Hey michigan - Don't cut my public worker pension until ALL welfare is eliminated

[bucs90]

If they had NO incentive to sign up there would be a draft. Because NO One would volunteer to fight for this country if there was NO incentive

YES. Exactly right. While military folks Im sure serve with pride and honor, there must be some incentive to be deployed often, sometimes in combat zones, and to put up with overbearing commanders and physical fitness req's, etc, etc. Otherwise, they wouldnt do it. The Marines love their country. But stop paying them, and see how many re-up.

Same goes for police officer. You ask them to work odd hours, weekends, holidays, miss kid's birthdays, miss Christmas, etc, etc. You ask them to go to horrible suicide scenes, child abuse scenes, murder scenes. To run INTO active shootings, risk being murdered themselves, to confront gang members. You ask them to find a way to deal with the mentaly ill of society....now that we dont have mental hospitals anymore. To deal with society's sickest, most disgusting, most evil filth on our darkest streets. And we ask them to do all that while the media and public second guess their every move, criticize them no matter what they do, and we want them to remain positive, polite and kind during it all.

And you expect people to keep doing that job, with less and less incentive to do it.

Eventually, things turn bad.

 

[Dont Taz Me Bro]

Would you say that a military man who spent 20 years in, retired, and is owed his retirement pension from the government is no different than someone getting welfare?

The military is the same as a public employee raiding the taxpayers' coffers by voting in corrupt city councilman to give them benefits and perks they can't afford to pay when the bill comes? Because that's what they did in Detroit.

Your attitude is why the Republican Party will be obsolete and irrelevant in 10 years.

I'm not a Republican so I fail to see how my attitude has anything to do with their alleged obsolescence or irrelevancy in ten years. Not everyone is a willing slave to the political duopoly sheeple like you keep propping up

I am sorry but the men and women who signed a contract and risked thier lives for 20 plus years EARNED their retirement. PERIOD

Did someone say they didn't?

 

[Jarlaxle]

Nobody said that. The OP is not retired military, he is a retired public employee, basically a career parasite.

The poster you responded to is a useless troll.

Um.....military members are public employees. You know that, right? You do know the military is a government establishment, right?

Wow. Cant believe I still have to point that out. But, your response is on par with the "Get the government's hands off my medicare" sign.

ARe you deliberately being obtuse or are you actually THAT DENSE?

 

[Jarlaxle]

My pension is money that by law is OWED to me. Welfare is just a GIFT we give to lazy deadbeats . No way any institution can give money away while stiffing its creditors!!!

As you acknowledge, you are nothing more than a creditor. If a city owes you money, it is not the entity paying the welfare, so you are comparing apples to oranges.

HAHAHA. Please learn basic english grammar. No one has any idea what you're saying.

Actually, his post was clear to anyone with the intelligence of, say, a 12 year old. It is not surprising you were not able to understand it.

 

[Jarlaxle]

Nobody said that. The OP is not retired military, he is a retired public employee, basically a career parasite.

The poster you responded to is a useless troll.

Yes, teachers, firemen, police officers, social workers, city workers from streets and sanitation, they're all career parasites. Another dumb and dumber post from a right wing idiot. I wish every Republican ran on a platform that stated that all public employees are career parasites. You and those like you are absolute morons.

The cops that retire at 50 with a lifetime pension thatthey have boosted up by working lots of OT their last few years? (This is a common scam in Massachusetts.) The tolltakers that make $65,000+ a year for what should be a minimum-wage job? The DPW guy who gets "hurt" on the job and collects welfare for 35 years? Yep...parasites all! Sometimes, the truth hurts. ARe you one of those parasites?

 

[Wyatt earp]

Could you point to your source that backs this up?

they didnt cause the trouble in the blue cities. the unions and liberal voters did.

What part of 123 Trillion unfunded liabilities are you not getting?
U.S. National Debt Clock : Real Time

Our large entitlement programs needs to be reformed or we will go Bankrupt in the future.

???? thought this thread was a about blue states. born and raised in Chicago and cook county Illinois. After 38 years when taxes got to high I left for a redstate. They could pay for it I wont and I dont think they had a Republican mayor since Bill Bill? in the early 1900's

and your right I never gave mucht thought or did reaserch on the governments unfunded pension programs I thought the post office was supposed to be funded for like 75 years or something thats why they are broke?

 

[Toro]

Would you say that a military man who spent 20 years in, retired, and is owed his retirement pension from the government is no different than someone getting welfare?

Both are a drain on Government and should be cut or eliminated.

You can't expect Politicians of Today to keep the Promises made by Politicians of the Past.

Clearly, you don't believe in property rights. Clearly, you ARE a communist.

 

[Harry Dresden]

Yep. Sure is. When Clinton slashed military funds, many in the military voted GOP in 2000. They dont vote for the folks who will cut military spending. They, too, vote for their own self interest. I bet a lot of miilitary members voted against Obama, because they knew Obama would cut miitary spending.

See how that works? So yeah, its the same.

The military don't have the right to collectively bargain.

The military are also dispersed all throughout the country. They aren't concentrated in one centralized city council district or urban area where they would have a larger influence and affect on an election outcome like city union lackeys are.

