If Obama stays pat, he's won the "Fiscal Cliff" battle.

[Sallow]

Personally, I don't give a flying fuck what Obama, the Dems, or the GOP "wins". What does the COUNTRY win?

Wrong thread.

 

[Si modo]

Personally, I don't give a flying fuck what Obama, the Dems, or the GOP "wins". What does the COUNTRY win?

Wrong thread.

Can't answer, I see. I am not surprised.

It's a simple question: What does the COUNTRY win? (If Obama wins)

 

[Crackerjack]

Personally, I don't give a flying fuck what Obama, the Dems, or the GOP "wins". What does the COUNTRY win?

People who treat this like a Red v. Blue game of "my side won, your side lost, nyah nyah nyah" piss me off. It's dick-measuring jackasses like this who got us where we are in the first place.

 

[Claudette]

We have to get serious about the National Debt, we need more spending cuts too. I think everyone should scarifice, rich, poor and in-between.

There are smart ways to cut spending and stupid ways.

Obama went with "smart" when he enacted the ACA..which saved about 750 Billion dollars in Medicare spending. Another good one was getting the banks out of student loans.

But of course people are going to grouse about those sorts of spending cuts. Since they are the real pork that enriches to the private sector.

A govt program saving money?! Is your comedy act in town tonight, Sallow?

I'm sure he's deadly serious.

I wonder where he thinks the money will be coming from to pay for those students to go to college and those folks without HC to get treated??

The magic tree out back of the WH??

 

[Votto]

Personally, I don't give a flying fuck what Obama, the Dems, or the GOP "wins". What does the COUNTRY win?

Come on, play the game right. Pick a side and start pounding away at the opposition.

After all, there are a few pennies here and there to be fought over and an election to win in 2014!!

 

[Vanquish]

There are smart ways to cut spending and stupid ways.

Obama went with "smart" when he enacted the ACA..which saved about 750 Billion dollars in Medicare spending. Another good one was getting the banks out of student loans.

But of course people are going to grouse about those sorts of spending cuts. Since they are the real pork that enriches to the private sector.

A govt program saving money?! Is your comedy act in town tonight, Sallow?

I'm sure he's deadly serious.

I wonder where he thinks the money will be coming from to pay for those students to go to college and those folks without HC to get treated??

The magic tree out back of the WH??

Obviously you don't study up on the topics you claim knowledge of. Shame really.

Do you realize that preventative medicine is often 3 to 10 times less expensive than emergency medicine? Emergency medicine that we already provide? One of the major healthcare cost reductions is based on the comparison between preventative and emergency medicine.

I guess it's just easier for some people to wrap their heads around "the government always does everything wrong" than the truth which is a lot less black and white and a lot more gray.

It is amazing to me that some Republicans can wrap themselves in the flag and claim they're protecting the constitution and hate the government as much as you sound like you do when it's a democrat in office. Oh sure, you say it's just this president you don't like, but then you contradict that with sweeping comments about how government sucks all the time.

 

[Votto]

A govt program saving money?! Is your comedy act in town tonight, Sallow?

I'm sure he's deadly serious.

I wonder where he thinks the money will be coming from to pay for those students to go to college and those folks without HC to get treated??

The magic tree out back of the WH??

Obviously you don't study up on the topics you claim knowledge of. Shame really.

Do you realize that preventative medicine is often 3 to 10 times less expensive than emergency medicine? Emergency medicine that we already provide? One of the major healthcare cost reductions is based on the comparison between preventative and emergency medicine.

I guess it's just easier for some people to wrap their heads around "the government always does everything wrong" than the truth which is a lot less black and white and a lot more gray.

It is amazing to me that some Republicans can wrap themselves in the flag and claim they're protecting the constitution and hate the government as much as you sound like you do when it's a democrat in office. Oh sure, you say it's just this president you don't like, but then you contradict that with sweeping comments about how government sucks all the time.

Indeed. In fact, I can envision madatory visits and check ups to the doctor, mandatory colonoscopies, mandatory breast exams, smoking to be outlawed, etc, etc.

