If paying into Social Security was optional...

[The2ndAmendment]

Would the Government keep threatening to halt Social Security checks to achieve their ambitions (be those Republican or Democrat ambitions)?

 

[tyroneweaver]

holding a ponzie scheme hostage...I'll have to think about that one.

 

[The2ndAmendment]

The people that vote "yes," tell me why you would keep paying into a system that is known to freeze your money?

 

[The2ndAmendment]

Light bulb

 

[Old Rocks]

Dumb fucks. The SS system is one of the most popular of government programs. It protects middle class and working poor Americans from the vagaries of the market. Mess with it at your own peril.

snopes.com: Eisenhower on Social Security

 

[Vox]

The people that vote "yes," tell me why you would keep paying into a system that is known to freeze your money?

because you can not avoid it. it is NOT optional

and you have formulated the question in such a way it is confusing for the most - I would not pay if that would be optional, but that does not mean government won't take it hostage for those who paid.

 

[Vox]

The people that vote "yes," tell me why you would keep paying into a system that is known to freeze your money?

it is not what you ask by your poll.

you ask if the SS payment is optional would it influence the government behavior, not would you pay into it if that would be optional.

 

[alan1]

Dumb fucks. The SS system is one of the most popular of government programs. It protects middle class and working poor Americans from the vagaries of the market. Mess with it at your own peril.

snopes.com: Eisenhower on Social Security

Social Security this,

Black Men Don’t Get Social Security

Well, the average black male gets no social security. It doesn’t matter how much they contribute.
All one has to do is look at the numbers to discover this.

For people born prior to 1955, the age to collect full social security benefits is age 66.
The average life span for a black male born prior to 1955 is less than 60 years.

For people born after 1959, the age to collect full social security is 67.
The average life span of a black male doesn’t exceed 67 years unless he was born after 1996.
Somehow, I am guessing that the age to collect full social security benefits will be raised before some person born in 1996 actually reaches the current 67 year old age requirement.

The average life expectancy for a black male born in 1970 is 60 years. We can assume that he begins earning income and paying FICA tax at 20 years of age. That means he puts 6.2% of his gross income into the system for 40 years. His employer matches that at 6.2% also. Based upon statistics, the average black male collects nothing from that 40 year contribution.

That’s what I call a zero sum benefit for black men. Had he taken that same 6.2% and stuffed it under his mattress, his wife or children would have it.

Here is a link to the average life expectancy for blacks and whites by gender, just in case you want to see where you fit in. Life Expectancy at Birth by Race and Sex, 1930?2010 | Infoplease.com

 

[deltex1]

holding a ponzie scheme hostage...I'll have to think about that one.

Ponzi hab bin berry good to me.........

 

[Vox]

Dumb fucks. The SS system is one of the most popular of government programs. It protects middle class and working poor Americans from the vagaries of the market. Mess with it at your own peril.

snopes.com: Eisenhower on Social Security

Social Security this,

Black Men Don’t Get Social Security

Well, the average black male gets no social security. It doesn’t matter how much they contribute.
All one has to do is look at the numbers to discover this.

For people born prior to 1955, the age to collect full social security benefits is age 66.
The average life span for a black male born prior to 1955 is less than 60 years.

For people born after 1959, the age to collect full social security is 67.
The average life span of a black male doesn’t exceed 67 years unless he was born after 1996.
Somehow, I am guessing that the age to collect full social security benefits will be raised before some person born in 1996 actually reaches the current 67 year old age requirement.

The average life expectancy for a black male born in 1970 is 60 years. We can assume that he begins earning income and paying FICA tax at 20 years of age. That means he puts 6.2% of his gross income into the system for 40 years. His employer matches that at 6.2% also. Based upon statistics, the average black male collects nothing from that 40 year contribution.

That’s what I call a zero sum benefit for black men. Had he taken that same 6.2% and stuffed it under his mattress, his wife or children would have it.

Here is a link to the average life expectancy for blacks and whites by gender, just in case you want to see where you fit in. Life Expectancy at Birth by Race and Sex, 1930?2010 | Infoplease.com

well, black females are getting those benefits not paying into that at all - all those single mothers with hordes of children from different baby daddies, never paying a dime into SS/Medicare but getting full benefits and until very old age.
and the life expectancy is so low because there are extremely high numbers for male mortality at the age of 18-30 due to violence.
But those men never pay into SS anyway.
So the ones who actually pay have also higher life expectancy as they are a different group of people that those that are prone to high mortality at a young age.