See how that works? So no, it's not the same. Better luck next time.

Most cops and firemen dont either, as most PD's and FD's are not unionized.

Yes, it IS THE SAME. They are all government employees. They all get paid by our tax dollars. They all vote according to their own interests. Its the same, you right wingers are just too confused about it. Like a dog who tilts his head when confused, you right wingers get confused when you are told the military is in fact made up of government employees, living off tax dollars, getting sweet 20 year retirements with pay/benefits for life starting as early as age 38. Imagine that. Work from 18-38 as a cook in the Navy. Then retire, and live the next 50 years off the taxpayer. Show me ONE non-military government job that offers such a sweet deal? There are none.

So, yeah, its the same. You RW'ers are just too brainwashed to have that discussion.

you know what Buc......just because someone doesnt agree with you ....DOES NOT mean he or she is a Right Winger....you are sounding like that little twerp named Dudley.....if you dont agree with him.....you are not only a "rw"......you are Anti-American.....maybe you are the "brainwashed" one here......

 

[ShootSpeeders]

[I am sorry but the men and women who signed a contract and risked thier lives for 20 plus years EARNED their retirement. PERIOD

Right - they are creditors and you can't stiff them just so can give unearned checks to welfare bums.

 

[ShootSpeeders]

No one fights for love of country?

Absolutely not. They do it for the money like with every other job. And if you owe them money you better pay it as long as you give money to welfare bums you have no obligation to pay!!!

 

[ShootSpeeders]

[
You are getting 4 checks when you retire, when most people get 2 when the retire.
If your State does not change the unfunded State workers retirement funds, you will only be getting 3 checks.
Seems to me, it would be better to get a smaller amount of your State retirement check rather than none at all if the State went Bankrupt because nothing at all was done about it.
I'm sure you will be fine with your 3 checks and one smaller State check.

How can a state call themselves bankrupt when they're still paying out welfare - money they don't have to pay.

 

[ShootSpeeders]

My pension is money that by law is OWED to me.

Actually, it's the taxpayer's money. Your union and their corrupt buddies in office promised you something that they cannot provide...a return on retirement funds that no stock or bond market could every consistently produce. Sorry, but the money's not there. .

Yes the money is there. That's the point of this thread. The state can't say they can't pay me the money they owe me, while they give welfare bums money they don't have to give them.

 

[ShootSpeeders]

My pension is money that by law is OWED to me. Welfare is just a GIFT we give to lazy deadbeats . No way any institution can give money away while stiffing its creditors!!!

And also by Law they can take both away.
What part of this are you not getting?
Whenever any government is big enough that it can give you something, they can also take it away.

I know they CAN take it away but is it ethical to take away the money i earned while they GIVE money to bums on welfare??? THINK

 

[ShootSpeeders]

The cops that retire at 50 with a lifetime pension thatthey have boosted up by working lots of OT their last few years? (This is a common scam in Massachusetts.) The tolltakers that make $65,000+ a year for what should be a minimum-wage job? The DPW guy who gets "hurt" on the job and collects welfare for 35 years? Yep...parasites all! Sometimes, the truth hurts. ARe you one of those parasites?

Ok they're parasites but what then do you call the welfare bums.? Certainly the cop has more claim to his pension money than bums like you have to your welfare check.

 

[eflatminor]

My pension is money that by law is OWED to me.

Actually, it's the taxpayer's money. Your union and their corrupt buddies in office promised you something that they cannot provide...a return on retirement funds that no stock or bond market could every consistently produce. Sorry, but the money's not there. .

Yes the money is there. That's the point of this thread. The state can't say they can't pay me the money they owe me, while they give welfare bums money they don't have to give them.

While I agree we should not be paying welfare bums, the fact is, the money is not there. They're called UNFUNDED liabilities for a reason.

 

[ShootSpeeders]

While I agree we should not be paying welfare bums, the fact is, the money is not there. They're called UNFUNDED liabilities for a reason.

STOP MAKING A FOOL OF YOURSELF. As we've explained a hundred times, the state can't say there is no money to pay pensions to its workers when the state continues to hand out welfare.

 

[eflatminor]

While I agree we should not be paying welfare bums, the fact is, the money is not there. They're called UNFUNDED liabilities for a reason.

STOP MAKING A FOOL OF YOURSELF. As we've explained a hundred times, the state can't say there is no money to pay pensions to its workers when the state continues to hand out welfare.

Yet that's exactly what they're doing. So who's the fool?

Not sure why you're lashing out at me. I agree with you! I would OF COURSE pay pensions before welfare.

But then I would have never agree to "define benefits" for state workers, only "define contributions", just like every other worker with a pension plan. Defined benefits plans are unrealistic and unsustainable. The money just isn't there for the returns the union contracts specify. Defined contribution plans would be 100% funded...defined benefit plans not even close.

While I would support the elimination of welfare programs that have only resulted in an increase in the poverty rate, I'm afraid reality is going to force everyone to take a haircut, including your pension that was enacted by two people on the same side of the bargaining table (a union rep and the politician they elected). In that regard, you'll not get a ton of sympathy from me, though I sincerely wish you good luck.