If the US healthcare system is the best and socialism is the worst

[PoliticalChic]

Americans are the most dissatisfied with the quality and quantity of their health care. Of the 10 largest industrialized nations, the U.S. ranked dead last in health care satisfaction, with an approval rating of only 11 percent. (3) There's no putting a positive spin on this statistic; any president with such a low approval rating would be impeached!

Most of this dissatisfaction stems from the high expense and unavailability of U.S. health care. During the 1993 debate on health care reform, polls consistently showed that two-thirds of all Americans supported the idea of universal coverage. (4) Polls also showed that Americans didn't want to pay the higher taxes to achieve this goal, which many pundits took to be an amusing example of public inconsistency. Actually, the public was entirely consistent. Other nations manage to cover everybody, and at lower cost.

Nor is America's international reputation in health care as high as many Americans boast it to be. "Ask anyone you know from a foreign country... which country is the envy of the world when it comes to health care," Rush Limbaugh wrote in See, I Told You So. But according to a Gallup poll published by the Toronto Star, only 2 percent of all Canadians believe that the U.S. has a better health care system than their own.

The U.S. has the best health care system in the world

You'er kidding, right?

"The Ugly Truth About Canadian Health Care
Mountain-bike enthusiast Suzanne Aucoin had to fight more than her Stage IV colon cancer. Her doctor suggested Erbitux—a proven cancer drug that targets cancer cells exclusively, unlike conventional chemotherapies that more crudely kill all fast-growing cells in the body—and Aucoin went to a clinic to begin treatment. But if Erbitux offered hope, Aucoin’s insurance didn’t: she received one inscrutable form letter after another, rejecting her claim for reimbursement. Yet another example of the callous hand of managed care, depriving someone of needed medical help, right? Guess again. Erbitux is standard treatment, covered by insurance companies—in the United States. Aucoin lives in Ontario, Canada.
When Aucoin appealed to an official ombudsman, the Ontario government claimed that her treatment was unproven and that she had gone to an unaccredited clinic. But the FDA in the U.S. had approved Erbitux, and her clinic was a cancer center affiliated with a prominent Catholic hospital in Buffalo

...people like the elderly woman who needed vascular surgery for a major artery in her abdomen and was promised prompt care by one of the most senior bureaucrats in the government, who never called back. “Her doctor told her she’s going to die,” Baker remembers. So Timely got her surgery in a couple of days, in Washington State. Then there was the eight-year-old badly in need of a procedure to help correct her deafness. After watching her surgery get bumped three times, her parents called Timely.
The Ugly Truth About Canadian Health Care by David Gratzer, City Journal Summer 2007

 

[Syphon]

If socialist countries have a more copacetic form of healthcare....what's keeping you here?

you think England is socialist? you think germany is socialist? you think france is socialist? you think canada is socialist?

Make a point.

all those countries are democracy's yet the provide health care as a public service. none of those democratic countries are making a move to the american system.

so it is not only socialist countries such as Cuba and China who have better state run health care, it is democratic nations as well.

if the american system was so grand, every country would adopt it..... so tell us why they arent.

 

[PoliticalChic]

you think England is socialist? you think germany is socialist? you think france is socialist? you think canada is socialist?

Make a point.

all those countries are democracy's yet the provide health care as a public service. none of those democratic countries are making a move to the american system.

so it is not only socialist countries such as Cuba and China who have better state run health care, it is democratic nations as well.

if the american system was so grand, every country would adopt it..... so tell us why they arent.

First, stop hiding behind the Liberal "us" and simply say tell "me"....
....don't be afraid to stand on your own two feet.

We're the richest nation. We have the best heathcare in the world.
Their standard of living and medical expectations aren't as high as ours.
The spend huge amounts of money on cradle-to-grave styles and you see the results in Greece, Portugal, Italy and Ireland.
Socialized medicine is fine for minor ailments, but if major and expensive, you don't get it.

National Institute for Health and Clinical Excellence (NICE): tells Brits if their life is worth living- in actual dollars and cents. As the NYTimes states, its job is to develop “a standard method of rationing. NICE has decided that Britain, except in rare cases, can afford only £15,000, or about $22,750, to save six months of a citizen’s life.”
(http://www.nytimes.com/2008/12/03/health/03nice.html)

So, the average one-bedroom apartment in Manhattan is worth way more than a Brits’ life!(New York City Real Estate | MNS is Real Impact Real Estate)
That the essence of your socialized medicine.