You have to analyze statistics not just face take them

 

[Old Rocks]

Dumb fucks. The SS system is one of the most popular of government programs. It protects middle class and working poor Americans from the vagaries of the market. Mess with it at your own peril.

snopes.com: Eisenhower on Social Security

Social Security this,

Black Men Don’t Get Social Security

Well, the average black male gets no social security. It doesn’t matter how much they contribute.
All one has to do is look at the numbers to discover this.

For people born prior to 1955, the age to collect full social security benefits is age 66.
The average life span for a black male born prior to 1955 is less than 60 years.

For people born after 1959, the age to collect full social security is 67.
The average life span of a black male doesn’t exceed 67 years unless he was born after 1996.
Somehow, I am guessing that the age to collect full social security benefits will be raised before some person born in 1996 actually reaches the current 67 year old age requirement.

The average life expectancy for a black male born in 1970 is 60 years. We can assume that he begins earning income and paying FICA tax at 20 years of age. That means he puts 6.2% of his gross income into the system for 40 years. His employer matches that at 6.2% also. Based upon statistics, the average black male collects nothing from that 40 year contribution.

That’s what I call a zero sum benefit for black men. Had he taken that same 6.2% and stuffed it under his mattress, his wife or children would have it.

Here is a link to the average life expectancy for blacks and whites by gender, just in case you want to see where you fit in. Life Expectancy at Birth by Race and Sex, 1930?2010 | Infoplease.com

well, black females are getting those benefits not paying into that at all - all those single mothers with hordes of children from different baby daddies, never paying a dime into SS/Medicare but getting full benefits and until very old age.
and the life expectancy is so low because there are extremely high numbers for male mortality at the age of 18-30 due to violence.
But those men never pay into SS anyway.
So the ones who actually pay have also higher life expectancy as they are a different group of people that those that are prone to high mortality at a young age.

You have to analyze statistics not just face take them

Agree with you on this. I have known a number of black men in my working career that have lived into their 80's. And they have collected SS in their retirement years.

 

[The2ndAmendment]

The people that vote "yes," tell me why you would keep paying into a system that is known to freeze your money?

because you can not avoid it. it is NOT optional

and you have formulated the question in such a way it is confusing for the most - I would not pay if that would be optional, but that does not mean government won't take it hostage for those who paid.

???

I never ask if the person answering the poll would pay into social security or refuse.

I asked if the government would behave differently with SS money if it was optional. That is the only thing the poll questions asks as well.

 

[alan1]

Social Security this,

Black Men Don’t Get Social Security

Well, the average black male gets no social security. It doesn’t matter how much they contribute.
All one has to do is look at the numbers to discover this.

For people born prior to 1955, the age to collect full social security benefits is age 66.
The average life span for a black male born prior to 1955 is less than 60 years.

For people born after 1959, the age to collect full social security is 67.
The average life span of a black male doesn’t exceed 67 years unless he was born after 1996.
Somehow, I am guessing that the age to collect full social security benefits will be raised before some person born in 1996 actually reaches the current 67 year old age requirement.

The average life expectancy for a black male born in 1970 is 60 years. We can assume that he begins earning income and paying FICA tax at 20 years of age. That means he puts 6.2% of his gross income into the system for 40 years. His employer matches that at 6.2% also. Based upon statistics, the average black male collects nothing from that 40 year contribution.

That’s what I call a zero sum benefit for black men. Had he taken that same 6.2% and stuffed it under his mattress, his wife or children would have it.

Here is a link to the average life expectancy for blacks and whites by gender, just in case you want to see where you fit in. Life Expectancy at Birth by Race and Sex, 1930?2010 | Infoplease.com

well, black females are getting those benefits not paying into that at all - all those single mothers with hordes of children from different baby daddies, never paying a dime into SS/Medicare but getting full benefits and until very old age.
and the life expectancy is so low because there are extremely high numbers for male mortality at the age of 18-30 due to violence.
But those men never pay into SS anyway.
So the ones who actually pay have also higher life expectancy as they are a different group of people that those that are prone to high mortality at a young age.

