Gay-rights bill clears first hurdle in Senate

[Plasmaball]

I don't need the government to proclaim me 'christian' or force others to accept my particular choice in religion.. just leave me alone and let me act as I want without interference for me or towards me

And I expect no bills forcing in the name of religion, nor forcing a religion to act against their beliefs.. even if I do not agree with their beliefs

but we have to accept it, its protected. i can't not hire you based on your religious following.

Cant have it both ways.

I don't want it both ways..

I think, as stated in the previous post, that a catholic church or whatever other religious organization should not be forced to hire someone who does not help their image, or is blatantly against their views

thats neat but we are talking about businesses and you cant discriminate. Tough shit. Your religious practice is a choice and nothing more, and thats protected.

 

[aaronleland]

Then I assume you want no freedom to be gay...

And saw no REP or conservative agenda making gay activities illegal or prohibited

And funny that nobody is trying to force acceptance of a religion, yet trying to force acceptance of this choice.. and I don't see agencies in the government pushing religious issues while they are pushing 'gay' issues


Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof; or abridging the freedom of speech, or of the press; or the right of the people peaceably to assemble, and to petition the Government for a redress of grievances.

A workplace can't discriminate against a person based on religion though.

It's just a protective measure.

I believe a christian book store should be able to discriminate by not hiring a satanist.. or a jewish organization not hiring a muslim.. or an atheist hedonist not hiring a bible thumper..

You are free to practice or worship... but you should not be protected against the freedom of others to portray the atmosphere they want as well

You are allowed to fire an employee for not portraying the image of your company you want them to. For instance, you can't bad mouth the company in front of customers, or portray them in a negative light. What a company can't do is refuse to hire somebody in the first place based on their beliefs outside of work. It's not the employer's business, and even bringing it up at work is inappropriate.

 

[DiamondDave]

The law says you can't discriminate against someone because of their religious beliefs.

Read the amendment again

It does not

And I don't support others laws that do protect 'choices'....

Having the freedom to exercise or worship or whatever does not mean others cannot and should not be able to exercise their beliefs not to want you around in their private business or whatever

There would be a lawsuit if you fired a christian simply because you don't like Christians.

No Corporation would do that and they know people are protected in their religious beliefs.

You may not care if religious people are protected but I do just as much as gay, bi and cross gendered folks.

Do I agree with that?? No.. If you run an anti-christian store selling crucifixes soaked in urine, you should not be forced to keep a devout christian employee, nor should you be forced to hire one if qualified.. if you choose that that is not right for your business, that is your freedom to believe that and exercise that, just as it is the freedom of the christian to act and believe their way

 

[DiamondDave]

but we have to accept it, its protected. i can't not hire you based on your religious following.

Cant have it both ways.

I don't want it both ways..

I think, as stated in the previous post, that a catholic church or whatever other religious organization should not be forced to hire someone who does not help their image, or is blatantly against their views

thats neat but we are talking about businesses and you cant discriminate. Tough shit. Your religious practice is a choice and nothing more, and thats protected.

I believe the FREEDOM should be protected.. not a forced protection nor forced acceptance.. whether it be for sexual choice, religious choice, or any other behavioral choice

 

[DiamondDave]

A workplace can't discriminate against a person based on religion though.

It's just a protective measure.

I believe a christian book store should be able to discriminate by not hiring a satanist.. or a jewish organization not hiring a muslim.. or an atheist hedonist not hiring a bible thumper..

You are free to practice or worship... but you should not be protected against the freedom of others to portray the atmosphere they want as well

You are allowed to fire an employee for not portraying the image of your company you want them to. For instance, you can't bad mouth the company in front of customers, or portray them in a negative light. What a company can't do is refuse to hire somebody in the first place based on their beliefs outside of work. It's not the employer's business, and even bringing it up at work is inappropriate.

Even if it is inappropriate, it is done... people express things.. and if I am operating a sex shop or strip joint, I don't think I will be hiring someone who applies that carries a bible, or openly voices things in opposition to my business whether it be inside OR outside of work...

Sorry.. I am about the freedom, not the unneeded protection of the consequences of my beliefs and actions

 

[Michelle420]

Read the amendment again

It does not

And I don't support others laws that do protect 'choices'....

Having the freedom to exercise or worship or whatever does not mean others cannot and should not be able to exercise their beliefs not to want you around in their private business or whatever

There would be a lawsuit if you fired a christian simply because you don't like Christians.

No Corporation would do that and they know people are protected in their religious beliefs.

You may not care if religious people are protected but I do just as much as gay, bi and cross gendered folks.

Do I agree with that?? No.. If you run an anti-christian store selling crucifixes soaked in urine, you should not be forced to keep a devout christian employee, nor should you be forced to hire one if qualified.. if you choose that that is not right for your business, that is your freedom to believe that and exercise that, just as it is the freedom of the christian to act and believe their way

Well that is just your preference of how you wish things to be.

We disagree.

 

[DiamondDave]

There would be a lawsuit if you fired a christian simply because you don't like Christians.

No Corporation would do that and they know people are protected in their religious beliefs.

You may not care if religious people are protected but I do just as much as gay, bi and cross gendered folks.

Do I agree with that?? No.. If you run an anti-christian store selling crucifixes soaked in urine, you should not be forced to keep a devout christian employee, nor should you be forced to hire one if qualified.. if you choose that that is not right for your business, that is your freedom to believe that and exercise that, just as it is the freedom of the christian to act and believe their way

Well that is just your preference of how you wish things to be.

We disagree.

That is a preference based on the first amendment as written... and I have and will continue to PERSONALLY hire people who may not be in line with my religious or sexual choices...

 

[Plasmaball]

I don't want it both ways..