So, it has concluded that if you have breast cancer, the drug Tykerb, shown to delay the progression of the disease, is worth more than you are “despite Glaxo’s offer to pay for the first 12 weeks of treatment.”
U.K. Says Tykerb Isn’t Worth Cost, Even With 12 Free Weeks - Health Blog - WSJ

Socialism is based on the collective, the herd, whereas our system...until recently...honored the life and wellbeing of individuals.
Which do you want?

 

[starcraftzzz]

Most medical advances and innovation come from the US. That's something we really need to consider... that innovation is created because we have a profit driven sector.

Source it.
American medial advances are from government funded sources and research
http://www.citizen.org/documents/ACFDC.PDF
^55% of the drugs developed in America are researched/funded solely by the government
^Only 22% of new drugs from the private market have therapeutic value.
^67% of the most important/used drugs were funded/developed solely or partial by the government
^The most successful drug companies are ones who use the most government research and drugs.
^The government provides almost all the basic research into medical breakthroughs
^53% of private market medical advancements have little to no therapeutic value another 31% have slight therapeutic value.

 

[starcraftzzz]

Explain how having a for profit middleman saves money on healthcare spending?

Britain is trying to overhaul its system... because its 'socialist' system is fucked. But please, don't let reality bite you in the ass.

They aren't changing the socialist nature of the system (which costs 2 times less then Americans despite having higher health outcomes)

Quote tags fixed.

 

[starcraftzzz]

We're the richest nation.

No there are a dozen countries with higher GDP per capital, and the rest of the 1st world has higher living standards then America

We have the best heathcare in the world.

Only if you ignore all the data and statistics

Their standard of living and medical expectations aren't as high as ours.

Their expectations might not be has high as our but their standards of living and health outcomes are higher then ours

The spend huge amounts of money on cradle-to-grave styles and you see the results in Greece, Portugal, Italy and Ireland.

Of which two of those having higher standards of living, and of 3 are hindered by not having their own country, and 1 isn't a first world country but is experiencing GDP growth of 5% plus.

It would be nice if when you posted next you posted something that wasn't a complete lie.

 

[Syphon]

Make a point.

all those countries are democracy's yet the provide health care as a public service. none of those democratic countries are making a move to the american system.

so it is not only socialist countries such as Cuba and China who have better state run health care, it is democratic nations as well.

if the american system was so grand, every country would adopt it..... so tell us why they arent.

First, stop hiding behind the Liberal "us" and simply say tell "me"....
....don't be afraid to stand on your own two feet.

We're the richest nation. We have the best heathcare in the world.
Their standard of living and medical expectations aren't as high as ours.
The spend huge amounts of money on cradle-to-grave styles and you see the results in Greece, Portugal, Italy and Ireland.
Socialized medicine is fine for minor ailments, but if major and expensive, you don't get it.

National Institute for Health and Clinical Excellence (NICE): tells Brits if their life is worth living- in actual dollars and cents. As the NYTimes states, its job is to develop “a standard method of rationing. NICE has decided that Britain, except in rare cases, can afford only £15,000, or about $22,750, to save six months of a citizen’s life.”
(http://www.nytimes.com/2008/12/03/health/03nice.html)

So, the average one-bedroom apartment in Manhattan is worth way more than a Brits’ life!(New York City Real Estate | MNS is Real Impact Real Estate)
That the essence of your socialized medicine.

So, it has concluded that if you have breast cancer, the drug Tykerb, shown to delay the progression of the disease, is worth more than you are “despite Glaxo’s offer to pay for the first 12 weeks of treatment.”
U.K. Says Tykerb Isn’t Worth Cost, Even With 12 Free Weeks - Health Blog - WSJ

Socialism is based on the collective, the herd, whereas our system...until recently...honored the life and wellbeing of individuals.
Which do you want?

the average income in Britian is 2600 pounds or approx $41,000
Income in the United Kingdom - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
average earning in the US were $46,000
Income in the United States - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
not exactly the huge difference

so now youre gonna use NYC, which is one of the most expensive cities in the world to live in as a comparison? thats a bad comparison.... but if you want more proof, it actually costs more to live in London than NYC. Housing in Toyko is much higher too, and the also have universal health care as well.