Making large sodas and Happy Meals illegal is at least a start.

 

[Soggy in NOLA]

We have to get serious about the National Debt, we need more spending cuts too. I think everyone should scarifice, rich, poor and in-between.

I tend to agree, but we're not there yet... too many have bought into the notion that a tax increase on Warren Buffet and Bill Gates will save the day and that we can keep spending like drunken sailors. Only when we're ready to address all spending from military to entitlements will we begin to get serious.

 

[The Rabbi]

And he may get what he wants in terms of the debt ceiling as well.

At this point, there is almost no upside to dealing with Republicans. Actually..there is none.

Once the Fiscal Cliff is done, so are they. They will lose the house in 2014.

Obama gets to sunset the Bush Tax cuts..and get the Defense cuts that were necessary to balance the budget. And he's got a great deal of leverage..since he can soften those.

Well played.

Personally..I didn't see this when the sequester deal was done.

Yes, let Obama "win" this one. Let taxes go up across the board. Let additional taxes fly for Obamacare. Let huge spending cuts happen.
The GOP will ride on the smoking ruin of the economy to victory in 2014 and 2016.

 

[JimH52]

There is little doubt that the GOP will lose again. I am not sure how many more battles they can lose and still stay a legitimate second party. I suggest they nominate Grover for an officce in 2014 and see how that goes.

 

[flacaltenn]

And he may get what he wants in terms of the debt ceiling as well.

At this point, there is almost no upside to dealing with Republicans. Actually..there is none.

Once the Fiscal Cliff is done, so are they. They will lose the house in 2014.

Obama gets to sunset the Bush Tax cuts..and get the Defense cuts that were necessary to balance the budget. And he's got a great deal of leverage..since he can soften those.

Well played.

Personally..I didn't see this when the sequester deal was done.

It's well-played if you have broccoli for brains.. Someone has to explain to thinking folks why the Bush Tax Cuts were "what got us into this mess" ------ but the card on the table is to PRESERVE the bulk of the Bush Tax Cuts so that the middle class is not held hostage. The only diff between the gosh-awful Bush cuts and what the infant Prez has been incessantly whining for is a meaningless 2% diff for the top 1%.

It's like whining because your parents won't buy you a double scoop, so you get dragged screaming out of the ice cream store with NOTHING. Same magnitude of importance to the rest of your life.

NOTHING has meaning in this Mexican stand-off ---- unless you're the Mad Hatter.

Just the fact that EVERY OPPORTUNITY since the election --- all you hear from Dear Leader is about "the rich".. There is no plan. The King has no clothes or tools.

"I" have "broccoli" for brains and yet you basically can't, as a grownup, discuss what a politically astounding move this was without deflecting into some hyperbolic mess that really doesn't have much to do with the topic.

In 2010 the public gave Obama a house filled with a majority of hard right radical right wingers bent on making him a one term President. And they did some very radical maneuvers to make it so, like evoking a record number of filibusters and holding the debt ceiling hostage.

I don't care where you sit politically..but this was a master stroke, and people who are political junkies should see that.

He got his opposition to trap themselves and declare victory about it.

[ame=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_paKxXLsenA]Boehner Christmas II - YouTube[/ame]

That's just really amazing.

Hey I credit your brain. I myself am just a couple carrots short of full salad. But yet -- I'm not impressed at all by the "brilliance" of this temper tantrum.

I don't celebrate triumphs based on lies and class warfare. I don't want to give the complicit media a pass when they'd rather monitor twitter than dive into a 20,000 page budget analysis. NONE of this deception is helpful. And with "my brain" -- I can't suspend logic, reason and facts to drive this country in harmful directions --- just to acheive political goals.

 

[Sallow]

Personally, I don't give a flying fuck what Obama, the Dems, or the GOP "wins". What does the COUNTRY win?

Wrong thread.

Can't answer, I see. I am not surprised.

It's a simple question: What does the COUNTRY win? (If Obama wins)

Same thing it won under Clinton.

