how and why did the middle class expand so much during the 50's and 60's?

[Old Rocks]

It would be repetitive. I am one of those people that thinks the recipe for success is to decrease the income gap. Some of the other liberal posters have done a nice job of discussing that. No need for me to repeat the theme.

I just wanted you to see that the 1950's was not all wine and roses.

thank you. i agree, the income gap needs to decrease.

The only way that gap decreases is through individual opportunity. Obama is trying to tax people to pay for another persons income and that can not and never has worked. The only thing that accomplishes is lowering the standard of living for everyone. If we really wanted prosperity we would set up a flat tax, reduce regulations to allow new competitors into the game and get the government out of the majority of our decisions. There will still be poor people there always are but this will give the majority the chance to succeed.

So, this is what you are defending.

[ame=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QPKKQnijnsM]Wealth Inequality in America - YouTube[/ame]

 

[Old Rocks]

i would like someone to explain this:

how and why did the middle class expand so much during the 50's and 60's?

what political and economic policies were involved? or did it not expand.

i'm having this debate with my...shall remain anonymous...nevermind...curious as to what USMB has to say

note to mods: i want both political and economic so i thought political forum would be best

The short answer is we built most everything we needed in the US. Then que the enviroweenies, unions and the EPA. Then throw in the federal governments plan to force the US economy into a consumer driven, service based piece of crap and you get a collapsing middle class.

You dumb ass. Unions were very much a part of the increasing income for the middle class in the US for that period. The percentage of the workers in unions was greater then than now. And the unions had greater power to make sure the workers were getting a fair share of the fruits of their labor.

Without the "enviroweenies" tens of thousands more people would die of industrial related illness from such products as asbestos. As for the EPA, most of us really like clean air and water, rivers which are not open sewers, where one can safely eat the fish that one catches there.

As for the present economy being a 'peice of crap', the people that people like you put into power in the first decade of this century created the greatest economic debacle since the First Great Republican Depression. And there are plenty of people that have done well in this economy, this old liberal being one of them.

 

[Katzndogz]

It's easy to have a tax rate when the 10% left is the whole economic pie of the entire world. Europe was a cinder, Japan a glowing hole in the ground, china had nothing but rice paddies and Russia was saddled with collectivist communism. Whatever got made, got made in an American factory. We had all the factories and no environmental anti pollution laws. We grew almost all the food and fed a decimated Europe.

Now we have competition. We don't have a workforce willing to work like granddad did. We don't export, money isn't flowing into the country. It's flowing out of the country as we import just about everything. Instead of a work force, we have a welfare force.

You think we could survive a 90% tax rate? High taxes don't create productivity. High productivity enables high taxes.

 

[MeNonPartisan]

Partially because of women's lib.

 

[Missouri_Mike]

I graduated catholic grammar school in 1951...and had all the education I needed right then. I could read, write, speak, add, subtract, multiply and divide. I knew what sacrifice, self denial and self discipline meant. I had a reasonable fear of God, knew the Ten Commandments and respected women...the nuns said girls hated sex...and I believed them. Life has changed...I am amazed at what my grand kids must learn...and what they must learn to avoid. God help them.

You thought you had all the education you needed right then. There is no such thing as all the education you need. You do not have time to get such. The best we can do is continual education throughout our lives, beginning to end.

Never an end for sure but kids had a far better base of education then than they do now. It's why we keep dropping the requirements for college entry today, they can't meet those standards. Kids were better prepared then and were expected to do better. Far too many go to college on our dime to just finish high school today. Dropping the standards hasn't helped.

 

[Missouri_Mike]

thank you. i agree, the income gap needs to decrease.

The only way that gap decreases is through individual opportunity. Obama is trying to tax people to pay for another persons income and that can not and never has worked. The only thing that accomplishes is lowering the standard of living for everyone. If we really wanted prosperity we would set up a flat tax, reduce regulations to allow new competitors into the game and get the government out of the majority of our decisions. There will still be poor people there always are but this will give the majority the chance to succeed.

So, this is what you are defending.

[ame=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QPKKQnijnsM]Wealth Inequality in America - YouTube[/ame]

No. What I'm telling you is how to fix it. There's a reason the wealth keeps moving to the top and the solution isn't because we need higher taxes or more regulation the cause is the regulation.

The more laws you pass to control people the fewer have the resources to comply and therefore only those that can afford to comply get the earnings. The money is moving toward the top because they are the only ones that have the resources to negotiate the f*cking rules and regulations.