Top 50 Highest Cost of Living Cities In The World

out system does not honor the individual life, its values profit. until the health care law was passed, it was legal for insurance companies to drop your coverage if you became too expensive or got sick. tell me how that honor individual life.

the essence of universal health care to provide equal access of health care services to all people no matter how much they make or how much they are worth. thus everyone gets equal treatment. the way the current system works is that those with the most money get access to better services than those with the least.

if you really value human and individual life so much, why are you advocating for different levels of care to different classes of society? is a human life really worth less than the value of a dollar?

Coverage Denied: How the Current Health Insurance System Leaves Millions Behind
In 45 states across the country, insurance companies can discriminate against people based on their pre-existing conditions when they try to purchase health insurance directly from insurance companies in the individual insurance market.4 Insurers can deny them coverage, charge higher premiums, and/or refuse to cover that particular medical condition. A recent national survey estimated that 12.6 million non-elderly adults5 – 36 percent of those who tried to purchase health insurance directly from an insurance company in the individual insurance market – were in fact discriminated against because of a pre-existing condition in the previous three years.

but i guess youre ok with denying people health care...... that makes you a real christian

 

[francoHFW]

JFC dittoheads- Socialism is always democratic, Cuba and China are COMMUNIST. The EU calls itself social demoratic just to avoid hearing a pile of Pubcrappe from you moron/Cold War dinosaurs...

The Uk has its Tories who are second only to Pubs as stupid greedy a-holes, followed now by Canada's Conservatives, far back. Major parties, Pub are hands down champs.

Our health care costs twice as much as anyone else's. Pure Pub default IDIOCY. You are sorely misled- end of story.

 

[PoliticalChic]

We're the richest nation.

No there are a dozen countries with higher GDP per capital, and the rest of the 1st world has higher living standards then America

We have the best heathcare in the world.

Only if you ignore all the data and statistics

Their standard of living and medical expectations aren't as high as ours.

Their expectations might not be has high as our but their standards of living and health outcomes are higher then ours

The spend huge amounts of money on cradle-to-grave styles and you see the results in Greece, Portugal, Italy and Ireland.

Of which two of those having higher standards of living, and of 3 are hindered by not having their own country, and 1 isn't a first world country but is experiencing GDP growth of 5% plus.

It would be nice if when you posted next you posted something that wasn't a complete lie.

Your ignorance prevents you from realizing the truth.

Amusing how you Leftists will do cartwheels to prevent having to deal with the truth....for example, to contend that 'everything you say is a lie,' you have to explain why my posts are linked, especially to sources like the NYTimes.....

Here's more:


a. “One often-heard argument, voiced by the New York Times' Paul Krugman and others, is that America lags behind other countries in crude health outcomes. But such outcomes reflect a mosaic of factors, such as diet, lifestyle, drug use and cultural values. It pains me as a doctor to say this, but health care is just one factor in health.
In "The Business of Health", Robert Ohsfeldt and John Schneider factor out intentional and unintentional injuries from life-expectancy statistics and find that Americans who don't die in car crashes or homicides outlive people in any other Western country.
And if we measure a health care system by how well it serves its sick citizens, American medicine excels.
Dave Petno | On Freedom

b) How about the result of having food? With so much food, so many choices (tell me about it), we Americans are eating ourselves to death: obesity. Is this the fault of poor healthcare?

From a NYTimes article about ‘Sicko,’ and Cuba:
“Because they don’t have up-to-date cars, they tend to have to exercise more by walking,” he said. “And they may not have a surfeit of food, which keeps them from problems like obesity, but they’re not starving, either.”
http://www.nytimes.com/2007/05/27/weekinreview/27depalma.html

c) Infant mortality. So, Cuba has a lower infant mortality rate? On January 2, 2009 they announced 4.7 out of every 1,000 for 2008. Seem believable? Well, maybe the number, but calculated in 48 hours? It takes the US about two years to get all the data for our. One reason that Cuba has a low infant mortality, and the corresponding high life expectancy, is because they induce abortion at the first sign of possible trouble with a fetus. “Cuba's annual induced abortion rate persistently ranks among the highest in the world, and abortion plays a prominent role in Cuban fertility regulation.”
The Persistence of Induced Abortion in Cuba: Exploring the Notion of an []Abortion Culture[] - B[]langer - 2009 - Studies in Family Planning - Wiley Online Library

