leading me to lose my job more than once), cozied up to Russia and China.

 

[struth]

Trump and his cult.

Trump and his cult want to be just like them.

March 3 2018
U.S. President Donald Trump praised Chinese President Xi Jinping Saturday after the ruling Communist party announced it was eliminating the two-term limit for the presidency, paving the way for Xi to serve indefinitely.

“He’s now president for life, president for life. And he’s great,” Trump said, according to audio of excerpts of Trump’s remarks at a closed-door fundraiser in Florida.

“And look, he was able to do that. I think it’s great. Maybe we’ll have to give that a shot someday,” Trump said to cheers and applause from supporters.


"Putin, fierce—they're smart. You know a lot of times I'll say somebody's smart and the fake news will go 'He called President Xi smart.' He rules with an iron fist 1.5 billion people, yeah I'd say he's smart," Trump then added.

Self proclaimed "conservatives" love authoritarianism.

Hungary's Viktor Orban tells Tucker Carlson​

View attachment 790391
Fox News
https://www.foxnews.com › media › hungary-viktor-o...
Aug 5, 2021 — In an interview on "Tucker Carlson Tonight," Hungarian President Viktor Orban fired back at U.S. President Joe Biden for linking Orban with ...

Tucker Carlson Interviews Brazil Far-Right Leader After ...​

View attachment 790392
Business Insider
https://www.businessinsider.com › Politics › Media
Jun 30, 2022 — Fox News host Tucker Carlson previewed an interview with Brazilian President Jair Bolsonaro, saying the far-right leader is completely different ...

Tucker Carlson Defends Putin, Says Italy Is Bigger Threat ...​

View attachment 790393
Business Insider
https://www.businessinsider.com › Politics › News
Jul 14, 2022 — Tucker Carlson defended Vladimir Putin again, suggesting Italy poses a bigger threat than Russia because of its slightly larger economy.




These are some of the first scenes of Tucker Carlson’s new “documentary,” boldly titled “Hungary vs. Soros: Fight for Civilization.” Why the quotation marks? Documentaries are supposed to show the truth, but Tucker Carlson’s portrayal of Hungary is quite far from it. And I’m not just talking about the trailer in which the Fox News host refers to Hungary’s southern neighbor as Slovakia. (It is, in fact, Serbia.)


Carlson’s documentary depicts Hungary as a conservative paradise with strong pro-family policies that has vanquished illegal immigration through its border fence. And the Hungarian-born Soros — shown only in black and white — is a villain who has spent billions trying to eliminate national borders and more generally fighting an ideological war against the West.

As a native Hungarian and resident of Budapest, I’ve watched since 2010 as Orbán, an ally of Donald Trump and Fox News favorite, has modified election laws to favor his party, curbed freedom of the press (leading me to lose my job more than once), cozied up to Russia and China.

what about Trump's policies are socialist or taking us towards socialism?

 

[DBA]

Trump and his cult.

Trump and his cult want to be just like them.

March 3 2018
U.S. President Donald Trump praised Chinese President Xi Jinping Saturday after the ruling Communist party announced it was eliminating the two-term limit for the presidency, paving the way for Xi to serve indefinitely.

“He’s now president for life, president for life. And he’s great,” Trump said, according to audio of excerpts of Trump’s remarks at a closed-door fundraiser in Florida.

“And look, he was able to do that. I think it’s great. Maybe we’ll have to give that a shot someday,” Trump said to cheers and applause from supporters.


"Putin, fierce—they're smart. You know a lot of times I'll say somebody's smart and the fake news will go 'He called President Xi smart.' He rules with an iron fist 1.5 billion people, yeah I'd say he's smart," Trump then added.

Self proclaimed "conservatives" love authoritarianism.

Hungary's Viktor Orban tells Tucker Carlson​

View attachment 790391
Fox News
https://www.foxnews.com › media › hungary-viktor-o...
Aug 5, 2021 — In an interview on "Tucker Carlson Tonight," Hungarian President Viktor Orban fired back at U.S. President Joe Biden for linking Orban with ...

Tucker Carlson Interviews Brazil Far-Right Leader After ...​

View attachment 790392
Business Insider
https://www.businessinsider.com › Politics › Media
Jun 30, 2022 — Fox News host Tucker Carlson previewed an interview with Brazilian President Jair Bolsonaro, saying the far-right leader is completely different ...

Tucker Carlson Defends Putin, Says Italy Is Bigger Threat ...​

View attachment 790393
Business Insider
https://www.businessinsider.com › Politics › News
Jul 14, 2022 — Tucker Carlson defended Vladimir Putin again, suggesting Italy poses a bigger threat than Russia because of its slightly larger economy.




These are some of the first scenes of Tucker Carlson’s new “documentary,” boldly titled “Hungary vs. Soros: Fight for Civilization.” Why the quotation marks? Documentaries are supposed to show the truth, but Tucker Carlson’s portrayal of Hungary is quite far from it. And I’m not just talking about the trailer in which the Fox News host refers to Hungary’s southern neighbor as Slovakia. (It is, in fact, Serbia.)


Carlson’s documentary depicts Hungary as a conservative paradise with strong pro-family policies that has vanquished illegal immigration through its border fence. And the Hungarian-born Soros — shown only in black and white — is a villain who has spent billions trying to eliminate national borders and more generally fighting an ideological war against the West.

As a native Hungarian and resident of Budapest, I’ve watched since 2010 as Orbán, an ally of Donald Trump and Fox News favorite, has modified election laws to favor his party, curbed freedom of the press (leading me to lose my job more than once), cozied up to Russia and China.

People who have escaped Communism and come to this country laugh at leftists ignorance and gullibility. Seriously, lefties have NO idea what they are talking about and that is all on purpose. Years of indoctrination have taken their toll.

 

[surada]

what about Trump's policies are socialist or taking us towards socialism?

Trump is just trying to take us towards nationalism and authoritarian leadership. Like Fascism. He really doesn't know. He's so ego driven and ignorant.