If you want this to end then you start doing smart things that help people help themselves. Taxing someone making more than you and making new regulations that keep the individual from being able to comply compound those problems not solve them. All you have done is insure that the small guy can't afford to compete, I guess you call that being fair but it's nothing even close to fair.

Stop worrying about how much one group makes over another and start looking at how you can empower the bottom to be able to get in the game. Taxing one side will not help the other, more regulations only help the established.

Make it easier for people to start their own company and the giants will fall due to a superior product coming online. Make regulations that keep people from doing that and you get what we have, only the top will survive. They're the only ones that can afford to do so.

 

[Rct_Tsoul]

...the result was an economy and culture which encouraged upward mobility.

Your right, during this time period it was necessary to allow the American sheeple to prosper unchecked, as we would need them to build the infrastructure of the United States, along with bodies for our armed forces needed to be increased if we were to win and defeat the Soviet Union ........ unfortunately we actually had to PAY the sheeple during this time period or the Soviet Union would have dominated us in the end.
The Soviet Union is finished, their is absolutely no formidable players against the United States anymore ........... so there is NO reason to pay the sheeple anymore, infrastructure is nearly complete, we really don't need them as it consumes a lot of natural resources just allowing them to do what ever they want ............ as all societies must eventually DISCARD undesirables to keep costs to a minimum, this must be done.
Unfortunately the sheeple are uncontrollable in the United States ..... for now ......... we need to get these dam guns away from them so we can Move Forward ........ if you know what mean.
This choking off their prosperity thing ........ might not work, as we could not have foreseen the power of the internet giving the ability to the sheeple to have an equal voice, along with the ability to educate themselves & children at will & unchecked, I can see this turning out really bad.
Education
Guns
Voting
God help us.

 

[Agit8r]

Both parties largely supported Keynesian economic policies. Research and development were seen as matters of national security, and were well subsidized. Saving rates lowered in response to Social Security. Basically there was more market activity as well as innovation, which made opportunities for more other market activities.

 

[waltky]

Simple - the post-war boom...

... during WWII Europe and Japan's plants and industries were reduced to rubble...

... that left us as the only game in town so to speak...

... so we got complacent which is why we ended up having the 'destroy a foreign car' fad during the late 70's...

... we thought the good times would last forever and didn't give it any thought that one day...

... Europe and Japan would recover and start producing their own products for not only domestic but global consumption...

... meanwhile, China got sidetracked by Mao's Great Revolution until they finally caught onto capitalism...

... the rest is history in the making.

 

[Two Thumbs]

i would like someone to explain this:

how and why did the middle class expand so much during the 50's and 60's?

what political and economic policies were involved? or did it not expand.

i'm having this debate with my...shall remain anonymous...nevermind...curious as to what USMB has to say

note to mods: i want both political and economic so i thought political forum would be best

The EU, Russia, China and Japan, all major world players, had been blown to bits, bombed to hell, destroyed, decimated, etc,etc.

So while they were digging out, our capitalist filled the void, so we had jobs jobs jobs.

Then the good times hit, liberals hated the successful, so in fairness they did things that took away jobs.

not that they can admit this

 

[MeBelle]

Too many carbs?

 

[Politico]

Because the Boomers couldn't vote yet and Generation Whne hadn't been born.

 

[LoneLaugher]

It's easy to have a tax rate when the 10% left is the whole economic pie of the entire world. Europe was a cinder, Japan a glowing hole in the ground, china had nothing but rice paddies and Russia was saddled with collectivist communism. Whatever got made, got made in an American factory. We had all the factories and no environmental anti pollution laws. We grew almost all the food and fed a decimated Europe.

Now we have competition. We don't have a workforce willing to work like granddad did. We don't export, money isn't flowing into the country. It's flowing out of the country as we import just about everything. Instead of a work force, we have a welfare force.

You think we could survive a 90% tax rate? High taxes don't create productivity. High productivity enables high taxes.

The American worker of today is more productive than grandad was. He works longer hours for less pay and has fewer prospects for upward mobility.

 

[LoneLaugher]

The only way that gap decreases is through individual opportunity. Obama is trying to tax people to pay for another persons income and that can not and never has worked. The only thing that accomplishes is lowering the standard of living for everyone. If we really wanted prosperity we would set up a flat tax, reduce regulations to allow new competitors into the game and get the government out of the majority of our decisions. There will still be poor people there always are but this will give the majority the chance to succeed.

So, this is what you are defending.

[ame=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QPKKQnijnsM]Wealth Inequality in America - YouTube[/ame]

No. What I'm telling you is how to fix it. There's a reason the wealth keeps moving to the top and the solution isn't because we need higher taxes or more regulation the cause is the regulation.