And, of course, there are a variety of ways that infant mortality statistics are measured. While 40% of America’s infant mortality rate is due to reporting of infants who die on the day of their birth, many countries don’t register such deaths at all. Other countries require specific size (Switzerland, 30 cm) and weights (Austria and Germany, 500 gms) to be listed as having been born.
Bernadine Healy, M.D.: Behind the baby count - US News and World Report

Rarely reported in comparing infant mortality rates it the negative effect of “very pre-term” babies, whose death rate is far higher than full term. When comparing the US infant mortality rate to such category-stars as in this NYTimes report of 11/4/09:
“If the United States could match Sweden’s prematurity rate, the new report said, “nearly 8,000 infant deaths would be averted each year, and the U.S. infant mortality rate would be one-third lower.”

We find the usual anti-US slant of the Times, in not mentioning that race is the reason:

“The use of this example highlights to disingenuousness of the authors. In their supposedly “detailed” report on infant mortality, they fail to analyze the most important detail: race. Unfortunately, African descent is a major risk factor for prematurity, and prematurity is a major cause of infant mortality. Therefore, it is hardly surprising that the US has a higher infant mortality rate than Sweden. The US has the highest proportion of women of African descent of any first world country. Sweden, of course, has virtually none. So our higher rate of infant mortality does not reflect poor medical care. It reflects factors beyond the control of doctors. Race is an uncontrollable factor; obstetricians and pediatricians have no control over assisted reproductive techniques. In fact, the data actually show obstetricians and pediatricians do a remarkable job of ensuring infant health.”

Infant mortality report neglects the most important detail - AmyTuteurMD - Open Salon


So you see, once you know more about a situation, it is hardly as simple as simple minded folks think it is...
...do you realize how stupid you sound claiming said links are "lies"?

Does that light over your head flashing "Idiot" keep you awake at night?

 

[francoHFW]

Yes, we have the best health care in the world, if you're a BILLIONNAIRE.

Otherwise, UNTIL THIS YEAR, thanks to ACA, insurers could throw you off for technicalities, or your charges could drive you into bankruptcy. 750k bankruptcies (3/4 people WITH insurance) and 45k DYING because they had no insurance- ALL UNKNOWN in any other modern country. AND a huge toll on our global competitiveness...

And the traffic accident stuff is total blather...

 

[The Rabbi]

Why are no socialist countries switching to our system of private insurance???


Oh, because US healthcare costs more and it provides worse outcomes.


Success is self-evident CONZ.
Point to all the demonstrations in socialist coutries DEMANDING they change to our system.
Point to the cost savings of the U.S. system.
Explain how having a for profit middleman saves money on healthcare spending?

Britain is trying to overhaul its system... because its 'socialist' system is fucked. But please, don't let reality bite you in the ass.

I understand that Canada is as well...

And Germany.
Their experience is like Maine, Tennessee and Mass. Every time you make it free you bankrupt the state.

 

[PoliticalChic]

Yes, we have the best health care in the world, if you're a BILLIONNAIRE.

Otherwise, UNTIL THIS YEAR, thanks to ACA, insurers could throw you off for technicalities, or your charges could drive you into bankruptcy. 750k bankruptcies (3/4 people WITH insurance) and 45k DYING because they had no insurance- ALL UNKNOWN in any other modern country. AND a huge toll on our global competitiveness...

And the traffic accident stuff is total blather...

I've noticed you remain totally consistent: never correct.

This should be your motto: Silence is golden. Duct tape is silver.

 

[Syphon]

Britain is trying to overhaul its system... because its 'socialist' system is fucked. But please, don't let reality bite you in the ass.

I understand that Canada is as well...

And Germany.
Their experience is like Maine, Tennessee and Mass. Every time you make it free you bankrupt the state.

or not...