Get on the road to fiscal sanity.

It was your peeps that abandoned paygo and so many other things.

 

[Sallow]

It's well-played if you have broccoli for brains.. Someone has to explain to thinking folks why the Bush Tax Cuts were "what got us into this mess" ------ but the card on the table is to PRESERVE the bulk of the Bush Tax Cuts so that the middle class is not held hostage. The only diff between the gosh-awful Bush cuts and what the infant Prez has been incessantly whining for is a meaningless 2% diff for the top 1%.

It's like whining because your parents won't buy you a double scoop, so you get dragged screaming out of the ice cream store with NOTHING. Same magnitude of importance to the rest of your life.

NOTHING has meaning in this Mexican stand-off ---- unless you're the Mad Hatter.

Just the fact that EVERY OPPORTUNITY since the election --- all you hear from Dear Leader is about "the rich".. There is no plan. The King has no clothes or tools.

"I" have "broccoli" for brains and yet you basically can't, as a grownup, discuss what a politically astounding move this was without deflecting into some hyperbolic mess that really doesn't have much to do with the topic.

In 2010 the public gave Obama a house filled with a majority of hard right radical right wingers bent on making him a one term President. And they did some very radical maneuvers to make it so, like evoking a record number of filibusters and holding the debt ceiling hostage.

I don't care where you sit politically..but this was a master stroke, and people who are political junkies should see that.

He got his opposition to trap themselves and declare victory about it.

[ame=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_paKxXLsenA]Boehner Christmas II - YouTube[/ame]

That's just really amazing.

Hey I credit your brain. I myself am just a couple carrots short of full salad. But yet -- I'm not impressed at all by the "brilliance" of this temper tantrum.

I don't celebrate triumphs based on lies and class warfare. I don't want to give the complicit media a pass when they'd rather monitor twitter than dive into a 20,000 page budget analysis. NONE of this deception is helpful. And with "my brain" -- I can't suspend logic, reason and facts to drive this country in harmful directions --- just to acheive political goals.

Except..none of that is really happening.

It's astounding you folks don't seriously know how societies function..or don't function.

When you have a situation when a small group of people hold all the marbles, the society will cease to function effectively.

That's why, for the most part, places with Monarchies, Aristocracies, Plutocracies, Oligarchies and Dictatorships don't last very long.

Humans band together to do things that it would be hard to do as an indivdual. Part of that social compact is that each indivdual gets a benefit from doing that.

If that's not happening..then there is no reason to band together.

 

[Remodeling Maidiac]

So this just boils down to a game for you Sallow? Obama won and that's what's important?

I think the american people and our economy will be the winners or losers and only time will tell what they end up with.

 

[C_Clayton_Jones]

Personally, I don't give a flying fuck what Obama, the Dems, or the GOP "wins". What does the COUNTRY win?

Wrong thread.

Can't answer, I see. I am not surprised.

It's a simple question: What does the COUNTRY win? (If Obama wins)

The country wins a sensible, responsible, and pragmatic approach to deficit reduction, as opposed to the right’s dogmatic and irresponsible approach.

 

[flacaltenn]

"I" have "broccoli" for brains and yet you basically can't, as a grownup, discuss what a politically astounding move this was without deflecting into some hyperbolic mess that really doesn't have much to do with the topic.

In 2010 the public gave Obama a house filled with a majority of hard right radical right wingers bent on making him a one term President. And they did some very radical maneuvers to make it so, like evoking a record number of filibusters and holding the debt ceiling hostage.

I don't care where you sit politically..but this was a master stroke, and people who are political junkies should see that.

He got his opposition to trap themselves and declare victory about it.

Boehner Christmas II - YouTube

That's just really amazing.

Hey I credit your brain. I myself am just a couple carrots short of full salad. But yet -- I'm not impressed at all by the "brilliance" of this temper tantrum.

I don't celebrate triumphs based on lies and class warfare. I don't want to give the complicit media a pass when they'd rather monitor twitter than dive into a 20,000 page budget analysis. NONE of this deception is helpful. And with "my brain" -- I can't suspend logic, reason and facts to drive this country in harmful directions --- just to acheive political goals.