You have to analyze statistics not just face take them

Agree with you on this. I have known a number of black men in my working career that have lived into their 80's. And they have collected SS in their retirement years.

Some do. I was speaking to averages and statistics. On average, most black males are contributors to SS, never to collect the dollars they put into it. One could almost call SS a racist program.

 

[Vox]

Agree with you on this. I have known a number of black men in my working career that have lived into their 80's. And they have collected SS in their retirement years.

good for them - they deserved it

 

[Vox]

well, black females are getting those benefits not paying into that at all - all those single mothers with hordes of children from different baby daddies, never paying a dime into SS/Medicare but getting full benefits and until very old age.
and the life expectancy is so low because there are extremely high numbers for male mortality at the age of 18-30 due to violence.
But those men never pay into SS anyway.
So the ones who actually pay have also higher life expectancy as they are a different group of people that those that are prone to high mortality at a young age.

You have to analyze statistics not just face take them

Agree with you on this. I have known a number of black men in my working career that have lived into their 80's. And they have collected SS in their retirement years.

Some do. I was speaking to averages and statistics. On average, most black males are contributors to SS, never to collect the dollars they put into it. One could almost call SS a racist program.

you would actually have to analyze the numbers exactly - at least for a year or a decade to make realistic conclusions.

SS is not racist.
SS was designed as a scum - not to pay almost anybody , but the designers never expected average longevity will extend 40% in 50 years( same is true in any other developed country)
That is the very reason this system is collapsing - especially medicare - it was not designed to change a 30K pacemaker in a 100 old nursing home bedridden granny in order for her to have a fixed broken hip which was broken while she was in bed ( which she will never leave anyway) and which grannie will die in 6 month after that no matter what we do.
BTW, in ALL single-payer systems the above mentioned patient will only get morphine for pain and nothing else as everything else is a total wasting of money without any positive prognosis - which numerous studies have proven repeatedly.
The highest expenditure of medical costs on American patients are in their last 2 weeks of life. Which are also usually futile.

 

[Vox]

The people that vote "yes," tell me why you would keep paying into a system that is known to freeze your money?

because you can not avoid it. it is NOT optional

and you have formulated the question in such a way it is confusing for the most - I would not pay if that would be optional, but that does not mean government won't take it hostage for those who paid.

???

I never ask if the person answering the poll would pay into social security or refuse.

I asked if the government would behave differently with SS money if it was optional. That is the only thing the poll questions asks as well.

of course government WOULD not behave differently.

But you then asked in your follow-up post - why do you people keep voting yes if you know the government would take your money.

The people that vote "yes," tell me why you would keep paying into a system that is known to freeze your money?

But that is not the way the poll question sounds - I voted yes, not because I would pay, but I think the behavior of the government won't change.

 

[candycorn]

Dumbass thread of the day.

 

[dadsgm]

With the funds collected under the Social Security Act Congress has a fiduciary responsibility to protect and manage the funds in such a way that payments are made. However, during the Johnson Administration the Fund was taken off budget and all collections go into the 'general fund' from which it is spent on anything the govt wants to. Therefore when the spending limits are reached there is no money left in the SS Fund except paper IOUs. Thus requiring Congress to raise the debt limit. As long as the Fund remains off budget and the Congress and the President continue to spend like they have a bottomless account the debt limit crisis will repeat itself every year.

 

[JakeStarkey]

When it was optional, the government, be it Dem or Pub, did nothing of the sort, so, nope, no.

 

[The2ndAmendment]

because you can not avoid it. it is NOT optional

and you have formulated the question in such a way it is confusing for the most - I would not pay if that would be optional, but that does not mean government won't take it hostage for those who paid.

???

I never ask if the person answering the poll would pay into social security or refuse.

I asked if the government would behave differently with SS money if it was optional. That is the only thing the poll questions asks as well.

of course government WOULD not behave differently.

But you then asked in your follow-up post - why do you people keep voting yes if you know the government would take your money.

The people that vote "yes," tell me why you would keep paying into a system that is known to freeze your money?

But that is not the way the poll question sounds - I voted yes, not because I would pay, but I think the behavior of the government won't change.

Then that's exactly what I wanted to know. I personally think that if SS was optional, it would actually be run better and produce higher returns, even if that resulted in raising the retirement age substantially.