Britain healthcare: British fear 'American-style' healthcare system - Los Angeles Times
"We will not be selling off the NHS, we will not be moving towards an insurance scheme, we will not introduce an American-style private system," Prime Minister David Cameron emphatically told a group of healthcare workers in a nationally televised address last week.

got any links to back up your claims.....

 

[francoHFW]

"Unfortunately, African descent is a major risk factor for prematurity, and prematurity is a major cause of infant mortality."

Because blacks and other poor WORKERS have crap health care here, dimwit.

 

[PoliticalChic]

all those countries are democracy's yet the provide health care as a public service. none of those democratic countries are making a move to the american system.

so it is not only socialist countries such as Cuba and China who have better state run health care, it is democratic nations as well.

if the american system was so grand, every country would adopt it..... so tell us why they arent.

First, stop hiding behind the Liberal "us" and simply say tell "me"....
....don't be afraid to stand on your own two feet.

We're the richest nation. We have the best heathcare in the world.
Their standard of living and medical expectations aren't as high as ours.
The spend huge amounts of money on cradle-to-grave styles and you see the results in Greece, Portugal, Italy and Ireland.
Socialized medicine is fine for minor ailments, but if major and expensive, you don't get it.

National Institute for Health and Clinical Excellence (NICE): tells Brits if their life is worth living- in actual dollars and cents. As the NYTimes states, its job is to develop “a standard method of rationing. NICE has decided that Britain, except in rare cases, can afford only £15,000, or about $22,750, to save six months of a citizen’s life.”
(http://www.nytimes.com/2008/12/03/health/03nice.html)

So, the average one-bedroom apartment in Manhattan is worth way more than a Brits’ life!(New York City Real Estate | MNS is Real Impact Real Estate)
That the essence of your socialized medicine.

So, it has concluded that if you have breast cancer, the drug Tykerb, shown to delay the progression of the disease, is worth more than you are “despite Glaxo’s offer to pay for the first 12 weeks of treatment.”
U.K. Says Tykerb Isn’t Worth Cost, Even With 12 Free Weeks - Health Blog - WSJ

Socialism is based on the collective, the herd, whereas our system...until recently...honored the life and wellbeing of individuals.
Which do you want?

the average income in Britian is 2600 pounds or approx $41,000
Income in the United Kingdom - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
average earning in the US were $46,000
Income in the United States - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
not exactly the huge difference

so now youre gonna use NYC, which is one of the most expensive cities in the world to live in as a comparison? thats a bad comparison.... but if you want more proof, it actually costs more to live in London than NYC. Housing in Toyko is much higher too, and the also have universal health care as well.

Top 50 Highest Cost of Living Cities In The World

out system does not honor the individual life, its values profit. until the health care law was passed, it was legal for insurance companies to drop your coverage if you became too expensive or got sick. tell me how that honor individual life.

the essence of universal health care to provide equal access of health care services to all people no matter how much they make or how much they are worth. thus everyone gets equal treatment. the way the current system works is that those with the most money get access to better services than those with the least.

if you really value human and individual life so much, why are you advocating for different levels of care to different classes of society? is a human life really worth less than the value of a dollar?

Coverage Denied: How the Current Health Insurance System Leaves Millions Behind
In 45 states across the country, insurance companies can discriminate against people based on their pre-existing conditions when they try to purchase health insurance directly from insurance companies in the individual insurance market.4 Insurers can deny them coverage, charge higher premiums, and/or refuse to cover that particular medical condition. A recent national survey estimated that 12.6 million non-elderly adults5 – 36 percent of those who tried to purchase health insurance directly from an insurance company in the individual insurance market – were in fact discriminated against because of a pre-existing condition in the previous three years.

but i guess youre ok with denying people health care...... that makes you a real christian

1. There was no groundswell to change healthcare until the Left decided that they could create a crisis, and certain dolts would fall for it....(if the shoe fits)...


“…while the numbers clearly show that people are happier with their own health care than with the system as a whole, there is no dimension with which their happier than the quality of care they personally receive…a mere 15 percent complain about the quality of care they receive.”.(New England Journal of Medicine)
Health Beat: The Quality Question

The most recent ABC News/Washington Post poll (June 21) finds that 83 percent of Americans are very satisfied or somewhat satisfied with the quality of their health care, and 81 percent are similarly satisfied with their health insurance.