Except..none of that is really happening.

It's astounding you folks don't seriously know how societies function..or don't function.

When you have a situation when a small group of people hold all the marbles, the society will cease to function effectively.

That's why, for the most part, places with Monarchies, Aristocracies, Plutocracies, Oligarchies and Dictatorships don't last very long.

Humans band together to do things that it would be hard to do as an indivdual. Part of that social compact is that each indivdual gets a benefit from doing that.

If that's not happening..then there is no reason to band together.

Cue the goose-stepping stormtroopers. The cute youth militia clothed in govt issued garb.

Let's all march.

I don't think we have enough experience with "how societies function" since the tests for success are measured in centuries. If you want to extrapolate insufficient data -- go right ahead.

I refuse to become a tool of the masses whim. Or a victim of skillful tactical politicians. My life is gonna be lived in the REAL WORLD of facts and reason. When a society abandons facts and values lies and propaganda, they will not thrive..

My platitude about the essence of societies beats yours... Shuffle and deal with it....

 

[Amelia]

Wrong thread.

Can't answer, I see. I am not surprised.

It's a simple question: What does the COUNTRY win? (If Obama wins)

Same thing it won under Clinton.

Get on the road to fiscal sanity.

It was your peeps that abandoned paygo and so many other things.

Same thing it won under Clinton? So you attribute the internet bubble to Clinton?

 

[The Rabbi]

Wrong thread.

Can't answer, I see. I am not surprised.

It's a simple question: What does the COUNTRY win? (If Obama wins)

The country wins a sensible, responsible, and pragmatic approach to deficit reduction, as opposed to the right’s dogmatic and irresponsible approach.

So raising taxes in a weak economy and cutting spending massively will result in a sensible approach to deficit reduction? Is this the new left wing talking point?

 

[Claudette]

Raising taxes isn't going to help a sluggish economy and you don't have to be a rocket scientist to know that.

And if anyone thinks there are going to be meaningful cuts anywhere in Govt then they are delusional.

Everything needs to be on the table for cuts. Everything, but you won't see it happen until the whole thing comes crashing down and its to late.

Thats the Clowns we have representing us. If anyone thinks either party gives a rats ass then you have way more faith than I do.

 

[Sallow]

Hey I credit your brain. I myself am just a couple carrots short of full salad. But yet -- I'm not impressed at all by the "brilliance" of this temper tantrum.

I don't celebrate triumphs based on lies and class warfare. I don't want to give the complicit media a pass when they'd rather monitor twitter than dive into a 20,000 page budget analysis. NONE of this deception is helpful. And with "my brain" -- I can't suspend logic, reason and facts to drive this country in harmful directions --- just to acheive political goals.

Except..none of that is really happening.

It's astounding you folks don't seriously know how societies function..or don't function.

When you have a situation when a small group of people hold all the marbles, the society will cease to function effectively.

That's why, for the most part, places with Monarchies, Aristocracies, Plutocracies, Oligarchies and Dictatorships don't last very long.

Humans band together to do things that it would be hard to do as an indivdual. Part of that social compact is that each indivdual gets a benefit from doing that.

If that's not happening..then there is no reason to band together.

Cue the goose-stepping stormtroopers. The cute youth militia clothed in govt issued garb.

Let's all march.

I don't think we have enough experience with "how societies function" since the tests for success are measured in centuries. If you want to extrapolate insufficient data -- go right ahead.

I refuse to become a tool of the masses whim. Or a victim of skillful tactical politicians. My life is gonna be lived in the REAL WORLD of facts and reason. When a society abandons facts and values lies and propaganda, they will not thrive..

My platitude about the essence of societies beats yours... Shuffle and deal with it....

What the heck are you talking about?

We've got thousands of years of recorded data in relation to how societies function.

Check out the library everyone once in a while.

And if you "refuse to become a tool of the masses whim"...

Islands for Sale Worldwide - Private Islands Online

There ya go.