The more laws you pass to control people the fewer have the resources to comply and therefore only those that can afford to comply get the earnings. The money is moving toward the top because they are the only ones that have the resources to negotiate the f*cking rules and regulations.

If you want this to end then you start doing smart things that help people help themselves. Taxing someone making more than you and making new regulations that keep the individual from being able to comply compound those problems not solve them. All you have done is insure that the small guy can't afford to compete, I guess you call that being fair but it's nothing even close to fair.

Stop worrying about how much one group makes over another and start looking at how you can empower the bottom to be able to get in the game. Taxing one side will not help the other, more regulations only help the established.

Make it easier for people to start their own company and the giants will fall due to a superior product coming online. Make regulations that keep people from doing that and you get what we have, only the top will survive. They're the only ones that can afford to do so.

I have started three businesses in the last decade. It isn't difficult if you have some cash. The "regulations" are reasonable.

Please compare regulations for businesses between the US and Japan, South Koreea and Germany. It will interest you.

 

[LoneLaugher]

I graduated catholic grammar school in 1951...and had all the education I needed right then. I could read, write, speak, add, subtract, multiply and divide. I knew what sacrifice, self denial and self discipline meant. I had a reasonable fear of God, knew the Ten Commandments and respected women...the nuns said girls hated sex...and I believed them. Life has changed...I am amazed at what my grand kids must learn...and what they must learn to avoid. God help them.

You thought you had all the education you needed right then. There is no such thing as all the education you need. You do not have time to get such. The best we can do is continual education throughout our lives, beginning to end.

Never an end for sure but kids had a far better base of education then than they do now. It's why we keep dropping the requirements for college entry today, they can't meet those standards. Kids were better prepared then and were expected to do better. Far too many go to college on our dime to just finish high school today. Dropping the standards hasn't helped.

Where do you get your info? The requirements for college admission are not dropping at traditional colleges and universities. . Some "colleges" take anyone who wants to learn. That is not indicative of a drop in requirements. Rather it indicates an increase in bullshit profit center schools.

 

[NightFox]

The top marginal income tax rate was 70-90% over the period, i.e. the 1% paid their way AND we prospered.

You make the mistake of using correlation to imply causation, one would suggest you attempt to look a bit deeper below the surface if you're really interested in finding the truth behind the OPs question, since it's self evident that no nation can tax it's way to prosperity.

"When you shout 'Let there be light!' every morning at dawn, that is when correlation implies creation" -- Benson Bruno

 

[Pennywise]

i would like someone to explain this:

how and why did the middle class expand so much during the 50's and 60's?

what political and economic policies were involved? or did it not expand.

i'm having this debate with my...shall remain anonymous...nevermind...curious as to what USMB has to say

note to mods: i want both political and economic so i thought political forum would be best

The top marginal income tax rate was 70-90% over the period, i.e. the 1% paid their way AND we prospered.

No one paid anywhere near those rates, because absolutely anything and everything could be written off as business expenses. You could buy a brand new car, every year and write off the entire cost; there was no depreciation nonsense. Talk about stimulus.

And that's a fact.

 

[LoneLaugher]

i would like someone to explain this:

how and why did the middle class expand so much during the 50's and 60's?

what political and economic policies were involved? or did it not expand.

i'm having this debate with my...shall remain anonymous...nevermind...curious as to what USMB has to say

note to mods: i want both political and economic so i thought political forum would be best

The top marginal income tax rate was 70-90% over the period, i.e. the 1% paid their way AND we prospered.

No one paid anywhere near those rates, because absolutely anything and everything could be written off as business expenses. You could buy a brand new car, every year and write off the entire cost; there was no depreciation nonsense. Talk about stimulus.

And that's a fact.

Yeah! It wasn't like today.......just oppressive taxation and no loopholes at all!

 

[ba1614]

People were motivated back then, nowadays we have way to many looking for others to look out for them and think that 6 figure jobs are a right that should be handed to them.

 

[editec]

i would like someone to explain this:

how and why did the middle class expand so much during the 50's and 60's?

what political and economic policies were involved? or did it not expand.

i'm having this debate with my...shall remain anonymous...nevermind...curious as to what USMB has to say

note to mods: i want both political and economic so i thought political forum would be best

History is the shortest answer.

1. the USA's industrial and social power was intact, while the rest of the world was in recovery from WWII

2. WE still had in place UNION protections such that, as the USA industrial growth took off to satisfy the industrial needs for the rebuilding of Europe, that meant that the WORKING CLASSES also benefitted from the profits.

Without UNIONS there is no large middle class.

That is what's happening to our shrinking middle class, right now.