They have good reason to be. If you're diagnosed with cancer, you have a better chance of surviving it in the United States than anywhere else, according to the Concord Five Continent Study. And the World Health Organization ranked the United States No. 1 out of 191 countries for being responsive to patients' needs, including providing timely treatments and a choice of doctors.
Defend Your Healthcare

Among insured Americans, 82 percent rate their health coverage positively. Among insured people who've experienced a serious or chronic illness or injury in their family in the last year, an enormous 91 percent are satisfied with their care, and 86 percent are satisfied with their coverage.
ABCNEWS.com : U.S. Health Care Concerns Increase

2. Everyone in the United States had healthcare.
Everyone.

3. The small percentage of chronically uninsured could be taken care of via government. So, ask yourself why it was necessary to destroy a system that worked well for the large majority...
....c'mon....you can figure it out.

4. The essential different is whether one believes in the free market, or, as you do, that bureaucrats will do a better job...think Motor Vehicle Department, or Post Office.

 

[PoliticalChic]

"Unfortunately, African descent is a major risk factor for prematurity, and prematurity is a major cause of infant mortality."

Because blacks and other poor WORKERS have crap health care here, dimwit.

One could almost believe that you invented stupidity, rather than simply perfected it.


One factor contributing to the U.S.'s infant mortality rate is that blacks have intractably high infant mortality rates -- irrespective of age, education, socioeconomic status and so on. No one knows why.

Neither medical care nor discrimination can explain it: Hispanics in the U.S. have lower infant mortality rates than either blacks or whites. Give Switzerland or Japan our ethnically diverse population and see how they stack up on infant mortality rates.
A Statistical Analysis of Maritime Unemployment Rates, 1946-1948. Just Kidding, More Liberal Lies About National Healthcare! - HUMAN EVENTS

 

[Oddball]

Why are no socialist countries switching to our system of private insurance???


Oh, because US healthcare costs more and it provides worse outcomes.


Success is self-evident CONZ.
Point to all the demonstrations in socialist coutries DEMANDING they change to our system.
Point to the cost savings of the U.S. system.
Explain how having a for profit middleman saves money on healthcare spending?

You can't be this stupid....

Yes, he really is.

 

[Syphon]

First, stop hiding behind the Liberal "us" and simply say tell "me"....
....don't be afraid to stand on your own two feet.

We're the richest nation. We have the best heathcare in the world.
Their standard of living and medical expectations aren't as high as ours.
The spend huge amounts of money on cradle-to-grave styles and you see the results in Greece, Portugal, Italy and Ireland.
Socialized medicine is fine for minor ailments, but if major and expensive, you don't get it.

National Institute for Health and Clinical Excellence (NICE): tells Brits if their life is worth living- in actual dollars and cents. As the NYTimes states, its job is to develop “a standard method of rationing. NICE has decided that Britain, except in rare cases, can afford only £15,000, or about $22,750, to save six months of a citizen’s life.”
(http://www.nytimes.com/2008/12/03/health/03nice.html)

So, the average one-bedroom apartment in Manhattan is worth way more than a Brits’ life!(New York City Real Estate | MNS is Real Impact Real Estate)
That the essence of your socialized medicine.

So, it has concluded that if you have breast cancer, the drug Tykerb, shown to delay the progression of the disease, is worth more than you are “despite Glaxo’s offer to pay for the first 12 weeks of treatment.”
U.K. Says Tykerb Isn’t Worth Cost, Even With 12 Free Weeks - Health Blog - WSJ

Socialism is based on the collective, the herd, whereas our system...until recently...honored the life and wellbeing of individuals.
Which do you want?

the average income in Britian is 2600 pounds or approx $41,000
Income in the United Kingdom - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
average earning in the US were $46,000
Income in the United States - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
not exactly the huge difference

so now youre gonna use NYC, which is one of the most expensive cities in the world to live in as a comparison? thats a bad comparison.... but if you want more proof, it actually costs more to live in London than NYC. Housing in Toyko is much higher too, and the also have universal health care as well.