I think, as stated in the previous post, that a catholic church or whatever other religious organization should not be forced to hire someone who does not help their image, or is blatantly against their views

thats neat but we are talking about businesses and you cant discriminate. Tough shit. Your religious practice is a choice and nothing more, and thats protected.

I believe the FREEDOM should be protected.. not a forced protection nor forced acceptance.. whether it be for sexual choice, religious choice, or any other behavioral choice

okie dokie, but your freedom is being protected. You cant be fired based on your religious faith.

 

[Iceman]

Choices do not need 'rights bills'

you choose to be a christian, so yes i agree, religious people dont need amendments or bills.

You shouldn't have to hire Christians or fudgepackers. I think this is the point he is driving at, freedom of association.

 

[JakeStarkey]

If you're right, let's get rid of the "freedom of religion" part of the First Amendment.

Then I assume you want no freedom to be gay...

And saw no REP or conservative agenda making gay activities illegal or prohibited

And funny that nobody is trying to force acceptance of a religion, yet trying to force acceptance of this choice.. and I don't see agencies in the government pushing religious issues while they are pushing 'gay' issues


Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof; or abridging the freedom of speech, or of the press; or the right of the people peaceably to assemble, and to petition the Government for a redress of grievances.

A workplace can't discriminate against a person based on religion though.

It's just a protective measure.

Business has every right to put religion and atheism on notice that it does not belong in the work place.

 

[Michelle420]

Then I assume you want no freedom to be gay...

And saw no REP or conservative agenda making gay activities illegal or prohibited

And funny that nobody is trying to force acceptance of a religion, yet trying to force acceptance of this choice.. and I don't see agencies in the government pushing religious issues while they are pushing 'gay' issues


Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof; or abridging the freedom of speech, or of the press; or the right of the people peaceably to assemble, and to petition the Government for a redress of grievances.

A workplace can't discriminate against a person based on religion though.

It's just a protective measure.

Business has every right to put religion and atheism on notice that it does not belong in the work place.

They can't fire you because on your own private time you are a christian.

 

[BreezeWood]

Having the freedom to exercise or worship or whatever does not mean others cannot and should not be able to exercise their beliefs not to want you around in their private business or whatever

... should not be able to exercise their beliefs not to want you around in their private business or whatever

(that's the point.)

On a vote of 61-30, the Senate voted to move ahead on the legislation that would prohibit workplace discrimination based on sexual orientation and gender identity.

not to want you around in their private business / that would prohibit workplace discrimination


earning a living in American capitalism is changing for the (sectarian) better.

.

 

[JakeStarkey]

A workplace can't discriminate against a person based on religion though.

It's just a protective measure.

Business has every right to put religion and atheism on notice that it does not belong in the work place.

They can't fire you because on your own private time you are a christian.

If you are bashing the company on your time off work because you don't likes its policies because of your Christian values, yup, you are toast.

 

[C_Clayton_Jones]

On a vote of 61-30, the Senate voted to move ahead on the legislation that would prohibit workplace discrimination based on sexual orientation and gender identity.

Rare.us | Gay-rights bill clears first hurdle in Senate

YAYAYAYAYAYAYAYA! Now we need it to pass the House. Hopefully this will not start another shutdown...

What "gay rights" are not already protected legally by civil rights laws generally?

This legislation has nothing to do with civil rights.

The measure the Senate passed is workplace regulatory policy, likely predicated on Commerce Clause jurisprudence, and Congress’ authority to regulate markets. It can be well argued that private businesses that discriminate against potential patrons based solely on their sexual orientation has an adverse effect on that particular market, regardless how small: and the fact that at some level all markets are interrelated. See, e.g., Wickard v. Filburn (1942), Heart of Atlanta Motel Inc. v. United States (1964).

 

[Michelle420]

Business has every right to put religion and atheism on notice that it does not belong in the work place.

They can't fire you because on your own private time you are a christian.

If you are bashing the company on your time off work because you don't likes its policies because of your Christian values, yup, you are toast.

But I never said any of those scenarios Jake.

I said you can't fire someone just because they are a christian outside of work.

You keep quoting me and adding narratives that have nothing to do with what I said.

 

[ScienceRocks]

What you do within your room = stays in your room. Shouldn't matter in the work place.

I thought such laws were already in place?

 

[Nyvin]

What you do within your room = stays in your room. Shouldn't matter in the work place.

I thought such laws were already in place?

It does quite significantly...if Mark posts on facebook "I had a great date with Steve today" and Mark's boss sees that facebook post...in 29 states it would be legal for Mark's boss to fire Mark. That's under no other issue other then Mark being gay.

 

[C_Clayton_Jones]

What you do within your room = stays in your room. Shouldn't matter in the work place.

I thought such laws were already in place?

Not Nation-wide, no.

In some states and jurisdictions gay patrons can be refused service.

Yes, it’s idiocy – hence the legitimacy of the proposed legislation.

 

[ScienceRocks]

What you do within your room = stays in your room. Shouldn't matter in the work place.

I thought such laws were already in place?

It does quite significantly...if Mark posts on facebook "I had a great date with Steve today" and Mark's boss sees that facebook post...in 29 states it would be legal for Mark's boss to fire Mark. That's under no other issue other then Mark being gay.

I agree with this law as no one should be fired over who they love.

 

[Iceman]

What you do within your room = stays in your room. Shouldn't matter in the work place.

I thought such laws were already in place?

It does quite significantly...if Mark posts on facebook "I had a great date with Steve today" and Mark's boss sees that facebook post...in 29 states it would be legal for Mark's boss to fire Mark. That's under no other issue other then Mark being gay.

Mark's boss should be able to fire him for whatever reason he wants, it is the boss's business after all.