Top 50 Highest Cost of Living Cities In The World

out system does not honor the individual life, its values profit. until the health care law was passed, it was legal for insurance companies to drop your coverage if you became too expensive or got sick. tell me how that honor individual life.

the essence of universal health care to provide equal access of health care services to all people no matter how much they make or how much they are worth. thus everyone gets equal treatment. the way the current system works is that those with the most money get access to better services than those with the least.

if you really value human and individual life so much, why are you advocating for different levels of care to different classes of society? is a human life really worth less than the value of a dollar?

Coverage Denied: How the Current Health Insurance System Leaves Millions Behind
In 45 states across the country, insurance companies can discriminate against people based on their pre-existing conditions when they try to purchase health insurance directly from insurance companies in the individual insurance market.4 Insurers can deny them coverage, charge higher premiums, and/or refuse to cover that particular medical condition. A recent national survey estimated that 12.6 million non-elderly adults5 – 36 percent of those who tried to purchase health insurance directly from an insurance company in the individual insurance market – were in fact discriminated against because of a pre-existing condition in the previous three years.

but i guess youre ok with denying people health care...... that makes you a real christian

1. There was no groundswell to change healthcare until the Left decided that they could create a crisis, and certain dolts would fall for it....(if the shoe fits)...


“…while the numbers clearly show that people are happier with their own health care than with the system as a whole, there is no dimension with which their happier than the quality of care they personally receive…a mere 15 percent complain about the quality of care they receive.”.(New England Journal of Medicine)
Health Beat: The Quality Question

The most recent ABC News/Washington Post poll (June 21) finds that 83 percent of Americans are very satisfied or somewhat satisfied with the quality of their health care, and 81 percent are similarly satisfied with their health insurance.

They have good reason to be. If you're diagnosed with cancer, you have a better chance of surviving it in the United States than anywhere else, according to the Concord Five Continent Study. And the World Health Organization ranked the United States No. 1 out of 191 countries for being responsive to patients' needs, including providing timely treatments and a choice of doctors.
Defend Your Healthcare

Among insured Americans, 82 percent rate their health coverage positively. Among insured people who've experienced a serious or chronic illness or injury in their family in the last year, an enormous 91 percent are satisfied with their care, and 86 percent are satisfied with their coverage.
ABCNEWS.com : U.S. Health Care Concerns Increase

2. Everyone in the United States had healthcare.
Everyone.

3. The small percentage of chronically uninsured could be taken care of via government. So, ask yourself why it was necessary to destroy a system that worked well for the large majority...
....c'mon....you can figure it out.

4. The essential different is whether one believes in the free market, or, as you do, that bureaucrats will do a better job...think Motor Vehicle Department, or Post Office.

#2 is a bold faced lie.
Americans Without Health Insurance Rise to 52 Million on Job Loss, Expense - Bloomberg

52 million americans is 1/6th of the population.

the free market made health insurance costs rise 14% annually since 1980. that is what your free market has done to health care.

In addition to higher health spending, the United States is increasing its spending faster than other countries. Exhibit 3 illustrates the trend in health spending among five countries. The United States’ higher growth rate in the 1990s and the 2000s ensured that it spent far more than other selected countries. While the United States had a slower rate of growth in the early 1990s, the late 1980s and 2000s were defined by an accelerated growth rate.
Snapshots: Health Care Spending in the United States & Selected OECD Countries - Kaiser Family Foundation

yet another failed argument.

 

[California Girl]

Americans are the most dissatisfied with the quality and quantity of their health care. Of the 10 largest industrialized nations, the U.S. ranked dead last in health care satisfaction, with an approval rating of only 11 percent. (3) There's no putting a positive spin on this statistic; any president with such a low approval rating would be impeached!

Most of this dissatisfaction stems from the high expense and unavailability of U.S. health care. During the 1993 debate on health care reform, polls consistently showed that two-thirds of all Americans supported the idea of universal coverage. (4) Polls also showed that Americans didn't want to pay the higher taxes to achieve this goal, which many pundits took to be an amusing example of public inconsistency. Actually, the public was entirely consistent. Other nations manage to cover everybody, and at lower cost.

Nor is America's international reputation in health care as high as many Americans boast it to be. "Ask anyone you know from a foreign country... which country is the envy of the world when it comes to health care," Rush Limbaugh wrote in See, I Told You So. But according to a Gallup poll published by the Toronto Star, only 2 percent of all Canadians believe that the U.S. has a better health care system than their own.

The U.S. has the best health care system in the world

Oh, I'm sorry. I thought we were discussing reality, not what people 'believe' about heathcare.

Twit.

 

[PoliticalChic]

the average income in Britian is 2600 pounds or approx $41,000
Income in the United Kingdom - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
average earning in the US were $46,000
Income in the United States - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
not exactly the huge difference

so now youre gonna use NYC, which is one of the most expensive cities in the world to live in as a comparison? thats a bad comparison.... but if you want more proof, it actually costs more to live in London than NYC. Housing in Toyko is much higher too, and the also have universal health care as well.

Top 50 Highest Cost of Living Cities In The World

out system does not honor the individual life, its values profit. until the health care law was passed, it was legal for insurance companies to drop your coverage if you became too expensive or got sick. tell me how that honor individual life.

the essence of universal health care to provide equal access of health care services to all people no matter how much they make or how much they are worth. thus everyone gets equal treatment. the way the current system works is that those with the most money get access to better services than those with the least.

if you really value human and individual life so much, why are you advocating for different levels of care to different classes of society? is a human life really worth less than the value of a dollar?

Coverage Denied: How the Current Health Insurance System Leaves Millions Behind
In 45 states across the country, insurance companies can discriminate against people based on their pre-existing conditions when they try to purchase health insurance directly from insurance companies in the individual insurance market.4 Insurers can deny them coverage, charge higher premiums, and/or refuse to cover that particular medical condition. A recent national survey estimated that 12.6 million non-elderly adults5 – 36 percent of those who tried to purchase health insurance directly from an insurance company in the individual insurance market – were in fact discriminated against because of a pre-existing condition in the previous three years.

but i guess youre ok with denying people health care...... that makes you a real christian

1. There was no groundswell to change healthcare until the Left decided that they could create a crisis, and certain dolts would fall for it....(if the shoe fits)...


“…while the numbers clearly show that people are happier with their own health care than with the system as a whole, there is no dimension with which their happier than the quality of care they personally receive…a mere 15 percent complain about the quality of care they receive.”.(New England Journal of Medicine)
Health Beat: The Quality Question

The most recent ABC News/Washington Post poll (June 21) finds that 83 percent of Americans are very satisfied or somewhat satisfied with the quality of their health care, and 81 percent are similarly satisfied with their health insurance.

They have good reason to be. If you're diagnosed with cancer, you have a better chance of surviving it in the United States than anywhere else, according to the Concord Five Continent Study. And the World Health Organization ranked the United States No. 1 out of 191 countries for being responsive to patients' needs, including providing timely treatments and a choice of doctors.
Defend Your Healthcare

Among insured Americans, 82 percent rate their health coverage positively. Among insured people who've experienced a serious or chronic illness or injury in their family in the last year, an enormous 91 percent are satisfied with their care, and 86 percent are satisfied with their coverage.
ABCNEWS.com : U.S. Health Care Concerns Increase

2. Everyone in the United States had healthcare.
Everyone.

3. The small percentage of chronically uninsured could be taken care of via government. So, ask yourself why it was necessary to destroy a system that worked well for the large majority...
....c'mon....you can figure it out.

4. The essential different is whether one believes in the free market, or, as you do, that bureaucrats will do a better job...think Motor Vehicle Department, or Post Office.

#2 is a bold faced lie.
Americans Without Health Insurance Rise to 52 Million on Job Loss, Expense - Bloomberg

52 million americans is 1/6th of the population.

the free market made health insurance costs rise 14% annually since 1980. that is what your free market has done to health care.

In addition to higher health spending, the United States is increasing its spending faster than other countries. Exhibit 3 illustrates the trend in health spending among five countries. The United States’ higher growth rate in the 1990s and the 2000s ensured that it spent far more than other selected countries. While the United States had a slower rate of growth in the early 1990s, the late 1980s and 2000s were defined by an accelerated growth rate.
Snapshots: Health Care Spending in the United States & Selected OECD Countries - Kaiser Family Foundation

yet another failed argument.

2. Everyone in the United States had healthcare.
Everyone.


Absolutely totally without a doubt true....

....bet your house on it?
Or you cardboard box...whatever...


You went to a government school....didn't you?